blankets
 

for those of you that have worked in the jungle, where it can be kind of cold at night, what sort of blanket do you use? I have always used a flannel sheet, but doesn't pack down very good. my son is 1st group, Okinawa, to tell you about me

The Army issue poncho liner (Woobie!) is the greatest invention ever. I've used it in the jungle, the desert, the forest, the mountains, the swamp, pretty much every environment. If it wasn't cold enough for a sleeping bag or the mission requirement meant packing lighter, the poncho liner was the key. Also, if you need a little more protection than the poncho liner alone, you can wrap the poncho around as an outside layer and it works just as well as the medium sleeping bag.

I've been out for 6 years and there is still a poncho liner within arms reach of the bed and one in the go bag.

Poncho Liner.
 

Light weight and dries fast; Does the job.

I still have the two I used in Nam 1970.
Now saved for the G-Kids :D

I slept in an NVA canvas hammock, one over, the other under.

Good insight:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/taskand...r-fielded/amp/

Remarkable how long the US Poncho and Poncho Liner have been in service with little change other than materials. These are pieces for dirt, mud, rain, snow and wind this and some moca pulled out of the ruck for a few hours during the dark of night...bad weather, heavy loads begins to put the pieces into perspective.

You mentioned jungle, a challenging environment to be a foot in. Higher rain fall and humidity with greater frequency, storms, stagnant air circulation, heavy dew, wet ground, mud, elevation changes are some of the environmental concerns. Besides warmth, I think moisture and wetness are big factors in comfort and health.

Sacrilege, I known but materials have changed, light weight insulation today can absorb far less moisture due to very hydrophobic materials, the micro filaments along with structure and construction can create clo ratings nearly as warm when wet. Resistances within the “blanket” when differed can vector moisture out and away efficiently, protect exterior to a greater extent and maintain the breath ability we associate with comfort. Now that same system with a warm body inside is protecting you from the environments ( potentially hot weather as well) and drying you, your equipment and mind out more effectively.

MOO

Well, your opinion is pretty good. The similar item of yours that you showed me was about as light as a tissue but I imagine it was at least the equal of a PL in comfort.

PSM hope you and yours are well! I remember that, 1,750,000 of us invaded Wyoming................and all of us drove separate cars:D

I can assure you that liner has held up better than the vehicle ;)

To answer, the 4oz Primaloft Gold is about 4 times thicker than the polyester insulation inside the issued liner. Gold aka Fusion was codeveloped with the military, It wicks more efficiently than the insulation inside the issued liner as the development concept was that it be as light as down but mitigate moisture issues... it comes close in the weight and far exceeds its ability to insulate when wet...as many here know.

I fondly remember the issue system and recently packed a stash BOB (Alice) with all the original kit I had been issued... even a uniform from basic/AIT circa Late 80s :).... but there was still room for our liner and Shell.

Stay cool down there!

I still have my woobie(s). Usually, two sewn together for an all-season sleep kit. And as you all will recall, I ventured into the woobie smoking jackets a while back. I've since moved on to my own design. No woobies were harmed or desecrated in the creation of my new concept. I use 3 separate layers to make these. This baby is currently lined with 2.5 oz APEX Climashield. With nothing more than a T-shirt on in a snow storm last winter, it was relatively light and extremely warm. And yes, that hood is a modular attachment. :D

However, looking at my source for materials, they're out of APEX so I may have to look at Primaloft for future projects.

Awesome :lifter

Are you still building those smoking jackets? Some of the team guys I work with expressed interest for their deployments.

I’m sure your familiar with Beyond Expedition Clothing https://beyondclothing.com/
Talking with Rick I found it interesting they use both Climashield (Apex) and a primaloft insulation ( I think on their cold weather kit). We started with Climashield (Combat ) but found the Primaloft was better for what we are doing.

Project Update
 

Gents,

After tinkering and casting spells on a number of projects in my makeshift mad scientist lab for the past 3 years, I've settled on this project to forge ahead with. I don't recall if I mentioned it before but this is my Patrol Base Lounge Jacket or PBLJ. The custom length robe version is the Vanguard. I've made at least 20 of these in a range of patterns and colors for friends, family and colleagues, with very good feedback. They aren't active apparel but have been utilized in high mountain elk hunting camps and forward deployed locations overseas as well as just relaxing around the house.

Note: I tried uploading small .jpeg images of them but I keep getting a failure message.

I'm waiting to hear back from a veteran treatment center that saw my very first prototype a couple years ago (I made it for a good friend going through there) and they had expressed interest in selling them. I have a few of the new models ready to ship out to get their unbiased feedback for the business plan. In the mean time, I'm working with a handful of advisors from the Regional BDC here in eastern Idaho to develop a plan to bring my products to market. The two big issues they're working on for me are allocating funding and outsourcing manufacturing. This design requires a lot more work than a woobie jacket and with my extremely limited workspace in addition to aggravations from the repetitive motions on my chassis damage, it takes me 5 days to build one. Except for the plastic hardware, I’ve been able to find all the materials in the US.

Considering my primary target market, I know where I want manufacturing to take place. However, a couple of successful businessmen who have spent decades in the textile industry strongly recommend going overseas in order to keep the price point down and QC up. That being said, I'm going to toss this question out there. I think I already know what the response will be but I have to ask. How many of you would be supportive/willing to purchase one of these if I settled on having them manufactured someplace over on the far side of the Pacific?

(Deleted - wrong thread)

I will support both, I would prefer "made in the USA", but understand business financials..

And I'd offer to model your 1st 4X hooded version

:lifter

4X?! :eek:

Always gotta be somebody who just can’t be let it be and has to throw me a curve. I’ve got S-3X sizes. Looks like I need to extrapolate and generate another template size. :D

BTW: There aren’t two versions. These are modular and the hoods can be removed. Also come with their own stuff sack. ;)

You’re going to have to PM me your shirt/blouse measurements so I can come up with the dimensions for the new template. Otherwise, can do, brother.

Your smoke jacket looks great. I have been meaning to put together a smoking cap which would be worn when chilling in my man cave. Your jacket would definately add to the "experience". Question though. Any chance you can make one using CADPAT? I will gladly provide the fabric. Let me know.

I wondered the same thing at one time, fortunately following my passion and what I know have found there is no shortage of customers who gladly pay for American made, American materials and American pride. I do read what you are saying with the details of construction. It is a challenge, we have much better control in house vs contracting with other companies. A result of the reduction of the domestic textile production in this country caused by larger companies going over seas. I perceive you have a niche market with the smoking jackets and that should work to your favor.
My 2 cents...

PBLJ's
 

Here's a sample of what I've built:

PBLJs 2
 

More pics

The Vanguard
 

Here's a selection of my Vanguard. I made a couple of the pink models for my mom and one of my Sis-in-Law. The green one was for my dad. The third is being modeled by some goon.

For reference, I'm 6'2" about 205.

Those look great, I do like the long ones. The guys I’ve forwarded your product to love the style. The pink one will create legends :D:lifter

I think I need this, Early B-day gift to self :lifter

I have enough old patches to bling it up as if it was issued? :D

concur - prefer Made in 'Merica; but at any rate put me down for 3. More to follow I'm sure as the word gets out.

good job!!

I’m in for this one.....

Attachment 36289

Gents,

I am ecstatic with the feedback so far. I know some of you were wondering if I would be able possibly build you one but, sadly, I have shut down my 1-disabled-man sewing operation in order to focus on the business side of things. In addition to improving the business plan, there are a lot of specs I have to update and compile for the logistics, such as the different sizes of templates, as well as update the assembly instructions. Although it looks similar to other jacket concepts, it is comprised of modified components of 4 different patterns or pieces of apparel so there is no available pattern outside of what I have created. In order for a manufacturer to be able to assemble these things in accordance with the steps in my process, I have to ensure my specs and instructions are as accurate and feasible as possible.

With that in mind, the cost of all the materials and components used in the assembly dictates that these jackets/robes are not going to be inexpensive. I won’t have a price point for it until a suitable manufacturer is identified and their input determines production costs. As some here might know, apparel is not easy, which is why I have avoided it for so long. I prefer to build things that aren’t crap and design them to stand apart in both appearance and application to a competitor. This tends for things to get over-engineered but I try to design my projects for longevity. That being said, this is somewhat of a luxury garment and not a piece of ruggedized/performance outerwear, like a service-issued field jacket or wet weather garment.

As previously mentioned, I know this product resembles other woobie jacket concepts but it is a markedly different design. For one, it isn’t made from a woobie, nor is it quilted. This makes it significantly warmer than a woobie or woobie garment. It is also NOT a smoking jacket. It’s made of polyester, which, like nylon woobie fabric, doesn’t do well with open flames, sparks and cinders. I know it’s a colloquial term we all use but, also unlike a smoking jacket, it is neither slimming, nor form fitting. Although, it is very stylish. My very first prototype that I made for my buddy, was made from a woobie and based on an actual smoking jacket pattern. It looked and fit okay so long as you were standing still. Otherwise, it was way too constricting and rode up quite a bit. What I’ve developed is a bit more roomy, as well as poofy due to the uniform insulation throughout it. You can really see that when you look at the pics of the robe in one of my earlier posts where the subject uses a Weaver-type stance compared to the frontal isosceles stance in this one. The camera adds 100 lbs when you do that.

As for the target market, it may be a relatively small niche, but I believe it can be broadened. Just the audience on this forum represents a wide range of users that can find use with this product.

Target users:
• Current Military & Veterans
• LEO/First responders
• Hunters
• Fishermen
• Campers
• Adventure travelers
• Spouses of all the aforementioned
• Military hospitals
• Service member treatment facilities
• Remote government installations
• High-end hotels, lodges, spas, etc.

I’m going to hijack an apparel company CEO’s tag line, “I’m not only the owner of the company. I’m also a customer.” I’ve had to undergo two shoulder repair surgeries within the past two years and you really can’t lay down flat to sleep for the first month or so. The blanket or comforter will not stay up, where upon you wake up freezing in addition to being in significant discomfort. Wearing this jacket with its hood attached, the blankets only needed to cover me below the waist because I was able to sleep in an upright position and remain warm and relatively comfortable during winter in Idaho.:D

Well hurry up with the business plan, Winter is Coming!!

Feedback source
 

Gents,

The treatment center my Ragnar buddy attended said they're still interested but currently occupied with all the bedlam affecting the nation. I was hoping they would be a good source for feedback and setting up a large order but that is not going to happen at this time.

One of my brothers put me in touch with a Navy officer over at Bethesda and I've shipped one of the models out to them to circulate through unofficial channels for feedback. The PBLJ may go very high, which would be nice, but I'm not pinning everything on that potential. I really wish I didn't have to pass these around so openly, but I'm not in much of a position to get picky if I want to generate a demand. My only concern is that some maroon falcon is going to try and hijack this design before I get them on the shelves.

If necessary, I'm willing to kick out a jacket or two (Size XXL) to get passed around this forum for feedback.

The Navy rep I'm talking with also suggested going to SOFREP. Any thoughts about that?

One option is to partner up with another company that attends military shows and would be willing to add you and your product to their booth, that helped me understand I was barking up the right tree.I say “ military show with the idea there would be less poaching and it being closer to your larger customer... later you may find your customers might not even be military.

I was far from any military community when I started both in location and service dates. Knew I didn’t have the money to market in any flashy way so decided to go the cult route. Started G1 MIST Program where we focused on getting pieces into the hands of deployed soldiers to develop relevancy, a lessons learned guy helped with that. One by one we brought customers on board... they are incredible sales agents and I saw a loyalty develop. That has developed into a community, we now get inquiries about building what their teammates have etc... it wasn’t an instant process but neither was purchasing all our materials.... on the bright side we buy nothing from China and MOQ requirements have left us in a solid position regarding resupply most materials. Understand there are a lot of ways to skin a cat...

I understand. In the mean time, I sold three to as many nephews currently active. One is a CPT, with CAV, IIRC, down in TX. One of his brothers is a 1SG at Leonard Wood. And the 3rd is their cousin, an ODA CDR in 3rd SF in Bragg. They tell me they've been sporting these around. The one in TX tells me his BC catches himself saluting him when mistaking him for a senior(superior) officer. :D:D

Update
 

I've been working with a local team comprised of the regional business development center and students at BYU-Idaho to get things rolling. I have provided some guidance to the team, who are doing a bulk of the work outside product development. Here's what we came up with.

1. Distribution: Although many of the venues we looked at are indeed viable, they will likely want to see sufficient demand before they agree to carry my brand/product. Demand is currently in its infancy so, as my friends over at Kelty suggested, I might want to start with a core following, which could very well be many on this forum, and conduct a direct sales campaign until such time as demand grows/evolves and retailers and distribution venues, such as Bass Pro, sporting goods stores, the Army/Air Force Exchange Service or Navy Exchange (PX/BX) systems want to carry it.

2. Manufacturing: In order to meet the aforementioned demand, there needs to be a reliable manufacturing source. While I'm the guy who designed this product, I'm more of an idea guy/tinkerer/inventor/prototyper and not necessarily qualified or skilled to oversee all the aspects of a manufacturing operation. I will suck it up and do the job to get it started, if that is what it will take. I'm still open to outsourcing the production to another organization. However, my team's lead guy stated many of those manufacturers he spoke with require a minimum number of units to be assembled before they agree to work on them, and that minimum number does not yet exist. And a lot of those manufacturers will require that they keep the templates and instructions, which doesn't sit well with me if their work turns out to be less than what was expected and we part ways. Some manufacturers I've spoken with in the past about doing embroidery or printing of my logo required they get control and/or ownership of the designs customers submit to them. This brings the option of local manufacturing back to being the most likely COA.

My student team is putting together a social media campaign to seek out and potentially recruit local seamstresses/tailors looking for work at a time when the country is pushing for manufacturing to return home. That would be nice if this works out because I'm interested to hear what a textile professional thinks of my concept and if can be streamlined any more.

There is also the possibility of presenting this project to the textiles/apparel department at BYU-I. I'm currently updating assembly instructions, which is very tedious and time consuming, to allow the least skilled individual to follow my work. I did this for ODA guys, green-suiters and other fabricators when I was overseas on my last contract. Depending on how skilled the students are, my guidance on how to assemble these may be minimal, except for particular details they aren't familiar with. And who knows, maybe if works out, some of those kids might want to continue working for me.

Continuing on this line of thinking of keeping this whole process here in the USA and potentially putting unemployed skilled labor (or unskilled labor in this particular field) back to work, for quality control and brand integrity, I believe manufacturing and distribution should be maintained in a local area to start with. For one, there is the logistics of either getting all the materials to the seamstresses/tailors, or getting those workers to a central location with the materials and equipment. Effects of the weather, economy, natural disasters, or a combination thereof, (like right now) can severely impact lines of communication and disrupt logistics and commerce. I would imagine that the more localized it is, the less moving parts are required, and chances of supply disruptions can be mitigated.

There would also be the reduced risk of knock-off copies to flood the market and corrupt the brand integrity if production wasn't spread out over multiple organizations or across a larger area of the country. The knock-offs and copies are going to happen. It will only be a matter of time. What will mitigate or slow it down is applying a level of control on both manufacturing and distribution.

As for the jackets/robes, themselves, I'm looking at starting with MULTICAM, Woodland, MARPAT, Coyote, OD, and Foliage for the outer shell options. I've gotten a request for NWU-III but my materials source doesn't have that print available for their fabrics yet. I can look at adding some of the other colors that you all have seen later if there is enough demand for them.

My price point is $200. I realize many might feel that's a bit steep but it takes a bit of materials to make one of these. Again, these aren't repurposed woobies turned jackets. Along with amenities that no one else has thought of, each jacket also has their own water and abrasion resistant stuff sack.

Sizes are currently S-3X but, because somebody here just had to be different :p, I'm now going to have to return to the salt mines and create a 4X. I've also been redrawing the sleeves to be significantly roomier because it occurred to me that some of you gents are likely sporting some serious pythons and these aren't supposed to be form-fitting Under Armor jackets.

Some of you have already expressed interest and even submitted requests, which is fantastic. I know winter is coming. And fall hunting camp arrives before that. For those interested, as a reference, I'm 6'2" and around 200 lbs. and I am comfortable in a 2X.

:lifter:D:lifter

After a couple of months of bickering and sourcing, we have a product.

And I am very pleased
:lifter:D:lifter

initial notes(NOT complaints)

1)inside pocket, I would have put it on the left side, I could use it as a holster. Caveat: my lightest toy is the S&W 342 Ti, 13oz+ loaded, I got it for swim trunk type shorts,, it may still show as the light fluffy material deforms with very little weight. :[

2)a small velcro patch or button on the center of the belt and under the center-back loop to keep the belt from sliding off

3)arm velcro patch is not big enough for the 1st Cav

4)love the:

• buttons on the lapels to hold the fold
• hood
• fit, it's nice to be a little oversized to wrap around when you sit.
• buttons on the sleeves to shorten them when needed, hot weather??

5)fit is supper. I sit out on my porch for a whisky & cigar 1-2 times a week all yr. Until the temps get below 32. This should keep me toasty down to 40deg? with some layering, maybe lower. I haven't experienced any of the new ultra-light thermal materials, still a canvas & down type.

Attached a couple of quick pictures.

And for the astute observers, after some 127+ days,, my #1 G-daughter cut a hi-n-tight. :]

link to older thread



PS; The beret is my orginal 1969 issue and the Cpt bars are the painter silver camo we had for a short period.

When my wife saw your 'hairy' pic, she said, "What is that?" :D

My first thought was. You clean up good though.

Attachment 36686

Update:

Issue #1: Sorry. No changes intended for the inside pocket. I had to standardize the design to streamline the assembly.

#2: The belt/loop issue, however, has been resolved. Working with the designers, we changed out the belt loops with lengths of gutted 550 and added a short bit of 550 on the center of the belt to secure it to the center loop.

#3: The 4x4 velcro on the shoulders is about as big as I can go. I've got some patches with odd dimensions, myself, and have simply opted to not put them on my PBLJ.

BTW, Jim, you can fall asleep on your porch in that thing at 40 degrees.

I'm waiting for a very small production run (30 solid OD jackets, 5/size) to be completed sometime in the near future. Manufacturing a new product, especially an apparel product takes a lot longer than I had hoped. On top of all that, WuFlu has been a serious boat anchor on every aspect of this process.

I realize this may sound a bit steep but the solid colors and the Woodland models will be $300. That will include shipping. There are other prints/patterns that I have used during product development and want to put into production, but the price on those models will be higher due to the cost per yard of their outer shell prints/patterns being significantly more expensive. The Multicam fabric I used on Jim's jacket turned out to be the second most expensive material I've found. Is there a less expensive MultiCam fabric? Yes, but it is the same fabric used in a poncho liner, which doesn't function as well as the stuff I've selected.

I know everyone would prefer a lower cost but you can't make something like this here in the States for the same price of overseas production. Besides, this is way beyond simply repurposing a woobie. Due to the complicated design, the prices for the materials and manufacturing per unit are high and that doesn't leave me with much of a profit per unit. All the materials are, to the best of my knowledge, US-based and the manufacturing is done by Americans. And with everything that has come to pass this past year, I absolutely refuse to surrender my design specs to overseas manufactures who I guarantee will bootleg them and flood the market with their shit copies.

Looks and sounds good
 

Finally, something to talk about besides the Commie insurrection.

This may he the coolest - warmest house coat to wear for Commie hunt’in.

I’m gonna have to get at least one.

Maybe missed the ordering process, AMBI, but all in and ready to procure a 3/4 length parka like hoodie.

Nothing has been missed. I don't have any inventory right now. I've handed the production over to a local manufacturer but it takes time. I presented them with something a bit more complicated than they first imagined. A long time was spent stream-lining and tweaking it. And there are two other issues: I'm not the only customer they are supporting and WuFlu has seriously impacted their level of operations. I fear the roll out will be rather slow.

No worries, ctc when up and running

A new version of the venerable G1 Liner 8BTR*, it pays homage to our early young testers that exclaimed the liners were hot as lava.
* 8oz/sq yd Primaloft Gold w/breathable thermal reflective membrane.

Black Lava, shown in the wrap configuration.

I don't know what any of this means...is this a woobie replacement? What is the link? Is it any good?

Very confused...