Trying to enlist- Airborne stamp with Med waiver

[MutherRucker]

Hello All.

This will be a long post, but I have been trying hard to get enlisted since April of 2009. I need some experienced persons to advise me on this final leg of my process.

I have decided to enlist in the Active Duty Army. Being very interested in SF, I am seeking an 18X contract.

The first time I arrived at the MEPS, I disclosed that I had a kidney stone in 2007. They sent me to a lab to have x-rays taken to ensure that I don't have any remaining stones. The radiologist found what he thought were more kidney stones. Reoccurring stones are a disqualifying condition, so I was sent home from the MEPS without signing.

As a last ditch effort to salvage my dreams of being in the Army, I went to an urologist to confirm what the lab found. I explained to my doctor how they diagnosed me and he concluded that the type of imaging they used was 2-dimensional and was incapable of correctly diagnosing kidney stones. The lab at his hospital gave me a KUB (3D imaging) and found no stones.

I submitted a letter from the doctor of his findings and all records pertaining to the visit to my recruiter. My recruiter called me 4 weeks later informing me that “My waiver was approved.”

Question 1: Why did my recruiter apply for a waiver for a condition that I didn’t actually have?

I went back to the MEPS this Monday morning to get signed up. When I sat in front of the Army counselor, he informed me that I cannot receive an 18X contract because I cannot obtain an “Airborne Stamp” on my physical due to the waiver. He offered me 11X. I promptly left the office and did not sign.

During my research, I discovered a few relevant threads on this board describing similar situations.

In this thread, the recruit had a similar problem in that he was told his waiver for PRK prevented him from obtaining an Airborne stamp. The members (QPs as well) generally thought the Army Counselor was lying and that he should stick to his guns and press for the 18X contract. They also recommended that he find a new recruiter that will get the job done.

Question 2: My recruiter was about as surprised as I was when I didn’t get the stamp. I do not believe that she is preventing me from the contract; the Army counselor at the MEPS is. Should I still consider a different recruiter?

In that same thread, user .45ACP personally attests that you can get an Airborne stamp with a medical waiver at the MEPS because he had gotten one. His waiver was also for a PRK.

Also in that same thread, The Reaper notes that “[they] are getting quite a few guys with waivers into 18X” which implies that it is possible to get an Airborne stamp with a waiver.

Question 3: Am I being lied to? Can I get the Airborne stamp (and then 18X) with a waiver?

Currently my recruiter thinks I will go 18X or nothing. I will end up enlisting as 11X and going the long route if I have to, but I don’t want to abandon the 18X just yet. The 18X has that special word (Guarantee) that tells me no matter what happens, at least I’ll get a shot a SFAS.

Thank you for investing your time to read this. Please advise.

[Surgicalcric]

Originally Posted by MutherRucker

...Question 1: Why did my recruiter apply for a waiver for a condition that I didn’t actually have?

Question 2: My recruiter was about as surprised as I was when I didn’t get the stamp. I do not believe that she is preventing me from the contract; the Army counselor at the MEPS is. Should I still consider a different recruiter?

Question 3: Am I being lied to? Can I get the Airborne stamp (and then 18X) with a waiver?

1- Because the MD at MEPS denied your enlistment due to a disqualifying condition. Your physician's diagnosis can be taken into consideration (on advisement) but the MEPS MD is the final authority at that level.

2- Technically speaking regardless of what the medical waiver is for the waiver in itself is a disqualifier for receiving the stamp. That said, it is possible to get an ABN stamp with a waiver (I got one.) It isnt your recruiter thats causing the issue here its someone wanting to put their neck out there and risk you packet being audited, after which the counselor would get his/her ass in trouble.

3- See #2.

Crip

[MutherRucker]

Excellent. Thank you for that information. That makes perfect sense of it all! In your experience, how rare is it to have a counselor "stick there neck out" and allow someone with a med waiver to get the stamp? Any advise on how I can go about convincing the counselor to do this for me?

Thanks again!

[The Reaper]

Originally Posted by MutherRucker

Hello All.

This will be a long post, but I have been trying hard to get enlisted since April of 2009. I need some experienced persons to advise me on this final leg of my process.

I have decided to enlist in the Active Duty Army. Being very interested in SF, I am seeking an 18X contract.

The first time I arrived at the MEPS, I disclosed that I had a kidney stone in 2007. They sent me to a lab to have x-rays taken to ensure that I don't have any remaining stones. The radiologist found what he thought were more kidney stones. Reoccurring stones are a disqualifying condition, so I was sent home from the MEPS without signing.

As a last ditch effort to salvage my dreams of being in the Army, I went to an urologist to confirm what the lab found. I explained to my doctor how they diagnosed me and he concluded that the type of imaging they used was 2-dimensional and was incapable of correctly diagnosing kidney stones. The lab at his hospital gave me a KUB (3D imaging) and found no stones.

I submitted a letter from the doctor of his findings and all records pertaining to the visit to my recruiter. My recruiter called me 4 weeks later informing me that “My waiver was approved.”

Question 1: Why did my recruiter apply for a waiver for a condition that I didn’t actually have?

I went back to the MEPS this Monday morning to get signed up. When I sat in front of the Army counselor, he informed me that I cannot receive an 18X contract because I cannot obtain an “Airborne Stamp” on my physical due to the waiver. He offered me 11X. I promptly left the office and did not sign.

During my research, I discovered a few relevant threads on this board describing similar situations.

In this thread, the recruit had a similar problem in that he was told his waiver for PRK prevented him from obtaining an Airborne stamp. The members (QPs as well) generally thought the Army Counselor was lying and that he should stick to his guns and press for the 18X contract. They also recommended that he find a new recruiter that will get the job done.

Question 2: My recruiter was about as surprised as I was when I didn’t get the stamp. I do not believe that she is preventing me from the contract; the Army counselor at the MEPS is. Should I still consider a different recruiter?

In that same thread, user .45ACP personally attests that you can get an Airborne stamp with a medical waiver at the MEPS because he had gotten one. His waiver was also for a PRK.

Also in that same thread, The Reaper notes that “[they] are getting quite a few guys with waivers into 18X” which implies that it is possible to get an Airborne stamp with a waiver.

Question 3: Am I being lied to? Can I get the Airborne stamp (and then 18X) with a waiver?

Currently my recruiter thinks I will go 18X or nothing. I will end up enlisting as 11X and going the long route if I have to, but I don’t want to abandon the 18X just yet. The 18X has that special word (Guarantee) that tells me no matter what happens, at least I’ll get a shot a SFAS.

Thank you for investing your time to read this. Please advise.

I would hold out for the 18X, but the word "guarantee" is of little value.

Most 18Xs never make it to a team, and wind up as 11Bs.

OTOH, you can enlist as an 11B, and unless you still have a DQ or fail to make the standards, IIRC, you can sign up for SFAS as soon as you are an E-4.

Either route will get you there, if you have what it takes.

Things should change on 1 October. New year, new quota.

TR

[Surgicalcric]

Originally Posted by MutherRucker

...In your experience, how rare is it to have a counselor "stick there neck out..."

I dont have any experience in that area so I wont comment on it.

Mind what TR said about holding out for an 18X contract. If you dont get "the stamp," time in the Infantry will not be wasted, providing you suck up the knowledge of those around you, like a sponge...

Best of luck.

Crip

[MutherRucker]

Thank you both for your input.

[Scimitar]

To add to this,

I too was able to get an Airborne waiver. The MEPS counsellor was probably just trying to see if you'd take 11B; you say no; and then he does the extra work to get the Airborne Stamp, which I believe he has to go through the Airborne School CO to get. Not knocking the counsellor, just the way the system works.

Another possibility / option. As TR pointed out there has been a clamp down on waivers being accepted etc. But things are very likely to open up 1 Oct onwards. There is an intake around 11 Nov if you are willing to wait that long. If you plan to resubmit your packet just after 1 Oct there will likely still be contracts available for that intake. Be warned though, I understand that there is a 3 month wait after that class intake, I believe they are not running SFAS during the 2 summer months, which causes a gap in 18X intakes during Dec-Feb. I have heard this second hand, so not from the horses mouth, but if you are trying to plan around a ship date, it is worth investigating.

Another option…many individuals have enlisted 11B, and then approached SF internal recruiters once at Benning. The internal SF recruiters have the power to bring you over to an 18X contract during Basic, and possibly can work around Med Regs a little easier then MEPS. I know of a few who have done this successfully, but again no guarantees. Contact the Benning SF recruiting unit and talk with them directly and see what they can do. I can provide POC if needed

HTH


Scimitar

[MutherRucker]

Thank you for your information, Scimitar. I would love a POC at Benning if you have one for me.

Regarding the MEPS situation, I contacted my recruiter and requested to attend the next Saturday processing day at MEPS. I informed her that others in the past have made it into 18X with waivers which prompted her to contact a friend she has at the Army office to get the "inside" story. I don't know what her friend does specifically at the Army office at the MEPS but I know the friend is a SSG and works behind a desk at the Army office. Today her friend informed my recruiter that getting the stamp with a waiver would still be a "no go".

It looks like I am on my own with the counselor at this point. When I get to the MEPS on Sept 12th, does anyone have any advice on how to handle the counselor? If you do chip in your 2 cents, please let me know what your experience is that leads you to believe your approach will be successful. If it makes any difference, I will be attempting to enlist at the Chicago MEPS. Thanks.

[Scimitar]

I would love a POC at Benning if you have one for me

Go here and select "Contact the SORB"
link

BTW just for kicks and giggles, type "SORB" (Special Operations Recruiting Battalion) into Google and tell me the first hit you get.

Priceless, you can't script that kind of stuff.

Oh…report back your findings would you....would be interested to see if this is still an option for anybody.

Regarding the MEPS situation, I contacted my recruiter and requested to attend the next Saturday processing day at MEPS. I informed her that others in the past have made it into 18X with waivers which prompted her to contact a friend she has at the Army office to get the "inside" story. I don't know what her friend does specifically at the Army office at the MEPS but I know the friend is a SSG and works behind a desk at the Army office. Today her friend informed my recruiter that getting the stamp with a waiver would still be a "no go".

Sorry...where does her friend work....

Again, this is likely the current hold on intake with Recruiting Command. However it may just be a permanent policy change (hope not, my airborne waiver request is going up to MEPS in a few weeks).

It looks like I am on my own with the counsellor at this point. When I get to the MEPS on Sept 12th, does anyone have any advice on how to handle the counsellor? If you do chip in your 2 cents, please let me know what your experience is that leads you to believe your approach will be successful. If it makes any difference, I will be attempting to enlist at the Chicago MEPS. Thanks.

I highly recommend using mild military courtesy, by that I mean, stand at ease when talking to anyone in uniform, know your ranks and address people correctly. This will go a long way to them treating you seriously. By 'mild' I mean don't come across too gung-ho, that might have more of a negative effect. Capesh?

The councillors I dealt with where pretty reasonably, simply make your request, if denied, politely advise that you are seeking only an 18X contract and does he/she know weather this no airborne waiver policy is temporary and weather it may possible change in the new recruiting year, or weather it is a permanent policy change, then ask for any advice he/she can give to circumnavigate the issue.

Also it might be wise to approach the main desk early on and advise them of your intent, that way they wont waste to much time processing stuff only to find out that you don't want to sign anything, however this will cause you to have a very long day.

Better your long day then their wasted work

Oh report back on what the councilor says as well would you. Always good for others to have any G2 you gather. Believe me when I say that there will be others that go down the same path you are.

HTH

Scimitar

[MutherRucker]

BTW just for kicks and giggles, type "SORB" (Special Operations Recruiting Battalion) into Google and tell me the first hit you get.

I assumed, since you offered a POC that you knew someone personally. I would certainly have no problem finding a contact listed on public sources.

Sorry...where does her friend work....

I know that was wordy but I hate using pronouns when writing. Its hard to get your exact point across.

Any way, thanks for the tips. I will need to decide if I will wait until after Oct 1 if my attempt to enlist on September 12 fails.

[Scimitar]

I've talked to the guys down there a couple of times, you're not wasting your time calling them, they will be happy to help, they have before with similar situations.

Just a point here, normally you wont get sent to MEPS for a situation like yours unless they already know you have the waiver. Are you sure your recruiter knows your intent? Nicely query her on what she's doing, if MEPS gets pissed of with your recruiter they may as well get pissed off with you.

Not saying your recruiter doesn't know what shes doing, Recruiters are very busy in an extreemly complex system, and oversights do happen.

My understanding of the normal process is that she will lodge a waiver request, she will getback that it is allowed, and then send you up to process that Waiver.

S

[MutherRucker]

For those interested, the policy that prohibits the MEPS from airborne-qualifying an Army applicant can be found here: USMEPCOM Regulation 601-96, Appendix R-6, Section A, lines 2 and 5 (Page 83 in that PDF).

I was able to have an Exception To Policy (ETP) submitted in order to circumnavigate that regulation. I was told by an LTC that the likely hood of that ETP being granted is high.

In the mean time, I went back to the MEPS this morning to obtain approval for my security clearance required for 18X. The security interviewer sent my information to OPM at Ft. Leonard Wood for review. OPM denied my request for security clearance due to repeat traffic violations (speeding), and failure to carry insurance card (all of the later were thrown out, i.e. no convictions). I can PM a full legal history if anyone is interested.

I would imagine that I am sunk for 18X at this point. Anyone have a different opinion?

If 18X is not an option for me, I will be enlisting as 11X and going the ol' fashioned way. Anyone have any tips for me to sweeten up my contract? I.e. are there any good schools that I can request right of the bat? I will be attempting to have Airborne in my contract as 11X (option 4), but what else can I request to make myself more attractive to the SF?

Also, should I knock out my DLAB at the MEPS before I enlist, while waiting to ship, or should I do it in the Army?

[Surgicalcric]

Originally Posted by MutherRucker

...Anyone have a different opinion?

...but what else can I request to make myself more attractive to the SF?

Also, should I knock out my DLAB at the MEPS before I enlist, while waiting to ship, or should I do it in the Army?

There really is nothing you can ask for in your contract that will make you more marketable to SF. Your performance at SFAS will do the talking for you. That being said I would do everything possible to get ABN in my contract. When you get to wherever your duty station will be learn EVERYTHING you can from those around you, it will pay off later if and when you get to SF, regardless of your MOS.

The DLAB has an expiration date on it so I would wait til I got to SFAS unless you currently speak another language and in that case you would be taking the DLPT instead.

Crip

[Twinkdawg]

MutherRucker, I would see about clearing up that issue you have with your security clearance. Me and most of mine were required to get a TS in order to do our jobs. If you can't get a secret clearance than you have bigger problems ahead of you. An important portion of the 18B course requires a secret clearance, let alone the other MOS's. So before I go signing any contracts I would make sure that issue is ironed out.

[MutherRucker]

Thank you guys for you advise.

The reason I was denied the clearance was due to reoccurring instances of the same offenses, i.e. speeding and not carrying an insurance card (mandatory in my state). I would imagine the only thing I could do to clear up this issue is not cease driving over the limit and to be sure I have my insurance info; or am I mis-understanding you? Will the past come back to haunt me in the pipeline if I maintain an impeccable driving record from this point onward?