The Donald, on the draft and McCain. - Page 2

JJ_BPK · 07-20-2015, 05:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guymullins

I don't know the details here, but how does one, as a POW refuse the wishes of your jailers? Surely he would have had no choice if the Vietcong wanted to repatriate him?

I think he did refuse,, but not for the obvious,,

I think his dad told him if he comes home he will be court marshaled for his carrier fu$$-up...

PSM · 07-20-2015, 12:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by JJ_BPK

And for heroism??

Who was the VN era fighter pilot that single handedly tried to
saved/sink a US Navy Aircraft Carrier??

http://rockcreekfreepress.tumblr.com...ccains-records

I was on Okinawa when ADM McCain became CINCPAC and that was roughly the rumor going around. Another was that the other pilot accidentally launched the missile. I think that the latter became the "truth" since he didn't survive.

Pat

blacksmoke · 07-20-2015, 21:05

John McCain served in Viet Nam
John McCain volunteered to be a fighter jet pilot, risking his life to bring the fight to the VC
John McCain cannot fully raise one of his arms because he was tortured as a POW

In my eyes John Mcain is a hero. Donald Trump is a loudmouth.

HOLLiS · 07-20-2015, 21:17

Trump never served. (along with the big O and Clinton)

Mills · 07-20-2015, 21:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by tonyz

Trump screws with the left and draws out some issues that occasionally smokes out some Republicans with weaker spines and stomachs to comment instead of hide. His presence in a debate might make for interesting discussion.

Trump was wrong on this and I don't like McCain.

Trump does not appear to be presidential material - if he ever was.

Damn good self-promoter though and that appears necessary for political office.

Agree that a Trump/McCain argument is at best a loser.

I would like to point out regardless of how I fell about what he said.............

The utmost professionalism by Ted Cruz in this whole situation. Not a word in regards to personal feeling or bias. Everyone is bashing Trump because they are scared of him (IMO). Doubt he will be president, however I hope he can at least screw things up for Jeb Bush and the other RINOs.

JJ_BPK · 07-21-2015, 05:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Broadsword2004

1) I interpreted Ted Cruz's actions to be a bit calculated side as opposed to straight up professional, but I could be wrong.

2) he will not support any GOP candidates but instead will run as a third party candidate. This means that he could well hand the election to Hillary Clinton.

1) agreed, When a stupid person opens their mouth, all will recognize,, but when someone keeps their mouth shut, you have a 50-50 chance of guessing their intent..

2) might make an interesting election. I am not sure the USA is ready for a multi party election, but it has proven to be effect in other countries??

McCain has survived much and his time as a POW should be lauded.

but after 45 yrs,, I think it's time to detach the hero of the past from the politician that he has become.

WarriorDiplomat · 07-21-2015, 06:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guymullins

I don't know the details here, but how does one, as a POW refuse the wishes of your jailers? Surely he would have had no choice if the Vietcong wanted to repatriate him?

McCain has a few nicknames given to him by fellow POW's one being the Hanoi songbird.

McCain would have had NO authority to accept "special favor nor parole" from the enemy ahead of those who had been there longer. He would have had to have the permission of the Senior Ranking Officer in captivity to accept it. To accept it would have been a violation of our code of conduct and would have been a killer for McCain's future in the military or anything else as well as injured his fathers legacy and position if he didn't hold him accountable with UCMJ actions. No doubt the NVA knew he could not accept but had he accepted it would have been a huge victory for the North in terms of morale and exploitation of those still in captivity. He was a golden egg to their cause.

According to many who were there he received his arm injury from the ejection and the following shoddy medical care and lack of rehab not torture. Many of his fellow POW's say he received better than average treatment BECAUSE of who is father was.

Honorable in the fact he didn't accept release.......yes, Heroic.....No, I reserve heroic in the face of the enemy under those conditions for men like Robby Risner, Jeremiah Denton, James Stockdale, Nick Rowe, James Thompson survivors of the Cuban program

Last hard class · 07-21-2015, 09:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarriorDiplomat

Honorable in the fact he didn't accept release.......yes, Heroic.....No, I reserve heroic in the face of the enemy under those conditions for men like Robby Risner, Jeremiah Denton, James Stockdale, Nick Rowe, James Thompson sirvivors of the Cuban program

My Take away was that Trump didn't call out McCain for is individual actions as a POW. He questioned the status of all POW's. If McCain wasn't such a political lightning rod this discourse might be different. Replace his name with one of the above. Would Trump's statement still be acceptable?

Would it be OK if Hillary says it?

LHC

MR2 · 07-21-2015, 09:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Last hard class

My Take away was that Trump didn't call out McCain for is individual actions as a POW. He questioned the status of all POW's. If McCain wasn't such a political lightning rod this discourse might be different. Replace his name with one of the above. Would Trump's statement still be acceptable?

Would it be OK if Hillary says it?

LHC

There you go, using common sense again.

WarriorDiplomat · 07-21-2015, 10:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Last hard class

My Take away was that Trump didn't call out McCain for is individual actions as a POW. He questioned the status of all POW's. If McCain wasn't such a political lightning rod this discourse might be different. Replace his name with one of the above. Would Trump's statement still be acceptable?

Would it be OK if Hillary says it?

LHC

My comments were in reference to the question and some of the comments that his time in captivity alone making him heroic. I did not read into as a dig at all POW's I saw it as dirty politics in reference to McCain the looney toon.

If Hillary said it, it would have been the same simply because I think both are turds.