05-09-2006, 13:23
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#1
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Asset
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: somewhere in the rockies
Posts: 49
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Nomination of new CIA director
What feelings do any of the QP's have about the nomination of Michael Hayden for CIA director. It is interesting to me that the White House has nominated a General from the military when it has come under fire from retired military higher-ups. Do you see this as the Admin trying to regain some faith with the military command? The CIA has had the same type of turn over and Morale issues that the military has seen with the command and personel as a whole.
I know the local/ city police depts. are following the same phenomenon.
Are we just facing a major turn in age groups? The younger generations coming to the front of world issues....
Curious.
Realized that this would be better in General Discussion Area.
Move at will. Thank You.
Last edited by helicom6; 05-09-2006 at 13:42.
Reason: Realized this would be better posted in General Discussion area
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helicom6 is offline
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05-09-2006, 13:41
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#2
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Gun Pilot
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Iowa and New Mexico
Posts: 2,143
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by helicom6
What feelings do any of the QP's have about the nomination of Michael Hayden for CIA director. It is interesting to me that the White House has nominated a General from the military when it has come under fire from retired military higher-ups. Do you see this as the Admin trying to regain some faith with the military command? The CIA has had the same type of turn over and Morale issues that the military has seen with the command and personel as a whole.
I know the local/ city police depts. are following the same phenomenon.
Are we just facing a major turn in age groups? The younger generations coming to the front of world issues....
Curious.
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You know, I am tired of all the political second guessing. I didn't know much about Goss, and I don't know much about Gen. Hayden, but hopefully he is the right guy for the job.
I am not concerned that he is military, I just hope that he is up to the job!
Terry
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CPTAUSRET is offline
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05-09-2006, 14:09
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#3
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Vermont
Posts: 3,093
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This is not the first military flag officer to head the CIA. Stansfield Turner did so and completely gutted the HUMIT aspect. Wild Bill Donovan started it when it went from the OSS to CIA. I do not know anything about the new guy, save the fact that he is an Airforce Officer. Airforce folks look at Intel differently than ground guys and the Navy is normally interested in looking at things that they can hit from afar. Whomever is in charge, it is all going to depend on properly defining the nationial interests of the US and then structuring the organization to ensure that they do their part to contribute to gathering the info and executing the programs to support those interests. Most will never know what those efforts entail and that is a good thing. The bad thing about this whole process is the involvement of the politicians whose agendas are short term re-election oriented and who are not qualified to clean the boots of the men and women who must wade through all the horseshit and human debris to satisfy ill defined requirements impeded by rediculous regulations that make difficult jobs damn near impossible.
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Jack Moroney (RIP) is offline
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05-09-2006, 14:25
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#4
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,816
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He headed up the NSA, why can't he run the CIA?
TR
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"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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05-09-2006, 15:15
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#5
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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Military DCIs
Rear Admiral Sidney W. Souers (January 23-June 10, 1946) Pre-CIA
Lieutenant General Hoyt S. Vandenberg (June 10, 1946-May 1, 1947) Pre-CIA
Rear Admiral Roscoe H. Hillenkoetter (May 1, 1947-7 Oct 1950)
General Walter Bedell Smith (7 Oct 1950-9 Feb 1953)
Vice Admiral William F. Raborn, Jr. (28 Apr 65-30 Jun 66)
Admiral Stansfield Turner (9 Mar 77-28 Jan 81) Turner retired from the Navy in Dec 78.
And of course, MG William J. Donovan. Rest In Peace Sir.
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"Espionage is not a nice thing, nor are the methods employed exemplary. Neither are demolition bombs nor poison gas... ...We face an enemy who believes one of his chief weapons is that none but he will employ terror. But we will turn terror against him..."
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Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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05-09-2006, 15:18
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#6
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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The track record hasn't been all that great in my opinion.
The Colonel already spoke on Turner. Raborn was a LBJ crony.
Hillenkoetter was fired, I believe for not predicting the Chinese jump into Korea.
I don't really understand all the fuss anyway. As The Colonel said, General Hayden is Air Force - hell, he's practically a civilian anyway... 
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Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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05-09-2006, 16:18
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#7
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Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,949
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One thing to keep in mind in assessing this nomination is that GEN Hayden's most important prior job was not Director of NSA, or AIA or juicy-two-cee. It is his current position: Principal Deputy Director of National Intelligence. To the extent that Ambassador Negroponte appears to be winning the turf war among agencies, this appointment may be seen as in effect reducing the DCI's profile to being just the DNI's deputy.
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Airbornelawyer is offline
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05-09-2006, 16:43
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#8
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Quiet Professional
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Location: LA
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Airbornelawyer
One thing to keep in mind in assessing this nomination is that GEN Hayden's most important prior job was not Director of NSA, or AIA or juicy-two-cee. It is his current position: Principal Deputy Director of National Intelligence. To the extent that Ambassador Negroponte appears to be winning the turf war among agencies, this appointment may be seen as in effect reducing the DCI's profile to being just the DNI's deputy.
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Agreed, the DCI is not the focus anymore. And Negroponte is making the pecking order clear.
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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05-09-2006, 18:13
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#9
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: America, the Beautiful
Posts: 3,193
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IMHO it will be good to get military leadership in the CIA...will hopefully melt the "imaginary wall" between CIA and DOD intel efforts....just wish it was LTG Boykin getting the nod. Figure the odds of that happening.
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Warrior-Mentor is offline
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05-09-2006, 18:56
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#10
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: South Georiga
Posts: 797
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I don't see where it makes any difference between a civilian or military leader i this position. He is not the first and he will not be the last. He is the man who is seeing that policies are carried out and fighing for the budget. He is not running agents or operations. He is the man steering the ship....... as long as he can do the job, that is all that should matter. One positive aspect right off the bat is that he will not let politics get in the way and may prevent some of the leaking that has been going on.
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Breaking a law or violation of a regulation is not a mistake. It is willful misconduct.
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen." [Samuel Adams]
Jim
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incommin is offline
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05-09-2006, 19:15
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#11
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Vermont
Posts: 3,093
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Now I want to put all your minds to rest about General Hayden. From 1975-1978 I was an ROTC Instructor at the University of Vermont. During that time Hayden was the ROTC Professor of Military Science at St Michael's College just up the road. I was asked to give his cadets instruction on Special Forces in particular and the Army in general. He took more notes than the troops-make you feel any better 
Snipped from Hayden's bio " July 1975 - August 1979, academic instructor and commandant of cadets, ROTC program, St. Michael's College, Winooski, Vt."
Jack Moroney: Nothing like walking on a Catholic College Campus in military uniform to rescue an Airforce ROTC Program in the mid 70s
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