Bronze Star awarded for fighting stress

kcphoenix · 08-26-2011, 16:57

Do you feel this service is deserving of a Bronze Star? I have heard some say yes and others say it pretty much makes the Bronze Star worthless now. What are your opinions on this?

Quote:

Psychiatrist wins medal for fighting stress
Army lieutenant colonel earned Bronze Star for work in Iraq

Read more: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/201...#ixzz1WB80y8Xw

lindy · 08-26-2011, 17:04

I saw a female Navy CDR get awarded a BS because she commanded the MARG that off-loaded Marines in Thessaloníki, convoyed through Macedonia, and then into Kosovo.

She never went ashore.

greenberetTFS · 08-26-2011, 17:07

It's a medal designed for bravery in combat...........

Big Teddy

blue02hd · 08-26-2011, 17:09

BSM= Thanks for playing. Majority of them are awarded to those who never leave the FOB's.

Snaquebite · 08-26-2011, 17:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue02hd

BSM= Thanks for playing. Majority of them are awarded to those who never leave the FOB's.

BSM pretty much an MSM in a combat environment. She was NOT awarded the BSV. (Bronze Star for Valor)

As a medal it's awarded for acts of merit or meritorious service.

**The Reaper** · 08-26-2011, 18:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaquebite

BSM pretty much an MSM in a combat environment. She was NOT awarded the BSV. (Bronze Star for Valor)

As a medal it's awarded for acts of merit or meritorious service.

Exactly.

TR

blue02hd · 08-26-2011, 21:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaquebite

BSM pretty much an MSM in a combat environment. She was NOT awarded the BSV. (Bronze Star for Valor)

As a medal it's awarded for acts of merit or meritorious service.

I agree brother, but pound fer pound, I can count on my hands how many MSM recipients I know versus the MULTITUDE of BSM's I have seen awarded.

TBH though, this is an issue I cannot pretend to have an answer to fix, as I do not truly feel I can understand how broken the award system has become.

Case in point: I am noticing that the MOH is rotating through service branches lately. My shiny quarter hiding in my pocket says the next MOH will go to the Zoomies, possibly a CTT or JTAC.

Just me rambling on as I await this bitch named Irene,,,,, Stay safe all.

Snaquebite · 08-26-2011, 22:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue02hd

Just me rambling on as I await this bitch named Irene,,,,, Stay safe all.

Well at least you're here...glad to hear that. How ya been doin?

uplink5 · 08-27-2011, 10:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaquebite

BSM pretty much an MSM in a combat environment. She was NOT awarded the BSV. (Bronze Star for Valor)

As a medal it's awarded for acts of merit or meritorious service.

Agreed,
I have no problem with this at all. It's not the same for instance as some of the blanket CIBs I remember from Desert Storm, which I for one also recieved for "being there". Many of us considered it a slap in the face to those from Vietnam and earlie, for us to have recieved one, when having not really earned it in comparison to those who had.

JoeEOD · 08-27-2011, 11:26

The awarding of a bronze star has been problematic since WW II. My dad was a platoon medic and got his first one for still being there after 3 months. He got his second one after the fact, in 1947, when there was a blanket award to all holders of the combat medics badge. He had only one purple heart award despite multiple woundings because "Why would you want more than one? It just shows you can't keep your ass down"
We used to joke about officers in the Vietnam era that you could tell how long they lasted in the 101st. It seemed that you got an ARCOM at 90 days, a bronze star at 6 months, and a silver star if you completed your tour. Not so for enlisted.
As an EOD specialist I always had my awards recommendations turned down because "risking your life is just part of the job". It was a little hard to swallow when the officer refusing your awards accepts an ARCOM for doing such a great job shuffling papers at FORCECOM when he rotates! However, I had my EOD badge - which was all I cared for - even if I did get berated in the PX by "STRAC" officers for having "those foreign jumps on the wrong side of my uniform"

greenberetTFS · 08-27-2011, 16:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaquebite

BSM pretty much an MSM in a combat environment. She was NOT awarded the BSV. (Bronze Star for Valor)

As a medal it's awarded for acts of merit or meritorious service.

That's true,but how many people know that?........ All they hear is he/she was awarded the Bronze Star,and many think because of its name it was awarded for combat bravery ...........

Big Teddy

BrianH · 08-27-2011, 16:10

The sad thing is that in SF they are INCREDIBLY stingy with medals and we won't have all of the "storied" people to parade around in 20 years. No MOH's, few (if any) DSC's, VERY few Silver Stars.

The SS has become the new SF MOH, IMHO. I've read a BSM-V citation for a guy that did exactly, to the letter, what Audie Murphy did to win his MOH.

While the rest of the military hands out awards like candy, we try to over-preserve the integrity of ours.

**Airbornelawyer** · 08-28-2011, 11:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaquebite

BSM pretty much an MSM in a combat environment. She was NOT awarded the BSV. (Bronze Star for Valor)

As a medal it's awarded for acts of merit or meritorious service.

Not just pretty much. The MSM was specifically created to stop the awarding of Bronze Stars in non-combat situations.

As we can see by this thread, though, that hasn't happened. In my opinion, the basic problem is that the Bronze Star is the lowest "combat-only" award in the armed forces' award hierarchy. The problem starts with the peacetime proliferation of MSMs and ARCOMs as merit and PCS awards. So when war comes, you have all these guys who already have a bunch of MSMs and ARCOMs (and AAMs for that matter), especially in administrative commands where being closer to the brass often expedites the awards process.

So a commander have a soldier whose performance in a wartime situation probably merits an MSM or an ARCOM. But the soldier already has one or more. And even if the soldier doesn't, the issue remains that there is no way to distinguish his ARCOM for successfully leading his platoon in combat or her MSM for running a resupply operation down IED-infested highways from some other guy's ARCOM for keeping the toilet paper stocked at the officer's club during a tour at Fort Lost-in-the-Woods or MSM for making sure the PowerPoint presentation always looked nice at his general's Pentagon briefings. So the award gets pushed up to a Bronze Star for achievement, since that's the only way to distinguish the wartime from the peacetime.

My personal opinion is that there needs to be a way to distinguish the wartime awards from the peacetime ones. Take the World War I Central Powers as an example. Among many of the states that made up the German Empire, as well as in Austria-Hungary and Bulgaria, there were two ways this was done. Typically, wartime awards were "on the war ribbon", a special ribbon solely for wartime awards (and sometimes even different ribbons for combatants and non-combatants). Austria-Hungary and Bulgaria also used a wreath of laurels or oakleaves as a war decoration on several of their decorations. Crossed swords also typically indicated a combat award. They still had their problems. The "war ribbon" was typically the same ribbon for different awards. Thus, the Prussians used the Iron Cross ribbon for war awards of at least six other decorations and the Austrians the ribbon of their Bravery Medal for at least four other decorations.

I think the "V" device to some extent performs thsi role in the Navy and Marine Corps. While the Army treats the "V" as distinguishing valor awards from those for combat achievement, the Navy treats the "V" as a "Combat Distinguishing Device", and authorizes it for the Legion of Merit and for commendation and achievement medals even for achievement if the achievement is in a combat situation. If you limited the "V" to valor awards and had another device for combat merit awards, you might have a way of addressing the issue.

Of course, the simpler course would be to stop diminishing the medals for achievement with so many peacetime awards, but the genie's already out of that bottle.

gagners · 08-29-2011, 06:12

...because people always have something to say about them, and rarely is it for the good of the soldier.

As the current BN S1 (FML), I hear "Well, I'm a CSM and have never received an MSM"... My response "So, how does your ERB affect the service performed by this 1SG, CSM?" Answer: It doesn't.

Or there's the "But was he REALLY in danger?" Spoken by a staff officer on an awards board for a BSM w/ V that we submitted in Afghanistan. My internal monologue (which ended up coming out of my lips): "No, dick. He only lives at a patrol base, devoid of power, water, and electricty, surrounded by Taliban infested mountains, and his unit has been in more TICs than the rest of the BN and dropped more JDAMs than the rest of the BDE. Maybe he wasn't in danger during this particular incident... How the office, BTW?" (we were both CPTs)

And then there's "awards boards". What a crock of sh*t that is. IMHO, awards boards were created because commanders are either a) "too busy" to deal with the pile of awards that come across their desk to accomplish one of the FEW THINGS reserved only for commanders (approve/deny) awards or b) they're too lazy.

Command is the only time you can promote soldiers by a swipe of the pen, meter out UCMJ, and approve awards. I have seen, and sat on, far too many awards boards to think that they have a legitimate place in our Army. Many, if not most, are staffed by officers and NCOs who are either so far removed from what's occurring on the ground and therefore cannot accurately judge awards, or they have just finished drinking a tall glass of hater-ade and get the "I'm a CPT, why would an E4 get the same service award as me?"

But the BSM mentioned in the OP seems legit, based on what is in AR 600-8-22:

"The Bronze Star Medal may be awarded for meritorious achievement or meritorious service"

"Title 10, United States Code, section 1133, (10 USC 1133) limits award of the Bronze Star Medal to service members receiving imminent danger pay."

More often than not, rank plays a role in the service award given. Don't get me started on that.

Last year in AFG, the 101st DIV CDR completely stopped the award of MSMs in theatre, which was nice to see.

I could rant about awards for days... But I'll spare you...

alright4u · 08-29-2011, 22:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaquebite

BSM pretty much an MSM in a combat environment. She was NOT awarded the BSV. (Bronze Star for Valor)

As a medal it's awarded for acts of merit or meritorious service.

The BSM for Achievement is an officer's good conduct medal in wartime these days. Even in RVN, MD's received them as did nurses.