05-27-2011, 09:51
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#1
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Kansas City (Overland Park, KS)
Posts: 30
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SF Combat Patches for Leg Spt
Was told last night that some 20th Gp company down in MS, after returning from A-stan, was handing out orders for SF combat patches like they were party favors. The result is there are a bunch of leg support troops running around them parts sporting SF patches on their right shoulder.
Any of you know about this?
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Mother Forker
Formerly of 1st, 5th and 12th Gps
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MoFo is offline
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05-27-2011, 10:11
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#2
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Area Commander
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Raeford, NC
Posts: 3,374
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If they were assigned or attached to a SF unit, that's the patch they wear.
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D-3129 Life
"If one day you decide to know yourself...you'll have to choose the warrior path...You'll reach the darkness of your spirit.... Then, if you overcome your fears....You will know who you are."
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Snaquebite is offline
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05-27-2011, 10:13
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#3
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pacific North West
Posts: 89
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This happens a lot with anyone attached to ODAs as well as smaller "leg like" units attached to bigger airborne units or any other unit they think is cool. It gets as bad as Army units wearing Marine unit patches for a combat patch when Marines themselves do not wear them. Sometimes it’s a appreciative gesture that the conventional guys take some pride with serving alongside an ODA.
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BRAVO-SMASH is offline
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05-27-2011, 10:19
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#4
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,780
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Yes, that happens with our attachments.
The Rangers don't do that, BTW. Their attachments and enablers get the SOCOM combat patch, IIRC. You don't get a combat scroll unless you are assigned to Regiment.
TR
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The Reaper is offline
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05-27-2011, 10:19
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#5
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoFo
Was told last night that some 20th Gp company down in MS, after returning from A-stan, was handing out orders for SF combat patches like they were party favors. The result is there are a bunch of leg support troops running around them parts sporting SF patches on their right shoulder.
Any of you know about this?
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It's nothing new.
1. What you arte calling combat patches are shoulder sleeve insignia-former wartime service (SSI–FWTS), not awards for combat.
2. Active Duty SFG's cut the very same orders, because that's what Army regs call for.
Last edited by VVVV; 05-27-2011 at 10:22.
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05-27-2011, 10:23
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#6
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Reaper
Yes, that happens with our attachments.
The Rangers don't do that, BTW. Their attachments and enablers get the SOCOM combat patch, IIRC. You don't get a combat scroll unless you are assigned to Regiment.
TR
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Gives a whole new meaning to "Scroll to the road".
Last edited by wet dog; 05-27-2011 at 11:32.
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05-27-2011, 11:20
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#7
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NorCal
Posts: 15,370
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Reaper
The Rangers don't do that, BTW. Their attachments and enablers get the SOCOM combat patch, IIRC.
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SOCOM or USASOC? I've only seen the latter.
Richard
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Richard is offline
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05-27-2011, 12:40
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#8
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Kansas City (Overland Park, KS)
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No OpCon
What I heard was that they were given to troops who were neither assigned nor attached, no opcon, and thus should not have had those orders.
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Mother Forker
Formerly of 1st, 5th and 12th Gps
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MoFo is offline
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05-27-2011, 12:44
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#9
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: PNW
Posts: 685
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ALARACT 055/2007
Unless there is an update that supersedes this, I refer to paragraph 9 in this ALARACT:
9. SOLDIERS WHO ARE CROSS-LEVELED, ASSIGNED, ATTACHED, OR AUGMENTING DEPLOYED UNITS, AND SOLDIERS WHO ARE TDY ON ORDERS THROUGH THE USE OF DD FORM 1610 (REQUEST AND AUTHORIZATION FOR TDY TRAVEL OF DOD PERSONNEL) WILL WEAR THE SAME SSI-FWTS WORN BY MEMBERS OF THEIR DEPLOYED UNIT (COMPANY OR HIGHER) TO WHICH ATTACHED OR OPCON. THIS DOES NOT APPLY TO MEMBERS OF TRIAL DEFENSE AND CIDC, WHO WILL WEAR THE SSI OF THEIR RESPECTIVE COMMANDS AS THEIR SSI-FWTS.
Obviously, from reading other portions of this ALARACT, one must pay close heed to the nature of the relationship between the SOF unit and the supporting unit.
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BKKMAN is offline
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05-27-2011, 16:03
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#10
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Quiet Professional
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Anyone assigned to a SFG during a combat rotation can get a UNIT PATCH. They must be in the unit for I think Three months in a Combat Zone.
Yes it is or the get orders for combat patches are shoulder sleeve insignia-former wartime service (SSI–FWTS)... NOT THE SPECIAL FORCES TAB just the Special Forces Unit patch which comes with ONLY the AIRBONE TAB.
I'm 18 Series not a PAC clerk so I don't know the Regs.
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Intelligence failures are failures of command [just] as operations failures are command failures.”
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MtnGoat is offline
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05-27-2011, 16:08
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#11
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Guerrilla Chief
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Ft Benning
Posts: 707
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MoFo,
PM me particulars and I'll look into it. I personally can attest that the 2/20th SOT-As are in compliance with 670-1 and the ALARACT. Our MI Det SGT would not tolerate anything less.
Lindy
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lindy is offline
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05-27-2011, 20:01
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#12
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Arizona
Posts: 5,222
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from my experience in Astan it's pretty much put on whatever patch you want.
We had imbedded NG's with the 205th Afghan Corps that had their own HQ's and complete Bn State unit deployed.....when SF took opcon of the Afghans for an individual op and the imbedded NG's went with they would all put on SF combat patches the next day.(those that rode along)
If they went with a US unit (173rd) then they'd wear that patch to (velcro is a great thing).
Mother Army doesn't care as long as they deploy. Sad really as tradition and unit integrity is not what it once was.
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PRB is offline
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05-27-2011, 22:46
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#13
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Quiet Professional
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MtnGoat
Anyone assigned to a SFG during a combat rotation can get a UNIT PATCH. They must be in the unit for I think Three months in a Combat Zone.
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There is no time in theater requirement for the SSI-FWTS and by extrapolation, no time requirement with the unit you are assigned/attached/OPCON to in theater in order to wear their patch.
From the ALARACT that I posted above:
5. THERE IS NO TIME-IN-THEATER REQUIREMENT TO BE AUTHORIZED TO WEAR THE SSI-FWTS.
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The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal. Aristotle
It is not inequality which is the real misfortune, it is dependence. Voltaire
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BKKMAN is offline
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05-28-2011, 06:57
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#14
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Asscrackistan
Posts: 4,289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BKKMAN
There is no time in theater requirement for the SSI-FWTS and by extrapolation, no time requirement with the unit you are assigned/attached/OPCON to in theater in order to wear their patch.
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I was hoping a S1 NCO would log on this weekend.. But with it being the weekend it is. I'll stop in Monday and ask PAC about this.
__________________
"Berg Heil"
History teaches that when you become indifferent and lose the will to fight someone who has the will to fight will take over."
COLONEL BULL SIMONS
Intelligence failures are failures of command [just] as operations failures are command failures.”
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MtnGoat is offline
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05-28-2011, 07:41
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#15
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Quiet Professional (RIP)
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Carriere,Ms.
Posts: 6,922
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BKKMAN
There is no time in theater requirement for the SSI-FWTS and by extrapolation, no time requirement with the unit you are assigned/attached/OPCON to in theater in order to wear their patch.
From the ALARACT that I posted above:
5. THERE IS NO TIME-IN-THEATER REQUIREMENT TO BE AUTHORIZED TO WEAR THE SSI-FWTS.
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That is shameful that they are allowed to wear it,they are no better than any other POSER we've address so far........ It's just BS pure and simple......... 
Big Teddy 
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I believe that SF is a 'calling' - not too different from the calling missionaries I know received. I knew instantly that it was for me, and that I would do all I could to achieve it. Most others I know in SF experienced something similar. If, as you say, you HAVE searched and read, and you do not KNOW if this is the path for you --- it is not....
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SF is a calling and it requires commitment and dedication that the uninitiated will never understand......
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SFA M-2527, Chapter XXXVII
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greenberetTFS is offline
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