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Old 10-10-2015, 12:37   #1
Team Sergeant
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The Ukraine, a time line to Freedom

Alright, I admit my background is the Middle East/ Asia and not Europe/Russia.

What's going on in the Ukraine? Should we be assisting the Freedom fighters against the extremely corrupt communist government?

Is it Ukrainians against Ukrainians?

After reading and watching some of the brutal beating of unarmed civilians by the Ukraine police I can only imagine at the level of corruption in the Ukrainian government.

Why did the EU turn their backs on the Ukrainian people? Fear of the Russians?
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Old 10-10-2015, 17:28   #2
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Hard to judge without ground-truth. Many over there seem to resent what they see as a US-installed gov't - and ripped off as citizens as a result, especially when they identify ethnically as Russian. (The "don't muck around in my hemisphere" thing isn't restricted to the US.) Doesn't seem the EU has the gumption to push-back against much of anything the current administration does & certainly they have their own fish to fry.

Interesting over the transom note from a Russian, on a web-blog here, that discusses one Russian's viewpoint vis a vis Putin, Crimean situation, and the Ukraine. More here than meets the eye.
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Old 10-11-2015, 00:02   #3
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Quote:
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Alright, I admit my background is the Middle East/ Asia and not Europe/Russia.

What's going on in the Ukraine? Should we be assisting the Freedom fighters against the extremely corrupt communist government?

Is it Ukrainians against Ukrainians?

After reading and watching some of the brutal beating of unarmed civilians by the Ukraine police I can only imagine at the level of corruption in the Ukrainian government.

Why did the EU turn their backs on the Ukrainian people? Fear of the Russians?
Ukraine is a chocolate mess. Imagine an entire country with a multiple personality disorder, yet all of the personalities are insanely paranoid. The Ukrainian national anthem captures the sadness well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHzHlSLhtmM

It is Ukrainians vs each other, fueled by a divided country that is part pro-Europe and part pro-Russian. Corruption? Of course, it's on par with most of Africa, and everyone there knows it.

Why did the EU turn away? Without a doubt it was fear of Russia. Europe is dependent on Russian energy. If Gazprom turns off the pumps, Europeans die.

Should we be there helping the freedom fighters? Tough question in the best of times with solid leadership in place in our gov't, but given our current political quagmire I'd say H-E-double hockey sticks- NO. Our politicians would find a way to make life even more miserable for the Ukrainians. Russia demands a buffer zone between it and the west, and unless we fix the problem (Russia) the borderlands will all remain in turmoil.
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Old 10-11-2015, 08:32   #4
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Ukrainians wake up!

Did a lot of reading and I've now gotten up to speed on the Ukraine's problems.

If the folks fighting for the Ukrainian Freedom want to make advances they need to target their own "Russian" Ukrainian politicians and kill them.

Nothing is going to change in the Ukraine until they start killing the corrupt Ukrainian politicians.

Stop fighting with the Russian Separatists and kill the corrupt Ukrainian politicians. Do this and watch the changes.

Also target the infrastructure of the Russian Separatists, turn off their electricity and target communications. Winter is almost here.

It's time for the face of War to change, let's kill the folks that start it instead of each other.
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Old 10-11-2015, 09:47   #5
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Stop fighting with the Russian Separatists and kill the corrupt Ukrainian politicians. Do this and watch the changes.

Also target the infrastructure of the Russian Separatists, turn off their electricity and target communications. Winter is almost here.
It seems the separatists object to the "annointed" Ukrainian political situation nearly as much as those currently viewing themselves as 'pure' Ukrainians, which may have driven them hard in bonding to their Russian ethnicity. (Just conjecture on my part.) If Ukrainian nationals address the first thing on your list, do you think it mitigates to any degree the need for the latter? Or do the separatists remain one of those "sooner or later" type things anyway?
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Old 10-12-2015, 13:31   #6
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It would seem Russia is once again attempting to annex Ukraine and the Ukrainians are not having it.
The only way the Russians can get away with it is to support those from within the Ukraine.

The Ukrainians need to focus their combined might and take out the Russian separatist leaders/shot callers. And they need to target the infrastructure of the Russian Separatists.

Do that and it will have one of two outcomes, Russia will invade or they will back off. I doubt they will invade with the Western World watching.

Fighting for ones Freedom comes at a high cost.
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Old 10-12-2015, 14:09   #7
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Is the Russian activity in Syria a distraction to enable continued turmoil stirring in Ukraine? After annexing Crimea it seems clear the next goal is overland LOCs through Russian controlled territory.
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