New Army (rifle) marksmanship manual

[frostfire]

https://rdl.train.army.mil/catalog-w.../TCx3-22.9.pdf

Very robust and light years beyond the previous manual.
It only takes several decades to adopt tried-n-true techniques from competitive disciplines.
If you've shot PRS, 2 gun, 3 gun, high power, long range, tactical,USASOC matches, etc. nothing new there, but I am glad to see big army catching on. Let's see how the pistol manual looks like and if it's up to TS standard!


Still, no mag on the ground

[Papa Zero Three]

Originally Posted by frostfire

https://rdl.train.army.mil/catalog-w.../TCx3-22.9.pdf


Still, no mag on the ground

Check page 6-24, the NOTE on the bottom of the page says you can place the magazine on the ground when prone unsupported.

[Team Sergeant]

Originally Posted by Papa Zero Three

Check page 6-24, the NOTE on the bottom of the page says you can place the magazine on the ground when prone unsupported.

Very, very bad idea.

A barrel is like a tuning fork and makes the same vibrations every time it's fired. And like a tuning fork if it struck while touching something else it does not have the same tune (vibration).

Besides that if you're placing pressure on the mag while firing you're asking for a jammed weapon.

But what do I know.....

[Papa Zero Three]

Originally Posted by Team Sergeant

Very, very bad idea.

A barrel is like a tuning fork and makes the same vibrations every time it's fired. And like a tuning fork if it struck while touching something else it does not have the same tune (vibration).

Besides that if you're placing pressure on the mag while firing you're asking for a jammed weapon.

But what do I know.....

Barrel harmonics are not affected by placing the magazine on the ground. I know it's an old rule of thumb about mags on the ground but the facts are that placing the magazine on the ground doesn't induce malfunctions...but that still doesn't keep some people from repeating that old wives tale. This I know.

[Leozinho]

Barrel harmonics aside (don't know enough to comment), I recently had the displeasure of watching young Marines trying to zero with iron sights at 25y. Shooting unsupported prone, none of them could shoot a group tight enough to even begin to know what adjustments to make.

Had they placed the mag on the ground, their groups would have tightened up enough to at least enough to make adjustments with some degree of accuracy.

(Better support from the mag on the ground would have greatly outweighed any issues with barrel harmonics.)

[Team Sergeant]

Originally Posted by Papa Zero Three

Barrel harmonics are not affected by placing the magazine on the ground. I know it's an old rule of thumb about mags on the ground but the facts are that placing the magazine on the ground doesn't induce malfunctions...but that still doesn't keep some people from repeating that old wives tale. This I know.

Originally Posted by Leozinho

Barrel harmonics aside (don't know enough to comment), I recently had the displeasure of watching young Marines trying to zero with iron sights at 25y. Shooting unsupported prone, none of them could shoot a group tight enough to even begin to know what adjustments to make.

Had they placed the mag on the ground, their groups would have tightened up enough to at least enough to make adjustments with some degree of accuracy.

(Better support from the mag on the ground would have greatly outweighed any issues with barrel harmonics.)

This was discussed before, science and all. But we can go back to placing butter on burns too.

Riddle me this, why oh why do we have "heavy barrels?"

http://www.stocks-rifle.com/harmonics.htm Just one of many harmonics/vibration discussions.

I'm guessing you both are SF snipers and 18B's?

[Joker]

This should be in the Comedy Zone.

[JJ_BPK]

Originally Posted by Papa Zero Three

Barrel harmonics are not affected by placing the magazine on the ground. I know it's an old rule of thumb about mags on the ground but the facts are that placing the magazine on the ground doesn't induce malfunctions.. but that still doesn't keep some people from repeating that old wives tale. This I know.

Maybe,, maybe not.. Some of that old wives tail has has do with lazy GI's not seating their mag completely and/or using poor aiming & mounting..

When my platoon was on the firebase (not to often ), We would have mad minutes. We would fire into the wood line using as many mags a possible.. Afterwards, I can remember partial mags laying around because they were "misfits" and "bent"..

Not really, the kids would half/a$$ insert the mag,, get a jam,, and move on to the next one.. They also would be shooting from inside bunkers,, using the window sills (usually a stack of rock hard sand bags) as a steady point,, being to lazy to use a proper shoulder mount.. They were counseled,, but kids??

AND this was with the old 20rd mags..

Had one kid, who would insist on using an AK-47, with 50rd mags. I wouldn't let him take outside the wire. He was always cursing and screaming, because the commie mags were bad,, it was his poor handling. I think he still has a SIZE problem?? I see his name in the paper every so often..

By the By,, outside the wire, without window frames,, no problemo..

[frostfire]

Originally Posted by Papa Zero Three

Check page 6-24, the NOTE on the bottom of the page says you can place the magazine on the ground when prone unsupported.

thank you for the correction