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one-zero
01-13-2006, 12:17
Gents;
An article from this months Men's Journal touches on cross-fit which is gaining immense popularity and for all the right reasons...Anyway here's the link to the cross-fit "type" exercises someone can use, especially a newcomer or someone who can't get online and look at the WOD each day.
BTW>If you don't follow the principles you defeat the purpose and advantages this form of fitness development offers...

http://www.mensjournal.com/healthFitness/0602/workout_20minutes.html

Rooster
01-14-2006, 08:24
We started doing cross fit in our reconnaissance platoon, definatly a great workout program.

Rodeo
01-14-2006, 08:55
We have been doing Crossfit at our firehouse. If done at a high intensity it is a very effective workout. They have an interesting article on the physical demands of combat and how to training for those demands.

www.crossfit.com

Thanks, Chris

The Reaper
01-14-2006, 10:44
Gents;
An article from this months Men's Journal touches on cross-fit which is gaining immense popularity and for all the right reasons...Anyway here's the link to the cross-fit "type" exercises someone can use, especially a newcomer or someone who can't get online and look at the WOD each day.
BTW>If you don't follow the principles you defeat the purpose and advantages this form of fitness development offers...

http://www.mensjournal.com/healthFitness/0602/workout_20minutes.html

1-0:

Paladins MC?

TR

one-zero
01-14-2006, 15:55
1-0:

Paladins MC?

TR
RGR that / Strength & Honor /. You ride?

The Reaper
01-14-2006, 16:22
Yep, and I know/knew some of the No Va Paladins as well.

TR

Sponge
03-31-2007, 08:19
http://www.crossfit.com/journal/library/47_06_CF_insurgency.pdf

This was frontpage over on crossfit.com for a little while. Scott is the real deal, I was one of his later converts. It's helped tremendously with my ACL rehab in regaining hamstring and quad strength, where extensive running was not the right answer. Enjoy!

*This might belong in the "Change the PT program thread," but I went with the thread with Crossfit already in the title.*

adal
03-31-2007, 21:50
Been doing crossfit for three years now. The only thing I add is a combatives program. ( for me and mine is Jiujitsu) Very good for my new line of work (ground paramedic) Could have used it on a team but we already did enough "crossfit style" things. Still all in all it's a great program. adal

FearMonkey
03-31-2007, 22:51
Crossfit works! In the 18E course we were worked like dogs in the name of Crossfit. I went from 290's to a 347 on the extended in just a handful of months. The class average was well over 300, and if memory serves there were less than 10 folks that scored under 300, but no one under 280.

Crossfit... it hurts so good.

stakk4
04-01-2007, 09:45
Is there any AD that does Unit PT in the morning and the WOD in the afternoon/evening? Do you do it as is, or modify depending on your PT from the AM? Trying to walk the line between animal PT and overtraining.

NousDefionsDoc
04-01-2007, 09:53
Fear Monkey, that avatar is funny as anything I've ever seen. You should talk to Kyo about a desert cammie suit and a Green Hat on it - then it would be perfect.

Surgicalcric
04-01-2007, 10:07
Is there any AD that does Unit PT in the morning and the WOD in the afternoon/evening? Do you do it as is, or modify depending on your PT from the AM? Trying to walk the line between animal PT and over training.

I don't know of any reg Army units who do PT/Crossfit twice a day here on Bragg, but I know of quite a few SF candidates who do Crossfit twice a day and one in particular :D who does body-part specific exercises in the AM and Crossfit at night. Scheduling workouts so they don't overlap takes some thought but working myself to the point of vomiting is always a great feeling.

3 days on, 1 day off is my schedule as well as taking a 3 day break every third week. Running is done at night as part of my evening workouts, mostly sprint workouts (400M repeats, ladders, fartlek, etc). I save my long runs for Sundays, 7 miler.

Crip

stakk4
04-01-2007, 10:09
Got it. Thanks, Crip!

FearMonkey
04-01-2007, 22:28
Good suggestion. :)

PBF
04-07-2007, 08:23
gents, look into kettlebells aswell. i use them along w/my cross-fit workouts. you can buy an adjustable kb for $150 that ranges from 35#-70# at uskettlebells.com

letinsh
04-08-2007, 18:20
I've just recently gotten into CrossFit, and in my searching, stumbled across the website of the gentleman that trained the actors/stuntmen for '300'.

His website is www DOT gymjones DOT com.
If you look under the 'Schedule' page, the workouts for the people he trains are given. In my limited experience, pretty hardcore stuff. Based on CrossFit, but takes it farther and makes it more painful :lifter

Edited to add: Site is run by Mark Twight - failed to search before posting, and is previously referenced in the Bodyweight PT (http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2178)thread.

Prester John
04-11-2007, 13:39
Two things...

A) I do crossfit in the AM 3-4 times a week, and isolation exercises in the evening three on and one off. I, like Cric, have seen some pretty amazing gains in strength and endurance. It's a great way to exercise if you don't mind throwing up.

B) Mark Twight and Crossfit are having a substantial squabble. I like that Crossfit is open and available to all, which is what allowed Mr. Twight to learn Crossfit to begin with. The GymJones stuff is cool, but I'll stick with the original.

Doug

FearMonkey
04-12-2007, 00:03
Wasn't Twight the guy who trained the Spartans for 300?

Surgicalcric
04-12-2007, 07:43
Wasn't Twight the guy who trained the Spartans for 300?

Yes.

Crip

ClemsonTiger
04-21-2007, 16:34
When you do your Crossfit twice a day, do you do the same routine in the AM and PM? If you don't mind me asking, how has this affected your top end strength? For the past year I have been lifting for the sake of strength solely. While my squat and deadlift are both in the 400s, my endurance has gone to hell. I am hoping to improve my overall work capacity without getting weak again.

Leozinho
04-21-2007, 22:33
When you do your Crossfit twice a day, do you do the same routine in the AM and PM? If you don't mind me asking, how has this affected your top end strength? For the past year I have been lifting for the sake of strength solely. While my squat and deadlift are both in the 400s, my endurance has gone to hell. I am hoping to improve my overall work capacity without getting weak again.

If you want to keep or maybe improve your max powerlifts, you should look into a variation of Crossfit, sometimes referred to as "black box" Crossfit or ME Crossfit, which replaces the middle day of every three WOD cycle with a day of low rep, maximal effort in a couple of O- or power lifts.

Folks report increasing their 1 rep max while their metabolic conditioning still goes through the roof. If you are already very strong, you make not make gains in 1 rep max, but you won't lose as much you would on a pure Crossfit WOD schedule.

Lots of good info on the Crossfit message board, but it's very akward to search old messages, so good luck. Or go to performancemenu.com and download the 3rd issue of Vol 1. You have to register first to get the chance to download one free issue.

AxeMan
04-22-2007, 00:05
I thought this might be relevant,
After CDQC went to 6 weeks (from 4), we found that quite a few students were coming up injured from doing the old school "Combat Diver PT". The old program consisted of Mon, Wed, Fri (long/ slow run/ upper body cals) and Tues, Thurs (2 mi. fast/ lower body cals). Long runs were 3-9 miles at a 7:30 pace and fast runs were 2 miles at 7:00 pace. These are the minimums for student performance, but the Primary Instructor would usually run much faster than this. The Assistant Instructor would always run the minimum standard time/ pace.

To prevent overuse running injuries, inject some variety, and to improve the overall results of the PT program, Key West started using Crossfit, and Crossfit style PT sessions intermixed with the "Old School" Combat Diver PT program. As far as I can tell, it is the only SWTC School that uses Crossfit. The success of this change is high. Students rate the current PT program for CDQC much higher in End of Course Critiques than in the past.

......MDW

ClemsonTiger
04-22-2007, 07:50
Thank you to both of you. I appreciate your input.

Surgicalcric
04-22-2007, 10:46
...As far as I can tell, it is the only SWTC School that uses Crossfit. The success of this change is high. Students rate the current PT program for CDQC much higher in End of Course Critiques than in the past.

......MDW

MSG:

The Echo course is also doing Crossfit from what I understand from the guys in Language School with me.

FWIW,

Crip

PBF
04-22-2007, 10:56
AxeMan,

I run my 18E studs through Crossfit on mon. and tues. I make up my own workouts that are not equipment intensive along with things like buddy carries and tire drags..

AxeMan
04-22-2007, 21:18
AxeMan,

I run my 18E studs through Crossfit on mon. and tues. I make up my own workouts that are not equipment intensive along with things like buddy carries and tire drags..

Glad to hear that there are others out there doing more "intelligent" PT these days. I personally have some major back problems. I have to be very specific about how I do PT to keep me from getting hurt and also to keep me able to max the PT test and still bring some smoke to the young studs. I just took the APFT last Monday, results as follows: 80 PU/ 87 SU/ run time 13:03 - total score = 323 extended scale. Not too bad for 40. I stay away from some of the Crossfit exercises because they are too rough on my back. I wish I had been doing that stuff since I came in the Army in 1986. My back would most likely be in much better shape at this point. The most important thing I can tell anyone out there is to stretch, stretch, stretch, and then stretch some more!! That is the single most effective thing for me to keep the pain level down and the ability level up. Even you young guys take heed. It will enhance performance, and reduce injuries. It is as important as the actual type of workouts you do.

PBF, I know money is tight in SWCS but they got kettle bells, medicine balls, and step platforms down in Key West somehow. Might have a shot at it yourself. Call the XO down there, MAJ Russo. He got all the stuff a year ago.

.......MDW

ClemsonTiger
04-22-2007, 21:37
I just wanted to throw some ideas out there that I picked up from powerlifters like Donnie Thompson for people who might be looking for ways to change up some of their PT.

Bands and chains are a great (and very cheap) way to maximize workouts. If you have a place to do them, chain pushups are great for the upper body. Also, bands can be used to optimize just about any lift so that there is no light spot throughout the range of motion. They can be used to add resistance to dips, situps, pushups, pullups, and anything else you could think of.

PBF
04-25-2007, 06:09
AxeMan,

Thank for the info brother. I've been working it here trying to get some kb's and I think we almost have it. I think the only problem is that I wanted 12 1.5pood bells and our current XO (fat, out of shape) thinks it's crazy but he is shipping out very soon and the new guy is all about it. If not I'll use your contact. Thanks again.

Blitzzz (RIP)
03-10-2008, 09:52
When you guys are as strong as you can get with Cross fit I can give you a system that WILL increase your strength by at least 20% with no loss of quickness and increase muscle endurance by double. This is in spite of any other system you have ever used. Blitz

jbour13
03-10-2008, 10:53
When you guys are as strong as you can get with Cross fit I can give you a system that WILL increase your strength by at least 20% with no loss of quickness and increase muscle endurance by double. This is in spite of any other system you have ever used. Blitz

I'm interested in a good follow-up program to what I'm in now. I love change, mind if I get a copy?

PM me and I'll pass my info to you.

Thanks

Marvin Blank
03-11-2008, 12:43
Blitz.....If you don't mind, I'd appreciate a look at the program as well. I developed a grade 2 stress fracture right before the DLPT, so I more or less have a month and a half off before Sage. With Language taken care of, my main focus right now is PT (as well as freshening up on 18D stuff and Spanish Vocab), so I'm looking for new stuff as well. Thanks.

KSC
04-17-2008, 09:56
Any of you crossfitters supplement with running? I know the WOD calls for running somedays, but is it enough to keep up with the demands of the q course?

PBF
04-17-2008, 10:54
ksc,

NO! you need to keep up your running. crossfit is just an additional workout

BlackDragon0311
09-18-2008, 14:00
the crossfit seems excellent and intense, i'm considering getting into it somewhat, but wanted some advice from other users on here...

i've gotten into a good routine myself, one that has helped me in bringing my Marine Corps PFT up signifigantly, infact its the best i've ever done on a PFT in my entire career, but as always i'm looking for improvment, increasing my stamina and agility, and overall looking and feeling better....here's what i've been doing so far...

Day 1: 5 min warmup run, weights for arms and shoulders.
Day 2: 20 min interval-cardio run
Day 3: 5 min warmup run, weights for chest, back, and abs.
Day 4: 20 min interval-cardio run
Day 5: 5 min warmup run, weights for legs and ass.
Day 6: Rest.

My PFT has gone up alot since I really got into fitness about a year ago after a hernia surgery made me realize i was out of shape and pathetic. Before I started my PFT was as follows...

Dead Hang PullUps- 14/20
Sit-Ups: 100/100
3-Mile Run: 23:40

After having started this, my last PFT (yesterday actually) was as follows:

Dead Hang PullUps: 20/20
Sit-Ups: 100/100
3-Mile Run: 21:14

Having stated all those facts, I am interested in getting into some form of cross fit, but dont wanna loose the increase in what i've already gained. Are there any suggestions to either add cross fit into my routine (like a AM PM schedule), just keeping my routine as is, or simply getting rid of my routine and getting a firm focus on some cross fit? Thanks for the input guys.

~JohnnyBoy

TheShootist
09-18-2008, 15:47
BD-

I'm by no means an expert and I'm not offering any advice. Personally I've been into CrossFit for four months now doing the CF WOD from crossfit.com in the mornings and then adding running workouts from crossfitendurance.com later in the day. I've seen tremendous gains in both my overall strength, and my running has improved greatly in the last six weeks since starting the endurance workouts in the evening. For the first time in my life I love working out.

_S2_
09-18-2008, 15:54
the crossfit seems excellent and intense, i'm considering getting into it somewhat, but wanted some advice from other users on here...

i've gotten into a good routine myself, one that has helped me in bringing my Marine Corps PFT up signifigantly, infact its the best i've ever done on a PFT in my entire career, but as always i'm looking for improvment, increasing my stamina and agility, and overall looking and feeling better....here's what i've been doing so far...

Day 1: 5 min warmup run, weights for arms and shoulders.
Day 2: 20 min interval-cardio run
Day 3: 5 min warmup run, weights for chest, back, and abs.
Day 4: 20 min interval-cardio run
Day 5: 5 min warmup run, weights for legs and ass.
Day 6: Rest.

My PFT has gone up alot since I really got into fitness about a year ago after a hernia surgery made me realize i was out of shape and pathetic. Before I started my PFT was as follows...

Dead Hang PullUps- 14/20
Sit-Ups: 100/100
3-Mile Run: 23:40

After having started this, my last PFT (yesterday actually) was as follows:

Dead Hang PullUps: 20/20
Sit-Ups: 100/100
3-Mile Run: 21:14

Having stated all those facts, I am interested in getting into some form of cross fit, but dont wanna loose the increase in what i've already gained. Are there any suggestions to either add cross fit into my routine (like a AM PM schedule), just keeping my routine as is, or simply getting rid of my routine and getting a firm focus on some cross fit? Thanks for the input guys.

~JohnnyBoy


You have set yourself a good base by lifting weights and such, and you should be strong enough to start crossfit without having to scale down the workouts too much. For you I would highly recommend doing the crossfitendurance.com workout of the day, you basically do the normal crossfit workout, then 3 or so hours later you either run/swim/bike/C2. You will see some great gains in performance.

Plus it's a better workout for us military type folk, than targeting different muscles groups to workout.

BlackDragon0311
09-20-2008, 21:02
ok, so two days on in starting cross fit, taking the above mentioned advice by doing cross fit from the WOD site and also from the other site, and gotta say it smoke checked my ass, back is still killing me from todays alone, infact I honestly couldn't completley finish todays total exercises cause, well quite honestly despite being in pretty damn good shape, it wrung my ass out good! i'll most definatly be keeping up with all of it as I can see over the course of time i'm really gonna start to benefit in both strength and stamina! thanks all!

~JohnnyBoy

MeC86
09-20-2008, 22:44
First time doing the Filthy Fifties will do that to anyone. Its a bear of a workout. Keep going, it only gets better.

TOMAHAWK9521
09-21-2008, 01:12
Gents,

I'm currently assigned to the WTU at Carson due to culmination of wear and tear on the knees after coming back from Iraq. Much to my chagrin, I have to look at new ways to get back in shape and such, all the while not aggravating the knees. My core training isn't what it used to be, what with not being able to run and being isolated to a bike or really light sissy weights on the machines. I confess that I haven't really looked at Crossfit, although I know many guys who do it. My biggest worries have been the knees. As I'm sure most of you all have endured similar joint problems, does this system really work for guys with knees made of broken glass? I have nothing but time on my hands to train/rehab and the sooner I get back online and out of the WTU the better.

Surgicalcric
09-21-2008, 02:33
Tomahawk:

The thing about Crossfit is many (most) of the exercises are full body. If you only worked the upper body you really arent getting the benefit of it being Crossfit over you just doing body-part specific routines (shoulders day, chest day, back day, etc). My advice, if your knees prohibit you from squatting, dead-lifting and such, would be to continue working your upper 1/2 including abs and thus increasing your strength and endurance while your knees are healing/being rehab'd. After that you can go into full body/complex muscle group workouts.

I jumped back into doing Crossfit while trying to rehab my shoulder and it set me back about 4 months, 4 painful months. Jumping the gun is only going to prolong your rehab as well.

Crip

frostfire
09-21-2008, 14:57
Gents,



I'm currently assigned to the WTU at Carson due to culmination of wear and tear on the knees after coming back from Iraq. Much to my chagrin, I have to look at new ways to get back in shape and such, all the while not aggravating the knees. My core training isn't what it used to be, what with not being able to run and being isolated to a bike or really light sissy weights on the machines. I confess that I haven't really looked at Crossfit, although I know many guys who do it. My biggest worries have been the knees. As I'm sure most of you all have endured similar joint problems, does this system really work for guys with knees made of broken glass? I have nothing but time on my hands to train/rehab and the sooner I get back online and out of the WTU the better.

TOMAHAWK9521:
During my lifeguard job, I observed injured athletes (torn ACL, ankle sprain etc.) switched to pool exercises to maintain shape (cardio, joint movement, & muscle memory) under the athletic trainer supervision. This may already be part of your rehab, but if not, get an aqua jogger belt and hit the pool. The movement is the same as that on the elliptical machine. That and exercises to engage rectus abdominus, transverse abdominus, obliques, and erector spinae. There are plenty of variations on youtube to prevent boredom. Best wishes for a speedy recovery.

BlackDragon0311,

Yep, crossfit is such a smoker that on WOD such as fight gone bad and GI Jane, I would only concentrate on not quitting, and not so much on competing with others time. Strangely, I've done well this way (top 2 or 3).

msgec
09-21-2008, 19:30
.

pheepster
09-21-2008, 21:33
I've been interested in getting into Cross-Fit for a while now and plan on starting tomorrow. I get the drift that it's fine to do the WOD along with other exercises as long as it's not too much or too similar. For example, tomorrow's WOD is:

"Isabel"

For time:
Snatch 135 pounds, 30 reps

Use 95 pounds, 65 pounds or broomstick as needed and post time and load to comments.

Though I'm sure it will be difficult, it is a shorter WOD than some of the others. Any advice on merging this into my existing workout?

thanks.

TheShootist
09-21-2008, 22:14
The beauty of crossfit is the scalability of the workouts. I've seen some folks that were very fit that let their machismo get in the way of their common sense when first starting out and put themselves in a lot of pain. Consider scaling things back a bit at the start and ramping it up over the first month. So unless you're in great shape currently with a good snatch technique, I'd suggest going with something in 65-95lb range. Generally in the comments posted to the WOD there will be numerous suggestions on scaling the workout back a bit.
Also, not to pimp the crossfit gyms, but the instruction and motivation that you will receive there will be much more productive than just starting out on your own- read better results and much sooner.

TOMAHAWK9521
09-21-2008, 22:16
Thanks for the advice, gents. The CrossFit "whole body" thing is what caused me to delay doing it. I knew my knees wouldn't make it at this stage. However, I look forward to the day when my knees are strong enough to handle it.

For right now, I will continue with my scheduled regimen as suggested. As for the aqua running, I've had guys who can still run (those bastages!) telling me about doing that as a substitute for the real thing. My first session will be tomorrow. As usual I'll feel like a polio victim out there when I first start.

Thank you again for the input.

BlackDragon0311
09-22-2008, 05:50
i'm really starting to get into the whole body thing that cross fit gives you, but it feels a bit lacking sometimes. today's WOD, the snatch for 30 res, I mean it seems good in conjunction with more, but just one workout seems detrimental to the progress i've made with weights and interval cardio...should I combine the WOD with some more exercises, or just go along with the site and go along with the one workout along with what I get from crossfit endurance?

~JohnnyBoy

MILON
09-22-2008, 09:02
Blackdragon0311,

I think if the WOD is a bit lacking you should add to it. Especially since you already have a endurance and strength base to work off of. I am not sure what methods you have been using, but the full body lifts Crossfit employs are a must for athletes. I dont buy into the non-isolation mentality Crossfit seems to have, so I would add those in as supplementary lifts at the end. This is what we do with our athletes and its worked very well.

With this being said, I would also consider how hard you want to work for that day. Most programs I draw contain download weeks where the intensity is lower. If you are in a time frame where recovery is more your focus, than a lower intensity may be what you need.

Questions for the Crossfitters: How does the Crossfit program account for recovery of its athletes? I have read the foundations brochure, but didnt find much detail on it. As mentioned above I usually implement a download week for my athletes. For example, we increase intensity for weeks 1-3 and on week 4 reduce it to promote more recovery and get a training effect.

Surgicalcric
09-22-2008, 09:18
...How does the Crossfit program account for recovery of its athletes?

I dont know how CF does it, never really cared to find out. I know my body and listen to what its telling me. Since I do both CF and isolation I generally will lift for 2 months and take a week off unless my body tells me something different...

Works for me, however YRMV.

Crip

BlackDragon0311
09-22-2008, 09:34
well what I THINK i'm gonna try and do, is keep most of my normal routine down as is, gonna keep going with the interval-cardio training every other day, continue to focus on isolation, but add in a good cross fit towards the end, or do something like the WOD, and add in atleast one isolation lifting exercise per muscle group at the end, that sound like a good way to take it?

~JohnnyBoy

MILON
09-22-2008, 10:16
Blackdragon0311,

From my perspective you have the right idea, except where the order comes in to play. Full body/compound movements (ie. clean, snatch, bench, squat, deadlift, etc) should "always" be performed at the beginning of the session. I put always in quotations because no one is going to arrest you for doing otherwise. However, these exercises give you the most bang for your buck, meaning you want to be at your full potential for them. If you place them at the end when your energy stores are depleted, they are not as effective. Does this make sense?

BlackDragon0311
09-22-2008, 11:04
I get what you say. Just got back from the gym, what I did was three sets of one exercise per muscle group (today it was arms and shoulders), then a full 15 minutes of cross fit (3 pull ups, 6 push ups, 12 squats) exercises. Thinking what i'll do is one day i'll do atleast one exercise per muscle group and then a quick cross fit exercise, the next day do my interval cardio, wait a few hours, then go with another cross fit. Am I reading you right in that I should do it the opposite way, start with my cross fit and then go for isolation? Or am I just whistling dixie outa my ass? lol!

~JohnnyBoy

Surgicalcric
09-22-2008, 11:25
Compound movements are those requiring more than one muscle group (ie: squat, deadlift, cleans, snatch, bench, bent-over rows, military press.) They are also the ones where acceleration thru the movement is most important. These should be done first in a routine since they will tax your system the most. Exercises such as leg extensions, leg curls, bidep curls, tricep extensions, shrugs, rack pulls, calf raises, deltoid raises, etc are focusing on / isolating one muscle group at a time and are generally performed after the large groups are fatigued or scheduled for another day as is the case for arm work.

There are exceptions to this but thats a another discussion altogether.

HTH,

Crip

msgec
09-22-2008, 11:43
.

MILON
09-22-2008, 12:08
You are understanding me correctly Blackdragon and Crip's post explains the concept exactly. Also, as he mentioned there are always exceptions, but this is a basic concept that is beneficial to understand.

I think msgec has the right idea as well. If increasing max strength is your goal, then a near max sets should be done first. It goes back to being at your highest potential (ie. not fatigued). Sounds like hell of a routine msgec! It is amazing how much genetics come into play as well though. Many top end athletes fell out of bed more athletic than the majority and really dont have to work as hard as the rest to make it to the top. Its just not fair, is it? :lifter

Blitzzz (RIP)
09-22-2008, 18:00
While I love the fact you guys are trying to be the best you can physically. You need to know that EVERY system of exercise out there is the same. They try different ways of doing the same thing. The results are the same as the others within certain degrees. It's like grading horse shit it's all the same. The blitz system is totally different.
I am suggesting that you all do the Blitz system workout. You will be stronger than you can believe and with unheard of muscle endurance You can down load a copy from this site . Just ask Dan how. He set it up so you guys could use it. It is a completely out-0f-the -box system of exercise that will double your endurance and give you a minimum of 20% strength over your life time best. As unlikely as it sounds it has worked with these results of over 15 years. No pain, no tendonitis or strains. no ligament tears or cartilege breakdown.. you exercise at a very fast speed and will totally fatigue but no pain. It also stays with you longer than other systems which is why I am trying to get it into 5th group as a full fitness system. Individualized power. Dave (Blitz)

moeasy
09-22-2008, 20:22
Blackdragon0311,



Questions for the Crossfitters: How does the Crossfit program account for recovery of its athletes? I have read the foundations brochure, but didnt find much detail on it. As mentioned above I usually implement a download week for my athletes. For example, we increase intensity for weeks 1-3 and on week 4 reduce it to promote more recovery and get a training effect.

Matt,

The Crossfit program accounts for recovery in two ways. The first is the rest day after 3 work days, and the second is by varying the workout to tax different muscle groups and energy systems in the body. Ex. You will not be running long distances on consecutive days using only endurance or aerobic metabolism.

MILON
09-23-2008, 14:09
Blitzz,

I downloaded the program, read through it, and I think its a great program for improving strength and work capacity. I have used this same method in my own training and, to a similar degree, with some of my athletes. However, I have to say I disagree with a couple of your statements.

Every system of exercise out there is definately NOT the same. The Blitz System is designed to increase work capacity by focusing on a density (amt. of work/unit of time) progression. You can focus program in a number of different ways and still achieve similar result. Like I mentioned before though, Blitz works great and kicks your ass, BUT if you want to concentrate on max strength, its not the best option. So, I would use a different system to accomplish different goals is what I am saying.

I dont believe there is no pain involved with this program either. Pain is subjective. No injuries, I do believe with a grain of salt. When you only work at 33% of your 1RM the likelyhood of injury is VERY low and lower if you performing basic excercises.

Overall, I believe the Blitz method would be a great tool in anyone's program. Especially if increasing work capacity is the desired result. But, I would simply consider it another tool in my tool box. If you can get it going with the 5th group or anyone I'd be willing to be you'd have a lot of success with it.

Moeasy,

Thanks for the reply. That answers my question.

Blitzzz (RIP)
09-25-2008, 13:05
I apreciate your background in exercise, but yourhave never used a system like this one there are some simular to it but none that produce like this one. You would have to see it to believe it. I will tell you that you can use any other system for as long as it takes to get as strong as you can, and when you are through, I can run you throough 6 weeks of blitz and you WILL be over 20% stronger and with doubled the endurance. This is something I have witnessed for over 16 years of it. It does not matter what other system you use. This system will add the results I claim. It is that scary. There is no pain. There are no injuries. The results have been consistant for everyone who has ever used it. This inncludes Post-surgical rehab of shoulders and Knees.

I respect you comments but you speak from a position of never having Blitzed. I would challenge anyone in any condition to try it and I will guarantee the results I have claimed. Respectfully, Dave

MILON
09-25-2008, 18:10
Dave,

You are correct, I have never Blitzed, BUT I have a good understanding of the method used and the adaptation that comes along with the program. This is why I agree it is a very effective program. I suppose you can say my opinions are based on assumptions, to a degree, but they are certainly not hollow. I have actually planned to work the Blitzed method into my personal program later on in my plan. I'll be sure to keep you informed on how it goes. :D


I think its VERY important to know the why behind methods used. Blitzed is based off of Escalating Density Training (EDT) and if readers are interested, I suggest looking it up. The human body is an amazing thing! It adapts to any stress we put on it and then it plateus until we change that stress. This is why I would work Blitz into my overall training plan and not depend only on Blitz. The body needs the change to continue to be challenged.

V/R

Matt

Teacher
09-26-2008, 08:06
Thought this was interesting from the CFE site in the FAQs section.

I am in the military and I need to ruck/run in boots/carry logs long distances should I do this in addition to the running?

No the same principles apply. Go short, and go hard. Learn technique, then do it fast, then you can do it long. Rucking marching long distances has more to do with muscular endurance than with cardiovascular fitness. Muscular endurance can be trained more efficiently by Crossfit than by walking for miles.

Look for an additional military oriented workout per week.

Surgicalcric
09-26-2008, 08:25
...Rucking marching long distances has more to do with muscular endurance than with cardiovascular fitness. Muscular endurance can be trained more efficiently by Crossfit than by walking for miles...

In simplistic terms yes. However, rucking is as much about getting used to having in on your back as it is about the walking itself and the only way to condition your body (back, feet, shoulders, & legs) to the pain brought on by the ruck is to do it for many miles.

I assure you whoever made that statement has never worn the "Tick" for hours on end in a tactical setting. While CF is a good overall program it is not the answer for everything as they would have people believe...

Crip

abc_123
09-26-2008, 13:25
In simplistic terms yes. However, rucking is as much about getting used to having in on your back as it is about the walking itself and the only way to condition your body (back, feet, shoulders, & legs) to the pain brought on by the ruck is to do it for many miles.

I assure you whoever made that statement has never worn the "Tick" for hours on end in a tactical setting. While CF is a good overall program it is not the answer for everything as they would have people believe...

Crip

One needs to have a sport-specific component to the overall fitness program if the goal is to truly excel at the specific sport.

CF and other similar programs are a great way to improve general fitness and increase one capacity for work... however, it won't break in your boots, put callouses in you back where your web gear and canteens rub, toughen your feet,or as Crip said, get your mind accustomed to the numbing pain that is unique to carrying the tick for miles.

If it were me, I'd still plan on doing some rucking.

MILON
09-26-2008, 14:05
The BEST way to get better at rucking, is to RUCK!

The BEST way to get better at football, is to play FOOTBALL!

The BEST way to get better at basketball, is to play BASKETBALL!

Do I need to continue????

Razor
09-26-2008, 14:10
Rucking marching long distances has more to do with muscular endurance than with cardiovascular fitness.

Spoken by someone that has never carried the tick up the side of a heavily wooded mountain.

Blitzzz (RIP)
09-26-2008, 15:04
Fitness is a necessity for doing the many things we are required to do but as the voices of experience say. you gotta ruck. In true ZEN fashion you and the tick are one. not for the twelve milers but for the months on end. Long term endurance really doesn't have a play in ruck world. It is a Mind set to take the next step after a very long day under the tick.

Curse it as we all have, it is still our life support, our house, our food, his commo gear, my demo gear, our wardrobe, our ammo and water. That's not to mention the comfort items like a bag of lemon drops to be shared with the team a couple of weeks out as a special. But then I digress. Put it on and live with it. It will become a part of you. Don't think ruck marches, think ruck journey. Up and down mountains, across deserts, through jungles. All of these add a different dimension to "rucking". Enjoy Dave

MILON
09-26-2008, 15:12
Since the topic was brought up. Lets set aside the obvious mental toughness one must have to ruck long distances. Is it more muscular endurance, cardiovascular fitness, muscular strength, a combination of all that come into play during the journey, etc.? I know if I did a search for ruck training there would be plenty of information to find, so I wont ask about that.

Matt

Surgicalcric
09-26-2008, 16:43
...Is it more muscular endurance, cardiovascular fitness, muscular strength, a combination of all that come into play during the journey, etc.?

Was the answers given above not enough for you Matt?

It is combination when broken down to just the physical part of it. However I, as I and others did earlier, submit that it cannot be simply broken down to its physical part(s) unless you are talking short distances, and even then I would argue there is more to it when discussing its tactical application.

As Dave said, a ruck is OUR home for the time we are in the field, whatever/wherever that may be. Rucking on a hardball road is very different than moving tactically across a variety of terrains. The muscles used to cross streams, duck under low branches, weave thru vines, etc arent generally worked in a standard ruck march. A soldier's mind must be in the game to function under such circumstances and to program your mind to do so, time and mileage must be put on your body. I am not talking about a couple hours; I am talking day in and day out on hardball roads, sand (as found at CMK), on hills, thru water, etc. I have seen guys who could run 9 minute/miles with a ruck but couldn't keep up with the patrol because they were constantly shifting or stopping to adjust the weight, on just didnt have mentally what it takes to stay with it in the long haul. Rucking is a great way to separate those with a strong body from those with a strong mind who have properly prepared their body.

If you want to break it down to its purest form (with training in mind), put the damn thing on your back with 55lbs in it and walk, walk until you cant put one foot in front of the other (working up to this goal of course), on a variety of terrains. You will meet both the physical and mental aspects of the task for which you are training.

When it comes to rucking there is but one standard and neither CF or any of the other fad workouts will get you anywhere near it.

BTW, this topic has been covered many times.


Crip

MILON
09-26-2008, 18:49
Crip,

I appreciate your time and answer, as it really layed out the bottom line. No more time needed for me on this one.

Matt

Teacher
09-26-2008, 21:12
Surgicalcric, abc 123, Razor, Blitzzz, thank you for your responses. When looking over the CFE site for the first time I thought that statement about rucking would raise a few QPs' experienced eyebrows. It seemed to fly in the face of everything that has been covered on this topic.

BlackDragon0311
09-29-2008, 10:32
ok, figure i've got a good routine set up, just want some input from those who know best in regards to cross fit....

Day 1: Weights, arms and shoulders.
Day 2: Cross fit, twice a day.
Day 3: Weights, chest and back and abs.
Day 4: Cross Fit, twice a day.
Day 5: Weights, Legs.
Day 6: Cross Fit, twice a day.
Day 7: Rest.

Only just started this routine this week, gonna see how it shapes up, any input is as always appreciated.

~JohnnyBoy

Razor
09-29-2008, 14:05
Since most of the CF workouts involve linked movements of large muscle groups throughout the body, when are you allowing your body to rest and recover following your resistance days besides Day 7? Personally, I don't find one day a week of rest to be enough if you're training hard. Who knows--maybe this is a good workout for you. Run it for 3-4 months; if you start to plateau on your gains after the second month and you find yourself getting little injuries that don't heal as quickly as you'd expect, you may want to rethink your work/rest ratio.

GTRich
09-29-2008, 17:59
ok, figure i've got a good routine set up, just want some input from those who know best in regards to cross fit....

Day 1: Weights, arms and shoulders.
Day 2: Cross fit, twice a day.
Day 3: Weights, chest and back and abs.
Day 4: Cross Fit, twice a day.
Day 5: Weights, Legs.
Day 6: Cross Fit, twice a day.
Day 7: Rest.


You might be able to handle this routine. In my case, my body would not be able to adequately recover from day-to-day. When you say "Crossfit," do you mean one of the workouts posted on the main site? If you do, most people who do the program do one of the workouts per day AND rest every fourth day. Crossfit workouts of the day (WODs) are almost invariably total body workouts, so traditional weight-training bodybuilding splits may not blend quite so well with the WOD.

Personally, I find myself able to run three to four days per week in the AM, sometimes with some calisthenics. In the PM, four to five days per week, I a couple compound and/or Olympic lifts to work strength and then do a Crossfit WOD. I like a 5 on/2 off split myself, and then I rest -completely- for the weekend. If you read earlier in this thread, Prester John and Surgicalcric do slightly different splits with frequent rest days, though all of our goals are probably different.

If you can stick with your program at high intensity for a few weeks and it hasn't adversely affected your performance, sleep, general well-being then more power to you, but I would caution you to start a little smaller and work your way up to a program like that to avoid burning out.

Best of luck.

Blitzzz (RIP)
09-30-2008, 09:18
A big study by a bunch of PHD's for the Nautilus folks stated that after a muscle fatiguing workout the ole bod requires 48 to 92 hours to rebuild muscle. 48 to 92 hours is based on each individual's metabolism and physical condition. For you young healthy guys it's more likely 48 hours, for me it's more like a month.:D Blitz

I will always recommend the "blitz" system over any thing else out there.

frostfire
10-06-2008, 20:50
Blitzed is based off of Escalating Density Training (EDT) and if readers are interested, I suggest looking it up. The human body is an amazing thing! It adapts to any stress we put on it and then it plateus until we change that stress.

I'll be darn. I've never heard of EDT before. Read about it and the assumptions seems to be around the theory that during your initial first few rep you're exerting much greater force than the resistance used. Hence, by lower reps and not repeating to failure, you keep the muscles trained at that higher level. Doesn't matter. I've been giving it a shot for the last few days. Maybe to early to jump into conclusion, but I do notice increase in performance (reps and resistances). Dunno, maybe it's the food I ate (which is inconsistent), the Rammstein music? Well, I'll keep it up for a few more weeks and we'll see. I also found that it's a very safe method to get back to exercise and high level of resistance that haven't been done in a while. Feel like a wuss for abandoning crossfit, and replacing it with EDT though :D

I found equipment to be the obstacle in doing the Blitz system. Need to find gym with those bowflex type machines.

calstyleee
10-07-2008, 12:10
I text message Cha-Cha (242-242) and ask them what the WOD is. Cha-Cha is a company that answers any question from text. Its free as long as you dont go over your allotted text message usage. This way i get the WOD anywhere I am.

Surgicalcric
10-07-2008, 15:45
I text message Cha-Cha (242-242) and ask them what the WOD is. Cha-Cha is a company that answers any question from text. Its free as long as you dont go over your allotted text message usage. This way i get the WOD anywhere I am.

I think I have heard everything now with the texting to find out what workout to do...

You guys are getting entirely too wrapped around the axle with this CF/Gym Jones stuff. Do you need so much supervision in your workouts that you cant do it without someone else telling you what to do? I am all for regimented routines, but you guys are taking it a bit far. Just freaking do something for God's sake.

Crip

MILON
10-07-2008, 17:52
Frostfire,

If you are having trouble finding a gym, try the website listed below. It has a variety of exercises and videos showing how to perform each. I dont believe there are many machine exercises, but they make good use of free weights, swiss balls, bands, chains, and medicine balls. Might give you some further ideas for your program. Glad its going well.

www.xlathlete.com

Matt

If for some reason the web address doesnt work, you should be able to find it with a google search.

Blitzzz (RIP)
12-18-2008, 20:28
Milon has much knowledge of exercise and conditioning. I have discussed this with many Exercise physiologist, ATCs, PTs etc, who have all the same qualifications. I will say for those of you seeking some advice, the "Blitz" system is NOT based on HDT or anything else you can think of. Totally different. Blitzzz

ZooKeeper
12-21-2008, 10:45
Milon has much knowledge of exercise and conditioning. I have discussed this with many Exercise physiologist, ATCs, PTs etc, who have all the same qualifications. I will say for those of you seeking some advice, the "Blitz" system is NOT based on HDT or anything else you can think of. Totally different. Blitzzz

I've looked at the Blitz system & like what I see for the most part. The only problem I see with it is that it doesn't list any or certain exercises to perform or even categorized exercises. Someone new to working out could pick the wrong exercises, perform the system perfectly and miss certain muscle groups that would need worked.

Basically seems like a good system for people who have a good understanding of working out/muscle groups needing worked but not for someone new & on their own.

Let me know if I'm missing something or there is more information that I haven't read (I've only seen the 'Blitz Power Workout.pdf') or you have a list of suggested exercises.

Blitzzz (RIP)
12-22-2008, 22:00
PM sent. Blitzzz

Calvengeance
01-13-2009, 22:55
I don't know of any reg Army units who do PT/Crossfit twice a day here on Bragg, but I know of quite a few SF candidates who do Crossfit twice a day and one in particular :D who does body-part specific exercises in the AM and Crossfit at night. Scheduling workouts so they don't overlap takes some thought but working myself to the point of vomiting is always a great feeling.

3 days on, 1 day off is my schedule as well as taking a 3 day break every third week. Running is done at night as part of my evening workouts, mostly sprint workouts (400M repeats, ladders, fartlek, etc). I save my long runs for Sundays, 7 miler.

Crip

Fartleks are something else. Griffs, too. I never would have though running backwards for a quarter of a mile at a time would do anything for me, but it put the lactic acid where it needed to go.