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aricbcool

01-31-2006, 17:58

A few weeks ago, I flew down to AZ for some private instruction in pistol marksmanship from Team Sergeant in relation to this thread:http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7618

Here’s how it went…

I met TS at the hotel at about 1100 the day I arrived. It turned out we had some moving to do (coffee tables to be exact) and I was happy to help. I had hoped to be able to stay busy outside of range time, and it worked out well. I got a tour of the downtown area, to include a spectacle I’d never even heard of before… a mall with valet parking. :eek:
I know many of you are thinking “get to the good part”, but that’s just it. Much of the time I spent outside of the range was part of the good part. Over the course of the next couple of days I would learn many things from TS in regards to SF through conversation, questions, and the many stories he would tell. It was very valuable to me, and much appreciated.
After moving stuff, and getting a bite to eat, we headed back to his house for some “classroom time” in the garage. Having only had roughly 8 hours behind a handgun, and no formal training, we covered the basics: Safety, stance, grip, sight picture, frontsight focus. We covered proper loading and clearing techniques, and dry-fired a bit for practice. After about half an hour, I was ready to hit the range and put it all to the test.
The range was out in the desert, and the next day we set up targets and got ready to go. The weather was sunny, if not a little chilly; I would be shooting TS’s HK .45.
I started at 5 meters, shooting a 4 shot group. Three hit in a one inch group; the fourth I missed. Moving to the next target, I shot the same, only this time the three within the group were touching each other. Third target, all four were bullet hole on bullet hole.
At this point, I was surprised to say the least. I’d never shot under a 3 inch group in my life. In fact I never really looked at groups in the first place. My shooting up to this point had been more “plinking” than anything else. I either hit the target (which was usually a can, or piece of old computer equipment) or I didn’t.
So we moved back to 7 meters, and I shot all over the target. It looked like someone had taken a blunderbuss to the cardboard man in front of me. This was not good, and there was no excuse I could offer. Time for a little counseling from the Team Sergeant.
TS is a great teacher. He knows when to instruct, when to ask questions, and when to apply the pressure. In this case, he stood next to me and repeated a mantra that will follow me the rest of my shooting days: “Don’t fucking flinch.” :D
I shot bullet holes through bullet holes at 7 meters for the next 20 minutes.
When I won the charity auction that got me here, I asked TS if there was anything I could read or do to get me ready. Grip strength was the reply. It turns out a person’s grip strength determines many things in regards to shooting, including the length of time one can shoot before marksmanship drops off the scale. I put this to practice that day on the range when, after 20 or 30 minutes, I started shooting (in TS’s words) “like a 3 year old with your hair on fire.”
Having covered all the basics, TS went over some more advanced concepts to include indexing and double-tapping. We capped off the day by putting some rounds through the CAR-15. :cool:
Day 2 found me at the range with my hair on fire again. With the first few targets I was able to put 4 rounds bullet hole on bullet hole. After that, I’d usually get two and then flinch my way through the rest. After two magazines, I took a break, grabbed a snap cap and went to the side to dry fire. TS laughed at this and said “Now that you’ve seen what you can do you’re gonna break a knee-cap kicking you own ass.” Yep. :D
After about 15 minutes of that, I went back and shot a couple more 4 shot groups to standard, and then fell back into the flinch. Looking back, I’m glad I did. Experience is the best teacher, and that day’s experience really gave me a proper appreciation for the time and practice it will take to become predictably proficient in proper marksmanship.
Overall, the trip beat my highest expectations. I had a great time too. Thanks TS for the time you spent, the hospitality you showed me, and the skills you’ve equipped me with to become a good marksman.

Regards,
Aric

Peregrino

01-31-2006, 18:49

Sounds like the "first steps" on a "journey of a thousand miles". :munchin Peregrino

CPTAUSRET

01-31-2006, 19:06

Glad you posted this story!

I heard about if rom someone else, you done good!

Terry

Sacamuelas

01-31-2006, 19:11

good story..... :cool:

mumbleypeg

01-31-2006, 19:14

Thanks for the post.

Roguish Lawyer

01-31-2006, 19:16

TS is a great instructor. Remember to dry-fire!

Huey14

01-31-2006, 19:19

That's pretty cool.

As an aside (and if anyone would prefer I make a new topic I wil), how does one increase their grip strength?

mumbleypeg

01-31-2006, 19:26

Talk to TS, this places fear in the belly. You then go to store and buy tennis balls and drive around squeezing them. Then, you buy those things that look like spring loaded nut crackers and squeeze those. That is until your wife finds out your building grip strength and says " oh good, you can massage my back" so you do that too.

Of course YMMV:D

Roguish Lawyer

01-31-2006, 19:36

That's pretty cool.

As an aside (and if anyone would prefer I make a new topic I wil), how does one increase their grip strength?

Putty and Captains of Crush.

Huey14

01-31-2006, 19:56

Oh yeah I know the things now. Thanks RL.

aricbcool

01-31-2006, 21:37

Thanks for the comments everyone. Coming home I couldn't help but think of Obi Wan Kenobi: "You've taken your first step into a larger world."

RL, will do. I've picked out a spot in the garage just for that purpose.

Huey,

I've been using these for grip strength: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0006ZKG1C/sr=1-4/qid=1138764835/ref=sr_1_4/104-2697455-9857560?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=3407731&s=sporting-goods&v=glance

A couple of exercises mentioned to me by TS:

1. Door frame pullups using only your fingers.

2. Tie a rope to some weights. Lift the weight by the rope and hold it out with your palms facing down. Then lift using only your wrist/forearm.

3. Mumbleypeg is right about backrubs. Not only will they build strength, but they'll also earn you brownie points.

--Aric

CoLawman

01-31-2006, 21:52

Money well spent Aric!

2. Tie a rope to some weights. Lift the weight by the rope and hold it out with your palms facing down. Then lift using only your wrist/forearm.

For clarification.........is that rope not tied to a dowel and you lift the weight by winding the weight up?

Peregrino

01-31-2006, 21:55

Money well spend Aric!

For clarification.........is that rope not tied to a dowel and you lift the weight by winding the weight up?

What's the name of the Western where Racquel Welch does that exercise? :confused: I've been trying to remember for months and can't. Peregrino

The Reaper

01-31-2006, 21:59

Do you mean "Hannie Caulder"?

Robert Culp is her teacher?

TR

aricbcool

01-31-2006, 22:01

Money well spend Aric!

For clarification.........is that rope not tied to a dowel and you lift the weight by winding the weight up?

Indeed it was!

As far as the dowel goes, that's a good idea. I hadn't thought of that. I don't believe TS mentioned it, but I could be mistaken. :o

--Aric

Peregrino

01-31-2006, 22:07

Do you mean "Hannie Caulder"?

Robert Culp is her teacher?

TR

Thanks, that's it. (BTW - nice editing skills there, you're pretty quick on the draw yourself. :cool: ) 100% spagetti western, pure unadulterated formula flic, but she was memorable enough to make up for all its other deficiencies. (Definitely not a Geena Davis.) Peregrino

CoLawman

01-31-2006, 22:29

Thanks, that's it. (BTW - nice editing skills there, you're pretty quick on the draw yourself. :cool: ) 100% spagetti western, pure unadulterated formula flic, but she was memorable enough to make up for all its other deficiencies. (Definitely not a Geena Davis.) Peregrino

I remember the scene well........I could not take my eyes off her well developed wrists!

aricbcool

01-31-2006, 22:34

I remember the scene well........I could not take my eyes off her well developed wrists!

This thread is useless without pictures. :D

--Aric

The Reaper

01-31-2006, 22:41

Sam Adams: You're a hard woman, Hannie Caulder.
Hannie Caulder: Like the man said, there aren't any hard women, only soft men.

aricbcool

01-31-2006, 23:00

Damn. That's one to add to the movie collection... :eek:

--Aric

CoLawman

02-01-2006, 08:13

Sam Adams: You're a hard woman, Hannie Caulder.
Hannie Caulder: Like the man said, there aren't any hard women, only soft men.

See........notice the wrists in TR's attached photo. I told you! Those were certainly some fine wrists in her day!

vsvo

02-01-2006, 09:44

Thanks for the story!

HOLLiS

02-01-2006, 10:04

WOW, great story, Makes me wished I still live in AZ. Would love to have been there.

Sdiver

02-01-2006, 10:45

This thread is useless without pictures. :D

--Aric

Couldn't find the pic of Rachel working with the "wrist roller" thingy.

But ANY picture of Rachel Welch is a good picture.

Chris

02-01-2006, 14:44

But ANY picture of Rachel Welch is a good picture.

Amen :munchin

The Dave

02-01-2006, 15:17

Roguish Lawyer

02-01-2006, 21:38

The valet parking at the mall surprised me too the first time I saw it. No offense to anyone here if they do that...but come on, 5 bucks to save you a 60 second walk??

LOL -- most of the malls here have valet parking.

Bill Harsey

02-01-2006, 21:43

Couldn't find the pic of Rachel working with the "wrist roller" thingy.

But ANY picture of Rachel Welch is a good picture.
Sdiver,
Good job keeping the pics tactically oriented with good gun leather and then illustrating how to hold the pistol at eye level.

Team Sergeant

02-01-2006, 21:48

What does the wrist roller do?

This is the idea.....

http://www.mikebrownsolutions.com/roller.htm

It puts quite a burn on the forearms, wrists etc.....

He's not quite Rachel......

aricbcool

02-01-2006, 21:54

See........notice the wrists in TR's attached photo. I told you! Those were certainly some fine wrists in her day!

Oh yeah. Now that you mention it, she does have nice wrists. I guess I was distracted. :D

--Aric

aricbcool

02-01-2006, 22:03

How did you like Phoenix in general?

I really didn't get out too much, other than range time. I saw a movie, and spent time at the book store. Oh yeah, and Walgreens for souveneirs.

I really enjoyed the weather though (it snowed up here the day before I left), and the scenery. I grew up in Southern California, and it was nice to get down south and see some palm trees and cacti. Up here it's either sage brush or ever-greens.

Funny story: I accidentally drove off with the wrong car at the rental-car lot. I had checked the car number at the airport and didn't double check it when I got there. Grabbed the car next to mine.

After a few tense words from the car attendant, I assured him I was nothing more than a dumbass and he had me drive around and pick up the right one.

Figures it would happen to me the first time I rent a car. :D

Regards,
Aric

The Dave

02-01-2006, 23:27

This is the idea.....

http://www.mikebrownsolutions.com/roller.htm

It puts quite a burn on the forearms, wrists etc.....

He's not quite Rachel......

I just saw/tried this for the first time tonight at the gym. Loved it, made the forearms feel like they were about to explode.

The Dave

02-01-2006, 23:29

I really didn't get out too much, other than range time. I saw a movie, and spent time at the book store. Oh yeah, and Walgreens for souveneirs.

I really enjoyed the weather though (it snowed up here the day before I left), and the scenery. I grew up in Southern California, and it was nice to get down south and see some palm trees and cacti. Up here it's either sage brush or ever-greens.

Funny story: I accidentally drove off with the wrong car at the rental-car lot. I had checked the car number at the airport and didn't double check it when I got there. Grabbed the car next to mine.

After a few tense words from the car attendant, I assured him I was nothing more than a dumbass and he had me drive around and pick up the right one.

Figures it would happen to me the first time I rent a car. :D

Regards,
Aric

There's nothing like being able to send home pictures of yourself in December/January, in front of a palm tree.

Thats hilarious...makes a for a funny vacation story though.

Detcord

02-02-2006, 04:35

I just saw/tried this for the first time tonight at the gym. Loved it, made the forearms feel like they were about to explode.

As an alternative forearm/grip strength exercise, you can always do some climbing when you're not shooting or doing PT, although climbing really is PT!!!

http://media.putfile.com/dan_osman

jbour13

02-02-2006, 10:00

The wrist rolling exercise is outstanding. I started it in high school for baseball and other sports. I have done it on occasion off and on for a few years. If you do it as the picture shows that TS posted it'll smoke your front delts too. :lifter One thing to keep in mind is keep good posture or you'll get pretty stiff lumbars.

I keep a stress ball at my desk and have noticed less forearm fatigue on my Friday night shoots. Most nights we do close to 1000rds. This is done in multiple calibers (9, 40, 45) The smaller the caliber the less stress of course. 1000rds of 45 will make your arms a bit rubbery and make you focus on slowing your shot to ensure it impacts the spot you intend it to. I don't do that very often because it's hard on the wallet and the pistol.

I've noticed a great improvement in shot placement and multiple shots. I've never timed myself on how fast I break the first shot or the time in between shots, but my follow-up shots are faster and hit where I want.

Sounds like you had a great trip and came away with some good experiences. Though I've never met TS, I trust his input based on his responses,.....no flair, just truth! Dry fire, dry fire and more dry fire helps. I have no set number of dry fires I do each day, but I do it before I put on my carry gun and before I shoot. I don't shoot until I'm completely satisfied that the muzzle of the pistol remained absolutely still.

This may get shot down for the obvious reasons, but here goes.
Lasers: lasers provide one useful benefit (for me at least), if you mount a laser to your pistol and focus on the dot (vs front sights) as you break the trigger you may improve. At increased distances it exaggerates your movement so you can see how good/bad you are manipulating the trigger. You do this with proper stance and grip as if you were engaging the target but focus on the laser vs. the front sights. Superimpose the laser on the screws on a light switch at different distances for reference. 5ft is a good start, then 10 and so on.

I do it with a store gun at the range and it's worked well for me. Of course the gun is a stock glock 19 with crimson trace grips, the trigger can only be so good. :D

As for other uses of the laser, not a fan. I feel it takes away from the sights too much and ingrains bad habits.

Razor

02-02-2006, 16:40

Another good wrist/forearm exercise is to fill a 5gal bucket with crushed corn or similar material, stick your hand in it halfway up your forearm, palm open and fingers touching (as in a hand salute), and rotate your wrist in all directions.

Roguish Lawyer

02-02-2006, 17:43

STR8SHTR

02-02-2006, 19:04

I will be finishing the state mandated training for specialized firearms instructor school tomorrow. I have learned alot in the last two weeks. However, I think a trip AZ and some range time with TS would be VERY beneficial to me and others.:lifter

12B4S

02-06-2006, 02:55

Well, being an old school type guy, the wrist rolling exercise is great. One simple one that I learned from my father as a kid and he learned it years before he went into pro baseball, was this. Take a newspaper, open it up and spread it out, lay it on the floor, table, whatever, reach down and place your hand in the middle of each sheet and wad it into a ball, just using your hand. Any Sunday paper should wipe those muscles out. Besides, most all the newspapers are lib anyway, will provide one with that extra motivation. :D

Warrior-Mentor

02-06-2006, 20:18

Want to smoke your forearms and have fun doing it?

Try Rock Climbing.

Preping for SFAS I scheduled regular trips to the rock gym. Try doing "Touchdowns" See how many time you can reach the ceiling in X amount of time. Race against a partner.

You'll be smoked when it's over.

JM

Bill Harsey

02-06-2006, 20:59

12B4S

02-08-2006, 02:15

I tried that once. The rocks broke.

Bill! You have to quit going to those indoor climbing joints! Ya can break more stuff in a bar. :D

Michelle

02-08-2006, 15:02

This is the idea.....

http://www.mikebrownsolutions.com/roller.htm

It puts quite a burn on the forearms, wrists etc.....

He's not quite Rachel......

Thank you so much for that TS.

I was so far off base on this exercise (based on verbal explanations of what to do) I was in a hocky rink.

For starters, I was doing it one hand at a time. That should tell you how wrong I was.

Funny thing is, what I was doing worked kind of well too. :D

m1

Roguish Lawyer

02-08-2006, 15:06

Couldn't find the pic of Rachel working with the "wrist roller" thingy.

But ANY picture of Rachel Welch is a good picture.

I believe that Rachel's name is Raquel. I just don't know whether that was a spelling error or if you piss chicks off by forgetting their names as often as I do. ;)

Endorphin Rush

02-08-2006, 16:47

Great post Aric. Thanks for the details. You are most fortunate to have had the opportunity to train with the Team Sergeant. I am envious.

As to the grip strengh issue:

Nike Hand Grip Gel: These are the most convenient thing I've found lately for grip strength. As TS and others have already stated, there are additional, and better, ways to strengthen ones grip. But these can be taken almost anywhere and used almost anytime. I use them all night long at work. They also offer almost limitless range of motion exercises depending on how you hold and squeeze the gel, ie., whole hand squeeze, thumb forefinger squeeze, individual finger contractions/extensions.

The link is offered for it's picture only. You can find these at Dick's Sporting Goods for around $12.00. They come in soft, medium and hard consistencies for varying hand strengths.

http://www.lacrosse.com/IWCatProductPage.process?Merchant_Id=1&Section_Id=2&pcount=&Product_Id=110467

ER