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-   -   Protecting the Second Amendment – Why all Americans Should Be Concerned (http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=40772)

PSM 11-28-2021 22:45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paslode (Post 672203)
A register is used to record a transaction. Invoice Registers, Form 4473, Driver License, Social Security numbers are all forms of registering a identifier to a individual.

If a person is required to fill out a form to purchase a firearm and the serial number is input on the form that firearm is registered to the purchaser. Whether that serial number correlates to a person being in a vast database is up for debate.

When the gun shop calls the FBI for a background check on the purchaser its really unknown whether the FBI tracks of how many times a person has had a background check run for the purchase of a firearm.

If a person purchases over a certain amount of firearms within a certain time period they are flagged.

It's not unfathomable that purchases at gun shops via Visa, MC, AMEX, etc and even personal check could be reported. That's not much different than banks flagging transactions over $10,000 or getting your ass in a sling because you deposit just less than $10,000 to avoid the paper work.


Exclusive: Feds issue 4,000 orders to seize guns from people who failed background checks: https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...cks/901017001/

The only way the Feds can issue 4,000 confiscation orders is if they know the individuals on the orders have guns. How would they know if a person who failed a background check owns firearms?
I own pre-NICS guns, I have a CCW in AZ which I used my DD214 to get and which means there is also no NICS check if I buy another gun, the FFL holds the 4473s, they are not sent to the Feds, and I paid for a gun delivered to my son's FFL. What do they really know about what or how many guns I own?

Razor 11-29-2021 13:46
Quote:
Originally Posted by PSM (Post 672206)
...the FFL holds the 4473s, they are not sent to the Feds...
Until the FFL goes out of business, then the Feds get all the records for 'storage' at the National Tracing Center.

PSM 11-29-2021 14:34
Quote:
Originally Posted by Razor (Post 672210)
Until the FFL goes out of business, then the Feds get all the records for 'storage' at the National Tracing Center.
Mine died but I only got one lower through him. The best thing was that he only charged $10 for everything.

Paslode 11-29-2021 20:22
Quote:
Originally Posted by PSM (Post 672206)
I own pre-NICS guns, I have a CCW in AZ which I used my DD214 to get and which means there is also no NICS check if I buy another gun, the FFL holds the 4473s, they are not sent to the Feds, and I paid for a gun delivered to my son's FFL. What do they really know about what or how many guns I own?
Time will tell.

Badger52 12-06-2021 20:20
Key portions of the NDAA struck
 
This is simply very good news. I have a Schadenfreude Pie I'd like to throw at a certain General who fancies himself a woke Marshal Zhukov but will refrain.

Quote:
Two provisions staunchly opposed by a group of House Republicans have been scrapped from the 2022 National Defense Authorization Act during negotiations on the bill between the House and Senate, Breitbart News has exclusively learned.

Negotiators scrapped a provision that would have established “Office of Countering Extremism” within the Office of the Under Secretary of Defense for Personnel and Readiness, a source familiar with the negotiations told Breitbart News on Monday afternoon.

The office would have furthered the Biden Pentagon’s goal to “root out” extremists from the military that conservatives feared was aimed at targeting conservative members of the military.


The other provision would have allowed military courts to issue protective orders that could be used to confiscate firearms from active duty service members without due process.
Full story at the jump here.

pcfixer 12-22-2021 05:32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paslode (Post 672203)
A register is used to record a transaction. Invoice Registers, Form 4473, Driver License, Social Security numbers are all forms of registering a identifier to a individual.


Exclusive: Feds issue 4,000 orders to seize guns from people who failed background checks: https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...cks/901017001/

The only way the Feds can issue 4,000 confiscation orders is if they know the individuals on the orders have guns. How would they know if a person who failed a background check owns firearms?
And.... this story is from December 2017-- 4 years ago.. :munchin

pcfixer 12-22-2021 05:39
P.Z. v. New Jersey
 
https://bearingarms.com/camedwards/2...un-case-n53737

Quote:
The Supreme Court is going to get a chance to weigh in on “red flag” firearm seizure laws thanks to a case out of New Jersey that left a man permanently prohibited from possessing a gun after what was supposed to be a temporary seizing of his firearms for “safekeeping.”

The case, known as P.Z. v. New Jersey, began several years ago when the plaintiff was the subject of a temporary restraining order; an order that was ultimately dismissed. Still, even though the restraining order was no longer in effect, the state refused to return the firearms to their rightful owner. And because the guns weren’t returned to him, “New Jersey “forever bars him from again possessing firearms.”
..

Badger52 12-22-2021 18:35
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcfixer (Post 672475)
It is my opinion that it should be law that a matter that has been concluded in favor of the accused, where it involved seizure of property belonging to the accused, the return of that property should be ordered forthwith as part of the basic disposition of the case. It is far too common that a person found to have acted in self-defense or undergoing some other weapon-related proceeding then still has to file a separate petition for return of their firearm(s). It should be law of the land and all these little Vichy protectorates like New Jersey should be cuffed upside the head. [/rant]

SCOTUS is a crapshoot at this moment. They are already 2/3 surrendered to the Dark Side and have not been concerned with Rule of Law since 11 Dec 2020.
I wish him luck.

PSM 12-22-2021 19:26
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcfixer (Post 672475)
Remember the North Hollywood Shootout in 1997? B&B Guns on Oxnard Blvd., who loaned the ARs to LAPD SWAT, never got them back. The owners claimed that the lawsuits between them and the City of L.A. led to their going out of business.

sfshooter 01-04-2022 18:58
Lets not forget that the war is not over in the 2A realm as that is the only way they can obtain true power. In a not surprising move we've added more shit to the citizens who follow the law:

https://americanmilitarynews.com/202...le-here-it-is/

"“Today’s announcements build on the department’s efforts to reduce the risk of firearms falling into the wrong hands,” Attorney General Merrick B. Garland said in a statement."

I think he meant to say it adds expense to the firearms for going into the right hands. If we nickel and dime the gun sellers to death, then there won't be anymore guns sold.

cbtengr 01-05-2022 14:55
Quote:
Originally Posted by sfshooter (Post 672569)
Lets not forget that the war is not over in the 2A realm as that is the only way they can obtain true power. In a not surprising move we've added more shit to the citizens who follow the law:

https://americanmilitarynews.com/202...le-here-it-is/

"“Today’s announcements build on the department’s efforts to reduce the risk of firearms falling into the wrong hands,” Attorney General Merrick B. Garland said in a statement."

I think he meant to say it adds expense to the firearms for going into the right hands. If we nickel and dime the gun sellers to death, then there won't be anymore guns sold.
As I read it the seller must have the devices available for sale, nothing about the purchaser having to buy the device. So what is the point? Just more BS from the DOJ.

Badger52 01-05-2022 20:54
Here's the actual rule.


Quote:
Moreover, the regulation requires that the secure gun storage or safety devices be compatible with the firearms offered for sale by the licensee.
"Here's a safe that will house anything we sell, up to & including that Barrett over there you keep drooling on."

Quote:
The certification requirement does not apply (emphasis mine) where a secure gun storage or safety device is temporarily unavailable because of theft, casualty loss, consumer sales, backorders from a manufacturer, or any other similar reason beyond the control of the licensee.
"We can order you one and here is the ATF's pamphlet with their comments about secure storage."

IMO, this is more reactive pandering but also serves as another lever to squeeze a particular FFL. And, as usual, there is plenty of leeway for them to always adjourn for coffee and come back with another interpretation.

Combat Diver 01-06-2022 00:17
If the building is already secure ie walls, doors, locks and the thief breaks in then its only a matter of time till they defeat the next level.

CD

sfshooter 01-06-2022 09:33
I guess I read it differently. I presumed that the FFL would now have to give (provide) each buyer with a lock box/safe, which in turn would add another expense to the FFL holder.
I didn't look at it in the capitalist viewpoint :D.
But then if the buyer has to buy said lock box then there is more expense for the buyer. All in all just more b.s. to jack with honest people for exercising their constitutional rights.

Old Dog New Trick 01-06-2022 11:55
I haven’t bought a new gun in the last twenty years that didn’t come with cable lock from the manufacturer thrown in the box.

I just bought a new shotgun from Cabela’s and came with a wonky little red metal/plastic trigger lock with two holes and a metal two pronged disk to remove it when I got home. Also included was a small pamphlet to address locking up your firearm and keeping it safe from children.

Best way I know to keep children safe from guns is to give them one when they are young and teach them firearm safety.

Don’t know why the DOJ needs to be involved but I’m sure the law making side of the CDC isn’t far behind.


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