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Old 08-11-2007, 11:11   #1
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Contractors in Iraq accused of opening fire on civilians, troops

http://www.fayobserver.com/article_ap?id=109151



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Old 08-12-2007, 07:06   #2
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This is an extremely inflamatory, biased article. Yes there have been "bad apples" in the contractor world. To be blunt I'm not a big fan of Blackwater, though there are some great people that work there.

For starters most of the contractors in Iraq are NOT armed. This includes the truck drivers, cooks, constuction workers, engineers, KBR, Lockeed Martin, IAP support folks. Granted there are many who wish they were armed.

Of the contractors that are armed, many are under direct US Govt supervision. The WPPS program (Worldwide Personal Protection Service) which provide PSD to DoS personnal, are supervised and often lead by TLs from State's own Diplomatic Security Service. Believe me many studs who thought they were "hairy chested gunslingers" have been fired and thrown out of country by their DoS DSS CoC.

Other armed contractors operate under ROEs and after a weapon is fired an AAR has to be done. I was in country in the "wild,wild west" days and they are certainly over. Granted there are still a few knuckleheads out there, doing stupid s$%t, but they likely did stupid S)*t when they were joes too.

To use the Ageis flim as an example, (which I admit, I have not seen) sometimes flim does NOT always show the true picture. What the article does not say, is the usally there is an escalation of force when a vehicle is approaching too close from the rear. Ours was first was to stick hand out, motioning stay back, 2nd throw a half filled water bottle if that did not get there attenion, 3rd was point your weapon, 4th fire in front of the vehicle, the 5th was to fire into the hood/front cap of the car and final was to fire on the driver. Keeping in mind a muji tactic was to overtake the convoy in a fast vehicle and rake it down with PKM fire or drive into with a sucide bomber at the wheel.
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Old 08-12-2007, 07:30   #3
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On the Zapata incident outside of Fallugha, the articles author leaves a whole bunch of details. As I was very close to 2 men involved in that, (1 retired USAF PJ, the other a a retired WO from 1st SFG) the article fails to mention that the Zapata convoy was at BIAP when the alleged shooting took place. This was confirmed by a NICS investigation. Second if a young Marine O' had not flown off the handle and over-reacted there would have been no incident. If what had happened those men would still be in the brig today. Bottom line was the MC made a big deal out of it, they were wrong and had to cover their butt. For the record the two gentelmen I mention were back in-country in 90 days working for the US Govt.

Frankly I have seen very little animosity between contractors and Coalition Forces. What little I have seen is generally from "Leg, Fobbit," Sr Officers & NCOs. I have always had excellant relationships with both Big Army combat troops & Special Operations Forces. If we saw something we reported it to local mil, if they had something we needed , we got them something they needed and traded. Hell there many contractors who are members of the Guard who bounce back between Mil deployments and contractor deployments.

As far as someone offering Marine LTC Mike Zacchea a $1000 a day I can pretty much call BS on that. For one thing I'm sure he was not qualified for a contract that would pay that. While I'm not at the top of the contacting pay scale, I'm pretty close. While there was some that did pay that in the early days, those were extremely special short-term deals. They also required very special skill-sets/quals that most folks don't have.

Sorry for going so long but this is typical MSM BS designed to piss mil personal off at contractors, as well as give a another black eye to the war effort. Sure there are negatives to the contracting business, but they serve a place.

Back to lurking.
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Old 08-12-2007, 09:01   #4
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I'm pretty sure that there was a "less-than-lethal" means proposed for Iraqi vehicles approaching IC convoys.

Don't get me started on some of these guys claiming "OPERATOR" status because the are doing PSD work.

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Old 08-12-2007, 10:16   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 504PIR
Frankly I have seen very little animosity between contractors and Coalition Forces. What little I have seen is generally from "Leg, Fobbit," Sr Officers & NCOs. I have always had excellant relationships with both Big Army combat troops & Special Operations Forces. If we saw something we reported it to local mil, if they had something we needed , we got them something they needed and traded. Hell there many contractors who are members of the Guard who bounce back between Mil deployments and contractor deployments.

As far as someone offering Marine LTC Mike Zacchea a $1000 a day I can pretty much call BS on that. For one thing I'm sure he was not qualified for a contract that would pay that. While I'm not at the top of the contacting pay scale, I'm pretty close. While there was some that did pay that in the early days, those were extremely special short-term deals. They also required very special skill-sets/quals that most folks don't have.
I agree with the statement about the animosity mostly being at the upper level of the CoC and the "Fobbits". That animosity would also branch over towards the SOF as well. It would get real bad towards the last part of my deployment in 2005. When the relieving unit took over operations on the FOB they would make rules such as "US Army personnel receive priority when entering chow hall". I understand you want to try to look out for your own, but when the only other people sharing the FOB are SEALs, I find it retarded. Besides, it's not like it was a battalion (or whatever the Navy calls it), there were only a few teams of SEALs.

As far as the comment about making $1000 a day, I've heard that echoed by other 'contractors'. I had the opertunity to cross train a bit with contractors hired by "Tactical Intelligence International." Most of these guys were Blackwater/Triple Canopy and the least "special" of the group was a former Recon platoon Ranger. The rest were all SEALs, SF, and Delta. Some of them echoed the '$1000 a day' thing, but they were the few that were contractors in the very beginning and were contracted to protect then SECSTATE Powell in Afghanistan. The rest would talk about $300 or $400 a day depending on the job.

I find it hard to believe that nowadays they're offering the same amount. Especially with all the 'wannabes' out there that will sign up for anything they can get.
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Old 08-13-2007, 20:28   #6
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I know a bunch of contractors that made over a thousand a day, none of them carried a weapon for a living. Those of us that did carry, made the normal $300-400 a day protecting those guys, yet all we ever heard about was the cost of security. The cost of "security" and delivery related "security issues" were the great excuse for every missed deadline and cost overrun. A big smoke screen drawing attention away from the real scammers, who happen to be the ones pocketing the real money.
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Old 09-17-2007, 05:56   #7
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Iraq pulling US security firm's license

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Associated Press BAGHDAD — The Interior Ministry said Monday that it was pulling the license of an American security firm allegedly involved in the fatal shooting of civilians during an attack on a U.S. State Department motorcade in Baghdad.

The ministry said it would prosecute any foreign contractors found to have used excessive force in the Sunday incident.

Interior Ministry spokesman Abdul-Karim Khalaf said eight people were killed and 13 were wounded when security contractors working for Blackwater USA opened fire in a predominantly Sunni neighborhood of western Baghdad.

"We have canceled the license of Blackwater and prevented them from working all over Iraqi territory. We will also refer those involved to Iraqi judicial authorities," Khalaf said.

Blackwater, based in North Carolina, provides security for many U.S. civilian operations in the country. Phone messages left early Monday at Blackwater's office in North Carolina and with a company spokeswoman were not immediately returned.
More here.
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Old 09-17-2007, 21:22   #8
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Tick-tock-tick...
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Old 09-20-2007, 08:03   #9
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Blackwater in Iraq given wide latitude by U.S.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20884905/


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Old 09-20-2007, 08:49   #10
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B.W. is currently confined to the Green Zone. State has suspended all surface travel/convoy operations pending...

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php...rticle=1&cat=0
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Old 09-21-2007, 23:01   #11
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More problems for Blackwater

Searched, didn't find this anywhere. Apologies if this is in the wrong place.

http://www.newsobserver.com/1575/story/712139.html

Feds target Blackwater in weapons probe

WASHINGTON - Federal prosecutors are investigating whether employees of the private security firm Blackwater USA illegally smuggled into Iraq weapons that may have been sold on the black market and ended up in the hands of a U.S.-designated terrorist organization, officials said Friday.
The U.S. Attorney's Office in Raleigh, N.C., is handling the investigation with help from Pentagon and State Department auditors, who have concluded there is enough evidence to file charges, the officials told The Associated Press. Blackwater is based in Moyock, N.C.

A spokeswoman for Blackwater did not return calls seeking comment Friday. The U.S. attorney for the eastern district of North Carolina, George Holding, declined to comment, as did Pentagon and State Department spokesmen.

Officials with knowledge of the case said it is active, although at an early stage. They spoke on condition of anonymity due to the sensitivity of the matter, which has heightened since 11 Iraqis were killed Sunday in a shooting involving Blackwater contractors protecting a U.S. diplomatic convoy in Baghdad.

The officials could not say whether the investigation would result in indictments, how many Blackwater employees are involved or if the company itself, which has won hundreds of millions of dollars in government security contracts since the 2003 invasion of Iraq, is under scrutiny.

In Saturday's editions, The News & Observer of Raleigh reported that two former Blackwater employees - Kenneth Wayne Cashwell of Virginia Beach, Va., and William Ellsworth "Max" Grumiaux of Clemmons, N.C. - are cooperating with federal investigators.

Cashwell and Grumiaux pleaded guilty in early 2007 to possession of stolen firearms that had been shipped in interstate or foreign commerce, and aided and abetted another in doing so, according to court papers viewed by The Associated Press. In their plea agreements, which call for a maximum sentence of 10 years in prison and a $250,000 fine, the men agreed to testify in any future proceedings.

Calls to defense attorneys were not immediately returned Friday evening, and calls to the telephone listings for both men also were not returned.

The News & Observer, citing unidentified sources, reported that the probe was looking at whether Blackwater had shipped unlicensed automatic weapons and military goods to Iraq without a license.

The paper's report that the company itself was under investigation could not be confirmed by the AP.

Meanwhile, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice ordered a review of security practices for U.S. diplomats in Iraq following a deadly incident involving Blackwater USA guards protecting an embassy convoy.

Rice's announcement came as the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad resumed limited diplomatic convoys under the protection of Blackwater outside the heavily fortified Green Zone after a suspension because of the weekend incident in that city.

In the United States, officials in Washington said the smuggling investigation grew from internal Pentagon and State Department inquiries into U.S. weapons that had gone missing in Iraq. It gained steam after Turkish authorities protested to the U.S. in July that they had seized American arms from the outlawed Kurdistan Workers Party, or PKK, rebels.

The Turks provided serial numbers of the weapons to U.S. investigators, said a Turkish official.

The Pentagon said in late July it was looking into the Turkish complaints and a U.S. official said FBI agents had traveled to Turkey in recent months to look into cases of missing U.S. weapons in Iraq.

Investigators are determining whether the alleged Blackwater weapons match those taken from the PKK.

was not clear if Blackwater employees suspected of selling to the black market knew the weapons they allegedly sold to middlemen might wind up with the PKK. If they did, possible charges against them could be more serious than theft or illegal weapons sales, officials said.
The PKK, which is fighting for an independent Kurdistan, is banned in Turkey, which has a restive Kurdish population and is considered a "foreign terrorist organization" by the State Department. That designation bars U.S. citizens or those in U.S. jurisdictions from supporting the group in any way.

The North Carolina investigation was first brought to light by State Department Inspector General Howard Krongard, who mentioned it, perhaps inadvertently, this week while denying he had improperly blocked fraud and corruption probes in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Krongard was accused in a letter by Rep. Henry Waxman, D-Calif., chairman of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, of politically motivated malfeasance, including refusing to cooperate with an investigation into alleged weapons smuggling by a large, unidentified State Department contractor.

In response, Krongard said in a written statement that he "made one of my best investigators available to help Assistant U.S. Attorneys in North Carolina in their investigation into alleged smuggling of weapons into Iraq by a contractor."

His statement went further than Waxman's letter because it identified the state in which the investigation was taking place. Blackwater is the biggest of the State Department's three private security contractors.

The other two, Dyncorp and Triple Canopy, are based in Washington's northern Virginias suburbs, outside the jurisdiction of the North Carolina's attorneys.

By MATTHEW LEE, Associated Press Writer

cnn
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Last edited by esco015; 09-21-2007 at 23:02. Reason: spelling
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Old 09-22-2007, 10:02   #12
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Having been the personal bodyguard for the American Ambassador, in a war zone, I can understand the possible requirement to fire into a crowd.

I also understand those that are trained properly one or two rounds will equal a dead bad-guy next to his AK-47.

My only question is how many of those 11 killed by blackwater contractors were found next to their AK's?

Shooting randomly into a crowd of unarmed people is cowardly at best.

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Old 09-22-2007, 11:39   #13
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I think this recent development stems from an earlier discussion about how when these companies have large contracts they just start throwing bodies into positions, regardless of the person's experience. I have seen a lot of Blackwater, Triple Canopy, and a few others out in Iraq and you can immediately tell the ones that know the business and those who dress/pretend like they know the business. I spoke to one guy who had a fancy little toy on his weapon, and when I asked about it he basically admitted to just having it there for looks, it didn't even have a power supply...

These guys used to tick us off, especially on the road, so I will admit part of me is happy that Blackwater is being investigated... not to mention the general lack of regard towards their employee's lives...

Should be interesting to see who the company tries to throw 'under the bus' when the hammer comes down....
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