12-09-2014, 05:58
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#1
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: 18 yrs upstate NY, 30 yrs South Florida, 20 yrs Conch Republic, now chasing G-Kids in NOVA & UK
Posts: 11,901
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When will the F-35 Madness Stop??
Someone with some testicle fortitude has to stop the madness.
This plane is a complete failure..
Quote:
Luke AFB changes refueling truck color, mitigates F-35 shutdowns, By Staff Sgt. Luther Mitchell Jr., 56th Fighter Wing Public Affairs / Published December 06, 2014
LUKE AIR FORCE BASE, Ariz. (AFNS) -- The 56th Logistics Readiness Squadron recently added a new fuel truck to its fleet designed to improve mission effectiveness and safety on the flightline.
However, it’s not really a new fuel truck, but an old fuel truck with its tank painted white.
What LRS Airmen once referred to as "Big Green," the “new” truck with a white fuel tank has been a little difficult for some to get used to; however, the change has a better purpose then just being aesthetically pleasing.
"We painted the refuelers white to reduce the temperature of fuel being delivered to the F-35 Lightning II joint strike fighter," said Senior Airman Jacob Hartman, a 56th LRS fuels distribution operator. "The F-35 has a fuel temperature threshold and may not function properly if the fuel temperature is too high, so after collaborating with other bases and receiving waiver approval from (the Air Education Training Command), we painted the tanks white."
With the change, the 56th LRS hopes for no delay in aircraft take-offs, all while maintaining mission sorties and ensuring pilots meet training requirements.
"It ensures the F-35 is able to meet its sortie requirements," said Chief Master Sgt. Ralph Resch, the 56th LRS fuels manager. "We are taking proactive measures to mitigate any possible aircraft shutdowns due to high fuel temperatures in the future."
http://www.af.mil/News/ArticleDispla...shutdowns.aspx
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Go raibh tú leathuair ar Neamh sula mbeadh a fhios ag an diabhal go bhfuil tú marbh
"May you be a half hour in heaven before the devil knows you’re dead"
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JJ_BPK is offline
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12-09-2014, 06:22
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#2
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Area Commander
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 2,086
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We could just put an ice cube in the Air Force's sippie cup.....
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Daniel
GM1 USNR (RET)
Si vis pacem, para bellum
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Streck-Fu is offline
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12-09-2014, 07:36
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#3
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Like My Mankini?
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: OH for now
Posts: 437
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How's the white tank going keep fuel cooler in the middle east or Africa?
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blacksmoke is offline
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12-09-2014, 09:03
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#4
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Area Commander
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 2,086
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Maybe using the fuel system as a heat sink for the avionics was not such a great idea.....
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Daniel
GM1 USNR (RET)
Si vis pacem, para bellum
Last edited by Streck-Fu; 12-09-2014 at 09:24.
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Streck-Fu is offline
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12-09-2014, 09:05
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#5
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 20,929
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There's no way you're going to stop the F-35, even if it's a complete failure.
Luke AFB would shut down and Senator McCain would look like an idiot, oh, ok, more of an idiot.
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"The Spartans do not ask how many are the enemy, but where they are."
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Team Sergeant is offline
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12-09-2014, 10:38
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#6
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,822
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The F-35 is a great CAS platform as long as all you need is one pass or strafing run (insufficient ammo storage for more than one) at twice the speed and twice the altitude of the Warthog with a damn sight less survivability.
After they lose the first couple doing CAS, they will keep them above 10,000' and for all intents and purposes, the AF CAS mission will be over.
TR
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"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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12-09-2014, 10:50
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#7
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Cochise Co., AZ
Posts: 6,204
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Let us compare.
BTW, the AF drivers say that it will not have CCIP (Constantly Computed Impact Point) capability, which may not be a good thing when it comes to CAS. Just saying. 
Pat
__________________
"Hector Lives!"
"The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress." -- Frederick Douglass
"The bigger the government, the smaller the citizen." -- Dennis Prager
"The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it." --H.L. Mencken
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PSM is offline
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12-09-2014, 10:58
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#8
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Asset
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Ft Benning, GA
Posts: 10
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Excerpt from 2015 National Defense Authorization Act... It also appears they're letting the Guard keep their Apaches. Interesting read to say the least. Unfortunately they're throwing another 5.8 Billion at the JSF. 
Quote:
-Prohibits the Air Force from retiring or preparing to retire any A-10 or Airborne Warning and Control Aircraft (AWACS), or making any significant changes in manning levels in FY15.
-Increases A-10 Operations and Maintenance funding by $256.5 million and AWACS Operations and Maintenance funding by $34.6 million.
http://www.armed-services.senate.gov...2005-23-14.pdf
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So climb inside your metal coffins, with eye pro that you'll never need.
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geardo211 is offline
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12-09-2014, 10:58
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#9
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Blackhawks-ville
Posts: 356
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Aside from the a-10 platform and the Flying PS4. (Aka F-35), I agree completely, listen to those that depend on it. If it ain't broke.........
At least, some enterprising individual came up with a cheap and possibly effective way to cool the fuel. I would have expected the AF to redesign and build a liquid nitrogen, super cooled, bells and whistles pick-up with a fuel tank for 2 million a piece.
BTW WTF: This new wiz bang mega million toy has no tolerance for the temp of fuel. It's like a kid saying "My soup is too hot!" It is beyond my comprehension.
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TacOfficer is offline
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12-09-2014, 11:09
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#10
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: DFW Texas Area
Posts: 4,741
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So how cool will the Fuel be while sitting iside the Flat Black/Grey AIRCRAFT?!?! Do they have Refrigeration units to keep it cool?!?! I don't believe they are using the Fuel Tanks as Heat Sinks.
Later
Martin
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Martin sends.
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Ambush Master is offline
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12-09-2014, 11:13
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#11
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: DFW Texas Area
Posts: 4,741
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brush Okie
Not if the oxygen system keeps malfunctioning. They will have to stay low.
Let me see they keep harping the future is LIC yet they build a fighter to fight WWIII. Granted I have no issue upgrading our fighter fleet, but lets at least get a good platform not an unreliable POS. Oh yea, during WWIII we will probably need CAS as well. Well what the hell do I know I don't work in the pentagon.
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I thought the only O2 issue was with the F22 and not the F35.
Later
Martin
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Martin sends.
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Ambush Master is offline
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12-09-2014, 11:44
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#12
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,822
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambush Master
I thought the only O2 issue was with the F22 and not the F35.
Later
Martin
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Concur.
I have not seen any reports of F-35 O2 issues.
Just the F-22.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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12-09-2014, 12:12
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#13
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Arizona
Posts: 5,326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blacksmoke
How's the white tank going keep fuel cooler in the middle east or Africa?
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Luke AFB gets temps in the 115+ degree range in summer and much higher on air strips.
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PRB is offline
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12-09-2014, 12:32
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#14
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Cochise Co., AZ
Posts: 6,204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambush Master
I don't believe they are using the Fuel Tanks as Heat Sinks.
Later
Martin
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Oh, but they are:
Quote:
The F-35 channels its strong thermal loads, accumulated by the powerful avionics and sub-systems on-board, as well as the engine, into its fuel. So really, the fuel works as a giant heat sink. If the fuel is already warm upon start-up, there is less capacity to exchange the heat from their aircraft's simmering systems. Therefore the jet must shut down or risk overheating. A clever design that most likely lightens up the jet and leaves extra room for weapons and fuel, but one that may have very little room for adaptation.
http://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/the...-sa-1668120726
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Pat
__________________
"Hector Lives!"
"The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress." -- Frederick Douglass
"The bigger the government, the smaller the citizen." -- Dennis Prager
"The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it." --H.L. Mencken
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PSM is offline
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12-10-2014, 14:53
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#15
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Area Commander
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Western WI
Posts: 7,004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PSM
Let us compare.
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I love that chart, but then I'm unapologetically biased about the 'Hog.
This lack of CCIP is bad juju.
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"Civil Wars don't start when a few guys hunt down a specific bastard. Civil Wars start when many guys hunt down the nearest bastards."
The coin paid to enforce words on parchment is blood; tyrants will not be stopped with anything less dear. - QP Peregrino
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Badger52 is offline
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