The Blademaster said stress...

[Bill Harsey]

Wow, Tactical Tooth Grinder! That's not in any of my knifemaking books. I'll have to back and read that again.

Originally posted by Bill Harsey
Think about instant realization of threat like a gunshot right behind you.

Closest example I have was an experience in a Belize jungle.

1) didn't turn; eye dilation and auditory restricted
2) didn't run - actually froze - immobility
3) brain plays games about reality; is this real? Disbelief etc.
4) the sound creating the fear was coming from behind me.
5) actually waited until the animal jumped me - turned out to
be a safe animal.

I always seem to do things abnormally.

[NousDefionsDoc]

Originally posted by Sacamuelas
E=MC2, brain housing group (x-Y2)x(B4/2710)=Cortex BG/12x the square root of a piece of pie=medulla

Right - OODA

If you've seen it before, you'll recognize it faster - especially if it kicked your ass last time.

[Sacamuelas]

LOL.... GO back and read it again and quit being scared of the big words. You sound like Cric and his fear of SOAP format(don't understand it so you make fun of it)...LOL



not exactly ALL that my post said...

It did say that if you seen it before..you'll recognize it faster expecially if it has kicked your ass before....BUT...

It also said that if you create patterns with enough repetition.. you will create reflexive reactions to trained for threats that will actually occur BEFORE your mind even has a chance to interpret that you are in danger. THAT IS THE KEY to being a level 6 monkey stomper!! LOL ( NO, I am not claiming to be at this level)

[Bill Harsey]

gross motor skills, Col. Rex Applegate realized fine motor skills went away just like Reaper said, he adapted his training to teach use of the whole body in sudden emergency situations to both aim and fire the weapon, whether it was handgun, shotgun, rifle or hand held machinegun. He/they trained to take advantage of the bodies natural stress responses to shoot fast and on target while training to overcome problems like loss of fine motor skills and convulsive gripping of the weapon. I know you guys have taken this science farther than the old school could have ever imagined.

[NousDefionsDoc]

It also said that if you create patterns with enough repetition.. you will create reflexive reactions to trained for threats that will actually occur BEFORE your mind even has a chance to interpret that you are in danger.

We KNOW that, but you're putting the fix in before we define the problem.

PS - I'm not scared of big words. I have a gun and I am more than competent.

[Sacamuelas]

I just finished reading the CQB pistol paper from a link on that gutterfighting website you posted NDD. I see Bill H. is covering most of that material in perfect detail... Great read BTW. I am lost as to what you are referring to though NDD.

Therefore, I will

[Bill Harsey]

Originally posted by NousDefionsDoc
We KNOW that, but you're putting the fix in before we define the problem.

Way guilty, I jumped too far forward.

[NousDefionsDoc]

Originally posted by Bill Harsey
Way guilty, I jumped too far forward.

Not you, the tooth mechanic.

create patterns with enough repetition.. you will create reflexive reactions to trained for threats that will actually occur BEFORE your mind even has a chance to interpret that you are in danger.

is how you fix the problem. He's jumping the gun.

Muscle memory is one of the fixes. We haven't finished defining the issue yet. I have to go to bed.

Mr. Harsey, you are a Warrior of many talents.

[Bill Harsey]

Originally posted by NousDefionsDoc
We KNOW that, but you're putting the fix in before we define the problem.

Ok, defining the problem now: "seizing up", "freezing" , "hesitating", "Failure to monkey stomp"...

[Bill Harsey]

Originally posted by NousDefionsDoc
I have to go to bed.

Good night Sir. Will keep thinking here.

[NousDefionsDoc]

Originally posted by Bill Harsey
Ok, defining the problem now: "seizing up", "freezing" , "hesitating", "Failure to monkey stomp"...

Right, caused by AM's adreneline dump - tunnel vision, auditory narrowing, body goes into a protective crouch to protect vital organs, head goes down to protect eyes, blood rushes to organs and face, arms come up, muscles tighten, convulsive grip, fine motor skills are lost. Subject focuses on threat to the exclusion of surroundings, etc.

[Solid]

Why oh why did I miss this thread?! Stress response was a big part of Psych 1.

To spit out what I learnt, and maybe (maybe!) add something to the Tactical Toothpuller's post-

The stressor triggers the hypothalamus. This links off into two chains. The first leads to the release of conticotrophin (CRF), which causes the anterior petuitary glands to release ACTH, the adrenal cortex releases many variants of stress hormones such as cortisol, which activate stress responses in the various organs (heart etc). The second chain begins with the hypothalamus causing the 'sympathetic nervous system' to cause the adrenal medulla to release another set of stress hormones such as epherine, which compliment the hormones released by the adrenal cortex. The sympathetic nervous system also activate stress responses in smooth muscles, which lead to pupil dilation etc. The sum total of these effects is the fight or flight response.
The sympathetic nervous system prepares the body for action by increasing levels of energy available to muscle groups by taking energy away from, for example, the immune system.
The reactions is causes are:
Increases strength of skeletal muscles

Decreases blood clotting time
Increases heart rate
Increases sugar and fat levels
Reduces intestinal movement
Inhibits tears, digestive secretions.
Relaxes the bladder
Dilates pupils
Increases perspiration
Increases mental activity
Inhibits erection/vaginal lubrication
Constricts most blood vessels but dilates those in heart/
leg/arm muscles

Seyle pioneered the concept of the General Adaptation Syndrome in the 1950s, which observes three stages of stress-reaction in the normal person. The first is Alarm Reaction. This is the stage which we are discussing, where the brain activates pre-cached stress responses in the body to better allow itself to survive. It is followed by the Resistance stage, where the sympathetic chain 'powers down' the immune system to allow it to sustain the stress-response. This eventually leads to the final stage, Exhaustion, where the immune system is so low that the body succumbs more easily to disease. The stress response itself can have a toll on the body, for example causing ulcers.

If this is of no use, I'll delete it to make space.

Thank you and have a good morning,

Solid

[The Reaper]

I think that the thread has merit, but if you back up a few steps, you could have already been prepared or avoided the threat altogether if you had been prepared.

I am in a minimum Condition Yellow at all waking times, and frequently while sleeping.

If it is night or a high crime area, I go to Orange.

While you have to train for that contingency that you might be surprised, if you have sufficient Situational Awareness in the first place, you can eliminate the vast majority of those "well, I was at the ATM and the guy just came out of nowhere" situations.

The second part is having the tools at hand to deal with problems on an escalating continuum of threat responses. From SA, to a serious look, to a hard word, to OC, to impact weapons, to lethal force, you have to be prepared. Physical resistance may be a part of that tool kit. It is not the only tool. You cannot shoot a mob for throwing rocks at your car, nor is it wise to go into your White Crane kung-fu kata then.

The next part is having the training to use the tools, automatically after deciding on your course of action. Your best course of action, as has already been stated by some martial arts practioners, is to gain space by temporarily disabling your opponent allowing you time and space to depart. Your reaction needs to be simple, rehearsed to be almost automatic upon receiving the threat, executed swiftly, violently, and until the threat is neutralized.

Finally, you have to have the will to see it through. I refuse to recommend firearms to people without the will to take a life. You take that thing out and wave it around at a provocation, you may be legally wrong, and someone may take it from you who DOES have the will to use it.

This does look a lot like an OODA loop, albeit a very accelerated one. Be situationally aware, identify threats early. Identify threats and analyze courses of action, select the appropriate COA, and execute, determine is reapplication or escalation is required.

Of course, when your plan is disrupted (and no plan survives contact with the enemy), you have to have a contingency plan. When Tony Pryor broke into that room in Afghanistan, shot a couple of bad guys, and got hit from behind with a 4x4 (breaking his clavicle and dislocating his shoulder), he had to break the other guy's cycle and go to a new plan. He did, and he won in a dirty rolling around on the ground fight to the death.

Just some observations and opinion.

TR

[Bill Harsey]

Well said Sir Reaper. This is an unusual group of people here (stating the obvious...). The old saying is that the best fighters win because they train and use the basics very well, not because they have achieved fancier and more complicated tecnique. NDD asked the foundation question that a Col. Rex Applegate also sorted out as the beginning of all problems in close contact combat. NDD also defined the human response to a close sudden threat better than I've ever seen it done.