07-27-2006, 19:21
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#1
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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Shooting Drills
Let's talk shooting drills. On another thread, I mentioned a drill we do. I call it the "Buddha how many more in the box!" Drill
You load 2-3 rounds in a buttload of mags and put them in a box. The shooter stands ready and the helper kneels down on his weak side. The shooter will engage and combat reload. Over and over again. As he empties the mag pouch, the helper will replace the mags until all are done. Change over and repeat.
Don't try to pick up the empties until the weapon is safe and holsterd and don't go forward of the shooter at any time. Doesn't work real well with chest mounted pistol mags.
Also - you need to have the basics of the combat reload down before you try this. You will need to dry fire it about 10,000 trillion times prior. It is a waste of ammo IMO to do the exercise before.
Oh - and as always, marksmanship counts... 
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Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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07-27-2006, 19:26
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#2
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Quiet Professional
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One thing I think is important - don't get in the habit of shooting one or two then transitioning for no reason or safetying and holstering after two every time. If you transition, you should either be dry or have a malfunction - both can be purposely introduced.
When you go to your secondary, you should vary the number of rounds you use before going back to the primary. Shoot two sometimes, more others. Every now and then, shoot it dry and combat reload.
You can use snap caps to introducce a malfunction - just have somebody else load it or do it with your eyes closed so you don't anticipate.
Grossman touches on the reasons for avoiding habitually doing the same things in On Combat. I just started it, not bad. Most of the recommendations he has so far we were doing insticitively.
Another thing I like is sliding to the side to transition or reload. Any ideas why?
Remember - you will revert to training when stressed. So train like you want to fight.
Anybody else?
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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07-27-2006, 19:33
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#3
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Quiet Professional
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On a related by different topic - anybody know where I can find the Wheel of Errors for Left-handed shooters on the net?
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Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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07-27-2006, 20:18
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#4
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Area Commander
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: No. VA, USA
Posts: 1,095
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by NousDefionsDoc
On a related by different topic - anybody know where I can find the Wheel of Errors for Left-handed shooters on the net?
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How about this?
Great thread, NDD.
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vsvo is offline
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07-27-2006, 20:20
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#5
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Quiet Professional
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Location: LA
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by vsvo
How about this?
Great thread, NDD. |
That's it! Dude you are Da Man!.
And thanks for the kind words.
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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07-28-2006, 21:14
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#6
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BANNED USER
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: KY
Posts: 43
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NDD
I have a dumb question I'm self teaching pistol CQB and other then the FM you posted about is there any other good books to read? Right now im reading the 5th edition of combat handgunnery by Massad Ayoob is this a good book for me to learn from?
Thanks Sir!
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badcarma is offline
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07-28-2006, 04:56
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#7
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Area Commander
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,355
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by vsvo
How about this?
Great thread, NDD. |
I am right-handed, so I'm assuming that the mirror image of this chart is what I need. Which suggests that I am jerking the trigger. At 7-10 yds, my shots are usually in a tight group about 1.5-2" low and to the left of the bullseye.
How can I correct this? 
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"Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave whither Thou goest." - Ecclesiastes 9:10
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jatx is offline
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07-28-2006, 07:13
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#8
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 20,929
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by jatx
I am right-handed, so I'm assuming that the mirror image of this chart is what I need. Which suggests that I am jerking the trigger. At 7-10 yds, my shots are usually in a tight group about 1.5-2" low and to the left of the bullseye.
How can I correct this? |
Quit jerking like a three year old. 
The wheel is not a valid tool anymore.
If you can place a good shot on the bullseye and then you have a group "1.5-2" low and to the left of the bullseye" you have a "controlled jerk". (You will not find the term "controlled jerk" anywhere, I made it up.)
Dryfire 5 minutes everyday, with snapcaps, in a safe place. 5 minutes, everyday. Do it for a month then go to 10 minutes everyday for a month. Then go shooting again. I'll send you a bill.
TS
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"The Spartans do not ask how many are the enemy, but where they are."
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Team Sergeant is offline
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07-28-2006, 07:34
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#9
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Castle Rock, CO
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by vsvo
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thanks...
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""A man must know his destiny. if he does not recognize it, then he is lost. By this I mean, once, twice, or at the very most, three times, fate will reach out and tap a man on the shoulder. if he has the imagination, he will turn around and fate will point out to him what fork in the road he should take, if he has the guts, he will take it.""- GEN George S. Patton
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lksteve is offline
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07-29-2006, 07:52
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#10
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Lacey Washington
Posts: 737
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by lksteve
thanks...
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Yo -- LK:
Took a look at that wheel thing on that PDF file. They got the 'hand' backwards. The one that says 'left handed shooter' is really for right handed shooters and vice versa.
We have one of these in GTA format next to our urinals. Put up by a former cadre of ours. Big GTA -- about two foot square so big enough that I can read it while pissing.
That wheel thing more relates to one hand firing of the pistol than two. Put two hands on the pistol and that wheel really doesn't work too well.
My biggest problem with such devices is that they tells a fellow everything he is doing wrong instead of telling him what to do right.
I troubleshoot human error using ball and dummy to see where the barrel moves on the shot, and then isolate the part of the body causing that movement. Normally some adjustment in position followed by mental discipline gives a fix. After it is fixed enough to gain confidence that it is fixed, it becomes a mental discipline issue.
This whole thing is more of a mental game than a physical one. Fun though.
Gene
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Gene Econ is offline
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07-28-2006, 08:29
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#11
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Auxiliary
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: KY
Posts: 77
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by vsvo
How about this?
Great thread, NDD. |
NDD also try here, about halfway down the page. They are in PDF format.
http://www.reloadbench.com/pdf.html
I am just a novice and tried to use the wheel, it did not work real well. I finailly found someone who was very good and had them watch me. With in 20 rounds my groupings got a whole lot tighter.
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Last edited by Polar Bear; 07-28-2006 at 08:35.
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Polar Bear is offline
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07-28-2006, 09:16
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#12
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Polar Bear
NDD also try here, about halfway down the page. They are in PDF format.
http://www.reloadbench.com/pdf.html
I am just a novice and tried to use the wheel, it did not work real well. I finailly found someone who was very good and had them watch me. With in 20 rounds my groupings got a whole lot tighter. |
PB, Great link.
OK lets discuss the Wheel, where would anyone like to start?
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"The Spartans do not ask how many are the enemy, but where they are."
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Team Sergeant is offline
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07-28-2006, 07:08
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#13
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by NousDefionsDoc
On a related by different topic - anybody know where I can find the Wheel of Errors for Left-handed shooters on the net?
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The wheel is also history.
RL, I didn't teach you all 8 factors because I don't believe they are needed for pistol marksmanship. You can shoot bullet holes through holes on demand, you think you're lacking some sort of training?
NDD,
Your drills sound good, I'll add, start SLOW, VERY SLOW. Learn the movements so well you can do them blind folded, in your sleep, time and time again. Work up to speed, work hard on smooth actions not jerky. This is the reason for 10,000 times. For the novice shooters it must be done correctly because doing it 10,000 times wrong is hard to break
TS
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"The Spartans do not ask how many are the enemy, but where they are."
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Team Sergeant is offline
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07-27-2006, 19:39
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#14
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,805
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by NousDefionsDoc
Another thing I like is sliding to the side to transition or reload. Any ideas why?
Remember - you will revert to training when stressed. So train like you want to fight.
Anybody else?
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To get off the target line.
We teach students to move at least one step laterally between strings and to continue scanning from side to side.
TR
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"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
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The Reaper is offline
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07-27-2006, 19:42
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#15
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Consigliere
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V&P?
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Roguish Lawyer is offline
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