10-05-2012, 10:53
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#16
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BANNED USER
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,751
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MR2
This inDUHvidual just needs some additional training. I'm thinking that a branch reclassification to Hard Rock Mining is in order with concurrent reassignment to Ft. Leavenworth.
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Leavenworth isn't as cool as it used to be. The farm is gone, the rose greenhouse, the shops are all gone. Trustees don't even bag groceries in the commissary any more.
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Dozer523 is offline
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10-05-2012, 16:22
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#17
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,780
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Okay, what is the message here if we punish everyone below the rank of GO for these crimes, but a four-star does it and gets away with minimal punishment?
Where is the fairness and equal application of justice?
GEN Ward abused his authority, violated his trust, and wasted pulic monies for his (and his wife's) direct personal benefit. He was briefed on unethical activities repeatedly during his career, had an IG and a JAG handy to tell him what was legal and what was not. He deliberately chose to disregard all of this and treat himself like royalty.
Read the IG report. This man was a walking, talking bad example.
As a thief, he should be hammered and made an example of.
The fact that he is not speaks volumes about the corruption of our leadership.
I am amazed that no one saw these defects in his character till he was a General. Maybe this was a pattern, and it was ignored for some other reason till now.
Now the rest of us will probably get to sit through four more hours of mandatory annual training on DTS and what constitutes unethical conduct. 
Meanwhile, he (who has been collecting his check, but not reporting in to work for an extended period) gets to retire without punishment and collect a big-assed retirement check.
Where is the justice?
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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10-05-2012, 19:25
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#18
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Posts: 280
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Ok, I'll say it. Maybe him being a member of a 'protected class' has something to do with not being puished.
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69harley is offline
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10-06-2012, 00:03
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#19
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Area Commander
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Southern California
Posts: 4,476
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 69harley
Ok, I'll say it. Maybe him being a member of a 'protected class' has something to do with not being puished.
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Do have any evidence to support this postulation? That is, other than the obvious.
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Sigaba is offline
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10-06-2012, 10:43
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#20
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Area Commander
Join Date: May 2007
Location: IL
Posts: 1,644
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 69harley
Ok, I'll say it. Maybe him being a member of a 'protected class' has something to do with not being puished.
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If you mean a GO then yes. If you mean black, you are wrong.
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afchic is offline
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10-06-2012, 12:02
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#21
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Arizona
Posts: 5,222
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Dempsey says and does some very questionable things.
His comments about 'retiree's' beeing silent on political events and now supporting a 4 star thief.
I think Dempsey is the perfect example of what a 'good' General looks like to the Obama admin.
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PRB is offline
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10-06-2012, 14:46
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#22
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Sneaking back and forth across the Border
Posts: 6,628
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PRB
Dempsey says and does some very questionable things.
His comments about 'retiree's' beeing silent on political events and now supporting a 4 star thief.
I think Dempsey is the perfect example of what a 'good' General looks like to the Obama admin.
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You mean looks and sounds like an Idiot ? 
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SF_BHT is offline
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10-06-2012, 16:49
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#23
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Posts: 280
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Quote:
Originally Posted by afchic
If you mean a GO then yes. If you mean black, you are wrong.
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Really? I am not so sure about that. You are obviously secure in your position on this. Why?
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69harley is offline
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10-06-2012, 18:43
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#24
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Arizona
Posts: 5,222
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I've an idea....let us let the Dems pull the race card when there is no real proof...that is one thing I never speculate about unless there is a direct link.
I believe this is an example of a stupid GO supporting a stupid GO because he is, well, simply stupid.
Dempsey has already shown his obtuse thought process.....maybe Dempsey thinks it is the right thing to do because the GO is black and he, Dempsey, wants to please his Admin masters....but there is no linkage to prove that....that would simply be Dempsey being Dempsey.
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PRB is offline
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10-08-2012, 12:31
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#25
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BANNED USER
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,751
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Reaper
Okay, what is the message here if we punish everyone below the rank of GO for these crimes, but a four-star does it and gets away with minimal punishment?
Where is the fairness and equal application of justice?
GEN Ward abused his authority, violated his trust, and wasted pulic monies for his (and his wife's) direct personal benefit. He was briefed on unethical activities repeatedly during his career, had an IG and a JAG handy to tell him what was legal and what was not. He deliberately chose to disregard all of this and treat himself like royalty.
... The fact that he is not speaks volumes about the corruption of our leadership.
Where is the justice?
TR
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The message is that with time and rank comes power and the more you have of the latter the less you have to care of why you were given ( yes, given) it.
Lack of action by those in power sends the message that fairness and equality don't matter to them when they see power in general threatened. Is that the truth? I hope not. Time will tell. If Leadership doesn't "do the right thing" then this will set it back. Shoplifting at the PX is gonna be a lot easier to do. Still be hard to get away with thought.
It has nothing to do with his race or his alma mater. He has probably always manipulated the system and others. He didn't wake up one morning and say, "Jackpot!, Honey."
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Dozer523 is offline
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10-08-2012, 16:10
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#26
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NorCal
Posts: 15,370
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 69harley
Really? I am not so sure about that. You are obviously secure in your position on this. Why?
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Based on my experiences and observations as both an NCO and an Officer with experience at the ambassadorial and theater army organizational levels, I, too, agree with afchic's comment. The GO club is as exclusive and as protective of "its own" - regardless of gender or race - as is the US Senate.
Richard 
__________________
“Sometimes the Bible in the hand of one man is worse than a whisky bottle in the hand of (another)… There are just some kind of men who – who’re so busy worrying about the next world they’ve never learned to live in this one, and you can look down the street and see the results.” - To Kill A Mockingbird (Atticus Finch)
“Almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.” - Robert Heinlein
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Richard is offline
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10-08-2012, 16:24
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#27
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Area Commander
Join Date: May 2007
Location: IL
Posts: 1,644
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 69harley
Really? I am not so sure about that. You are obviously secure in your position on this. Why?
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Because I have spent the last 8 years dealing with the GO club. I have seen how they work and know they will circle the wagons to protect one of their own. It has nothing to do with the color of his skin but the four stars on his shoulders.
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afchic is offline
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10-08-2012, 17:57
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#28
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Arizona
Posts: 5,222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by afchic
Because I have spent the last 8 years dealing with the GO club. I have seen how they work and know they will circle the wagons to protect one of their own. It has nothing to do with the color of his skin but the four stars on his shoulders.
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Tend to agree...I worked at GO level for 5 years....double secret probation is the order of the day until it affects the 'whole club' then you get 'offered up' as it where.
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PRB is offline
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10-23-2012, 06:37
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#29
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Area Commander
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Western WI
Posts: 6,824
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard
Based on my experiences and observations as both an NCO and an Officer with experience at the ambassadorial and theater army organizational levels, I, too, agree with afchic's comment. The GO club is as exclusive and as protective of "its own" - regardless of gender or race - as is the US Senate.
Richard
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Decision Soon On Ex-AFRICOM Chief’s Punishment
By Lolita C. Baldor, Associated Press
Early Bird link to AP story
Quote:
WASHINGTON — Demoting a four-star general for spending misconduct could be harsh and would force the officer to lose as much as $1 million in retirement pay, the Army’s top military officer said Monday, noting that a lower level officer would never be asked to pay such a high price.
“I’ve never heard of a private getting fined a million dollars,” Odierno told reporters at a news conference on the opening day of the Association of the United States Army conference. But, he added, “This is not a good old boy network. When you do something wrong you will be held accountable.”
He said it may not be fair to compare Ward’s possible punishments to younger officers, who in many cases are often demoted, discharged or arrested and charged in connection with financial crimes or other offenses.
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I find this last statement attributed to GEN Odierno at once incredible horsehockey, and completely expected.
QP Richard's comparison to legislative "censure" is getting good odds in my book (you're a bad boy, go to your room & no allowance for 2 weeks). Not like 1 speaking engagement won't make up the difference.
More bling should mean more sting.
__________________
"Civil Wars don't start when a few guys hunt down a specific bastard. Civil Wars start when many guys hunt down the nearest bastards."
The coin paid to enforce words on parchment is blood; tyrants will not be stopped with anything less dear. - QP Peregrino
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Badger52 is offline
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10-23-2012, 08:38
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#30
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Italy
Posts: 1,987
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Odierno's commenst are offensive and out-of-touch. So, someone of lesser grade wouldn't be punished as severely? Do we not expect the behavior of a four star to differ from that of a Private or Lieutenant? Does anyone really believe that a Private or lieutenant wouldn't go to jail over this? Or that he wouldn't be, comparatively (at least) strip[ped of his pay, let alone not being allowed to retire?
He disgusts me.
__________________
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sinjefe is offline
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