Marksmanship When You Cannot Go To The Range.

[Longstreet]

Jayson here and I am a Reservist in the Canadian Forces. In a couple of weeks we will be doing our annual rifle marksmanship tests where we have to both shoot from a stationary position and run a distance and then shoot from a stationary position. In the past I have always passed the tests, but I would like to earn our "advanced marksman" award where I have to score a higher amount of points.

The problem is that we have minimal range time and I do not have a C7 (M4) at home to at least practice going through the movements with. I know fitness is part of shooting and have been engaging in exercises where I sprint a short distance and then run a distance before sprinting again. I have also been doing daily PT to help strengthen my core. Several years ago I purchased an old Army sniper manual and have used some of the skills it mentioned to get me where I am now (passing). Unfortunately, I have been told that the skills I used (in particular exhaling and holding my breath before shooting) are more for a sniper type rifle and not a C7.

I have looked briefly on Google, but have not really found anything that did not include going to a shooting range. So I was wondering if there is anything I can do at home to help improve my scores? I do have a .22 and can practice any drills on it if it would help. I even purchased a number of mags and have practiced getting them in and out of my tacvest while wearing my helmet and ballistic glasses while wearing gloves to help become more familiar with shooting. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

One last thing which may be of importance. The C7 is equipped with a C79 optical sight rather than standard iron sights.

jaYson

[1stindoor]

Have you ever tried to do the dime/washer drill after your sprints?

[Longstreet]

Jayson here and I just did a Google search of it and found this website which explains your dime/washer drill as well as a number of others.

https://www.globalsecurity.org/milit...-22-9/appa.htm

I am looking to start implementing some of these drills. That being said, as mentioned I do not have easy access to a C7. Would it help to use the 22. rifle that I have to simulate using my C7?

jaYson

[frostfire]

Unless you are completely inept with the operation of an AR platform, not practicing with the actual C7 should not be completely detrimental. Further, you are not competing against everybody else but against a set standard. Do a search of posts by Master Gene Econ on physical, technical, and mental aspects of marksmanship excellence. Mentally rehearse/visualize the course of fire, the physical steps of operating the C7, all the way to scoring perfect in all stages. Do it especially the night before.

Originally Posted by Longstreet

Unfortunately, I have been told that the skills I used (in particular exhaling and holding my breath before shooting) are more for a sniper type rifle and not a C7.

IMHOO, not true. The shot process is the same, albeit at shorter cycle. It's not holding breath, it's natural respiratory pause. Not. The. Same. Note your respiration next time during a conversation, and you will find there's a spot where the brain is not telling the body to breathe. With good cardio and mental conditioning, that spot will get longer. Likewise with HR. My resp pause is about 20 seconds now with 36 resting HR. Folks always thought I was a runner, resulting in several curses from NCO's who thought by hanging out right behind me during APFT they'll get fast run times. By third lap they realize I was not going any faster and it's too late for them to make up the time lag

Originally Posted by Longstreet

I know fitness is part of shooting and have been engaging in exercises where I sprint a short distance and then run a distance before sprinting again. I have also been doing daily PT to help strengthen my core.

Good. Just add the mental rehearsal part to it. Don't just do PT for PT sake, but incorporate the stages of your qual i.e. dry running the stage. You see competition shooters do it all the time. Heck, the door kickers use a mock house of the target and rehearse zillion times too.

Originally Posted by Longstreet

I even purchased a number of mags and have practiced getting them in and out of my tacvest while wearing my helmet and ballistic glasses while wearing gloves to help become more familiar with shooting. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Unless, they are the minimum requirement of the qualification, looking like Rambo is neither the requirement nor the solution towards marksmanship excellence. The helmet and glasses are good idea since you cheek weld and positioning tend to be different with those two

Originally Posted by Longstreet

One last thing which may be of importance. The C7 is equipped with a C79 optical sight rather than standard iron sights.

jaYson

Well, it's a magnified optics like ACOG. Obviously if you have zero familiarity/proficiency with it, you'll be at disadvantage. But if you already know the eye relief and cheek placement that works with you from past training, it should not be a problem. Disciplining the eye to focus on the harder itty bitty front sight then going to a magnified reticle is good training.

Finally, practice these positions

http://www.army-armee.forces.gc.ca/en/cafsac/index.page
https://www.flickr.com/photos/canadianarmy/15235079680/

Kneeling is where most falter.

[Sinister]

Great advice above.

Generations of Canadian and allied Soldiers shoot against each other annually at CFSAC, at Bisley, in Australia, and at Camp Robinson. Many of them don't have access to a C7, either.

Find a range that allows you to run and fire. Use your .22 -- irons or glass, machts nichts. While the hardware changes the mechanics are the same -- it shouldn't matter if you're using a C7, C8, AK, or anything else -- you break the shot when it's right...master your own body and the function of breaking a correct shot.

Good luck -- you should have fun!

[ccrn]

If you you want to shoot outside of your unit having any rifle helps. Having an M4 is great if even just to dry fire and rehearse magazine changes.

As far as marksmanship Im not an expert but having spent 10 years in the Army, 4 years in the Infantry and 6 years SF support with trips to the box, Ive done a little shooting. The same basic marksmanship for shooting a 22 applies to shooting an M4 or sniper rifle. Just different positions, moving targets, and while moving. Even with owning my own AR15 and having shot some courses, nothing prepared me as much as just being in the Army and shooting with my unit. Doesn't your unit shoot regularly? I was in a National Guard Infantry unit and we shot every month. Typically an 18 hour day. We went to the shoot house a couple times a year. Thats what we got and we did the best with that. I think half the battle is just wanting to be better than you currently are. Constantly striving to be better. Im still doing that., dry firing almost daily and shooting occasional competitions.

I think if you stay in good shape (maybe do a taper before your competition vs going out to see if youre in shape or not) and shoot some with that little 22 you have youll be fine. Just use BRASS (breath, relax, aim,site picture, squeeze) .

As far as "differences" of shooting with a 22 or M4 the biggest difference the US Army teaches (and I use) is if you have time and youre just zeroing your weapn etc then they teach to hold your breath in the neutral spot between breaths, when your lungs are neither empty or full. While youre still comfortable, take your shot.

With an M4 in a combat shooting scenario you want to take your breath in then hold it while you take your shot.

An advanced standing posture with M4 is to face your target, pull your weapon in tight, pull your elbows in tight to your sides, round your shoulders slightly forward, and take in a big breath. Youll find this sucks the weapon in tight and gives you a stable turret.

*Make sure your hand is high up on the pistol grip, as high up on the back strap as it can go
*Pull the weapon in tight to your shoulder pocket
*I hold my non-firing hand all the way out on the end of the free floating tube but you probably have a gov issues piece with short fore-grip and iron sight. Use this to pull the weapon back as well, or a Chicago grip if you use one (I bought my own when they were popular)
*Squeeze or pull the trigger back with the pad of your finger
*If youre using red dot focus on the target. If youre using iron sights focus on the front sight post keeping the target blurry. Works good with handguns too (flash sight picture)
*I was taught in the Infantry (and at Group) to stand facing the target while shooting. Dont stand bladed.

This is all stuff I learned in the Army or at shooting schools. I never shot before the Army and didnt grow up with guns. Everything you need to be a great shooter and shoot expert is in an Army manual. Instead of reading a SOF sniper manual perhaps get your military M4/M16 manual and read every word.

If you really want to get good I cant recommend competition enough. Civilian competition completely changed military shooting in America when Tier 1 and Tier 2 guys started going to events after their first few trips to Afghanistan and Iraq. ITs all over America in the form of 2 gun, 3 gun, Steel challenge, IDPA and USPSA.

Search Frank Proctor on ******* that guy has forgotten more than most people knew and he knows how to blend competition and combat shooting which he sees as on and the same. He was our senior instructor when I was still support in group.

See you on the high ground-

[frostfire]

Originally Posted by ccrn

*Squeeze or pull the trigger back with the pad of your finger
-

This is one of the old school methodology the MTT aimed to remove.
If it’s on open source, look at the new manual Jayson or anybody else there’s a good section on this

Don’t get me wrong, if it works it works. However,
with 6 to 8 lbs trigger pull and even grittier and not consistent with burst model, one wants to maximize leverage, which lead to smoother pull and not milking/jerking the trigger.
Per Master Gene Econ and master Boucher, place wherever the index falls naturally on trigger face. Combining with the above, for most it’s the first joint.
FWIW just a marksmanship circus monkey here, who’s been blessed to compete against, instructed by, and to coach the best.