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-   -   National Review is Against Trump (http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50328)

sinjefe 01-24-2016 02:17

I think this captures Trump well:

"The appeal of a Donald Trump is obvious:



1) He has his own money, which means he’s beholden to no one.

2) He eschews political correctness and focus-group-approved language.

3) He has charisma and guts enough to broach topics considered radioactive for other candidates.



On those fronts, Trump is an ideal candidate. Unfortunately, behind those positive points lies a mess of unprincipled confusion, pandering and shameless self-promotion all disguised as policy."

http://townhall.com/columnists/derek...y-pal-n2108964

Dusty 01-24-2016 07:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by sinjefe (Post 602925)
I think this captures Trump well:

"The appeal of a Donald Trump is obvious:



1) He has his own money, which means he’s beholden to no one.

2) He eschews political correctness and focus-group-approved language.

3) He has charisma and guts enough to broach topics considered radioactive for other candidates.



On those fronts, Trump is an ideal candidate. Unfortunately, behind those positive points lies a mess of unprincipled confusion, pandering and shameless self-promotion all disguised as policy."

http://townhall.com/columnists/derek...y-pal-n2108964

It's unfortunate that he's the frontrunner, but he beats the alternative-long run and short-and that is an undeniable fact.

Paslode 01-24-2016 09:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by sinjefe (Post 602925)
Unfortunately, behind those positive points lies a mess of unprincipled confusion, pandering and shameless self-promotion all disguised as policy."


I believe you could much the same about the vast majority of politicans. It seems seems to me their 'Policy' revolves around personal-enrichment, covering ones ass and growing their teams brand over the needs of the nation.


Trump only said he could get away with murder, HRC on the other hand actually has gotten away with murder and a long list of other crimes. So the longer this circus continues the more it looks like Trump may be more qualified than he is been given credit.

craigepo 01-24-2016 09:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by sinjefe (Post 602925)
I think this captures Trump well:

"The appeal of a Donald Trump is obvious:



1) He has his own money, which means he’s beholden to no one.

2) He eschews political correctness and focus-group-approved language.

3) He has charisma and guts enough to broach topics considered radioactive for other candidates.



On those fronts, Trump is an ideal candidate. Unfortunately, behind those positive points lies a mess of unprincipled confusion, pandering and shameless self-promotion all disguised as policy."

http://townhall.com/columnists/derek...y-pal-n2108964

I think it was Eric Erickson who recently opined that, while we should welcome Trump and his newfound conservatism, his is too new to be elected as a "trusted conservative" to the most powerful position on the planet. I'm finding it rather difficult to logically merge Trump's present statements with his past actions.

Opinions are preferences which can change. Conversely, a person can't compromise his convictions without redefining who he is. Applying this logic to Trump does not paint an electable picture.

Paslode 01-24-2016 10:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by UWOA (Post 602922)
I was using SFQC premise as an analogy counter to you alluding that neither training nor experience should be deciding factors in selecting/voting for a candidate ... also, given the nature of the process you're always going to be faced with picking 'the lesser of two evils' -- because none of the choices are perfect, so your statement is disingenuous at best; otherwise, based on your subsequent statement it seems we are more in agreement than disagreement ....

.

I agree with you 100% on the need of qualifications. Whether it is me, you or whomever, people find comfort in knowing that a person or persons is up to the task. We all want to people we can count on....

The problem is the standard bar for politicians includes the unsavory qualifications of adultry, lying, cheating, theft, treason, sedition and many other unsavory characteristics......you must be very short on integrity to be a present day politician.

ddoering 01-24-2016 10:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paslode (Post 602935)
I agree with you 100% on the need of qualifications. Whether it is me, you or whomever, people find comfort in knowing that a person or persons is up to the task. We all want to people we can count on....

And they found that in Obama? Sorry but I disagree. The uneducated masses got for celebrity. They are used to shallow personallities. They also don't expect a politician to really follow thru on his campaign promises, at least not during the first term. We are a nation of idiots.

Dusty 01-24-2016 11:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by craigepo (Post 602934)
I think it was Eric Erickson who recently opined that, while we should welcome Trump and his newfound conservatism, his is too new to be elected as a "trusted conservative" to the most powerful position on the planet. I'm finding it rather difficult to logically merge Trump's present statements with his past actions.

Opinions are preferences which can change. Conversely, a person can't compromise his convictions without redefining who he is. Applying this logic to Trump does not paint an electable picture.

Ronnie backed up Truman on the single-payer crap and hung with Humphrey.
People can change.
We may not have a choice other than Trump or a Marxist. What are you gonna do?

Paslode 01-24-2016 12:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddoering (Post 602936)
And they found that in Obama? Sorry but I disagree. The uneducated masses got for celebrity. They are used to shallow personallities. They also don't expect a politician to really follow thru on his campaign promises, at least not during the first term. We are a nation of idiots.

Heck no, they/we got a bag of crap with Obama. But they do believe and expect all the promises that are made to be cashed in full....just as with Read my lips, No new taxes. When they don't get what was promised they run to a new savior.

Do you expect politians to follow through? If not, then why cast a vote?

Paslode 01-24-2016 12:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by craigepo (Post 602934)
I think it was Eric Erickson who recently opined that, while we should welcome Trump and his newfound conservatism, his is too new to be elected as a "trusted conservative" to the most powerful position on the planet. I'm finding it rather difficult to logically merge Trump's present statements with his past actions.

Opinions are preferences which can change. Conversely, a person can't compromise his convictions without redefining who he is. Applying this logic to Trump does not paint an electable picture.

I can agree with that premise, however I do not believe so-called established conservatives like John Bohner, Eric Cantor, Paul Ryan, John McCain and Mitch McConnell (too name just a few) can be considered 'Trusted Conservatives'.

As I see it you could put any of the fives names above in place of Trumps

'I'm finding it rather difficult to logically merge _______________ present statements with his past actions.'

UWOA (RIP) 01-24-2016 13:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paslode (Post 602944)
Heck no, they/we got a bag of crap with Obama. But they do believe and expect all the promises that are made to be cashed in full....just as with Read my lips, No new taxes. When they don't get what was promised they run to a new savior.

Do you expect politians to follow through? If not, then why cast a vote?

I don't expect anyone to save me ... I'll take care of that myself (using a few close friends). That's what sheeple expect -- a saviour ....

.

Roguish Lawyer 01-24-2016 15:17

1 Attachment(s)
You know what they say about pictures . . . :munchin

(1VB)compforce 01-24-2016 15:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roguish Lawyer (Post 602957)
You know what they say about pictures . . . :munchin

Is that the pocket flap of Ted Cruz's suit? :D

(1VB)compforce 01-24-2016 15:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roguish Lawyer (Post 602957)
You know what they say about pictures . . . :munchin

Seriously though... His ties are made in China, his suits in Mexico. It's the way the regulations and tariff structures are set up. When it's cheaper to make something overseas/in another country and import it than it is to make it here, it sets up a trade imbalance that is a big part of why manufacturing in the US is dying. I will tell you that I do believe that Trump is a patriot. If the choice between manufacturing overseas or doing it here had roughly the same costs, I'd be willing to wager that he would choose to make them here.

The US has some of the highest business taxes in the world.

Quote:

The United States has the third highest general top marginal corporate income tax rate in the world at 39.1 percent, exceeded only by Chad and the United Arab Emirates.
http://taxfoundation.org/article/cor...und-world-2014

China is either 33% or 25% depending on various factors. They also have Government sponsored subsidies on goods that are exported. There's a reason that there are so many companies going there for manufacturing, not just Trump.

Interestingly, even though it would hurt his own business, Trump is advocating for a tariff on goods manufactured in China (even though he argued badly in the debate that it wasn't a tariff). This was one of the points that Ted Cruz opposed in the debate.

Quote:

"Both Donald and Jeb have good points, and there is a middle ground. Donald is right that China is running over President Obama like he is a child, that President Obama is not protecting American workers and we are getting hammered," Cruz said. "But Jeb is also right that if we just impose a tariff, they'll put a reciprocal tariffs, which will hurt Iowa farmers and South Carolina producers and 20% of the American jobs that depend on exports."
Personally, I agree with doing it. China is manipulating currency and now their stock market to undermine the dollar. If it wasn't so much cheaper to build in China and import into the US, we'd actually have higher tax revenue AND create more jobs here in the US. My belief is that the impacts that Cruz cited would happen, but the additional revenue and jobs would more than make up for it. The economy is not a zero sum game...

Change the rules to make manufacturing in the US a value proposition and businesses will adjust, albeit slowly.

Dusty 01-24-2016 16:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paslode (Post 602908)
I did not mention anything about SFQC, but it takes far more than whoring yourself to pass the course. Qualifications for SF and DC is like comparing apples to oranges.

The choices aren't all that great, very true. The choice haven't been that great for quite awhile, and every cycle we continue the insanity by voting for the preceived lesser of two evils. The last two lacky's that come to mind were John McCain and Mitt Romney and both were complete jokes.

So if you don't mind a continuation of the DC circus and its insane clown posse by all means vote for Hillary or Jeb, and kick the can down the road for another 4-8 years. A vote for Hillary is a vote for more Benghazi's. A vote for Jeb means fours years of him tellng eveyone he has a plan and hearing what a genuis Karl Rove is.


Nothing is ever going to change as long as you keep playing their game.

Here's what will never change: not voting for the non-dem gives the dem half a vote.

craigepo 01-24-2016 19:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dusty (Post 602942)
Ronnie backed up Truman on the single-payer crap and hung with Humphrey.
People can change.
We may not have a choice other than Trump or a Marxist. What are you gonna do?

As I've said before, anybody in the GOP field is preferable what the Democrats are offering. But the point remains, that the GOP needs to put forward the best we have.
Here's one huge problem as an illustration: Imagine you're Hillary's campaign manager (disgusting, I know, but bear with me). One of your jobs is to put together Hillary's commercials, emails, facebook posts, mailers, etc. Your goal is to galvanize your base, demoralize the GOP base, and to try and get independents and cross-over voters.
The script against Trump writes itself. Trump has traded in two wives for younger women, he owns casinos, he was previously pro-abortion, and his religious faith is lukewarm at best (how many Christians now stay home). He was previously for an assault rifle ban (now the NRA folks get squeemish). He is for expanding use of eminent domain (property rights issues are pretty important in rural areas). He received a ton of deferments to avoid the draft (now your veteran groups are groaning). So, how many commercials could we come up with so far, and we haven't even had a Hillary-Trump debate?
So far, the field has been so broad that he hasn't had to answer any tough questions. He hasn't had to put forward a tax plan, proposals on foreign affairs, etc. Once the field narrows, his off-the-cuff remarks must be replaced by solid policy proposals. I hope that he doesn't come up with anything too crazy, but Trump's history shows that there is no guarantee.
It's one thing to say that a person will vote for Trump vs. the democrats. It's wholly another to say that he should be the GOP nominee. We have some pretty impressive candidates up there, but the problem is that Trump steals the oxygen from the room with a lot of bluster and zero substance. The voters in Iowa and New Hampshire go to the polls in the next few weeks, hopefully they send us some pretty good winners.


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