Deportation

[Peregrino]

Originally Posted by Oldrotorhead

If he liked it in the US and wanted to stay you would think in 17 years he would have found time to become a citizen. His wife is mentioned but there is no comment on her status. Wonder why?

Ding, ding! We have a winner! 17 consecutive years on a work visa? AMCIT children, wife, etc. with no (apparent) attempt to seek citizenship or a green card? What are we not being told?

[Old Dog New Trick]

I have some American friends that reside in Mexico (Baja Sur) they are there to live forever. They wanted a house looking out over the Pacific; the government doesn't allow foreigners to buy and own land to do that and I'm sure some of you have heard stories of those that bought a lease only to see the government come take it all back. She went through a very long, exhausting process to become a Mexican national. You have to read, write, and speak Spanish with the fluency of a native born person. The test is very difficult to pass but she did. OTOH her husband is there on a visa that must be renewed from time to time and there are no guarantees that the Mexican government will do that. As with many expats around the world living within the rules of the host country are essential and mandatory. Back to my friends, they are still constantly afraid that one day the Mexican government will show up at their beautiful stone and timber home on a cliff overlooking the ocean and tell them to leave or tell him he's not welcome. That is a real fear. Because it could happen even if they continue to follow all the rules and laws.

Why is it that people who come here to better themselves and raise a family can't follow our rules and laws, pay taxes and participate in building a better community?

If my friends screwed up one time they'd be asked to leave and leave their house behind. If they did not they'd be arrested and sent to one of those Mexican jails you've heard of. Not one citizen of Ensanada would give a rats ass nor protest the government on their behalf. I guess one reason is the government and federal police would just as likely open fire and kill you.

Ain't America great! We not only allow protests and civil disobedience we encourage and promote it. Even if the people protesting have no legal right to do so because they too should be arrested and deported because of their status.

[Penn]

Americans aren't breeding children fast enough and 49% of them will grow up conservative Republican. Immigrants (just like inner city minorities) vote for free stuff because they will never have to pay for it - ever!

..her status and why?

This is a true story, the wife, is my employee. This "Story" was presented in the hope of exploring alternatives. SF is after all in the people business. finding and making work relationships for mutual benefit.

Does the Republican party currently have the power position to resolve the immigration issue, would effecting that policy insure the Spanish vote?

[The Reaper]

What other nation on this planet denies its own laws and chooses to allow millions of people (a large percentage of which are felons) to illegally invade and occupy lands, collect large amounts of benefits, and the natives assist them in that, while LE is denied the option of incarcerating and deporting them?

Most don't even want to be Americans. They just want the benefits this nation offers.

I don't think any other nation would even contemplate this insanity.

If you want to immigrate and become an American, fine, there is a legal process, follow it and I have no objections.

TR

[Old Dog New Trick]

Originally Posted by Penn

This is a true story, the wife, is my employee. This "Story" was presented in the hope of exploring alternatives. SF is after all in the people business. finding and making work relationships for mutual benefit.

Does the Republican party currently have the power position to resolve the immigration issue, would effecting that policy insure the Spanish vote?

Okay but what's his story - the father? You ever talk with him?

FWIW I'm not against anyone that wants to come to America, to work, raise a family, better themselves or family back home. I would then and would still give my life in the hopes and dreams of others to be free. That doesn't mean I want to support them forever or allow them something for free that I have to pay for.

I don't think the Republican Party has a clue and neither do the Democrats. Like you said it's complicated. There is a legal process...it takes time, money, patience and there are still no guarantees you or a loved on will be allowed to come here on permanent or non-permanent basis. Maybe if that process was easier or if people didn't abuse it it would work better for more people. My wife immigrated here from Asia it took awhile. After my son was born she decided to become an American citizen, before that event she still had no intention of staying here so non-permanent 'Green Card" was good for her. We had to renew that at least once - we did - before it expired. Her English was and is still just okay. She still translates most technical things like a driver's handbook and she now knows more about American civics 101 than a graduating senior from high school and from the looks of it most college/university students.

We all have requirements to travel abroad. Passports, visas, entry permits and so forth. All of them expire if you don't take care of that - problems arise.

Immigration is messed up not because people illegally cross the border to come here. Immigrants will do what immigrants do...lawfully or unlawfully. The problem is compassion is poor excuse for allowing lawlessness and being taken advantage of. If we reward those here illegally every twenty years with amnesty and forgiveness in twenty years the problems will be tenfold bigger and they will have created everything they left: poverty, crime, violence, government crackdowns and a broken government that can no longer provide even basic services let alone advanced ones for any price.

Beirut, Phnom Penh and countless other developing cities were jewels of their time - Destroyed by success! What ever happened to the Aztecs, the Romans, and the native populations before immigrants arrived?

[Penn]

To all, I present this story to open a discussion for consideration to find a solution to the problem.

There is a ton of experienced leaders here. I am not defending the decision chain, but presented a picture of one family that examples many others, and at a heavy cost to both parties, the deportee and the Nation.

The arguments presented in reply only respond to adherence to the law, as a Nation of Laws, they must be enforced. I get that and I agree.

How then to develop a list of consideration that would satisfy adherence to the law and resolve keeping good people here, and in doing so, build inroads to groups usually outside mainstream republican reach.

[PSM]

"A married father of two American born high school boys, 17 & 13 years of age. Father has worked his entire career for one company, on a “work permit” issue by the US. He is a trusted employee, often given responsibility for daily operations of the company and execution of all work orders.

His Sons are A+ students. Mom also works, and is involved in everyday decisions with relation to her sons, the schools district, and the local PTA."

The friend of my BiL, and American born citizen, has a similar story except that he was a stock broker. He broke an SEC law and just got out of prison after 20 years. His children were younger.

Both knew the law.

Pat

[Old Dog New Trick]

(BO)^^^I agree that the politics of immigration is not a Republican - Democrat problem to solve or fix. The fix is already written in ink. Both parties are guilty of looking the other way. One for votes, one for money and they are complicit in both. They both talk a lot and do secret deals behind closed doors. They make promises they know they can't keep or will be reversed someday but the immediate effect was all they needed. There are heros and villains and each will find a microphone if only until the next closed door session. And then nothing will change.

As I and also Reaper said, there is no other country with a functioning government that allows the abuses that go on here in America. The Mexican government would in a matter of seconds confiscate all assets and lock away the perpetrators at best. Shoot them for resisting at worst.

There is a really really big carrot hanging over the USofA and the stick is made from jello. When mayors, city officials, state AGs and governors chose to not follow the law and their oath of office to the citizens of the country then all is lost. They need to be held accountable even if that is in contempt and arrested. They can resign as not fulfilling their oath or be prosecuted and either found guilty or acquitted but they cannot be allowed to flout the law and undermine the Constitution. Follow the money! The subversives will be voted out of office or impeached as soon as crime rates soar and streets turn into shooting galleries over turf wars and gang violence. When the innocents begin to die it changes people's behavior.

This idea that one persons 'humanity' is more important than another persons 'humanity' is a cause for humanity to fail. At some point in leadership you can't bring the whole company down to the lowest and slowest. You have to cut them lose and they will either take a different path to find success or be destroyed. Nature is better at this without human interference. The strong will have a better chance of survival and the weak feed the lowest in the food chain so eventually even the strong will have eaten their young. One way or another the strong survive.

Immigrants who come here and follow our laws and the rules, work hard and raise honest children to go on and create productive families of their own are the strong. But there is a subset of the weak that came here following that other path...a path of crime, gangs, and disruption of the natural order of things. They feed off the strong like parasites and bring everyone down to their level. This is what really needs fixing and I believe the world is overpopulated so the disappearance and extermination of certain species and subspecies of the human race would benefit the whole in a positive way. But that's just me. I don't believe so much in rehabilitation and incarceration. Some can most cannot and sustaining them forever in a state of nonconformity is a strain on already tight resources. Same goes for anyone born here or not.

[miclo18d]

A guy on my team, US cit, with strong ties to Mexico, goes to MEX, meets a woman, and decides to get married.

No brainer, right? Let's get her to USA, get her a green card and get her on the path to US Cit.

He did it the legal way and it took nearly 8 fucking months, to get his WIFE a green card so she would be legal, while millions of illegals poured across the border.

It's okay to want to come here. It okay to bea good person, hard worker, family oriented. It's NOT okay to bypass the system and excuse that behavior, because they are "good" people. You want to be here. Wait in line. Do the paper work. Cross the border with your green card.

My wife is first gen American. Her parents immigrated from Canada....LEGALLY! They didn't like Canada. (They hate it even more nowadays!) he voluntarily joined the military and fought in Vietnam for HIS new country, went to OCS and became an officer, retired a LTC. My wife and her parents are grateful to the USA, they didn't come here to get a job so they could send money back to Canada to bring more of them here. They fled the liberal insanity there. They believed in a nation of laws!

One of those laws has to do with coming here ILLEGALLY, cutting in line. Not playing by the rules. It doesn't matter if you're nice.

[rsdengler]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

What other nation on this planet denies its own laws and chooses to allow millions of people (a large percentage of which are felons) to illegally invade and occupy lands, collect large amounts of benefits, and the natives assist them in that, while LE is denied the option of incarcerating and deporting them?

Most don't even want to be Americans. They just want the benefits this nation offers.

I don't think any other nation would even contemplate this insanity.

If you want to immigrate and become an American, fine, there is a legal process, follow it and I have no objections.

TR

Cannot agree more.....If you actually want to immigrate to the US, then you should abide by the law and do it legally. And why would someone keep renewing a green card for 17 years and is unwilling to become a citizen? Either you have something to hide (and do not think that you will be caught) or you may just want to reap the benefits without contributing your fair share. The Immigration problem has no easy fix. Both sides of the aisle in Washington would rather bite and scratch each others eyes out then work together to offer any acceptable resolution. The Left would rather let illegals run a muck without retribution, and the Right just wants to piss off the Democrats. Laws are laws, and we have them in place for a reason.

You cannot just bypass a law and let everyone come into this country. After all, it effects us all as citizens. The burden is on our backs because we have to support people who are here illegally, and it is not fair to those who come here and follow the rules to obtain citizenship the right way. Why is it so hard for Politicians to allow LE agencies to enforce the Law and do their sworn duty? It's not, it is because the Democrats, and the Media don't really give a rat's ass. Spin the tale, and the Left will continue to try to re-write the laws based on their blind objectives. And the Right will continue to have no clue ......It is rather maddening.....

Yep, obey the law or be deported.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016...ents-show.html

[Hand]

Originally Posted by Brush Okie

BTW if I was POTUS a lot if the illegal stuff would be stopped real easy. When they do INS raids use the laws on the books now to throw the people that hire illegals in prison for a few years. Why do they not do that? One has to wonder.

I've often wondered about this myself. Every place I've ever worked, I had to fill out an I-9 before I even "clocked in" for the first day.

I was living on the coast when Katrina destroyed everything on the beach from Waveland to Pascagoula. It seemed like overnight, every where you looked, there were crews of Mexicans ripping off damaged roofs, and replacing them.

Then, suddenly, they were gone.

All those folks came from somewhere, worked for a business entity of some type, then disappeared. Where did they come from, where did they go, la la dit da dit cotton eyed joe.

[rsdengler]

Originally Posted by Hand

Then, suddenly, they were gone.

All those folks came from somewhere, worked for a business entity of some type, then disappeared. Where did they come from, where did they go, la la dit da dit cotton eyed joe.

I think they came up to Maryland and are now working for my friends Landscaping Company.....

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by Brush Okie

BTW if I was POTUS a lot if the illegal stuff would be stopped real easy. When they do INS raids use the laws on the books now to throw the people that hire illegals in prison for a few years. Why do they not do that? One has to wonder.

I guarantee you that the people that hire illegals contribute some hefty sums to the RNC, the DNC and the bureaucrats of both parties.

[echoes]

Originally Posted by Brush Okie

There is a solution to the problem. Its called obey the law if you want to come to this country and stay.

Okay, I will bite. I think Chef Penn's response is in context, and has had no illicit angry intent. Again JMHO, but the attack and derogatory comments towards him personally seem a bit uncharacteristic of the decorum here in this thread...

Not to judge anyone personally, but where do we draw the line of attacking a person who is simply asking a question for which it seems to an SF soldiers response was the aim?


Holly