Military split on Obama, McCain ?

[dennisw]

Military split on Obama, McCain
By Nancy Benac, Associated Press Writer
In print: Wednesday, July 2, 2008


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http://www.tampabay.com/incoming/article655556.ece



WASHINGTON — Brandon Ziegler served two tours in Iraq and wears a bracelet inscribed with the name of an Army buddy who never made it home. Jim Morin saw action in both Iraq and Afghanistan and has lost several friends to the war in Iraq, the latest just a month ago.

Both say their choice in the 2008 presidential election is clear: For Ziegler, it will be John McCain; for Morin, it will be Barack Obama.

Those viewing the presidential race through the lens of military service can see it entirely differently: The desire to quickly get out of Iraq is balanced against the hope to see the country stabilized; respect for one candidate's storied military history is weighed against another's relative youth; concern about the war's drain on the U.S. Treasury is measured against the wish for expanded benefits for new veterans.

Sizing up the candidates as the nation prepares to celebrate Independence Day, retired Command Sgt. Maj. Ronald Friday in South Carolina laughs and predicts "it's going to be an interesting summer." Put him in the undecided column.

McCain, with a family tradition of military service and his own history as a Vietnam prisoner of war, holds natural appeal for members of the military and for veterans. An AP-Yahoo News poll conducted last month found that veterans favored McCain over Obama 49 percent to 32 percent, while the two candidates ran about even in the population as a whole. Three-fourths of veterans in the survey thought McCain would be a good leader of the military, compared with one-fourth who thought likewise of Obama.

Nonetheless, dissatisfaction with the course of the war under President Bush and with the treatment of veterans returning home has given Obama, who did not serve in the armed forces, an opening with military voters and veterans. So does his appeal to younger people.

That Obama attracts support from some in the military is evident in dollars and cents: Among people who have donated at least $200 to a presidential campaign this election cycle, Obama has collected more than $327,000 from those identifying themselves as military personnel, while McCain has collected $224,000, according to an analysis of Federal Election Commission data by the Associated Press.

But it is in the voices of recent veterans and, to a lesser extent, of those still serving in the military, that the McCain vs. Obama debate comes alive — although most active-duty personnel are loath to air their views publicly because they are discouraged from mixing in politics.

Friday, who retired last year after serving as the top command sergeant major at Fort Jackson in South Carolina, said he doesn't want either candidate to take his vote for granted, based on his race or his career.

"I don't want anyone to think that because he (Obama) is of the African-American heritage that he automatically has my vote, or that McCain will get it because I was in the military," said Friday, who is black.

Friday, 49, added that he understands what McCain meant when he said the United States could have troops in Iraq for 100 years, but he doesn't necessarily support the statement. Still, he predicted, "We will be in Iraq until death do we part."

Such talk rankles Sgt. Kenyon Ralph, 24, of San Diego. Ralph, a Marine reservist who served in Iraq twice, is a member of Iraq Veterans Against the War and is backing Obama.

Ralph, who once was a registered Republican and twice voted for Bush, says he gradually turned against the war and now can't bring himself to vote for someone who supports keeping troops in Iraq.

"What did he say? One hundred years or something," Ralph said of McCain. "We've got five down and 95 more years to go."

Sgt. Maj. Brent Dick, a 35-year-old career soldier stationed at Fort Bliss in Texas, hasn't decided whom he'll vote for in November, but he agrees with McCain's stance on Iraq.

"I favor staying there until we are done with our mission," said Dick. He said the candidates' plans for Iraq will be one deciding factor in his vote, but the weakening economy also is a huge concern.

Dick, who served in Afghanistan, said McCain's military service and his time as a prisoner of war are pushing him toward McCain.

"I think that means something for their character," said Dick, interviewed as he and his 8-year-old son got ready to play golf on a recent afternoon at the Fort Bliss golf course.

Not far away, standing outside his off-post home after work, Darrell Warren, a 41-year-old staff sergeant at Fort Bliss, said he's also on the fence, but leaning the other way.

"I'm a Democrat," said Warren, who served three tours in Iraq. He said that while the war will be an issue for him in picking a president, he doesn't see military service as a must.

"They don't necessarily have to have served in the military to know about it," he said.

Ziegler, interviewed in the library at Kutztown University in Pennsylvania after attending a night class, sees three reasons to vote for McCain entwined in the Republican's military service: He connects to McCain as a war veteran, believes it makes sense during wartime to have a president who has served, and says McCain's POW history speaks to the quality of his character.

As for Obama, says Ziegler: "He's new and he's young. He's got what seem like new ideas. I don't think now's the right time for that, being that we are in Iraq."

By contrast, Morin, whose 10 years in the military included four years as a West Point cadet, thinks Obama has the most "comprehensive solutions to complex problems" in Iraq and Afghanistan. He also said he was disappointed by McCain's opposition to an expansion of the GI bill that would offer full military scholarships for those who serve three years in the military.

"I have a lot of respect for McCain," Morin said. "Everyone in the military is going to tell you that."

But then he added: "I don't think he has anything new to offer. His mind-set is really stuck maybe in the Vietnam era, and the conflicts we're facing now have nothing to do with Vietnam."
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Hard for me to believe the picture the above artical is trying to draw.

That Obama attracts support from some in the military is evident in dollars and cents: Among people who have donated at least $200 to a presidential campaign this election cycle, Obama has collected more than $327,000 from those identifying themselves as military personnel, while McCain has collected $224,000, according to an analysis of Federal Election Commission data by the Associated Press.

Additionally, this is somewhat hard to believe.

[Razor]

Obama stopped by our command today, for what legitimate reason I couldn't tell you. Trust me when I say that the "split" was VERY disproportionate, and not in his favor.

[Defender968]

This seems much more accurate than the previous stories on who the military is supporting.

http://www.militarytimes.com/news/20..._poll_100508w/

Sen. John McCain enjoys overwhelming support from the military’s professional core, a Military Times survey of nearly 4,300 readers, indicates, though career-oriented black service members strongly favored the Democratic Party candidate.

McCain, R-Ariz., handily defeated Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., 68 percent to 23 percent in a voluntary survey of 4,293 active-duty, National Guard and reserve subscribers and former subscribers to Army Times, Navy Times, Marine Corps Times and Air Force Times.

The results of the Military Times 2008 Election Poll are not representative of the opinions of the military as a whole. The group surveyed is older, more senior in rank and less ethnically diverse than the overall armed services.

But as a snapshot of careerists, the results suggest Democrats have gained little ground in their attempts to significantly chip away at a traditionally Republican voting bloc in campaign messages and legislative initiatives, such as the recent expansion of GI Bill benefits, experts said.

The poll:
The charts

The methodology


Related reading:
Complete transcript of July 2008 interview with Sen. Barack Obama

Complete transcript of Oct. 2007 interview with Sen. John McCain

In Their Own Words: McCain and Obama on national security

“The military has been perceived as a conservative Republican institution,” said Peter Feaver, a political science professor at Duke University and a special adviser to the National Security Council from 2005 to 2007.

“A lot of people thought that eight years of frustration with the Bush administration was going to undermine that,” he said. “This evidence suggests that it hasn’t undermined it as much as they thought, at least not yet.”

Officers and enlisted troops, active-duty members and reservists, those who have served in combat and those who haven’t, all backed McCain by large margins, to about the same extent they supported President Bush four years ago.

About 69 percent of respondents said they voted for Bush in 2004, while about 16 percent voted for the Democratic nominee, Sen. John Kerry.

McCain’s majority wanes among women and disappears altogether among black respondents.

Nearly eight out of 10 black service members indicated they intend to vote for Obama despite his lack of military service and despite McCain’s record as a naval aviator and prisoner of war in Vietnam.

“I’m going to vote for Barack Obama,” said Marine Gunnery Sgt. Derrick Pipkin, a heavy equipment chief with the 3rd Marine Aircraft Wing in Miramar, Calif., and a black man who said he served seven months in Iraq in 2005.

Pipkin said his vote was influenced more by the continued presence of 152,000 troops in Iraq than by race.

“I believe that we did our best for the country,” he said. “It’s time to move on.”

Iraq is third-biggest issue
Among the top issues for respondents in the survey, the war in Iraq ranks third; it was the top concern in the 2004 Military Times survey. Among white respondents in the most recent survey, the candidate’s character ranked as the top issue; African Americans cited the economy as most important.

Recent progress in stabilizing Iraq has helped McCain politically, Feaver said. McCain was an early supporter of the troop surge credited with helping to reduce violence in Baghdad and other areas of Iraq.

Similarly, the character question plays to McCain’s strength, Feaver said. His dramatic experience as a POW is embodied in his campaign slogan, “Country First,” and carries a particular resonance in the military community, as service members themselves indicated.

Army Sgt. 1st Class Derriel D. Collins, who is black, said he was influenced by McCain’s service record, though he acknowledges black friends question his decision.

“I’m not going to give [my vote] to you just because you’re black,” he said. “It doesn’t work like that.”

“John McCain went to war for this country, even though he had an admiral father who probably could have gotten him out of the service,” Collins said. “He stuck it out five years in a prisoner of war camp. If that ain’t fortitude, showing your willingness to go all the way, I don’t know what the credentials are.”

Army Sgt. Timothy Coen said he will vote for McCain because that would be in keeping with his political views.

“I just always voted conservative and on a lot of the issues at hand — gun rights and abortion — it just seemed like the more logical choice,” he said.

Coen, who is white, said he is proud to see a minority running on the ticket of a major political party.

“But we’d all be fools to think that the race card isn’t going to be played in this election,” he added. “As much as we’d like to say that discrimination or inequality is a thing of the past, it’s not.”

Daniel J. Becker, an enlisted airman who declined to provide his rank because he wanted his comments to reflect only his personal views and not those of the service or Defense Department, said he will vote for McCain because he has always leaned toward Republican candidates.

“I’ve always felt that the Republican Party was interested in having a stronger military, which leads to a stronger America,” he said. “That gives us a better voice in world politics and just makes us stand out as the world leaders that we are.”