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Old 11-10-2009, 01:40   #241
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I didn't conclude that. You did.
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Old 11-10-2009, 04:33   #242
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http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,573547,00.html

Fort Hood Suspect Warned of Muslim Threat Within Military

Tuesday, November 10, 2009
The Army psychiatrist suspected of killing 13 people at Fort Hood reportedly warned senior Army physicians in 2007 that the military should allow Muslim soldiers be released as conscientious objectors instead of fighting in wars to avoid "adverse events."

According to The Washington Post, Major Nidal Malik Hasan was supposed to make a presentation on a medical topic during his senior year as a psychiatric resident at Walter Reed Medical Center.

Instead, Hasan lectured his supervisors and two dozen mental health staff members on Islam, homicide bombings and threats the military could encounter from Muslims conflicted about fighting against other Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan.

A source who attended the presentation told the paper, "It was really strange. The senior doctors looked really upset."

The Powerpoint, entitled, "The Koranic World View As It Relates to Muslims in the U.S. Military," consisted of 50 slides, according to a copy obtained by the Post.

"It's getting harder and harder for Muslims in the service to morally justify being in a military that seems constantly engaged against fellow Muslims," Hasan said in the presentation.

On the final slide, labeled "Recommendation," Hasan wrote: "Department of Defense should allow Muslims [sic] Soldiers the option of being released as 'Conscientious objectors' to increase troop morale and decrease adverse events."

An Army spokesman told the Post Monday night he was unaware of the presentation, and a Walter Reed spokesman declined comment.

The warning signs were all there: the justification of homicide bombings; the spewing of anti-American hatred; the efforts to reach Al Qaeda ...

But the U.S. military treated Hasan with kid gloves, even after giving him a poor performance review. And though he was on the radar screen of at least one U.S. intelligence agency, no action was taken that might have prevented the Army psychiatrist from allegedly gunning down 13 people and wounding 29 others in the Fort Hood massacre last week.

"There were definitely clear indications that Hasan's loyalties were not with America," Lt. Col. Val Finnell, Hasan's classmate at the Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences in Bethesda, Md., told FoxNews.com in an exclusive interview. He and Hasan were students in the school's public health master's degree program from 2007-2008.

"There were all sorts of ... comments made throughout the year that made me question his loyalty to the United States, but nothing was done," said Finnell, who recalled one class during which Hasan gave a presentation justifying homicide bombings.

"The issue here is that there's a political correctness climate in the military. They don't want to say anything because it would be considered questioning somebody's religious belief, or they're afraid of an equal opportunity lawsuit.

"I want to be clear that this wasn't about anyone questioning his religious views. It is different when you are a civilian than when you are a military officer," said Finnell, who is a physician at the Los Angeles Air Force Base.

"When you are in the military and you start making comments that are seditious, when you say you believe something other than your oath of office — someone needed to say why is this guy saying this stuff.

"He was a lightning rod. He made his views known and he was very vocal, he had extremely radical jihadist views," Finnell said. "When you're a military officer you take an oath to defend against all enemies foreign and domestic.

"They should've confronted him — our professors, officers — but they were too concerned about being politically correct."

Finnell said the warning signs were clear to many, not just classmates. Faculty members, including many high-ranking military officers, witnessed firsthand his anti-Americanism, he said.

Finnell recalled Hasan telling his classmates and professors, "I'm a Muslim first and I hold the Shariah, the Islamic Law, before the United States Constitution."

He recalled one time when his classmates were giving presentations in an environmental health class on topics like soil and water contamination and the effects of mold. When it was Hasan's turn, he said, he got up in front of the class and began to speak about his chosen topic, "Is the War on Terror a war on Islam?"

Finnell says he raised his hand. "I asked the professor, "What does this topic have to do with environmental health?"

"When he was challenged on his views, Hasan became visibly upset. He became sweaty, he was emotional."

But despite questioning from the other students, Finnell said, the professor allowed Hasan to continue. He said Hasan's anti-American vitriol continued for two years as he worked toward his degree in public health.

There were even more warning signs that might have alerted the Army in recent months:

— In the days and weeks before the shooting, Hasan voiced his objections to Muslims fighting the war on terror to members of his mosque, the Islamic Community of Greater Killeen. Congregants at the mosque said he voiced his objections to Muslims serving in the U.S. military and to his impending deployment to Afghanistan.

— Over the summer, Hasan's comments led Osman Danquah, co-founder of the mosque, to recommend that it deny Hasan's request to become a lay Muslim leader at Fort Hood, the Associated Press reported.

— In the months before Thursday's shooting Hasan tried reaching out to people associated with Al Qaeda — and did so under the watchful eye of at least one U.S. intelligence agency. An intelligence official told FOXNews.com that "Hasan was on our radar for months."

On Sunday Sen. Joe Lieberman announced his intention to lead a congressional investigation into the Fort Hood murders, saying there were "strong warning signs" that Hasan was an "Islamic extremist."

"The U.S. Army has to have zero tolerance. He should have been gone," said Lieberman, who is chairman of the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs.

In interviews Sunday, Army Chief of Staff Gen. George Casey stressed that it was too early in the investigation to know whether these warnings signs could have spared the lives of the 13 killed, dismissing earlier reports about such signs as "speculation" based on anecdotes. "I don't want to say that we missed it," he said.

Finnell said that once Hasan was identified as the suspect in Thursday's massacre, he reached out to the Army to tell them about his experiences with Hasan.

This time, he said, "They listened."

Fox News' Jana Winter contributed to this report.
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Old 11-10-2009, 08:19   #243
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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33819877...shington_post/ (Note: Different info)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...T2009110903704 (This is 'Hasan on Islam'. His presentation and slideshow.)


The Army psychiatrist believed to have killed 13 people at Fort Hood warned a roomful of senior Army physicians a year and a half ago that to avoid "adverse events," the military should allow Muslim soldiers to be released as conscientious objectors instead of fighting in wars against other Muslims.

As a senior-year psychiatric resident at Walter Reed Army Medical Center, Maj. Nidal M. Hasan was supposed to make a presentation on a medical topic of his choosing as a culminating exercise of the residency program.

Instead, in late June 2007, he stood before his supervisors and about 25 other mental health staff members and lectured on Islam, suicide bombers and threats the military could encounter from Muslims conflicted about fighting in the Muslim countries of Iraq and Afghanistan, according to a copy of the presentation obtained by The Washington Post.

"It's getting harder and harder for Muslims in the service to morally justify being in a military that seems constantly engaged against fellow Muslims," he said in the presentation.

"It was really strange," said one staff member who attended the presentation and spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the investigation of Hasan. "The senior doctors looked really upset" at the end. These medical presentations occurred each Wednesday afternoon, and other students had lectured on new medications and treatment of specific mental illnesses.

An Army spokesman said Monday night he was unaware of the presentation, and a Walter Reed spokesman declined to comment. It is unclear whether anyone in attendance reported the briefing to counterintelligence or law enforcement authorities whose job it is to identify threats from within the military ranks.

Hasan spent six years at Walter Reed as an intern, resident and fellow beginning in 2003. He was transferred to Fort Hood as a practicing psychiatrist in July and was set to leave soon for Afghanistan. According to a relative, he had asked not to be deployed. It is not known whether he ever sought conscientious-objector status.

Maj. Gen. Gina S. Farrisee, the Army's personnel chief, said in an interview Monday that because of the investigation, she and other Army officials could not discuss whether Hasan had officially asked to quit the service or not to be deployed. However, she and another Army official said it would be highly unusual for officers with Hasan's rank and medical training to be allowed to resign, given their service obligation.

'Potential implications'
Investigators are examining Hasan's religious beliefs, whether he harbored extremist views, and whether he was in contact with others who may have encouraged violence against U.S. troops.

The title of Hasan's PowerPoint presentation was "The Koranic World View As It Relates to Muslims in the U.S. Military." It consisted of 50 slides. In one slide, Hasan described the presentation's objectives as identifying "what the Koran inculcates in the minds of Muslims and the potential implications this may have for the U.S. military."

He also sought to "describe the nature of the religious conflicts that Muslims" who serve in the U.S. military may have and to persuade the Army to identify these individuals.

Other slides delved into the history of Islam, its tenets, statistics about the number of Muslims in the military, and explanations of "offensive jihad," or holy war.

Another slide suggested ways to draw out Muslim troops: "It must be hard for you to balance Islamic beliefs that might be conflicting with current war; feelings of guilt; Is it what you expected."

Hasan's presentation lasted about an hour. It is unclear whether he read out loud every point on each slide. If typical procedures were followed, his adviser would have supervised the development of his project, said people familiar with the practice.


The final three slides indicate that Hasan referred to Osama bin Laden, the Taliban, suicide bombers and Iran.

Under a slide titled "Comments," he wrote: "If Muslim groups can convince Muslims that they are fighting for God against injustices of the 'infidels'; ie: enemies of Islam, then Muslims can become a potent adversary ie: suicide bombing, etc." [sic]

The last bullet point on that page reads simply: "We love death more then [sic] you love life!"

Under the "Conclusions" page, Hasan wrote that "Fighting to establish an Islamic State to please God, even by force, is condoned by the Islam," and that "Muslim Soldiers should not serve in any capacity that renders them at risk to hurting/killing believers unjustly — will vary!"

The final page, labeled "Recommendation," contained only one suggestion:

"Department of Defense should allow Muslims [sic] Soldiers the option of being released as 'Conscientious objectors' to increase troop morale and decrease adverse events."
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Don't you wonder why muslims join the United States Military at all? If it is so very offending to their core beliefs, why enter into a VOLUNTARY service that is so contrary? Our issues with mid-east countries are not new and anyone entering the armed services in ANY capacity certainly knows this.

On their app. they should state: 'I want to wear the uniform, but I don't want to have to do my job.'
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Old 11-10-2009, 08:22   #244
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Originally Posted by kimberly View Post
Obama went golfing
Bush went to the hospitals to visit the wounded

Obama says give Hasan the benefit of the doubt
Bush would most likely say string him up and make an example of him.

Hmmm

Mr. Hollywood has some learnin' to do.
I think everyone needs to take a step back, as far as Obama showing up at Ft Hood. In my personal opinion, the absolute LAST thing that base needed was to have Obama show up there right after the attack. They had enough going on without having to worry about the added headache of Secret Service etc. I have been on a base that had to deal with a last minute drop in of the President and it consumes a whole lot of senior people's time that would be better utilized in dealing with the families, the injured etc...

I remember President Bush took a whole lot of flack in the news when the P-3 Crew that emergency landed in China, were brought home, and he wasn't there to greet them. He said everyone had enough to worry about, he didn't want to add to it, and I praised him for that view.

We may not like Obama very much, but there is more than enough things we can harp on him about, I don't think him not showing up at Ft Hood is one of them. I think it was a good call. My .02 worth
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Old 11-10-2009, 08:39   #245
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Agreed.
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Old 11-10-2009, 08:46   #246
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I think everyone needs to take a step back, as far as Obama showing up at Ft Hood. In my personal opinion, the absolute LAST thing that base needed was to have Obama show up there right after the attack. They had enough going on without having to worry about the added headache of Secret Service etc. I have been on a base that had to deal with a last minute drop in of the President and it consumes a whole lot of senior people's time that would be better utilized in dealing with the families, the injured etc...

I remember President Bush took a whole lot of flack in the news when the P-3 Crew that emergency landed in China, were brought home, and he wasn't there to greet them. He said everyone had enough to worry about, he didn't want to add to it, and I praised him for that view.

We may not like Obama very much, but there is more than enough things we can harp on him about, I don't think him not showing up at Ft Hood is one of them. I think it was a good call. My .02 worth
I don't think showing up at Fort Hood is what people expect. It's the way he is handling himself is what I have a gripe with. His priorities, demeanor and what he says could use a wakeup call.
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Old 11-10-2009, 09:04   #247
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I don't think showing up at Fort Hood is what people expect. It's the way he is handling himself is what I have a gripe with. His priorities, demeanor and what he says could use a wakeup call.
You mean like praising conference attendees, mistaking a Medal of Freedom for a Medal of Honor recipient, and offering shout-outs to his buds for 2:30 before mentioning 43 casualties of a Muslim terrorist?

TR
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Old 11-10-2009, 09:09   #248
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The President is the CinC

The President is the Commander in Chief.

The CinC should be at the memorial service. Lets see the focus of what he says. Does it stay in the "memorial tone", does it become a lecture on how we should behave with Muslims or does it hit a number of "I" spots?

We'll see - I would hope it stays in the "memorial tone".

But thats just me.
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Old 11-10-2009, 09:14   #249
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You mean like praising conference attendees, mistaking a Medal of Freedom for a Medal of Honor recipient, and offering shout-outs to his buds for 2:30 before mentioning 43 casualties of a Muslim terrorist?

TR
Bingo..........

AFChick

You are right and he did not need to go as far as I am concerned.

He did not do him self any good by how he started it out.......Conf, Golf, etc....
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Old 11-10-2009, 09:16   #250
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Bingo..........

AFChick

You are right and he did not need to go as far as I am concerned.

He did not do him self any good by how he started it out.......Conf, Golf, etc....
I agreee wholeheartedly. I don't see it getting much better, unfortunately
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Old 11-10-2009, 09:16   #251
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I'm glad I'm not the POTUS - all I have to worry about is my wife getting on me for 'adjusting' myself in public while everybody else seems to be too polite to point out my shortcomings.

And so it goes...

Richard's $.02
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Old 11-10-2009, 09:19   #252
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It's the way he is handling himself is what I have a gripe with. His priorities, demeanor and what he says could use a wakeup call.
The exact same thing was said of GWB post Katrina.

Presidential 'visits' are a major PIA, just as the residents of Key Biscayne how they felt once Nixon was gone.

Some people have a problem with expressing emotion and some people don't have able mature advisors around them to make sure they say the correct things, at the correct times. Not that it makes it right, but it is an observation.
AM

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Old 11-10-2009, 11:57   #253
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You mean like praising conference attendees, mistaking a Medal of Freedom for a Medal of Honor recipient, and offering shout-outs to his buds for 2:30 before mentioning 43 casualties of a Muslim terrorist?

TR
Exactly what I mean.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete View Post
The President is the Commander in Chief.

The CinC should be at the memorial service. Lets see the focus of what he says. Does it stay in the "memorial tone", does it become a lecture on how we should behave with Muslims or does it hit a number of "I" spots?

We'll see - I would hope it stays in the "memorial tone".

But thats just me.
I agree. Will it be all about him, or about those who have earned recognition and our high esteem?

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Originally Posted by SF_BHT View Post
Bingo..........

He did not do him self any good by how he started it out.......Conf, Golf, etc....
Exactly. My view as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by armymom1228 View Post
... .

Some people have a problem with expressing emotion and some people don't have able mature advisors around them to make sure they say the correct things, at the correct times. Not that it makes it right, but it is an observation.
AM
I agree, but with every citizen in the United States of America at his disposal, one would think he could surround himself with the maturity in enough people to do the job efficiently, with honor, and without being so narcissistic.
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Old 11-10-2009, 18:24   #254
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Well, I'm sitting out here at THE most luxurious spa and resort in Texas, USASMA at Fort Bliss. I watched the whole memorial service and thought it was very well done.
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Old 11-10-2009, 21:41   #255
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Not once did the POTUS look into the faces of those at Fort Hood. He moved from side to side (teleprompter to teleprompter) never once looking forward into the crowd. Every so ofter he glanced off to the side of his tele, but not once out into the service men and women standing before him.

Whoever wrote his speech did an OK job though.

My opinion.
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"Political correctness: A need to avoid stepping on toes that in reality should be blown off the foot." ~me
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