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smp52 · 02-06-2008, 13:49

I posted the following on SOCNET the other day, on a similar thread, discussing socialized healthcare. Based upon the vaunted UN's own data, the US is actually above its western european EU counterparts when it comes to human development (health care and long life being a factor in it). EDITED slightly for clarity.....

I've done this exercise before, but just to make my point that the USA isn't too far off the top of the list once normalized for population, I will use the UN's own data from the Human Development Index (a composite figure) to make my point. I will use only EU nations for a comparison to ensure it is comparable to the United States (ranked 12), so we're not getting too far off winding up doing an apples and oranges comparison.

Now, I want to compare approximately 300 million people, so I'll take the EU (494 million) minus the smaller players (who are higher up on the list and at towards the bottom third), which represent the following numbers and approximately 63% of the EU population (309 Million):

Germany - rank #22, 16.8% of pop. (82,400,996)
France - rank #10, 13% of pop(63,718,187)
UK- rank# 16, 12.39% of pop (60,776,238)
Italy - rank #20, 11.86 % of pop (58,147,733)
Spain - rank #13, 9% of pop (44,448,191)

So, normalizing for population, how do the above big boys of the EU compare to the USA?
The rank of the five nations listed above comes to approx. 16
The rank of the total EU comes to approx. 22
EDIT: The ranks are below the USA, though not too far off, but still lower.

So much for how much the US is behind its European counterparts in Human Development. One can't take a look at health care in isolation, it has to be looked at with other economic factors that balance things out. The growth and economy of the United States is far more beneficial, constraining that with a nationalized health care system for 300 million people would not help, rather slow down development.

HDI measures the average achievements in a country in three basic dimensions of human development: a long and healthy life, knowledge and a decent standard of living.

EDIT: My hypothesis is that anything 'social' works only when consent is unanimous. This ideal condition only works in small, homogenous (social, ethnic, racial, religious, economic, political) groups. For Europe, the Scandinavians are the closest one gets to this ideal. Most of the world doesn't fit this, so in order to fit the square peg in a round hole, consent (freedom) is what gets taken away. For a diverse and large population of the United States, it simply cannot work for a myriad of reasons, the first one being a model that does not fit the demographics. The above numbers show that we don't need a 'radical' shift, rather removal of constraints to make the system efficient.

02-06-2008, 13:49	#24
smp52 Guerrilla Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: So. Cal Posts: 122	I posted the following on SOCNET the other day, on a similar thread, discussing socialized healthcare. Based upon the vaunted UN's own data, the US is actually above its western european EU counterparts when it comes to human development (health care and long life being a factor in it). EDITED slightly for clarity..... I've done this exercise before, but just to make my point that the USA isn't too far off the top of the list once normalized for population, I will use the UN's own data from the Human Development Index (a composite figure) to make my point. I will use only EU nations for a comparison to ensure it is comparable to the United States (ranked 12), so we're not getting too far off winding up doing an apples and oranges comparison. Now, I want to compare approximately 300 million people, so I'll take the EU (494 million) minus the smaller players (who are higher up on the list and at towards the bottom third), which represent the following numbers and approximately 63% of the EU population (309 Million): Germany - rank #22, 16.8% of pop. (82,400,996) France - rank #10, 13% of pop(63,718,187) UK- rank# 16, 12.39% of pop (60,776,238) Italy - rank #20, 11.86 % of pop (58,147,733) Spain - rank #13, 9% of pop (44,448,191) So, normalizing for population, how do the above big boys of the EU compare to the USA? The rank of the five nations listed above comes to approx. 16 The rank of the total EU comes to approx. 22 EDIT: The ranks are below the USA, though not too far off, but still lower. So much for how much the US is behind its European counterparts in Human Development. One can't take a look at health care in isolation, it has to be looked at with other economic factors that balance things out. The growth and economy of the United States is far more beneficial, constraining that with a nationalized health care system for 300 million people would not help, rather slow down development. HDI measures the average achievements in a country in three basic dimensions of human development: a long and healthy life, knowledge and a decent standard of living. EDIT: My hypothesis is that anything 'social' works only when consent is unanimous. This ideal condition only works in small, homogenous (social, ethnic, racial, religious, economic, political) groups. For Europe, the Scandinavians are the closest one gets to this ideal. Most of the world doesn't fit this, so in order to fit the square peg in a round hole, consent (freedom) is what gets taken away. For a diverse and large population of the United States, it simply cannot work for a myriad of reasons, the first one being a model that does not fit the demographics. The above numbers show that we don't need a 'radical' shift, rather removal of constraints to make the system efficient. Last edited by smp52; 02-06-2008 at 13:53.
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