Old 06-24-2008, 19:05   #16
uboat509
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Originally Posted by rudelsg2 View Post
So, I guess back when it was just phase 2 (MOS) and then phase 1&3, all the guys that failed out due to the inability to pass land nav, were cheated out of their right to be in SF also? Where does this sense of entitlement come from, and where does it end?
First of all, I never said anyone had a right to be SF. I simply said that just because someone does not have the aptitude to pass the 18D course does not mean that they would not be an asset to SF in another MOS. During my time in SF I have met quite a few guys who started out in the 18D course but finished another course. They were not sh*tbags who had some sort of sense of entitlement. They were good guys who did not have the aptitude to pass the 18D course.

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Old 06-24-2008, 19:40   #17
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First of all, I never said anyone had a right to be SF. I simply said that just because someone does not have the aptitude to pass the 18D course does not mean that they would not be an asset to SF in another MOS. During my time in SF I have met quite a few guys who started out in the 18D course but finished another course. They were not sh*tbags who had some sort of sense of entitlement. They were good guys who did not have the aptitude to pass the 18D course.

SFC W
Granted you didn't and I have met guys as you describe also. But, I also have friends that could have been described as not having the aptitude for 18D, but buckled down, completed it and are/were great medics. But, then they also did not act as if they had the door out to another MOS in the corner of their eye either just so they could "be" SF.

Maybe my post is more for the ones who have the misconception that just because they put alot of time into something it gives them some kind of credit to cash in if they fail. Ever see a day one recycle in Florida?

It seems alot of studs come here wanting/needing their short comings validated by someone else instead of being a man, buckling down and doing what needs to be done.

But, then again, my post was about the policy as posted. If it keeps the guys out who go through every MOS 2 or 3 times till they hit jackpot, it is fine by me. I do not know about others, but I never needed a full team that badly.

Last edited by rudelsg2; 06-24-2008 at 19:53.
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Old 07-01-2008, 20:06   #18
weeman
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As far as I am concerned this is the only GOOD thing I have heard of him implementing. Personally, I am tired of the three and four time mouth breathing re-treads that get recycled through till they finally find a MOS that they are mediocre at. A SFQC Grad should be more than a warm body with a MOS attached to it.

If your looking for someone to rub your belly and tell you it will be o.k., you need to quit now and join the Peace Corp.
I didn't start this thread to have my belly rubbed or to tell you I want to to quit and join the peace corp. I was referring to the fact that hard working students are getting screwed becuase like you said someone was "sensitive" to some sh%$bags and they slid through. I absolutley do not think that just becuase I was selected I am entitled to be in SF. I fully understand that I was selected to ATTEND the SF QUALIFICATION Course and I fully understand that everyday I have to bust my @$$ to be here and to stay here to QUALIFY to be in SF. I also completly understand your frustration. When I was a SQD LDR/ PLT SGT the Army has the same mentality of "your SQD LDR/PLT SGT will teach you", but isn't it our jobs as NCO's to mentor, train and influence others to accomplish the mission by providing purpose, direction, and motivation? I do believe above average guys should be in SF and all I was commenting on was that the new policy was getting rid of some above average guys.
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Old 07-01-2008, 22:51   #19
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I didn't start this thread to have my belly rubbed or to tell you I want to to quit and join the peace corp. I was referring to the fact that hard working students are getting screwed becuase like you said someone was "sensitive" to some sh%$bags and they slid through. I absolutley do not think that just becuase I was selected I am entitled to be in SF. I fully understand that I was selected to ATTEND the SF QUALIFICATION Course and I fully understand that everyday I have to bust my @$$ to be here and to stay here to QUALIFY to be in SF. I also completly understand your frustration. When I was a SQD LDR/ PLT SGT the Army has the same mentality of "your SQD LDR/PLT SGT will teach you", but isn't it our jobs as NCO's to mentor, train and influence others to accomplish the mission by providing purpose, direction, and motivation? I do believe above average guys should be in SF and all I was commenting on was that the new policy was getting rid of some above average guys.
So why did you start this thread? Still sounds like more of the same to me. Minus the last nine months at the SGM Academy, the last 14 years of my Army life has been spent in an SF company. So unless you have any amount of time close to that, I doubt you understand my "frustration" as you call it.

I find it amusing that in the same thread you have graduated from an NCO that viewed going back to the regular Army as "babysitting"; to schooling me on what my responsibilty is as an NCO. Give me a break.

The Army is full of above average guys that did not make the cut for one reason or another, that's life. I have always considered myself a average Soldier who had the ability to accomplish above average goals, through self motivation, drive and the want to do or be something few people could. Maybe that is why I worked harder to accomplish my goals, instead of hoping someone else would set the right conditions for me to achieve them.

But, I guess it is always easier to blame the system than to examine oneself and determine what one's weakness really is and how to make it one's strength.

I guess I'm glad there was no internet and books about how to make it into SF when I went through. Otherwise I might have sat around and felt sorry for myself instead of just doing it, whatever the outcome. Nah, never.

Last edited by rudelsg2; 07-01-2008 at 23:32.
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Old 07-13-2008, 08:04   #20
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I have been in the Army 9 years. I don't know if you consider that close enough to your 14 years in SF company and an additional 9 months in the SGM academy, but I feel that I might have been almost halfway around the block.

Obviuosly we dont agree about the policy. Thats fine. I do agree that a student shouldn't bounce from MOS to MOS ,but it should be on a case by case basis if they do get recycled to another MOS once. I do also agree that they should raise the GT score back to where it use to be.

The 'babysitting" comment I guess needs clarified. I did not mean every soldier needs babysitted. The soldier that doesn't want to be in the Army, he thinks everyone is against him, he does drugs( not just pot but all the way up to herion), can't pass a PT test, is waaayyy overwieght...etc. That is the type of soldier I am sick of "babysitting". Commanders need to enforce regulations to kickout dirtbags instead of worrying about the numbers. Kind of sounds like an issue SF has faced, but my apologies for saying as a leader I have been frustrated with they the way the Army works sometimes.

The D course is more than just "buckling down and studying". There is more to it. SARR is a good example.

Finally the reason I started the thread was again I do not agree with the policy and I thought people should be aware of it.
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Old 07-13-2008, 09:22   #21
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I have been in the Army 9 years. I don't know if you consider that close enough to your 14 years in SF company and an additional 9 months in the SGM academy, but I feel that I might have been almost halfway around the block.
No, I would not, two different worlds. By the way that's 14 years in an SF company out of 20 in the Army, but I guess I get no respect for that from you either, SF Candidate. But by all means, if you graduate, please let me know and I will request you for my company and we can talk about it then.

I guess the "18D course made easy" did not quite work out the way you envisioned it?

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Old 07-13-2008, 17:15   #22
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Parker will be missed like a cold sore.

x/S
thought that it would more like an infectious disease like the clap.....
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Old 07-13-2008, 17:40   #23
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Some of the best teammates I've had over the last 16yrs in SF took the 18D "Short Course", and then completed the 18C or 18B courses.

I recommend that you young aspiring Special Forces Soldiers familiarize yourself with the SOF Truths.

I heartily agree with Rudelsig in regards to the need for quality personnel on an ODA.


Klagt Nicht, Kampft !!
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