04-02-2010, 02:36
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#31
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Where the Trade Winds blow
Posts: 677
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confirmed rumors
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard
Actually - COL Guest wanted the RVN era colors out of the 5th SFGA flash.
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Quote:
On 7 Dec 84 COL James Guest, 5th SFG CDR, submitted a request to the Director, Institute of Heraldry, requesting that the official flash of the 5th SFG be changed back to the solid black with white border because:- The colors of a foreign flag should not be incorporated in a US Army beret flash
- The RVN and the original purpose for having the RVN colors in the flash no longer existed
- The 5th SFG was no longer oriented towards SEA
- The mission and organization of the 5th SFGA had been significantly transformed to meet modern requirements and the change of beret flash would depict that metamorphosis
The request was approved by the Institute of Heraldry on 16 Jan 85.
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It is interesting that you would have this information available. A barracks rat that was the COL'S driver/bitchboy had presciently blabbed such nefarious behavior would occur. Claimed to have been within earshot during certain conversations. Group HQ opsec for you.
Poster on the wall:
Top: Think OPSEC
Bottom: Who talked?
Hand written below: Who didn't?
Caused a lot of rumors with negative chatter about our fearless leader. As an enlisted man, I was just happy to know someone up top was keeping their eyes on the important things. 
Last edited by Last hard class; 04-02-2010 at 02:44.
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Last hard class is offline
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04-02-2010, 06:02
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#32
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NorCal
Posts: 15,370
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Here's a good one for trivia's sake - the JCRC flash - never authorized - I've got a flash but never saw one of the wing background ovals.
The black is for the nature of the mission and the orange reflective of the VS-17 panel pieces worn on the uniforms (jungle fatigues - upper front pockets and across the back of the shoulders) by the field teams.
Those of us TDY to JCRC wore the USASFT (46th Co) flash.
Here's an interesting web-site to browse:
http://www.military-insignia.us/Page...Insignia.html#
Richard
__________________
“Sometimes the Bible in the hand of one man is worse than a whisky bottle in the hand of (another)… There are just some kind of men who – who’re so busy worrying about the next world they’ve never learned to live in this one, and you can look down the street and see the results.” - To Kill A Mockingbird (Atticus Finch)
“Almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.” - Robert Heinlein
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Richard is offline
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04-02-2010, 06:19
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#33
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Where the Trade Winds blow
Posts: 677
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard
Here's a good one for trivia's sake - the JCRC flash - never authorized - I've got a flash but never saw one of the wing background ovals.
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How exactly does an unauthorized flash come to life?
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Last hard class is offline
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04-02-2010, 06:28
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#34
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Hope Mills, NC
Posts: 2,765
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wet dog
In winning bar trivia bets, I've found it useful to quote those of authority like, The Reaper, Ambush Master and finally Richard.
- sorry fellas, I couldn't resist.
WD
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hey...as long as my answer sounds better than the other guys answer...with info from other folks..(correct or not) works for me 
as long as I get a beer out of it...it's all good 
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Out of all the places I've been, this is one of'em....
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glebo is offline
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04-02-2010, 06:29
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#35
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NorCal
Posts: 15,370
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Quote:
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How exactly does an unauthorized flash come to life?
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The command comes up with a proposal to be submitted for approval - while awaiting 'official' approval, either unit $$ purchase and issue or individual purchase of the proposed flash is done and the unit begins wearing it until told to stop or authorized and it continues.
Richard
__________________
“Sometimes the Bible in the hand of one man is worse than a whisky bottle in the hand of (another)… There are just some kind of men who – who’re so busy worrying about the next world they’ve never learned to live in this one, and you can look down the street and see the results.” - To Kill A Mockingbird (Atticus Finch)
“Almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.” - Robert Heinlein
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Richard is offline
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04-02-2010, 06:39
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#36
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BANNED USER
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,751
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard
while awaiting 'official' approval, . . . is done and the unit begins . . . until told to stop or authorized and it continues. Richard
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Like so many things my kids do.  Explains why the corgy looked like a poodle and was sorta green two weeks ago. Poor dog thinks her name is WTF!!?!
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Dozer523 is offline
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04-02-2010, 08:58
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#37
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Eastern Panhandle, WV
Posts: 719
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Does anyone have the FANK Training Command flash? I had a copy (it was close but wrong). I'd like to see what a real one looked like.
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Green Light is offline
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04-02-2010, 09:13
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#38
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NorCal
Posts: 15,370
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Quote:
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Does anyone have the FANK Training Command flash?
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Go to the link in post #32 - you'll find it. 
Richard
__________________
“Sometimes the Bible in the hand of one man is worse than a whisky bottle in the hand of (another)… There are just some kind of men who – who’re so busy worrying about the next world they’ve never learned to live in this one, and you can look down the street and see the results.” - To Kill A Mockingbird (Atticus Finch)
“Almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.” - Robert Heinlein
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Richard is offline
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04-02-2010, 09:14
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#39
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Colorado Springs
Posts: 92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stras
I was referring to the similarity in the timeframe of the two actions (Branch and Flash Change) and whether or not becoming a branch caused the standardization of the flashes change. This was prior to my coming on the scene, and I've yet to find a good reference on the matter.
Did you guys get any more Reutberg out there yet? I'm cracking open the last of my Resupply Bundle stash.
ARSOFE wore the Green flash with the German Colors until they were Deactivated and reactivated as 7th Special Operations Support Command (SOSC) Theater Army (TA). 7th SOSC(TA) then switched to an almost teal blue flash with what I called "rainbow stripes". I believe this was right before the move from Bad Tölz to Stuttgart in late 1991/1992.
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Stras, no joy with the Reutberg yet. All, as soon as I can get the document scanned I'll post it. It's a brochure from the “The Regiment First Formation". Tells the history of all flashes and why the colors are what they are.
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Don Bennett
Special Forces Association
Region 10 Representative
De Oppresso Liber
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Bennett is offline
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04-02-2010, 11:12
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#40
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Asset
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Poland
Posts: 5
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Any reason why each color was selected for that particular Group ?
Reread post #6 of this thread.
Richard
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LitleBird is offline
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04-19-2010, 09:46
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#41
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Eastern Panhandle, WV
Posts: 719
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard
Go to the link in post #32 - you'll find it.
Richard |
Thx! Had to dig a bit, but it's worth it!.
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Green Light is offline
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05-12-2010, 12:50
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#42
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Newnan, GA
Posts: 273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lksteve
Actually, I was in Toelz when 1/10 reverted to the 10th Group flash...it occurred 30 September 1983...I...
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I thought it was Sep 1984. I left June '84 and was still wearing the Det Eur flash as I recall....
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Tony
Newnan, GA
W1AJO
De Oppresso Liber
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Aoresteen is offline
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05-12-2010, 12:52
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#43
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Castle Rock, CO
Posts: 2,531
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aoresteen
I thought it was Sep 1984. I left June '84 and was still wearing the Det Eur flash as I recall....
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Nope...when we came back from Greece in September or October of 1983, MAJ Calvert and LTC Barber were on the drop zone making uniform corrections...September of 1984, I was training LTs in IOBC...
__________________
""A man must know his destiny. if he does not recognize it, then he is lost. By this I mean, once, twice, or at the very most, three times, fate will reach out and tap a man on the shoulder. if he has the imagination, he will turn around and fate will point out to him what fork in the road he should take, if he has the guts, he will take it.""- GEN George S. Patton
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lksteve is offline
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05-16-2010, 12:19
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#44
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Newnan, GA
Posts: 273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lksteve
Nope...when we came back from Greece in September or October of 1983, MAJ Calvert and LTC Barber were on the drop zone making uniform corrections...September of 1984, I was training LTs in IOBC...
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Man, getting old sucks. Memories fade so fast. I stand corected, thanks!
BTW, I had dinner with both Herr Calvert & Herr Barber in '07 at Ft Bragg. Both are doing well.
__________________
Tony
Newnan, GA
W1AJO
De Oppresso Liber
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Aoresteen is offline
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05-16-2010, 13:04
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#45
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Quiet Professional (RIP)
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Carriere,Ms.
Posts: 6,922
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wet dog
In winning bar trivia bets, I've found it useful to quote those of authority like, The Reaper, Ambush Master and finally Richard.
- sorry fellas, I couldn't resist.
WD
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3 excellent candidates,however the winner is Richard!!!! I've yet to see his info challenged except when he loves to play his devils advocate role...... 
Big Teddy 
__________________
I believe that SF is a 'calling' - not too different from the calling missionaries I know received. I knew instantly that it was for me, and that I would do all I could to achieve it. Most others I know in SF experienced something similar. If, as you say, you HAVE searched and read, and you do not KNOW if this is the path for you --- it is not....
Zonie Diver
SF is a calling and it requires commitment and dedication that the uninitiated will never understand......
Jack Moroney
SFA M-2527, Chapter XXXVII
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