America's Second Civil War

[echoes]

Originally Posted by Trapper John

miclo18d, I take issue with one thing you said .

Nope, and I hope they think so! He has them chasing the next shiny object at his will. DJT is a master of misdirection and they fall for it every time.

Meanwhile he is moving his agenda forward step by step. His tactics have put them in the "no message" position. The real truth is emerging and that coupled with his successes (tax reform, immigration reform, infrastructure rebuilding, not to mention the foreign policy successes, balancing trade, and repatriation of $Trilions) will redefine the political landscape forever.

Look for the real draining of the swamp to begin in 2019. Then they will wake up to the reality that is upon them , but it will be too late. JMHO

TJ, very inspiring words! It is a tremendous thing when someone can articulate so well, the truth!


The financial sector does not lie, and indeed finally Our Country is seeing gains for the first time in a long time. Go-Trump-Go! And guess what, the big zero needs to face reality; Trump is your President, so suck it up buttercup!

JMHO,

Holly

[miclo18d]

Originally Posted by Trapper John

miclo18d, I take issue with one thing you said .

Nope, and I hope they think so! He has them chasing the next shiny object at his will. DJT is a master of misdirection and they fall for it every time.

Meanwhile he is moving his agenda forward step by step. His tactics have put them in the "no message" position. The real truth is emerging and that coupled with his successes (tax reform, immigration reform, infrastructure rebuilding, not to mention the foreign policy successes, balancing trade, and repatriation of $Trilions) will redefine the political landscape forever.

Look for the real draining of the swamp to begin in 2019. Then they will wake up to the reality that is upon them , but it will be too late. JMHO

I guess what I mean by against the ropes is that he is assailed on all sides. Of course the dems, the meadia, but also his own administration (deep state) and the RINOs. He has a tough road ahead and I support him in that! I’m wringing my hands in anticipation for when the tide completely turns and all the skinny dippers are exposed.

[tom kelly]

START WITH, DOJ HOLDOVERS LIKE ROB ROSENSTEIN,ANDREW WEISSMAN, ANDREW McCARTHY & ALL ASST.U S ATTORNEYS APPOINTED BY BARRY OBAMA. THE F B I LEFT OVERS LISA PAGE & PETER STRUCK.....FIRE MULLER NOW.....................TOM KELLY

[Box]

instead of trying to drain the swamp... maybe just flood it

drown the mammals - they deserve it - without a food source, the reptiles will start eating themselves

win-win

[tonyz]

7 Forces Driving America Toward Civil War
John Hawkins|Posted: Apr 21, 2018 7:40 AM
TownHall.com

I was interviewed by a mainstream media reporter yesterday. I thought he wanted to talk tech issues, but we actually spent almost the entire conversation discussing the feeling that many conservatives have that America has gone off the tracks and is headed toward dissolution or alternately, a civil war one day. Obviously, this would be a terrible thing and ironically, twenty years ago, it would have been laughable. Today, the joke isn’t so funny because we are a deeply unhealthy society with a dysfunctional government and for all our money, success and storied history, we seem to be on an increasingly dangerous trajectory.

1) A Post-Constitutional Era: Liberals don’t believe in the Constitution. Typically they deny this, but that’s exactly what a “living” Constitution means. You make it up as you go along. The Founders foresaw the instability and danger that would be created by this approach, which is why they wanted us to be a constitutional republic, not a democracy. Unfortunately, America has in many ways already become a post-constitutional democracy and we’re one liberal judge away from abandoning the Constitution altogether. Once we get to that point, America just becomes the representation of that old saying, “Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to have for dinner.” Of course people are not lambs and when large numbers of them believe they aren’t being treated fairly, they do have the option of getting away from the wolves.

2) Tribalism: The “you only have to listen to people you already agree with” nature of social media has dramatically ramped up the level of tribalism in the United States. The Right has gotten much more tribal since Donald Trump rose to prominence and the Left has taken tribalism into hyper-drive. Increasingly, liberals treat a range of opinion between Elizabeth Warren and Hillary Clinton as legitimate while everyone else is viewed as a white supremacist Nazi primitive that must be driven down into the gutter for society to move forward. This makes any sort of dialogue or cooperation nearly impossible. When every issue is a zero sum war where one tribe must win or lose, a lot of people quite understandably ask, “What do we gain by staying allied to this other tribe?”

3) Federal Government Too Powerful: Federalism is a safety valve on the American pressure cooker. As long as people in San Francisco can, for the most part, live the way they want to live while the people in rural North Carolina can, for the most part, live the way they want to live, it’s much easier for everyone to get along. When people are unnecessarily forced to live under rules they find abhorrent because the federal government has become an octopus that has inserted its tentacles into every minute crevice of American life, it creates discontent on a wide scale. If most Americans wanted to live like people in San Francisco, they’d live in San Francisco.

4) Moral Decline: As Samuel Adams once noted, “A general dissolution of principles and manners will more surely overthrow the liberties of America than the whole force of the common enemy. While the people are virtuous they cannot be subdued; but when once they lose their virtue then will be ready to surrender their liberties to the first external or internal invader.”

A large number of Americans HAVE LOST their principles, manners and virtue and it shows through from the sort of politicians they elect, to their rudeness online, to the sort of shallow hedonism and fame whoring they find appealing. Americans are increasingly becoming a soft and decadent people which is problematic because the challenges may change, but we can be certain that Americans will face future challenges every bit as difficult as the ones past generations had to tackle. This is frightening because if you look at the “principles, manners and virtue” of Americans today, they don’t seem capable of dealing with monumental events like the War of 1812, the Civil War, the Depression or World War II. Most people in their twenties probably couldn’t tell you why all those events were such challenges in the first place. When America faces a challenge bigger than we can handle because of ineffective politicians and our “amusing ourselves to death” population, there are no guarantees our republic will survive.

5) The Debt: America is a freight train heading toward a cliff, but because we’re not moving toward the edge at lightning speed, no one seems all that concerned. However, the fact of the matter is that a reckoning is coming. At some point, probably within the next decade or two, we will face a debt-driven economic collapse; borrowed money will stop flowing into the United States and Medicare/Social Security as we know it will fall apart because we will not have the money to pay it. If and when we get to that point, all bets are off because if regions of the country see an advantage to splitting off from the United States at that point, they will do it.

6) Lack Of A Shared Culture: There has never been a time when American culture was more fragmented than it is today. By that, I mean that there are legions of people with millions of fans or followers on the Internet that the vast majority of Americans have never heard of in their lives. We don’t have that shared love of anybody or for that matter, anything. Conservatives and liberals disagree on economics (capitalist/socialist), religion (friendly to Christianity/hostile to Christianity), the Constitution (support/believe in a living Constitution i.e. no Constitution), etc., on and on. The average conservative and the average liberal disagree on 95% of the issues and in the few limited cases where they do look at things the same, they won’t support a proposal by the other out of sheer tribalism. Over the long haul, there has be something more to hold a country together than, “We wear Nikes, like pop music and play golf.”

7) Gun Grabbing: Liberals have fallen in love with the idea of ignoring the 2nd Amendment and confiscating all firearms. The logistics of doing this in a nation with hundreds of millions of guns (many of which are off the books) when many police departments and tens of millions of Americans would not cooperate is seldom discussed. Another thing that seldom seems brought up is that large numbers of conservatives would see this as a prelude to the government’s use of force against the citizenry. When it is discussed on the Left, there seems to be an assumption that lone resisters might get into firefights with dozens of police or soldiers, as opposed to ganging up with other formerly law-abiding Americans to waylay gun confiscators, politicians and anti-gun activists at THEIR HOMES in guerrilla actions that would be silently applauded and supported by hundreds of millions of Americans concerned about their freedom. Confiscating guns is a dangerous and stupid idea that could in and of itself end our republic if a serious attempt were ever made to implement it.

https://townhall.com/columnists/john...draft-n2473193

[Trapper John]

^^^ Finest Kind tonyz!

[Badger52]

That's a good find Tony, thanks.

Another thing that seldom seems brought up is that large numbers of conservatives would see this as a prelude to the government’s use of force against the citizenry.

Prelude my ass. They have been using the threat of force for a very long time. But no one wants to play the tape to the end if someone stands, in the face of some regulatory check-box on a form, and repeatedly says, simply, "No." As in,

No I will not pay your fine for not buying your shitty health insurance.
No you cannot garnish my money because it's no longer anywhere you can reach.
No I will not honor your warrant to appear.
No I will not be arrested on this day.

[Badger52]

‘The only thing we learn from history,’ it has been said, ‘is that men never learn from history’...

26 pages (incl titles & intro), so not too long.
Interesting comparison of the phases & durations of various "empires" by Lieutenant-General Sir John Bagot Glubb, KCB, CMG, DSO, OBE, MC, KStJ, KPM, nom de guerre "Glubb Pasha" b.1897 d. 1986.

From the closing:

(d) The stages of the rise and fall of great nations seem to be:
The Age of Pioneers (outburst)
The Age of Conquests
The Age of Commerce
The Age of Affluence
The Age of Intellect
The Age of Decadence
(e) Decadence is marked by:
Defensiveness
Pessimism
Materialism
Frivolity
An influx of foreigners
The Welfare State
A weakening of religion.
(f) Decadence is due to:
Too long a period of wealth and power
Selfishness
Love of money
The loss of a sense of duty.

[Trapper John]

^^^ Great post Badger, Finest Kind

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by tonyz

7) Gun Grabbing: Liberals have fallen in love with the idea of ignoring the 2nd Amendment and confiscating all firearms. The logistics of doing this in a nation with hundreds of millions of guns (many of which are off the books) when many police departments and tens of millions of Americans would not cooperate is seldom discussed. Another thing that seldom seems brought up is that large numbers of conservatives would see this as a prelude to the government’s use of force against the citizenry. When it is discussed on the Left, there seems to be an assumption that lone resisters might get into firefights with dozens of police or soldiers, as opposed to ganging up with other formerly law-abiding Americans to waylay gun confiscators, politicians and anti-gun activists at THEIR HOMES in guerrilla actions that would be silently applauded and supported by hundreds of millions of Americans concerned about their freedom. Confiscating guns is a dangerous and stupid idea that could in and of itself end our republic if a serious attempt were ever made to implement it.

It is down the road a ways, but I believe the development of AI could be a game changer. It was only last week I read about the development of autonomous killer drones, so it is not too far fetched to consider the federal, state and local governments employing AI to police the unruly humans.

[tonyz]

Originally Posted by Paslode

It is down the road a ways, but I believe the development of AI could be a game changer. It was only last week I read about the development of autonomous killer drones, so it is not too far fetched to consider the federal, state and local governments employing AI to police the unruly humans.

All the more reason for the importance of the Bill of Rights.

Free speech and the Second Amendment are fundamental to liberty and yet they are under attack daily.

It has not gone unnoticed that BIGGOV seems to grow no matter which party might be in charge.

Technology, as in your comment referencing AI, in the hands of despots often gets turned on the people.

While the heart of a tyrant doesn’t change...the means to subjugate the people certainly may.

[Badger52]

Originally Posted by tonyz

All the more reason for the importance of the Bill of Rights.

Free speech and the Second Amendment are fundamental to liberty and yet they are under attack daily.

It has not gone unnoticed that BIGGOV seems to grow no matter which party might be in charge.

Technology, as in your comment referencing AI, in the hands of despots often gets turned on the people.

While the heart of a tyrant doesn’t change...the means to subjugate the people certainly may.

Much of the data to be leveraged has already been willingly offered by the future victims.

[tonyz]

Originally Posted by Badger52

Much of the data to be leveraged has already been willingly offered by the future victims.

Concur.

Although I’d like to believe all will not be victims.

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by Badger52

Much of the data to be leveraged has already been willingly offered by the future victims.

Yes indeed, and it is not a one sided affair. There is enough data on any person or group of persons to start the round up, who gets rounded up for re-education camp or the mass grave depends on who is in power and what their leanings are.

[Old Dog New Trick]

JMHO -

I think the author is wrong about a few things. First the Civil War has already started. The assault from the Left on civil liberties, rights and freedoms have never been more evident than shortly after the 2016 election and the loss of their candidate. The student protests, the Antifa movement and the anti white peoples movement that culminated in Charlottesville are all examples of the progressive leftists assault on our collective rights and freedom.

The re-education camps already exist - they are and have been the schools and higher learning academic campuses across America. While it has been a long time coming (50-years) it has accelerated rapidly the last 20+ years. Reaching a breakneck pace under Barry.

The mass graves and genocide will not be an issue for the Left (or the far-right) it will happen all by itself - first in the inner cities then in the poor rural and desert communities through disease and violent crime. Eventually the wealthy suburbs will either have to defend in place or evacuate to hardened encampments run by whichever government agency you believe in most.

I strongly believe that the people who are strongest (most independent) and the kind of people on this board will hunker down in places (coast to coast and border to border) that support a sustainable simpler life in places that will be forgotten by the extreme powers and will emerge much later after the whole thing burns itself out.

The military and police if called upon will be too busy and overwhelmed just maintaining Marshal Law in big cities to go hunting small “rebel” groups who will undoubtedly rule the local landscape. They will tire quickly of having their asses handed to them and go back to keeping watch within the walls.

Again, JMO