View Full Version : If someone finishes Selection and is not...
Selected, do they a certificate stating that they "Attended"? My reason for asking is this, I was in my platoon office today and a few soldiers started talking about going to selection. One of the other PSGs hears them and yells out "I went to SFAS when I was at Bragg". Then he whips out his I Love Me book and shows us a copy of a Certificate from JFKSWCS that says ATTENDED along with the date he went. I have no reason to doubt this man, but I just wanted to know if those who actually finish the course but aren't selected get COAs. Thank you gentlemen for any replies. Kuri out..
The Reaper
01-24-2006, 19:06
At various times, we have issued CoAs.
TR
Sir, thank you for the reply.
Warrior-Mentor
01-30-2006, 21:26
If my memory serves me correctly, for a while SFAS also gave a certificate for Land Navigation Training for those who successfully completed the Star...
You get an automatic NTR now? That sucks. I went back in Nov of 2004 and as long as you didn't quit, 1SGT opsec admin edit*please do not post cadre names in the clear* Eagle would let you come back the very next class. There was one guy that had been to the previous 2 selection classes, didn't pass ours and was planning on going to the Jan class.
Aequitas
02-18-2006, 09:32
You get an automatic NTR now? That sucks. I went back in Nov of 2004 and as long as you didn't quit, 1SGT admin edit* please do not post cadre names in the clear-Eagle would let you come back the very next class. There was one guy that had been to the previous 2 selection classes, didn't pass ours and was planning on going to the Jan class.
rab,
He is now the SGM S3 of 1st swtg. Even when I went to selection back in october they were handing NTRs out like candy. Like the comments above, it's all who is running show. Oh and my class didn't get any certificates or anything...they made sure we left with the memo that had everyone's name on it that was selected.
The Reaper
02-18-2006, 10:27
rab,
He is now the CSM of 1st swtg. Even when I went to selection back in october they were handing NTRs out like candy. Like the comments above, it's all who is running show. Oh and my class didn't get any certificates or anything...they made sure we left with the memo that had everyone's name on it that was selected.
Unless you know something that I don't, SGM (NOT CSM) S. was the Group S-3 SGM as of two weeks ago.
Has he been selected, assigned, and replaced CSM A. already?
The SFAS NCOIC makes recommendations, he does not make the NS/NTR decision alone.
You people need to quit speculating and putting up bullshit rumors on this board. If you don't know, keep your pieholes shut. People rely on this board for accurate information, and you guys are not helping. It also reflects poorly on you as candidates and soldiers to be posting incorrect info as factual. At this point, what you don't know could fill volumes.
TR
Selected, do they a certificate stating that they "Attended"? My reason for asking is this, I was in my platoon office today and a few soldiers started talking about going to selection. One of the other PSGs hears them and yells out "I went to SFAS when I was at Bragg". Then he whips out his I Love Me book and shows us a copy of a Certificate from JFKSWCS that says ATTENDED along with the date he went. I have no reason to doubt this man, but I just wanted to know if those who actually finish the course but aren't selected get COAs. Thank you gentlemen for any replies. Kuri out..
Kuri,
Certificates were given out in the past but not anymore. Candidates now receive a memorandum stating that they attended and if they were selected or not. That's it. Very simple and very straightforward.
NousDefionsDoc
02-18-2006, 20:58
SGM S - now that sings!
Why would you accept a certificate of attendence if that's not what you went there to get?
Team Sergeant
02-18-2006, 21:05
Why would you accept a certificate of attendence if that's not what you went there to get?
That's what I was thinking.....:rolleyes:
The Reaper
02-18-2006, 21:46
SGM S - now that sings!
Why would you accept a certificate of attendence if that's not what you went there to get?
IIRC, some units count them for promotion points, and it looks a damn sight better on the wall than a VW statement would.
TR
You get an automatic NTR now? That sucks. I went back in Nov of 2004 and as long as you didn't quit, 1SGT opsec admin edit*please do not post cadre names in the clear* Eagle would let you come back the very next class. There was one guy that had been to the previous 2 selection classes, didn't pass ours and was planning on going to the Jan class.
I want to clear up your concerns as best I can.
First, there is no automatic NTR UNLESS YOU QUIT or commit a serious integrity or honor code violation.
Second, if you recieve an NTR, then there were NUMEROUS MULTIPLE serious issues/concerns with the candidate that the board determined the NTR for that individual. Again, many NUMEROUS/MULTIPLE issues/concerns. NO ONE thing except as stated in sentence number one.
Third, the board (made up of the following: O5, O4, E9, E8, E7x3, and a CW3 who records) makes the decision based on a vote that considers the candidates' entire record and performance data from SFAS. If a guy receives an NTR, all of those board members and their combined 100+ years SF experience are more than qualified to determine that.
Fourth, what happened when you went through and what happens now can't be compared. Things change and if you research a little, you will see the entire SFQC is in a transformation right now. The SFQC has changed to keep up with the changing world dynamic and the war we are engaged in.
Fifth, if a guy doesn't quit, does his best, and is a true "TEAM PLAYER", then that's all he can do and that's his best chance to get selected.
Finally, SF doesn't cater to those who want the easy way around. If we did, the tab wouldn't say "Special Forces", it would say "Regular Forces". You earn what you put out. Nothing more, nothing less.
Good luck.
The Reaper
02-18-2006, 22:40
Now that is some excellent advice that you can take to the bank, Gents.
Thanks!
TR
NousDefionsDoc
02-18-2006, 23:14
More than fair. As usual.
More than fair. As usual.
+1
Doc
Stiletto11
02-19-2006, 09:59
Daver, thanks for taking the time to clear things up. It is appreciated.
Finally, SF doesn't cater to those who want the easy way around. If we did, the tab wouldn't say "Special Forces", it would say "Regular Forces". You earn what you put out. Nothing more, nothing less.
Good luck.
The 1SG when I went to SFAS always said this...I still remember it. That guy was a real motivator....
After reading the response from Daver I understand the concept of a NTR, but I have a question concerning a NTR. I know that NTR is NEVER TO RETURN but if one finds his mistakes and fixes his problems then is it possible to return. The reason I ask is because I recieved a NTR during selection and ever since then I have been dedicated to fix whatever problem I have so I can return and hopefully get selected. I just can't quit. I want this too bad to give up. I noticed that I did poor on land nav, I was anti-social, and my knee gave me a little problems. My biggest problem was because I was there for ME and that in it's self is a NO GO. I've been working to fix all those problems and I really want to give it another shot in a few years after deployment and after I know that the problems listed above are corrected. What do I have to do to go back to SFAS?
Thank You for your time,
-Jamie
NousDefionsDoc
05-07-2006, 16:33
"You've had your whole life to prepare for this moment. Why aren't you ready?"
The Reaper
05-07-2006, 16:35
Get a waiver from the Group Commander.
Going to be hard to prove that you are a born again, land-navigatin', team-playin', healed-up guy who deserves a second chance. Why didn't you get it done the first time?
TR
I agree.....I have had my whole life to prepare and it is going to be hard to prove myself, but I am willing to do what I have to do to go back.
Jack Moroney (RIP)
05-07-2006, 19:14
[QUOTE=The Reaper]Get a waiver from the Group Commander./QUOTE]
Delta04 I don't want to dash your hopes but when I was the Group Commander I never granted a waiver. SFAS is not about letting you fix your problems but demonstrating that you have what it takes to make it thru the Q course and serve as a Special Forces soldier. If you were identified as NTR, while it is laudatory that you have recognized and wish to fix what you percieve to be your short comings, you might be better served as being the best for which you are most suited. Not everyone is cut out to be SF but that does not mean you are not cut out to be an outstanding soldier doing something else. NTR exists primarily because we do not have the time, nor do we want to cut someone else out of a slot who is prepared to demonstrate that they have the potential for SF, to allow you to use SFAS as a personal development laboratory. The board that looked at you looked at you closely and the traits that they identified that resulted in your NTR are those that they evidently felt were not within your demonstrated capability to fix. The board does not take its responsibility lightly and they have a vested interest in the outcome because they are going to have to serve with those that they feel are qualified to proceed.
NousDefionsDoc
05-07-2006, 19:18
I agree.....I have had my whole life to prepare and it is going to be hard to prove myself, but I am willing to do what I have to do to go back.
You don't seem to understand - you had your shot.