Rise of the Warrior Cop

[Sdiver]

I remember growing up when cops were meant to "Serve and Protect."
Now it seems they've changed their strips. They're more along the lines of, "To Scare and Intimidate."

Scenes from a militarized America: Iowa family TERRORIZED! (Video)

Watch this video, taken from a police raid in Des Moines, Iowa. Send it to some people. When critics (like me) warn about the dangers of police militarization, this is what we’re talking about. You’ll see the raid team, dressed in battle-dress uniforms, helmets and face-covering balaclava hoods take down the family’s door with a battering ram.

You’ll see them storm the home with ballistics shields, guns at the ready. More troubling still, you’ll see not one but two officers attempt to prevent the family from having an independent record of the raid, one by destroying a surveillance camera, another by blocking another camera’s lens.

Link with video ..... http://www.thefederalistpapers.org/u...rrorized-video

[TacOfficer]

I don't expect much empathy, but the scenario law enforcement finds itself in has evolved.

Mayberry has fallen. Domestic terrorism exists. Happy anniversary Boston.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/04/15...g-anniversary/

Of course, the police over reacted with long guns and pistols chasing two poor immigrant boys around town that were just expressing their first amendment rights, maybe the second amendment too. They were about to turn their lives around. I'm sure the MIT officer's family feels bad that his killer, whoops I mean the oppressed citizen, was offended by all that militarized police presence (http://tech.mit.edu/V133/N19/policeman.html).

Foreign terrorism on US soil is just a myth. It would never happen here, not with our "Dear Leader" at the controls. Hasn't he restarted and made friends with all those misunderstood nations that support misunderstood individuals looking for an outlet for their feelings.


I'm sure the armed forces feel they have all the resources they need to prevent a domestic attack. Police don't even need to be armed. Look how well it's working out for the Brits, nobody has a gun there. Just try to avoid taking the underground (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_Jul...ondon_bombings), or African immigrants with kitchen knives (http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2013/m...ident-woolwich) .

The men and women I serve with could care less if a hippy or some low life wants to smoke a little weed to forget his troubles. We are engaged with an organized adversary that is well funded, armed and entrenched in communities.

I agree with all that say that the application of force must be measured and appropriate to the circumstance. I also agree that excessive force should always be brought to light for accountability. I am a big supporter of the second amendment. A well armed citizenry will give pause to the predatory criminal. But if you think police should be armed with smile and a ticket book, unable to defend the citizens they swore to protect, themselves and come best prepared, I don't think anyone would take the job and throw away their life.

If all you want is a report taker, or social worker, we'll be happy to appease your wishes. Let the citizens take their stand, after all it's granny's right to self defense and she doesn't need any help at all while the two local boy's choirs settle their disagreement on who gets control of the fund raising corner. Just call us when it's over and we'll give you a report for you records.

Oh and we might be a little late because everyone knows that we ain't goin' till the last doughnut's done.

[PSM]

Originally Posted by TacOfficer

I don't expect much empathy, but the scenario law enforcement finds itself in has evolved.

Mayberry has fallen. Domestic terrorism exists. Happy anniversary Boston.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/04/15...g-anniversary/

Of course, the police over reacted with long guns and pistols chasing two poor immigrant boys around town that were just expressing their first amendment rights, maybe the second amendment too. They were about to turn their lives around. I'm sure the MIT officer's family feels bad that his killer, whoops I mean the oppressed citizen, was offended by all that militarized police presence (http://tech.mit.edu/V133/N19/policeman.html).

Foreign terrorism on US soil is just a myth. It would never happen here, not with our "Dear Leader" at the controls. Hasn't he restarted and made friends with all those misunderstood nations that support misunderstood individuals looking for an outlet for their feelings.


I'm sure the armed forces feel they have all the resources they need to prevent a domestic attack. Police don't even need to be armed. Look how well it's working out for the Brits, nobody has a gun there. Just try to avoid taking the underground (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_Jul...ondon_bombings), or African immigrants with kitchen knives (http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2013/m...ident-woolwich) .

The men and women I serve with could care less if a hippy or some low life wants to smoke a little weed to forget his troubles. We are engaged with an organized adversary that is well funded, armed and entrenched in communities.

I agree with all that say that the application of force must be measured and appropriate to the circumstance. I also agree that excessive force should always be brought to light for accountability. I am a big supporter of the second amendment. A well armed citizenry will give pause to the predatory criminal. But if you think police should be armed with smile and a ticket book, unable to defend the citizens they swore to protect, themselves and come best prepared, I don't think anyone would take the job and throw away their life.

If all you want is a report taker, or social worker, we'll be happy to appease your wishes. Let the citizens take their stand, after all it's granny's right to self defense and she doesn't need any help at all while the two local boy's choirs settle their disagreement on who gets control of the fund raising corner. Just call us when it's over and we'll give you a report for you records.

Oh and we might be a little late because everyone knows that we ain't goin' till the last doughnut's done.

I'm sure that some of that rant was supposed to be in pink font.

Some of the points you made are valid, but you left out the part where Political Correctness has placed less-than-capable officers on the force. And some of those are now Chiefs.

Pat

[badshot]

Have to say you have a point and made it well. I know there have to be cells here....

Oops - Just noticed there's a keylogger on my tablet...

It has just gotten too out of control...and they win. If only we looked to Israel for counter terror and implemented it - not PC enough.

Where ever you are the citizens should be proud to have men like you.

[TacOfficer]

Thank you,
I agree with you both. PC has killed our department, not to mention the corruption that rules Chicago.

[miclo18d]

Originally Posted by TacOfficer

I don't expect much empathy, but the scenario law enforcement finds itself in has evolved.

Mayberry has fallen. Domestic terrorism exists. Happy anniversary Boston.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/04/15...g-anniversary/

Of course, the police over reacted with long guns and pistols chasing two poor immigrant boys around town that were just expressing their first amendment rights, maybe the second amendment too. They were about to turn their lives around. I'm sure the MIT officer's family feels bad that his killer, whoops I mean the oppressed citizen, was offended by all that militarized police presence (http://tech.mit.edu/V133/N19/policeman.html).

Foreign terrorism on US soil is just a myth. It would never happen here, not with our "Dear Leader" at the controls. Hasn't he restarted and made friends with all those misunderstood nations that support misunderstood individuals looking for an outlet for their feelings.


I'm sure the armed forces feel they have all the resources they need to prevent a domestic attack. Police don't even need to be armed. Look how well it's working out for the Brits, nobody has a gun there. Just try to avoid taking the underground (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_Jul...ondon_bombings), or African immigrants with kitchen knives (http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2013/m...ident-woolwich) .

The men and women I serve with could care less if a hippy or some low life wants to smoke a little weed to forget his troubles. We are engaged with an organized adversary that is well funded, armed and entrenched in communities.

I agree with all that say that the application of force must be measured and appropriate to the circumstance. I also agree that excessive force should always be brought to light for accountability. I am a big supporter of the second amendment. A well armed citizenry will give pause to the predatory criminal. But if you think police should be armed with smile and a ticket book, unable to defend the citizens they swore to protect, themselves and come best prepared, I don't think anyone would take the job and throw away their life.

If all you want is a report taker, or social worker, we'll be happy to appease your wishes. Let the citizens take their stand, after all it's granny's right to self defense and she doesn't need any help at all while the two local boy's choirs settle their disagreement on who gets control of the fund raising corner. Just call us when it's over and we'll give you a report for you records.

Oh and we might be a little late because everyone knows that we ain't goin' till the last doughnut's done.

[rant: on]

"Mayberry has fallen, domestic terrorism exists" - and by militarizing the police you create the self licking ice cream cone. The preverbal self fulfilling prophecy by creating the world that the 'domestic terrorists' see by the militarization of the police. McVeigh blew up that building because he believed the police were becoming militarized which made the police militarized. Yay, the world changed! Let's just be communists while were in the game of fundamentally changing everything!

I guess you forgot when the oppressed immigrant boys were being sought, all of the 4th amendment protections of the citizens of the area being violated. The fact that their 2nd amendment rights have already been revoked so that they have to depend on the militarized police force to kick in their own doors to look for the extremely dangerous kid hiding in a boat. Then shooting said UNARMED criminal in the name of officer safety (probably while doing the PMMA - Police Modified Mexican Ambush).

If the shoe fits Officer Fife...

I can take care of any terrorists and bombs on my street, not sure if you and your tacticool ninjas can say the same. He'll, your fellow federal agents can't even police up a herd of cows.

If your job description and oath doesn't include "jack booted thug" or "constitutional rapist" in it then make sure that you're not acting like it.

I think you've mistaken this thread as a bust on cops thread. It's more like a 'when the hell did cops become commandos?' thread.


[/rant: off]

[TacOfficer]

Post edited.

[TacOfficer]

Originally Posted by miclo18d

[rant: on]

"Mayberry has fallen, domestic terrorism exists" - and by militarizing the police you create the self licking ice cream cone. The preverbal self fulfilling prophecy by creating the world that the 'domestic terrorists' see by the militarization of the police. McVeigh blew up that building because he believed the police were becoming militarized which made the police militarized. Yay, the world changed! Let's just be communists while were in the game of fundamentally changing everything!

I guess you forgot when the oppressed immigrant boys were being sought, all of the 4th amendment protections of the citizens of the area being violated. The fact that their 2nd amendment rights have already been revoked so that they have to depend on the militarized police force to kick in their own doors to look for the extremely dangerous kid hiding in a boat. Then shooting said UNARMED criminal in the name of officer safety (probably while doing the PMMA - Police Modified Mexican Ambush).

If the shoe fits Officer Fife...

I can take care of any terrorists and bombs on my street, not sure if you and your tacticool ninjas can say the same. He'll, your fellow federal agents can't even police up a herd of cows.

If your job description and oath doesn't include "jack booted thug" or "constitutional rapist" in it then make sure that you're not acting like it.

I think you've mistaken this thread as a bust on cops thread. It's more like a 'when the hell did cops become commandos?' thread.


[/rant: off]

McVeigh was a psychopath that took it upon himself to avenge the deaths of Ruby Ridge and Waco buy killing 168 men, women and children and wounding over 600.
I'm not what you call one of his fans.


If your argument is that the perceptions of the police justify or incite violent antisocial behavior, then I fail to follow your logic to its end.


I suppose you forgot the rule concerning "Exigent circumstances"? Yes, I would like the police combing through my neighborhood looking for the offenders who blew up the Boston Marathon. I must admit I'm not aware of the MSM posting the citizen's complaints because the police were violating their rights.


I would have loved to try Aunt Bea's homemade pie.


I'm sure you can take of yourself, I'm willing to bet that most on this forum have the right mindset and formal training to address the threat, however we also serve those that are unable or unwilling. As for the cow thing, one of the few time I agree with the Feds, they chose to de-escalate a situation that had the potential for loss of life over back fees and steak.


Heck, I was never issued those boots and frankly they don't seem comfortable, though the mounted unit uses them.


I have seen my share of extremist over play the "Constitution" card as much as others play the "Race" card. Sometimes all at once! I serve, protect and defend everyone's constitutional rights. I don't disagree that there is over zealous and sometimes criminal behavior by the Feds i.e: Fast and Furious or police i.e Abbate (our local politically connected idiot). Believe it or not in my opinion, our biggest issue in the department are those hired either by PC or cronyism that are absolute dogs. They wouldn't get off their butts to save the proverbial "Granny", let alone make the effort to violate somebody's rights.


It did seem to be going that way, I do not take offense when abuses are brought to light. Every house needs to be cleaned. Police aren't commando's, agreed. To ignore or not be prepared to respond to the threat is foolish. Just because someone doesn't like the image of a policeman carrying an AR with body amour, doesn't mean I'm going to an active shooter or gang shooting in my dress blues with my dad's Colt six shooter. The police were caught with their pants down during the North Hollywood, CA bank robbery. I wouldn't call it self-fulfilling, I would call it lesson learned.

[Streck-Fu]

RE: Boston bombing.
In spite of all that manpower, helicopters with FLIR, hours of searching, APCs with turrets, house to house searches, a home owner found him in the boat after the police searched the area and called it clear....

If the police want to justify the military equipment and tactics as necessary to ensuring the public safety, then it needs to be successful during the most public display of such a need. What we took away from that search is that even with all that tacticool technology, they still can't catch a wounded bleeding kid.

[miclo18d]

Tell that to the family that was hit with a "SWAT" team in Iowa for harboring 2 suspected of credit fraud.

I think we've already had the discussion here about 'use it or loose it' mentality of "SWAT" teams.

Exigency and Terry stops can be construed to just about anything to include violation of the constitution under the guise that it was a Supreme Court ruling therefor cops will use them to only bust criminals and when they stop Joe Citizen on the street they WON'T use those rules. Or is it PoPo's discretion? That's like congress making laws that allow them insider trading. Rule for thee, not for me.

I'll bet you call Joe Citizens "civilians" don't you? Like you are in some other class than we are. Above the law much?

A sheriffs deputy (for another county) just moved in down the street from us. I thought, awesome, we have a LEO in our neighborhood! The first time I saw the guy he was stealing water from the lot next door to water his lawn! Now what would a cop do if that had been me stealing that water? What is my recourse for that? Call my county's deputies? Riiiiiiiiight! Piss of a neighbor AND a cop!

Another time when my wife rolled a stop sign, the cop came up to her with huge attitude until he realized that she had called me and I was listening on speaker phone. His attitude changed quickly. (The fact that he said not all 4 tires came to a stop made me laugh. How many did come to a stop officer? 2...3?)

If there were hundreds and hundreds of stories of soldiers taking ears and shooting noncombatants were pervading the news, I'd bet you would have a lot to say about that. I could tell you I wouldn't be defending that. I would have run from the military. "Good" people do bad things. Cops, soldiers, doctors, garbage men. There will always be bad apples. But when your whole system has been corrupted.... What then?

I hope as you write your rebuttal you search your soul and ensure that you have NEVER used your position for gain.... Whether a free donut, gotten your wife's number while writing her a ticket, or bent the law to catch a criminal! I spent your tax dollars wisely when deployed. I completed every mission lawfully AND morally (sometimes even lawful orders are not moral orders). I did that not for your sake, but for the sake of my soul.

[MR2]

I am disturbed by the tone of some of the comments. Opinions are fine, but too many are frankly, personal attacks.

[The Reaper]

I agree.

We have one of the most rigorous selection processes in the world, and we still have our 5% who should not be SF.

Like it or not, LE has a large percentage of people who want to protect the sheep, and a few who joined for the gun, the badge, and the authority to abuse. Unfortunately, those people tend to gravitate toward tactical units.

While Andy and Barney never had al Qaeda getting off the bus in downtown Mayberry, they also never breached anyone's door on a 0430 no knock service at the wrong address after killing the family dog with an MP-5SD.

My personal opinion is that having military gear makes it more likely that it is going to be used. When this happens, the odds are that innocents are going to be hurt.

This compromises the ability of LE to build trust and confidence in the community. IMHO, the hearts and minds of the public (and their support) are worth far more than a few million dollars of surplus military gear and a high-speed, low-drag tactical unit pulling violent raids on American citizens' homes in the wee hours.

Just my .02, YMMV.

TR

[Streck-Fu]

My personal opinion is that having military gear makes it more likely that it is going to be used. When this happens, the odds are that innocents are going to be hurt.

This compromises the ability of LE to build trust and confidence in the community.

The community trust would not suffer so much damage if more Chiefs and administrators would offer apologies, mea culpas, and compensation when those officers do raid the wrong house and shoot the family dog that is fear barking. But the majority of reports show an unapologetic administrator stating that the officers did nothing wrong and merely had bad information.

"Sorry but that druggie we arrested last month claimed to buy it at 115 Maple when he now says he meant 117 Maple. Sorry we didn't have time to verify his claim before sending in SWAT because this is time sensitive information......"

That is evidence that the problem is more systemic than being a small percentage of yahoo low hanging fruit individually abusing their authority.

[TacOfficer]

Originally Posted by miclo18d

Tell that to the family that was hit with a "SWAT" team in Iowa for harboring 2 suspected of credit fraud.

I think we've already had the discussion here about 'use it or loose it' mentality of "SWAT" teams.

Exigency and Terry stops can be construed to just about anything to include violation of the constitution under the guise that it was a Supreme Court ruling therefor cops will use them to only bust criminals and when they stop Joe Citizen on the street they WON'T use those rules. Or is it PoPo's discretion? That's like congress making laws that allow them insider trading. Rule for thee, not for me.

I'll bet you call Joe Citizens "civilians" don't you? Like you are in some other class than we are. Above the law much?

A sheriffs deputy (for another county) just moved in down the street from us. I thought, awesome, we have a LEO in our neighborhood! The first time I saw the guy he was stealing water from the lot next door to water his lawn! Now what would a cop do if that had been me stealing that water? What is my recourse for that? Call my county's deputies? Riiiiiiiiight! Piss of a neighbor AND a cop!

Another time when my wife rolled a stop sign, the cop came up to her with huge attitude until he realized that she had called me and I was listening on speaker phone. His attitude changed quickly. (The fact that he said not all 4 tires came to a stop made me laugh. How many did come to a stop officer? 2...3?)

If there were hundreds and hundreds of stories of soldiers taking ears and shooting noncombatants were pervading the news, I'd bet you would have a lot to say about that. I could tell you I wouldn't be defending that. I would have run from the military. "Good" people do bad things. Cops, soldiers, doctors, garbage men. There will always be bad apples. But when your whole system has been corrupted.... What then?

I hope as you write your rebuttal you search your soul and ensure that you have NEVER used your position for gain.... Whether a free donut, gotten your wife's number while writing her a ticket, or bent the law to catch a criminal! I spent your tax dollars wisely when deployed. I completed every mission lawfully AND morally (sometimes even lawful orders are not moral orders). I did that not for your sake, but for the sake of my soul.

I finally got around to watching the Iowa video.

First off, the police were wearing what looked like Tru-spec green uniforms and clearly marked police vests, not ACUs or camouflage Ninja pajamas. Every yahoo with a credit card and dial-up connection can order those.

Security cameras? Yes an officer clearly disabled those. If you were part of a search warrant team, would you want the targets (we use the term target for the subjects of a search warrant wether it be a person, place or thing) having prior knowledge of your entry. It might just compromise the whole premise and even though some have batted "officer safety" around here like it's a four letter word, it's the highest priority to officers. Not something we take lightly.

As for the "poor family being terrorized" by the big bad police, Ma Kettle wasn't Good House Keeping's homemaker of the year. The "terrorized family" was running a drug house with a sophisticated surveillance system. Poor Jr. was hiding in the bathroom in fear of his life? Really? Would it be a fair assumption that he was flushing contraband down the toilet or did he think they were getting burglarized, hid in the bathroom with a pistol while he left his mother and associates in the open to defend themselves?

The the amusing part was when he related that he holstered his weapon and sat down with his hands folded. He stopped just short of saying "just like I do in church". That might have been even a bit much for him.

Let's not forget the two in-custody. First one had an arrest warrant related to a probation violation on a charge that was already convicted and sentenced for. The second was charged as a result of the search warrant, not with simple possession as in his own personal stash, but possession with intent to deliver. Police usually just call it "Delivery" for short. Now to get those charges approved or charged in court you have to established that there was a large enough quantity of narcotics that was being/had been packaged for distribution.

Jr. isn't in custody because had the opportunity to flush his contraband due to the fact the Police DID knock and announce a search warrant. Now he gets to play the saintly innocent child while exploiting his mother as a prop during an media interview.

Yea, I would like to have the opportunity to explain a couple of things to them. Furthermore, if they are receiving any of my tax dollars, I want them cut off and evicted. Give it to a needy family that isn't using it for criminal enterprise seed money.

[badshot]

Originally Posted by Streck-Fu

shoot the family dog that is fear barking.

God help anyone that shoots little dogs...