Fathers, Sons, and the Lessons of War

05-30-2005, 14:56

Fathers, Sons and the Lessons of War in the Los Angeles Times
By Frank Schaeffer, Frank Schaeffer is a writer and most recently the author of "Faith of Our Sons -- A Father's Wartime Diary" (Carroll & Graf/Avalon, 2004).

**The Reaper** · 05-30-2005, 15:00

Outstanding.

Thanks!

TR

Gypsy · 05-30-2005, 15:37

Excellent, thanks Martin.

Abu Jack · 05-31-2005, 12:57

Great thread,
Thanks Martin

**Razor** · 05-31-2005, 13:34

Good story, and I'm really glad he finally understands. However, I think this also highlights the 'why should I care' issue that is partly responsible for the large rift between those in (or were in) the military and those that aren't at all affiliated. As he stated, until his son got involved in the war, and thus he stood to personally lose someone, he really didn't think about those fighting and dying in OEF and OIF.

jatx · 05-31-2005, 14:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razor

Good story, and I'm really glad he finally understands. However, I think this also highlights the 'why should I care' issue that is partly responsible for the large rift between those in (or were in) the military and those that aren't at all affiliated. As he stated, until his son got involved in the war, and thus he stood to personally lose someone, he really didn't think about those fighting and dying in OEF and OIF.

Most Americans have not really been challenged to care. For example, all across the country this month, many of our best and brightest are graduating from college, and leaders from all parts of public life are giving them speeches. How many of those speakers are challenging those young people to sacrifice for their country? How many are making a personal appeal for individual participation in public service? Now think about the President, the Vice President, the leaders of Congress, and the Cabinet, all of whom have nearly unfettered access to the media. How many of them are saying, "We want YOU"? When was the last time that you saw any of those leaders look into the camera and really throw down the gauntlet? When was the last time that most Americans were made to feel truly guilty for not doing their part? It's been a long time, I'd wager.

I believe that Americans will respond to a challenge when the stakes are clear and they receive proper leadership. This sort of leadership is sorely lacking at the moment. While I am a proponent of mandatory national service between the ages of 18-20, it will never happen. But the least our leaders could do is ask more of our citizens in a direct fashion. You never know how people might respond.

**Jack Moroney (RIP)** · 05-31-2005, 14:18

So I am to feel good about this sorry, sniveling, psuedo-patriotic father. Give me a damn break. He is justifiably proud of his son and kudos to the lad for doing what he thought was the right thing to do, but the old man is typical of every other individual in this country whose only contact with the military is the sticker shock they see when they look at the DOD budget. What he sees now as his sacred duty of " sheding tears for strangers" just frosts my Irish....
Rant over.

Jack Moroney-

**Jack Moroney (RIP)** · 05-31-2005, 14:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by jatx

many of our best and brightest are graduating from college

Best and brightest at what?

jatx · 05-31-2005, 14:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Moroney

Best and brightest at what?

First off, notice that I said "some of." Second, they are the best in the world in many of their chosen fields and, like it or not, they are the best our Nation is going to have in each of those fields. They will also never be more idealistic than at this point in their lives, but they have not been issued a call to duty, military or otherwise. Do you really disagree?

**Roguish Lawyer** · 05-31-2005, 14:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by jatx

First off, notice that I said "some of." Second, they are the best in the world in many of their chosen fields and, like it or not, they are the best our Nation is going to have in each of those fields. They will also never be more idealistic than at this point in their lives, but they have not been issued a call to duty, military or otherwise. Do you really disagree?

Oh, my. Dude, get your head down and RUN! LMAO

**Jack Moroney (RIP)** · 05-31-2005, 14:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by jatx

First off, notice that I said "some of." Second, they are the best in the world in many of their chosen fields and, like it or not, they are the best our Nation is going to have in each of those fields. They will also never be more idealistic than at this point in their lives, but they have not been issued a call to duty, military or otherwise. Do you really disagree?

Well actually you said "many", but then maybe my college degrees did not make me one of the best and brightest in my majors as I evidently cannot read.

jatx · 05-31-2005, 15:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Moroney

Well actually you said "many", but then maybe my college degrees did not make me one of the best and brightest in my majors as I evidently cannot read.

Oh, come on, you KNOW that's not my point.

My point is just that public service, whether military or otherwise, is not part of the decision set being evaluated by most young Americans. Most parents don't raise their kids to think about it, and public leaders don't do much to fill the gap. The end result is that people feel disconnected and insulated from our national struggles. Let that accumulate for a couple of generations and you have men like the one above experiencing moments of clarity next to their sons' beds.

So what should be done about it?