Looks like it'll be another bumper crop of nuts this year...

Richard :munchin

IMHO, anyone who describes himself as a "demolitions expert" is not!

If I may, I would like to add to your research in the form of the Militia Act of 1792, which may provide meaning into what the founder thought about what sort of weapons people should possess:

An ACT more effectually to provide for the National Defence, by establishing an Uniform Militia throughout the United States.

I. Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America, in Congress assembled, That each and every free able-bodied white male citizen of the respective States, resident therein, who is or shall be of age of eighteen years, and under the age of forty-five years (except as is herein after excepted) shall severally and respectively be enrolled in the militia, by the Captain or Commanding Officer of the company, within whose bounds such citizen shall reside, and that within twelve months after the passing of this Act. And it shall at all time hereafter be the duty of every such Captain or Commanding Officer of a company, to enroll every such citizen as aforesaid, and also those who shall, from time to time, arrive at the age of 18 years, or being at the age of 18 years, and under the age of 45 years (except as before excepted) shall come to reside within his bounds; and shall without delay notify such citizen of the said enrollment, by the proper non-commissioned Officer of the company, by whom such notice may be proved. That every citizen, so enrolled and notified, shall, within six months thereafter, provide himself with a good musket or firelock, a sufficient bayonet and belt, two spare flints, and a knapsack, a pouch, with a box therein, to contain not less than twenty four cartridges, suited to the bore of his musket or firelock, each cartridge to contain a proper quantity of powder and ball; or with a good rifle, knapsack, shot-pouch, and powder-horn, twenty balls suited to the bore of his rifle, and a quarter of a pound of powder; and shall appear so armed, accoutred and provided, when called out to exercise or into service, except, that when called out on company days to exercise only, he may appear without a knapsack. That the commissioned Officers shall severally be armed with a sword or hanger, and espontoon; and that from and after five years from the passing of this Act, all muskets from arming the militia as is herein required, shall be of bores sufficient for balls of the eighteenth part of a pound; and every citizen so enrolled, and providing himself with the arms, ammunition and accoutrements, required as aforesaid, shall hold the same exempted from all suits, distresses, executions or sales, for debt or for the payment of taxes.

blah blah blah

III. And be it further enacted, That within one year after the passing of the Act, the militia of the respective states shall be arranged into divisions, brigades, regiments, battalions, and companies, as the legislature of each state shall direct; and each division, brigade, and regiment, shall be numbered at the formation thereof; and a record made of such numbers of the Adjutant-General's office in the state; and when in the field, or in serviced in the state, such division, brigade, and regiment shall, respectively, take rank according to their numbers, reckoning the first and lowest number highest in rank. That if the same be convenient, each brigade shall consist of four regiments; each regiment or two battalions; each battalion of five companies; each company of sixty-four privates. That the said militia shall be officered by the respective states, as follows: To each division on Major-General, with two Aids-de-camp, with the rank of major; to each brigade, one brigadier-major, with the rank of a major; to each company, one captain, one lieutenant, one ensign, four serjeants, four corporals, one drummer, and one fifer and bugler. That there shall be a regimental staff, to consist of one adjutant, and one quartermaster, to rank as lieutenants; one paymaster; one surgeon, and one surgeon's mate; one serjeant-major; one drum- major, and one fife-major.

IV. And be it further enacted, That out of the militia enrolled as is herein directed, there shall be formed for each battalion, as least one company of grenadiers, light infantry or riflemen; and that each division there shall be, at least, one company of artillery, and one troop of horse: There shall be to each company of artillery, one captain, two lieutenants, four serjeants, four corporals, six gunners, six bombardiers, one drummer, and one fifer. The officers to be armed with a sword or hanger, a fusee, bayonet and belt, with a cartridge box to contain twelve cartridges; and each private of matoss shall furnish themselves with good horses of at least fourteen hands and an half high, and to be armed with a sword and pair of pistols, the holsters of which to be covered with bearskin caps. Each dragoon to furnish himself with a serviceable horse, at least fourteen hands and an half high, a good saddle, bridle, mail-pillion and valise, holster, and a best plate and crupper, a pair of boots and spurs; a pair of pistols, a sabre, and a cartouchbox to contain twelve cartridges for pistols. That each company of artillery and troop of horse shall be formed of volunteers from the brigade, at the discretion of the Commander in Chief of the State, not exceeding one company of each to a regiment, nor more in number than one eleventh part of the infantry, and shall be uniformly clothed in raiments, to be furnished at their expense, the colour and fashion to be determined by the Brigadier commanding the brigade to which they belong.

blah blah blah

X. And be it further enacted, That it shall be the duty of the brigade inspector, to attend the regimental and battalion meeting of the militia composing their several brigades, during the time of their being under arms, to inspect their arms, ammunition and accoutrements; superintend their exercise and maneuvres and introduce the system of military discipline before described, throughout the brigade, agreeable to law, and such orders as they shall from time to time receive from the commander in Chief of the State; to make returns to the adjutant general of the state at least once in every year, of the militia of the brigade to which he belongs, reporting therein the actual situation of the arms, accoutrement, and ammunition, of the several corps, and every other thing which, in his judgment, may relate to their government and general advancement of good order and military disciple; an adjutant general shall make a return of all militia of the state, to the Commander in Chief of the said state, and a duplicate of the same to the president of the United States.

And whereas sundry corps of artillery, cavalry and infantry now exist in several of the said states, which by the laws, customs, or usages thereof, have not been incorporated with, or subject to the general regulation of the militia.

XI. Be it enacted, That such corps retain their accustomed privileges subject, nevertheless, to all other duties required by this Act, in like manner with the other militias.

This photograph shows soft armor on the ground with stuff taken off the perp...

LINK

I might be totally off base but my understanding of soft body armor is that when hit it will still allow a significant amount of cavitation. Basically acting as a net.

So without hard plates isn't it reasonable to believe that shots to center mass may indeed have impeded his ability to continue to shoot effectively at least for some time?

I imagine it's also possible he could have retreated. It seems he likely chose the location that would provide minimal resistance with a lot of potential targets. Getting struck with a couple shots may have been more than he bargained for even with the soft armor. He didn't finish off with a firefight with the police and didn't resist so maybe he wasn't ready to die that day. Faced with the possibility of a death not on his terms, he may have fled. Unfortunately, we'll never know...

Soft armor is built to meet NIJ standards for its rating, and to minimize backface deformation. Most soft vests have thin, hard armor plates that you can slip into pockets on the inner side of the vest to minimize backface derformation over the critical heart area.

You do not want to be hit in the vest, but it beats being hit by a bullet in the same area without a vest.

I believe that you could continue to engage while being hit in the vest, but it would likely affect your aim and rate of fire.

Multiple center of mass hits should have slowed him down, and the follow-up rounds to the face (failure drill) finished it. If not, well, better to die while returning fire than shot in the back while running. It is not like you would have had anything more important to do at that moment, and it could save a lot of lives.

And some people take more effort to kill than others.

TR

Exactly. Take Chicago...up 40%.

QP TR,
Thanks for the clarification. You learn something new every day. :)

TR- Thanks for the info. I suppose I over estimated the deformation getting hit would cause.

The shooter was rumored to be heavily dosed with painkillers, too.
Seems like he got ideas from the north Hollywood bank robbery.

"I don't understand why the police officers across this country don't stand up collectively and say we're going to go on strike," - Mayor Bloomberg

Because most police officers believe strongly in the Second Ammendment. Because most police officers will tell you that the best way to protect yourself is to arm yourself and train to protect your family until help can arrive.

Roughly 9,000 to 10,000 people are murdered by gunfire every year in the U.S. (a majority of these victims are involved in criminal activity themselves). Approximately 35,000 people die from drug overdose each year. Yet liberals want to legalize drugs and ban firearms. Makes sense to me:rolleyes:

So he had body armor. Return gunfire could have

A. Struck him in the head and killed him

B. Caused him to turn the gun on himself (as many of these mass shooting suspects have done when confronted by police or gunfire)

C. Driven him out of the theater

D. Distracted him enough to allow more people to escape

E. Struck his weapon and created a malfunction, allowing you to close on him and finish it

Etc.....

Then they could have wiped up his blood and brains with copies of the Bill of Rights.