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Old 07-15-2007, 07:03   #1
echoes
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Marine: Beating of Iraqis Became Routine

If this testimony is to be believed, it is shocking.

Holly


http://dailynews.att.net/cgi-bin/new...qd0oig0&src=ap

Marine: Beating of Iraqis Became Routine
Updated 7:58 AM ET July 15, 2007

CAMP PENDLETON, Calif. (AP) - A Marine corporal testifying in a court-martial said Marines in his unit began routinely beating Iraqis after officers ordered them to "crank up the violence level."

Cpl. Saul H. Lopezromo testified Saturday at the murder trial of Cpl. Trent D. Thomas.

"We were told to crank up the violence level," said Lopezromo, testifying for the defense.

When a juror asked for further explanation, Lopezromo said: "We beat people, sir."

Within weeks of allegedly being scolded, seven Marines and a Navy corpsman went out late one night to find and kill a suspected insurgent in the village of Hamandiya near the Abu Ghraib prison. The Marines and corpsman were from 2nd Platoon, Kilo Company, 3rd Battalion, 5th Regiment.

Lopezromo said the suspected insurgent was known to his neighbors as the "prince of jihad," and had been arrested several times and later released by the Iraqi legal system.

Unable to find him, the Marines and corpsman dragged another man from his house, fatally shot him, and then planted an AK-47 assault rifle near the body to make it appear he had been killed in a shootout, according to court testimony.

Four Marines and the corpsman, initially charged with murder in the April 2006 killing, have pleaded guilty to reduced charges and been given jail sentences ranging from 10 months to eight years. Thomas, 25, from St. Louis, pleaded guilty but withdrew his plea and is the first defendant to go to court-martial.

Lopezromo, who was not part of the squad on its late-night mission, said he saw nothing wrong with what Thomas did.

"I don't see it as an execution, sir," he told the judge. "I see it as killing the enemy."

He said Marines consider all Iraqi men part of the insurgency.

Lopezromo and two other Marines were charged in August with assaulting an Iraqi two weeks before the killing that led to charges against Thomas and the others. Charges against all three were later dropped.

Thomas' attorneys have said he suffers from post-traumatic stress disorder and traumatic brain injury from his combat duty in Fallouja in 2004. They have argued that Thomas believed he was following a lawful order to get tougher with suspected insurgents.

Prosecution witnesses testified that Thomas shot the 52-year-old man at point-blank range after he had already been shot by other Marines and was lying on the ground.

Lopezromo said a procedure called "dead-checking" was routine. If Marines entered a house where a man was wounded, instead of checking to see whether he needed medical aid, they shot him to make sure he was dead, he testified.

"If somebody is worth shooting once, they're worth shooting twice," he said.

The jury is composed of three officers and six enlisted personnel, all of whom have served in Iraq. The trial was set to resume Monday.
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Old 07-15-2007, 15:23   #2
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I wonder if Cpl Lopezromo is being charged with anything.
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Old 07-15-2007, 15:50   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by groundup
I wonder if Cpl Lopezromo is being charged with anything.
Sounds like a "plea Bargain" testimony to me.
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Old 07-15-2007, 16:12   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QRQ 30
Sounds like a "plea Bargain" testimony to me.
Exactly - sounds like he would rather shame his men, unit, country, and the entire military than go to jail for his own actions. It would be just as despicable for his Officers to have made such an order and not stand up to take accountability for their actions.

Quote:
Thomas' attorneys have said he suffers from post-traumatic stress disorder and traumatic brain injury from his combat duty in Fallouja in 2004. They have argued that Thomas believed he was following a lawful order to get tougher with suspected insurgents.
How do they know that isn't causing him to make this up? I am sure that defense can be used in prosecution as well. RL would know better on that.

Either way, someone died and the truth is still being hidden.
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Old 07-15-2007, 16:37   #5
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I would suggest that ALL of you, except for those that WERE THERE, draw back/pull-up and let this not be flogged by the UN-KNOWING!!!!!

Later
Martin
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Old 07-15-2007, 16:42   #6
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A Simple Question!!

How many of you, answer with a simple Me, have ever been in a hostile engagement with people who would kill you if they had the chance???? (Much less with those who are born onto this earth to KILL US!!) And killed them?!?!?!

I'll open it up!!!


ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 07-15-2007, 16:50   #7
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Devil's Advocate

I may be opening a can of worms here, but I can't help wondering if this isn't a sign of the times. I don't mean to belittle any member of the Marine Corps, but given the crop of movies about badass Marines (Heartbreak Ridge, Full Metal Jacket, and Jarhead), I wonder if their actions are beginning to mimic their "persona". The former Marines - let me reword that as 'not currently serving' - I've known and work with, are nothing like what the movies show. They are decent, hard working, professionals who take extreme pride in their service to their Country.

Unfortunately there are some who buy into that crap about being the meanest son-of-a-bitch in the valley. And it's not just the Marines! I've known some US Army types who thought the same way...up until the bullets start flying.

Well, I've said it and it's out there for you to think over and shoot me down. I hope to God I'm wrong, but I've got a nagging thought that won't go away - that maybe we're victims of our own design.
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Old 07-15-2007, 16:58   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hipshot
I may be opening a can of worms here, but I can't help wondering if this isn't a sign of the times. I don't mean to belittle any member of the Marine Corps, but given the crop of movies about badass Marines (Heartbreak Ridge, Full Metal Jacket, and Jarhead), I wonder if their actions are beginning to mimic their "persona". The former Marines - let me reword that as 'not currently serving' - I've known and work with, are nothing like what the movies show. They are decent, hard working, professionals who take extreme pride in their service to their Country.

Unfortunately there are some who buy into that crap about being the meanest son-of-a-bitch in the valley. And it's not just the Marines! I've known some US Army types who thought the same way...up until the bullets start flying.

Well, I've said it and it's out there for you to think over and shoot me down. I hope to God I'm wrong, but I've got a nagging thought that won't go away - that maybe we're victims of our own design.
HS,

You were composing this when I posted above.

Later
Martin
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