Pinewood Derby
 

Anyone remember the Pinewood Derby? Well, the Little Dude is 7 and a Tiger Cub. This was our first year of it, so when I kept hearing "Dad, We gotta get this thing done." I was trying to figure out how without serious blood loss. Back in the foggy days of my Boy Scouts we were talking whittling. And the idea of the Little Dude wielding my Buck was scary. So off to Sears. We discovered the Rotory Tool. A great time was had by all!

Way cool fun! Let us know how he does. Scouting is a great organization and teaches young men a lot of life skills.

One of my sons was an Eagle Scout and we shared many memorable adventures during those times. It's fun to fill the old memory box with these kinds of things so it will keep you from seriously harming the little *** when he becomes a gnarly teenager! :rolleyes:

Richard's $.02 :munchin

I gotta get my son off the ball. His pinewood derby is at the beginning of April and he hasn't done anything for his yet. It's a lot of fun for someone (me) that didn't get the chance to be a scout.

Loved Pinewood derby
 

My sons and I did them for 4 years. great fun if you can let the guys do more of the work.:)

Now you need to teach him some kinetic energy principles and weight distribution techniques and he will be one step closer to genius and winner of the soap box derby!!!

That stuff is great love the snow goggles! Wish him luck and make sure he puts plenty of powdered graphite on them squared axles...:cool:

Just finished my youngest's last PWD (he crossed over into Boy Scouts earlier this month). PWD was a great excuse to teach the boys how to use woodworking tools, and practice some patience ("Am I done sanding yet, Dad?"). IMO, the key to speed is weight placement and axle/wheel prep. Keep the added weights just ahead of or centered over the rear axle. Put the axle pins in the chuck of a drill and use a file to remove the spurs under the head (you run the drill, while the boy can hold the file). Then use wet 220 sandpaper to burnish the pin, followed by a rag with Brasso to polish it. Again, the boy can help chuck the pin, then hold the sandpaper/rag while you run the drill. Lightly sand the outer circumference of the wheels to remove injection spurs/holes and help round them. Put the axle in the wheel, then chuck the axle in the drill, add LOTS of graphite in the wheel center hole where the axle rubs and have Jr. hold the wheel still while you run the drill. Add graphite occasionally. Repeat the graphite process 2 - 3 times. Between the 2 boys, they have 5 1st place pack finishes out of 6 derbies to show this technique works well.

Our race is this weekend! It brought back some memories of when I built mine.....thirty some years ago:eek: It was alot of fun making it.

My sons car weighed 4oz so I added a couple 175gr bullets to bring it up to 4.8oz and with any luck the bullet powered beast will put up a good fight.

My dad and I set up a Bridgeport mill and we really went to work on the axles and wheels.

Saturdays in an empty machine shop with my dad are some of my fondest memories.

If it is still legal to re-cut the axle channels, square them up with a good miter box and the boy can do all the sawing.

Great pics, Dozer. I especially love the choice of eye protection. Just think, 30 years from now when he has sons of his own he'll tell them: "You think you have it tough? Ha! In my day, my dad made me build mine out in the snow in the middle of winter, not in some warm, cushy living room." :D

MY Gosh. . . You ACTUALLY LOST one? Wish I'd posted these pictures before the race. We went four for four . . . Dead last. With this advice "We'll get'em next year!"
The little dude was cool about it."I don't think the super charger works unless there is a real engine in it." Even so, making it was lots of fun and he was very proud that he got to make it himself. Sure was easy to tell the cars that had been "contracted out" to Dad.
And that rotary tool . . . That is so sweet! I remember Pinewood Derby when I was a Cub. (we probably used fosilized wood) Carving and carving between and during three weekly meetings with my little Boy Scout folding knife. We did a little first aid cross training too.

:D Tiger Cubs. . . "if it was easy everyone would do it.":D
You are right about the eye protection. They are made by a company called REVISION. http://www.revisioneyewear.com/index.html
I ran into a Rep at a Conference and he GAVE me a sample of EVERYTHING. (Note to Aspiring QP's The long tab gets you free stuff ;))
These goggles are awesome; they have the widest field of view I've ever seen. And they fit everyone comfortably -- little dude to big headed big guy. I wear a pair of black one when I ski in lousy weather; they are comfortable and never fog up. Nice weather I wear the Sawfly style (glasses) -- very comfortable even with a ski helmet (NSP recommends helmets) the lenses are easy to change. The example they showed of the one that took a shotgun blast with no penetrations or cracks was pretty cool too. I'm not getting a commission and this is not a commercial endorsment but, good gear is good gear.

Dozer523, Boy those pictures bring back some really great memories. My boys are in their mid to late forties and they are following up with their kids now. Great post....:D

GB TFS :munchin

Twenty nine years later, my two PWD cars sit on a bookshelf in my home office. They are fond reminders of the time spent with my Dad in the wood shop.

Your son will treasure those photos in the years to come. Good job! :)

Dozer,

Looks like you missed a few spots when shoveling snow around the b-ball hoop. (Unless you made the "little dude" do it! If you need an extra snow shovel, I'll send you mine. I rarely use it anymore! :D

Congrats on the PWD time. You cannot buy time like that with your children later in life... and they never, ever forget it.

Memories
 

Dozer,
That sure brings back memories from 30 years ago.
Both of my guys participated. I “helped” a little, after they went to bed, by finishing off some rough edges.
Have you enjoyed runny pancakes at Oh-dark 30 yet? :D

SnT

My son was a Tiger Cub when he was 7 YO. He went on to be a Boy Scout and later a Venturer. Made Eagle Scout and Ranger. He was an Order of the Arrow Founder's Award recipient and a Brotherhood Award recipient.

I am a commissioner in the BSA now.

Car #17
 

I still have my car, as well as the first place medal it earned. It didn't hurt that my dad was/is a professional carpenter.

As we were putting it together I expressed to my dad my concerns that the car wasn't cool looking. My dad suggested we maybe should concentrate on making it go fast first, and looking good later.

I was bummed out at the meet when people didn't stop to check it out before the race, mostly concentrating on the cars with paint jobs and flames and G.I. Joe glued on. Lucky for them they got a second chance to check it out, sucking all the bling off the other cars as it blasted past.

If I hadn't realized it before, I did then; my dad is a wise man.

Looks like you have quite a young man there Sir. I got a kick out of how determined he looked going to work on his project. I'm glad his old man can teach him a thing or two growing up. :D:p

Dozer523, you the man. Thats very cool of you getting him in the scouts.
I am a Cub Master here in MD, and ours is on the 4th of April.
There is no better way to teach then experience.

The rest of you Gents,
its good to see that there is a bunch of us that are or have traveled the same scouting trial. This summer I am heading to NM to PTC, with the whole family.
My team are all scouters. its just another adventure to go on.

With many of our back-grounds, I also believe in this way. Heck after 20 years it does matter. its all about the young children that soon will run our country.


CM AL 4 RIVERS Pack 119

Razor is right on. My son is on his 4th PWD and he has 2 Second place finishes and 1 First place finish. I now have 2 more boys to do this with, looks like I have about 6 more years of PWD ahead of me. Whew!

Razor's advice.
 

It's that time of year, again. Bumping this to the fore.
All builders take careful note of Razor's advice.
Good Luck!

Our race is in two weeks... this weekend should be the "big build". I am going to use Razor's advice. :lifter

Knowing that I had been in Scouting growing up, a friend of mine asked me to help her grandson build his car. I helped him research building techniques, designs, and "go fast" tricks etc. Once he came up with a design, we worked on the car in my shop over several weeks until he finished it. Other than the initial band saw cut out, he did all the final shaping, sanding and painting. When trying to get the weight to the maximum 5 oz, he came up with the suggestions on placing the weights and actually suggested the steel rod he saw in the shop over lead weights. It was a great experience and brought back a lot of memories.

First race tomorrow.

Attachment 14423

Used all the techniques Razor mentioned. Getting the weight distribution just in front of the rear axle was probably the trickiest because of the body design Nathan chose. Getting this right is a key step. Too far back and the front will hop around, too far forward and you get no "push" down the track.

Razors advice...
 

...ABSOLUTELY!!

We substituted a dremel instead of a drill and substituted PLEDGE(yup, the furniture cleaner) for the graphite.

Careful not to go too long in the dremel at 30,000 rpm. this will will heat up the axel (nails)too much and mis-shape the axel, which is illegal. (oops! :D)

Slight side track - "Space Derby" rockets - (maybe you have done this, but for those that haven't...)
Glue two pieces of balsa together, the hole in the nose end of the rocket should be no more than 3/8" once glued together.
One piece of 3/8" threaded rod long enough to be chucked into a drill/drill press and fit through the body of stock, one 4 pronged tee nut, a couple large washers.

Chuck threaded rod in drill/drill press, thread one nut, large washer, tee nut into base of rocket body, thread the tee nut while on the rocket down onto the threaded rod, top off with a large washer and double nut nose end.

Turn on drill and using smooth grit sandpaper let the kids sand it down starting at the nose end...

*careful not to sand too much off the top third of the rocket as the walls of the rocket will get thin and this coupled with the tension of the tightly wound rubber band will crush the nose down into the body of the rocket... Oops, again! :D

RAZOR
 

Thanks for seeing Tatonka316 and myself today for lunch.

Glad to hear everything is going well.

WD

p.s., I've got some great PWD model plans, I'll bring them next time I'm the springs.

Won all heats in the Pack level races today. 197.9 avg MPH :lifter Overall 1st Place

Snaquebite and Razor: You're doing some superior "dad work" right now and you deserve to be applauded. Stick with it. Well done!

Edit Note: This accolade applies to y'all doing St Joseph's work. God bless each of you...seriously.

What a fun read...helped my son build his last entry into the pinewood derby two years ago. Thankfully he's still going strong in scouting and already thinking about Eagle Scout projects.

I used my scroll saw to rough cut his car and then he finished with all the sanding, painting, detailing, etc. When I get back from to Bragg I'll have to take some pictures of his earlier entries. Good luck to all of the participants this year.

RAZOR, YOU ROCK.
Little dude and I followed your advice and we made it through the prelims and we are going to district!

Go Dozer,Gooooooooooo Little Dude. :lifter:lifter:lifter

Big Teddy :munchin

Here are a few shots from the Preliminary run. Note the difference in styles. And that is Little Dude and his best bud - chief competitor. I wonder if they realize how lucky they are to have each other as "wingmen" at such an early age.
BTW I need to find about .005 of a second. I'm open to suggestions.
einherjar we used your car design as our base. Thanks (I think "cars" should look like cars.)

1. Lengthen the wheel base. (If allowed)
2. Some folks believe raising one of the front wheels off the track creates less friction. Never tried it though.
3. Center of gravity, 1 to 1 1/4 inches in front ot the rear wheels. Keep the weights low in the body. The car should balance somewhere between 1 and 1-1/4 inches in front of the rear axle.
4. Once you get the wheels correctly aligned, use a small amount of super glue to keep them that way.
5. Take a pipe cleaner and polish the inside hub of the wheel. Most folks don't think about this.
6. When you lube the axels, don't just add a few puffs of graphite. Spin the wheels and work the lube in the hub. Then add a little more on both sides of the wheel.

If your rules allow:

1. Make a round paper hub cap to glue onto the wheel after final assembly of the wheels and axles. When the wheel moves towards the car body, the hub cap contacts with the axle cap before the wheel can touch the car body. The spinning wheel and hub cap just touch in the very center of the axle cap resulting in minimal friction. Even better if you put a bit of graphite in the hubcap before final glue-down.
2. Shave down the wheel width so they look like bicycle tires. This causes a very thin track contact point for less friction. It also has less mass in the wheels meaning less inertia and less energy to get the wheels spinning at the start.
3. The cap on the axle touches the plastic wheel across its surface. This means for friction to slow down the wheel. Grind away the outter side of the wheel so a thin circle around the axle hole is higher than the surrounding wheel. This causes the wheel to touch the axle cap close to the center where there is less energy wasted.

Edited to add: these last three mods are a little difficult for the kids to do.

Happy Racing

Sure looks like they know. Great pics, sir!

Snaquebite, I'm callin' the entire pit crew in tonight. The car is going back up on the lift.
We're going to work on the alignment. -- hubcap idea merits some thought. Major source of frustration was the open slot for the front axles. Did not offer the tighness and support; and any downward pressure messes up the alignment. Solved that by covering the slot with a piece of popcicle stick.
We'll look at the weight placement, too. Thanks.

Dozer, sounds like fun....good luck.

For any who have not seen this it's worth a look. Funny Movie.

http://www.downandderby.com/home.php

Congrats to you and the Little Dude, Dozer.

Congrats to you both, Dozer! Be sure to check the District rules before you do any modifications to wheelbase, wheels or axles--you don't want LD to be DQ'ed for something inadvertently. One year, we did raise one of the front wheels about 1/32" higher than the other three to reduce rolling friction. I don't know if it made a significant difference in overall performance, but that car was also a 1st place pack finisher. If the District rules are pretty strict on modifications, I'd recommend doing the axle-and-wheel-in-the-drill routine with LOTS of graphite (better do it outside to keep momma happy) several times every day this week. The more graphite gets imbedded in the wheels' axle channels, and the more the axle pin and channel gets burnished, the less friction the car has to overcome. Good luck!

bumping this to the front.
It's Pine Wood Derby time.
For those just joining us, there is invaluabe advice here.

We have already spent 2 days working on the axles and wheels alone. We are going with the weights internal. Last year we had them mounted underneath and forward. We were good on the Pack track but didn't have enough clearance at the Council. At the last second we had to move the weights to the roof but we still did well. Thanks again.

Many years ago (40 to be exact) I was a member of the YMCA Indian Guides and not only participated in, but actually took first place in a pinewod derby competition. Can't remember all of the regulations regarding construction but do remember that Dad and I added the melted lead fishing weights to a 3/4" hole that was bored in the top of the car just behind the rear axel. It made the required weight perfectly. I remember that during my constant wins the judges weighed the car several times to make sure it was within regs.

NICE! This time of year we weight a a few of those for our customers since we have two sets of certified scales that weight down to the 1 tenth of an ounce.