Shooting with IBA

ccruic · 02-07-2011, 19:09

Hope this is the right forum. Im trying to get some tips on shooting while wearing an IBA. I can consistently put nickel size groups @ 300m in the prone, but once I go kneeling my form is shot to hell

(no pun intended). I just cant seem to get the weapon in the pocket; it ends up either on my bicep or sliding around on the IBA. Any tips?

NoRoadtrippin · 02-07-2011, 19:44

Nickel size groups with an M4/AR style weapon at 300m? That's way under MOA. Some pretty impressive shooting for a rifle designed to be a 3-5 MOA weapon.

**Peregrino** · 02-07-2011, 20:00

I'm very impressed. I've got a couple of reasonably accurate rifles and I can't seem to get them to group smaller than about 2.5" at 300M. And that's on a no-wind day without IBA on. (My eyes must be getting old!)

If you're engaging targets at 300M stick with prone or some varient of supported. Otherwise move the buttstock closer to centerline of your IBA. Putting a friction enhancing buttpad on will also help - if you're willing to accept tradeoffs in handling. That or modify your IBA by adding a high friction surface or putting a pouch outboard of where your buttstock rests. Lots of potential solutions, you just have to experiment until you find one that works without too much PITA (everything involves compromise - what are you willing to put up with?).

ccruic · 02-07-2011, 21:21

Roger. Granted this was on a VERY good day with no wind and prone supported... The weather being overcast also helps because I can crank the CCO down to get lower MOA dot. Obviously ideal conditions

. The buttstock is probably a no-go due to SOP (line infantry company), but I will definitely try the other tips. Thanks for the heads up!

**Peregrino** · 02-07-2011, 21:38

Hmmm. That's even more interesting. I can't get a 4" group at 100 yds with an M-68. Even dialed down, the dot is too big for old eyes. The Gods have smiled on you young Jedi. Join the AMU before they change their mind. (There's a reason the Greeks personified the Fates as women!)

Friction enhancing buttpad can be as simple as quality (3M) skateboard tape. Virtually invisible (until it gets dirty then almost impossible to get clean), relatively cheap, and removeable for in-ranks inspections. It will however accelerate wear of anything it comes in contact with.

J8127 · 02-07-2011, 21:42

Thats .27 MOA out of a 4 MOA gun, with a 4 MOA red-dot. That's literally unbelievably good.

Ramirez · 02-08-2011, 17:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoRoadtrippin

Nickel size groups with an M4/AR style weapon at 300m? That's way under MOA. Some pretty impressive shooting for a rifle designed to be a 3-5 MOA weapon.

3-5 MOA? Most I've seen were 1-2MOA.

And yeah nickel groups at 300yards seems like some sharp shooting.

**Peregrino** · 02-08-2011, 18:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramirez

3-5 MOA? Most I've seen were 1-2MOA.

Concur. That is unless the particular weapon was severely abused.

**The Reaper** · 02-08-2011, 19:03

M855 ammo is not able to reliably produce less than 3 MOA groups. In fact, the AMU has to test a variety of lots to select the most accurate possible for their use. A rack issued service rifle is probably a 2 MOA weapon at best. We won't even get into the error of the optic or fact that the reticle subtends roughly 12" at 300 meters.

The odds of you "consistently" producing five shot groups under 1/3 MOA at 300 yards from the supported prone with an issue rifle and ammunition and a CCO are roughly the same as me consistently winning the next several consecutive Powerball drawings.

I agree, you should quit your day job and start preparing for Camp Perry.

This is not a good place to try and BS people.

TR

Ramirez · 02-08-2011, 22:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Reaper

M855 ammo is not reliably able to produce less than 3 MOA groups. In fact, the AMU has to test a variety of lots to select the most accurate possible for their use. A rack issued service rifle is probably a 2 MOA weapon at best. We won't even get into the error of the optic or fact that the reticle subtends roughly 12" at 300 meters.

The odds of you "consistently" producing five shot groups under 1/3 MOA at 300 yards from the supported prone with an issue rifle and ammunition and a CCO are roughly the same as me consistently winning the next several consecutive Powerball drawings.

I agree, you should quit your day job and start preparing for Camp Perry.

This is not a good place to try and BS people.

TR

I just ordered 1000 rounds of M855. It's from American Tactical. It should be in this week, I'll chrono it and see how it fairs in groups w/ my 16" DDM4. I'm zeroed at 50 with my eotech, but I've shot it out to 500 yards w/ a 3x magnifier using 75g TAP.

NoRoadtrippin · 02-10-2011, 14:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramirez

3-5 MOA? Most I've seen were 1-2MOA.

My OP was based on a comment made by the AWG instructors during CATC at Benning a couple of years ago. It might have been in reference to the contracted margin of error that the weapons are allowed. They might start of a bit better than 3-5. I believe he also meant it to reference the total package. I.e. in conjunction, the weapon, optic, and round is supposed to be a 3-5 minute system. Some of course might get more out of it than others can conjure.

Surgicalcric · 02-07-2011, 23:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by ccruic

I can consistently put nickel size groups @ 300m

Quote:

Originally Posted by ccruic

Roger. Granted this was on a VERY good day with no wind and prone supported... The weather being overcast also helps because I can crank the CCO down to get lower MOA dot. Obviously ideal conditions....!

So you shoot 1/4 MOA groups at 300m utilizing a 4 MOA optic from a weapon which on its best day is more than a 2 MOA gun. And this is done consistently on "VERY good days with overcast skies" which are apparently ideal conditions.

BULLSHIT!!

I have several sub MOA weapons designed for long distance engagements with 20x optics sitting in my arms room that wont shoot that well with match ammo.

If you need advice just ask for it. But dont make shit up becuase you thin it looks good, it doesnt.

Crip

REVN556 · 02-08-2011, 00:38

Are you shooting at the simulated 300m paper target that's 25m away? Then I can see you getting a nickel size grouping on a "300m" target. That's not the same....

ccruic · 02-08-2011, 02:42

Quote:

And this is done consistently on "VERY good days with overcast skies" which are apparently ideal conditions.

As I said before, this allows me to get a fine dot on the CCO allowing greater accuracy.

Quote:

But dont make shit up becuase you thin it looks good, it doesnt.

I came here for advice about shooting with the IBA. Maybe I should have left out all the "fluff" and been more direct with the question, however I felt it necessary to give some background. This was one day at the range where, obviously, I got pretty lucky. The first group was fist size, the second about the size of a quarter, and the third, about nickel size. I've been shooting all my life and would consider this about 90% luck, 10% Redbull

35NCO · 02-08-2011, 05:11

"I can consistently put nickel size groups @ 300m in the prone,.."

I see you are in MD. Ft Meade happens to be my home station. Close to you at all? I will be returning there in around 8 months. When I do, you are coming with me to an NRA High power match. 200m, 300m and 600m iron sights. I will personally pay your registration to see that "nickel size" group...Hell, if you do that, I will drive you to Camp Perry. Start fine tuning those skills, because I do not "fluff" about my future competition.

I sincerely doubt a rack grade weapon shot .27....Do you have a video of this? Do you have a range card with the weather conditions? What was your dope that day?

Don’t BS something like that ever again. Either you did it or you did not. There is a difference between a big fish story and a total lie. I happen to not be a fan of either. Integrity is still an Army value!