US Army Combat Tracking School

[MtnGoat]

Originally Posted by exsquid

MtnGt:

I think you are a little high on your estimate, not much but a little. I figured it at $25,853.37 (FY2009) w/ the course being funded. Adding in another $10K to cover TTOS's cost, I think $35K should cover it.

x/S

Nope, Just did a DFT for the course. So with current airfare, rental cars and TDY for 10 PAX ODA and course fees. It's around that mark.

Me IMO I think is should fall under TRADOC or JIEDDO (SA) funding. 5th and 10th, from what I'm told have used this training to track bad guy and do some bad things to them.

[exsquid]

Damn inflation. I stand corrected.

x/S

[Guy]

See if you can swing some type of deal with them, their trackers are outstanding and do it on a daily basis; they use too teach at New Mexico Tech for DOS-Anti Terrorism Assistance Program.

Stay safe.

[Knight]

Are there any books out there that anyone with experience in this field would recommend on the skill of tracking? I have done some research, but nothing has stood out as better than another. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks Gentlemen.

[NoRoadtrippin]

I am getting word from one of the O's on our BN staff that an ODA-esque or group related team is going to be teaching a MTT tracking school at Hood sometime soon. Any information anyone can provide on that?

[BoyScout]

Originally Posted by Knight

Are there any books out there that anyone with experience in this field would recommend on the skill of tracking? I have done some research, but nothing has stood out as better than another. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks Gentlemen.

Look on page two for ScoutTracker's post. I grew up on a state park, all I had to do was either fish or run in the woods and track down different animals. What little man tracking I did was for some lost guys with dad and other LEOs or hide and seek with family so I might be out of my lane here. I also talked (listened) to anyone with the knowledge about it.

[booker]

Originally Posted by ScoutTracker

Of course, going out and tracking is the only way to actually get any good. Even better is to go out with someone else and practice with them, either practice interpreting or trailing each other...but the debates and learning that ensues when you disagree on something can be the most valuable.

That being said, here are a few books that I personally own and have read, along with a brief description. These books focus mostly on trailing and mantracking.


- Brown, Tom jr. 1986. Tom Brown’s Field Guide to Nature Observation and Tracking. Berkley Publishing Group, New York, NY
Good book on expanding your awareness. It gives good exercises for tracking and awareness expansion.


- Brown, Tom, jr. 1999. The Science and Art of Tracking. Berkley Publishing Group, New York, NY
Good book on the study of “pressure releases” (aka “action indicators” by others). Many other books give examples of pressure releases, but this book delves much deeper into them. Some of this is information is excellent stuff and common sense, but some of it very controversial in the tracking communites.


- Carss, Bob. 2009. The SAS Guide to Tracking. The Lyons Press. Guilford, CT.
Great book on tracking, with a lot of excellent information on training. Good guide to training trackers


- Diaz, David. 2005. Tracking: Signs of Man, Signs of Hope. Lyons Press, Guilford, CT.
Good book on mantracking. Inspirational stories with information on tactical and SAR tracking. Particularly good info on team member roles on a tracking team.


- Kearney, Jack. 1999. Tracking: a Blueprint for Learning How. Pathways Press, El Cajon, CA
Good book on training trackers, and full of lots of exercises. Written by a seasoned Border Patrol tracker.


- Liebenberg, Louis, Adrian Louw, Mark Elbroch. 2010. Practical Tracking: A guide to following footprints and finding animals. Stackpole Books.
Good book on trailing animals. It includes animals from both North America and South Africa. Anecdotal with a lot of lessons to learn from


- Speiden, Robert. 2009. Foundations for Awareness, Signcutting and Tracking. Nature Awareness and
Tracking School, LLC. Christiansburg, VA.
Excellent book on the fundamentals of mantracking. Geared toward SAR cases, but one of the better man-tracking guides available. Gives a solid foundation with basic, but thorough information

Rob is a great teacher and a really humble guy, and, despite the SAR slant in his courses, you will come away with a lot of knowledge that is applicable in a multitude of situations. Last I talked to him he was finishing up on the 2009 book. Prices are reasonable as well.

[RONIN08]

Guys,
TTOS has a lot of problems. Their best instructors have been leaving the company for the past year. Most of their POI has been watered down. They lost their contract with the Army and the Marines because of bad business practices and they appeared to be becomeing an unstable company. Just for your info TTOS pushed David Scott out of his own company and he has had to start up a school of his own outside of tombstone. The remnants of TTOS have been living and operating off the sweat of others. Also if you are paying $35,000 -$45,000 or more for just 1 ODA you might want to consider going with COMPANY NAME REMOVED. The founder used to be the Lead Instructor for TTOS he was also a former 1st SFG guy. His company teaches a tracking course that is far more aggressive than anything TTOS has or has done. They live and teach their program in a field environment. So the cost of the course is significantly cut down.

[The Reaper]

Originally Posted by RONIN08

Guys,
TTOS has a lot of problems. Their best instructors have been leaving the company for the past year. Most of their POI has been watered down. They lost their contract with the Army and the Marines because of bad business practices and they appeared to be becomeing an unstable company. Just for your info TTOS pushed David Scott out of his own company and he has had to start up a school of his own outside of tombstone. The remnants of TTOS have been living and operating off the sweat of others. Also if you are paying $35,000 -$45,000 or more for just 1 ODA you might want to consider going with TYR Group. The founder used to be the Lead Instructor for TTOS he was also a former 1st SFG guy. His company teaches a tracking course that is far more aggressive than anything TTOS has or has done. They live and teach their program in a field environment. So the cost of the course is significantly cut down.

This might have some credibility if you had read the board rules and complied before posting.

Link removed till you are vetted.

TR

[RONIN08]

Sorry, didn’t mean to break any rules. I just wanted to put out the info so that people interested can do their own research.

[the boy]

Originally Posted by MtnGoat

Nope, Just did a DFT for the course. So with current airfare, rental cars and TDY for 10 PAX ODA and course fees. It's around that mark.

Me IMO I think is should fall under TRADOC or JIEDDO (SA) funding. 5th and 10th, from what I'm told have used this training to track bad guy and do some bad things to them.

JIEDDO only funds for 2 years, so this initiative transitioned to the Army in ’09 I believe. The Army still budgeted for the course; however the folks in Arizona decided not to continue housing it. Some people involved wanted TRADOC to pick it up but they passed, in spite of many letters to congress and state officials, the course is not being run by the Army. I am sure you can pay TTOS to give the training but it is not an Army course at that point.

[MtnGoat]

Originally Posted by the boy

JIEDDO only funds for 2 years, so this initiative transitioned to the Army in ’09 I believe. The Army still budgeted for the course; however the folks in Arizona decided not to continue housing it. Some people involved wanted TRADOC to pick it up but they passed, in spite of many letters to congress and state officials, the course is not being run by the Army. I am sure you can pay TTOS to give the training but it is not an Army course at that point.

Boy... Your Right..

JIEDDO started the program, others picked it up.. then Big Army.. Really Fort Huachuca picked up the bill. But someone there saw that it didn't fall into a MI or INTEL course or driven or gathering or something course. So they dropped it. Now units must pay "out of pocket" for it. To me, IMHO, some thing of SA should cover the bill. Heck, we send people to UK for training. Don't get me on those cost. BLUF - like i said 5th and 10th have used it in OIF along with others. So someone in USASFC or USASOC could look at cost VS benz.

My .02

[slickman777]

Tracker MTT will be at Hood next week. Just got confirmation.

[MtnGoat]

Originally Posted by exsquid

Damn inflation. I stand corrected.

x/S

X/S Saw this tread bumped....I will get the total cost of what it cost my ODA to go this January. We doubled up on room and made changes to rental cars and number of people dropped. I get a cost per man and what it was for my ODA to go.

[Defend]

Is anybody else interested in a resident course @ Ft. Huachuca in the first half of May? TTOS has two bites so far, need 6 more to make a class happen.

I was on the phone with Paul Crownover (I hope I spelled that right) at TTOS today checking on classes in May. I'm trying to get my unit to fund it, but odds are I'll have to find a way to cough up the dough and pay out of pocket. Any suggestions on pitching the course to a PSYOP company as adding to my TPT's capabilities?

From what Paul was able to tell me, it sounds like all of the Ft. Hood classes are full for now, but LTC Bogart is working on getting the course funded higher up for down the road. In my case, it's looking as though I may need the skill in a non-training environment before bureaucracy runs its course.

Other thought, is anybody having the MTT come that would have room for an extra attendant?

-Out