View Full Version : 18F Course
Anyone on the list have a GOOD POC number for the 18F committee. I have a few questions since I'll be headed out there next week for the next class.
Warrior-Mentor
01-02-2006, 23:05
(910)396-xxxx/xxxx
The Reaper
01-02-2006, 23:09
(910)396-XXXX
Please PM that number or move it to a restricted area.
I am sure that they do not want to hear from the 235 yahoos from here who will call and ask them what badge is awarded for the course, and if they can go prior to the SFQC.
TR
RangerRick
01-23-2006, 19:40
As of today there will be no more Echo's or Delta's able to attend the Fox course. As per DA
RR
Did not know about this. Please post the message.
RangerRick
01-23-2006, 20:36
In the course now and they put it out at formation. I will look and see if there is any offical write up. AS for the length of E and D I don't know for how long they will not be able to attend.
RR
Surgicalcric
01-23-2006, 20:43
In other news, there were 8 E-6's chosen this past week from Student Co to start the Fox course. These are guys with no other 18 series MOS; straight from PH-II to the Fox course. The only details I have are those chosen have 5+ years Infantry and atleast one combat tour.
Crip
NousDefionsDoc
01-23-2006, 21:04
I wouldn't get all knotted up about it, we've survived worse.
The Reaper
01-23-2006, 21:29
In other news, there were 8 E-6's chosen this past week from Student Co to start the Fox course. These are guys with no other 18 series MOS; straight from PH-II to the Fox course. The only details I have are those chosen have 5+ years Infantry and atleast one combat tour.
Crip
I am sure that they do not want to hear from the 235 yahoos from here who will call and ask them what badge is awarded for the course, and if they can go prior to the SFQC.
TR
See, I told you!
TR
Eagle5US
01-23-2006, 21:44
As of today there will be no more Echo's or Delta's able to attend the Fox course. As per DA
RR
Well looky there...I be among the "special folks" now :D
Eagle
Yeah they told us yesterday in [the 18F class] formation.
Originally Posted by The Reaper
I am sure that they do not want to hear from the 235 yahoos from here who will call and ask them what badge is awarded for the course, and if they can go prior to the SFQC.
TR
AND I found out I don't get a "FOX" tab! ;) Oh the humanity!!!
Surgicalcric
01-24-2006, 21:20
In other news, there were 8 E-6's chosen this past week from Student Co to start the Fox course. These are guys with no other 18 series MOS; straight from PH-II to the Fox course. The only details I have are those chosen have 5+ years Infantry and atleast one combat tour.
Crip
I am sure that they do not want to hear from the 235 yahoos from here who will call and ask them what badge is awarded for the course, and if they can go prior to the SFQC.
TR
See, I told you!
TR
Sir thats one of the enlisted MOS's I care nothing for...atleast at this time... I am too busy trying to get in and finish the Delta course. I am a medic and a medic I shall be.
Crip
NousDefionsDoc
01-24-2006, 21:28
Atta Boy Crip!:lifter
Eagle5US
01-24-2006, 22:05
That's our boy Paaaw!
wiping a single tear from my cheek
Eagle
That's our boy Paaaw!
wiping a single tear from my cheekyou guys need to get out more...
The 18F portion of SF training has evolved over the years.
The main point of it is many can go to the school and hold an 18F MOS but few are "real" 18Fs. A good 18F has a "feel" for things more like a good police detective. The ability to direct the intelligence cycle and make sense of it is an art form. HUMINT is not something you say, it's an even higher art form.
As for 18Ds and 18Es? Well, I see nothing has changed in 25 years. I expressed my views to a few CSMs over the years and the replies were not what I wanted to hear.
Pete
LongWire
01-25-2006, 08:35
The 18F portion of SF training has evolved over the years.
The main point of it is many can go to the school and hold an 18F MOS but few are "real" 18Fs. A good 18F has a "feel" for things more like a good police detective. The ability to direct the intelligence cycle and make sense of it is an art form. HUMINT is not something you say, it's an even higher art form.
As for 18Ds and 18Es? Well, I see nothing has changed in 25 years. I expressed my views to a few CSMs over the years and the replies were not what I wanted to hear.
Pete
Yeah I really dont know where the logic comes from..............
Times are a changing and all, but I still know a lot of hold outs on the Computer side of the house. Alot of guys still have no skills and dont want any either. If you dont care to have any computer skills then maybe you shouldnt be going to the F course.
At the same time, most Echo's and Delta's have a substantial computer base to build upon. Not only that, but they tend to be more inclined to the Fox side of the house to boot.
Also I have no idea who got the impression that once you are switched to the Fox MOS that you automatically cant do your previous job. Seems to be a trend, I've seen quite a few 18F/ 18Z that seem to forget that they also have a previous skill set.........not trying to flame on anyone in particular, just passing along what I've seen!!!!!!!!!!!!
Eagle5US
01-25-2006, 09:51
OK...I realize I went to O&I a little while ago-uhhhh...maybe a long while ago (but not REALLY long) ....but we weren't authorized computers.
Everything we did...E V E R Y painful handwritten piece of paper in our 100+ page packages had to be handwritten in block letters. All of our order of battle stuff was book bound and based.
You guys are really making me feel old:boohoo
Eagle
LongWire
01-27-2006, 03:29
OK...I realize I went to O&I a little while ago-uhhhh...maybe a long while ago (but not REALLY long) ....but we weren't authorized computers.
Everything we did...E V E R Y painful handwritten piece of paper in our 100+ page packages had to be handwritten in block letters. All of our order of battle stuff was book bound and based.
You guys are really making me feel old:boohoo
Eagle
Dont feel bad......it was the same way when I went through 3 yrs ago, But understand that this is the New Fox Course now, being run seperate from ANCOC again.............
Even if they were doing all the stuff by hand, you get back to group and eveything is automated again, so it wouldnt really help that much, other than if your shit crashed!!!!!!!!!!!!!
magician
01-28-2006, 02:40
I suppose the part that disturbs me most about this decision is the profound ignorance that it displays of the role played by 18D's when deployed.
There is no faster, more efficient way to make friends than to treat their children.
And that is all that I will say about that.
Eagle5US
01-28-2006, 11:48
I suppose the part that disturbs me most about this decision is the profound ignorance that it displays of the role played by 18D's when deployed.
There is no faster, more efficient way to make friends than to treat their children.
And that is all that I will say about that.
That's a good point there Stevo-but you know what that means now...
18F=NURSE:p
Eagle
NousDefionsDoc
01-28-2006, 15:12
They've done this before, maybe not quite so publically. Tells me they're short the two MOS in a bad way. It won't last.
LongWire
01-29-2006, 08:43
They've done this before, maybe not quite so publically. Tells me they're short the two MOS in a bad way. It won't last.
They are Always short of these 2............I really dont understand the disconnect, It seems as though we are always needing these 2 MOS's.
NousDefionsDoc
01-29-2006, 08:48
They are Always short of these 2............I really dont understand the disconnect, It seems as though we are always needing these 2 MOS's.
I don't understand the Echo thing either, not really much to it from what I can see...:p
As for the Medics, well, it's hard to find diamonds in the rough that will eventually produce shining perfection.:lifter
LongWire
01-29-2006, 09:18
I don't understand the Echo thing either, not really much to it from what I can see...:p
As for the Medics, well, it's hard to find diamonds in the rough that will eventually produce shining perfection.:lifter
Your in a Mood Today Huh???????:p
NousDefionsDoc
01-29-2006, 09:29
LOL - not at all. Just happy to be here...;)
Eagle5US
01-29-2006, 10:27
Honestly though...since they did away with AMIC...hasn't the pass rate increased???
Eagle
NousDefionsDoc
01-29-2006, 10:31
Honestly though...since they did away with AMIC...hasn't the pass rate increased???
Eagle
Uh oh....:munchin
I was poking the TS a little with a sharp pointy stick. I didn't think anyone would actually be silly enough to come along and pour rock salt on the wound...LOL
Actually, my guess would be no, indicator being they won't let them go to the Fox course.
The Reaper
01-29-2006, 11:02
Honestly though...since they did away with AMIC...hasn't the pass rate increased???
Eagle
Well, the attrition rate for those failing AIMC has certainly decreased.
TR
Eagle5US
01-29-2006, 11:10
Well, the attrition rate for those failing AIMC has certainly decreased.
TR
:D
Thank you for clearing that up TR. Ahhhh...I can now rest easy.
Eagle
uboat509
02-13-2006, 03:41
When I went through the course last summer the head instructor came in and told the Echos to maintain a low profile because someone in the SWCS chain of command was looking to pull them out of the course. It never happened but I am not suprised that they have changed it now.
SFC W
In other news, there were 8 E-6's chosen this past week from Student Co to start the Fox course. These are guys with no other 18 series MOS; straight from PH-II to the Fox course. The only details I have are those chosen have 5+ years Infantry and atleast one combat tour.
Crip
Surgical -
Not True on the 8-E6's Students in the 18F Course that are not 18 Series!!!
Listen to what is written.. 8 Drop outs or students in the SFQC that are awaiting training, lets see, maybe their Phase 3 block. NOT!
Then they are going to the SF intelligence Sergeant Course without being 18 Series Qual?? NOT!!
Does that Student Company OT Pool rumor really sound that sound?? NOT!!!!!!
There is a thing called prerequisites.. This Committee fights to have seasoned SF NCO’s attend this course with team time. Because of how much "stuff" these NCO are and will be doing on a SFODA. Some NCO from the line really wouldn't know what to do. Look maybe an INTEL guy (96B/N??) but even that NCO really wouldn't know what we SF guys are looking for. Its not all about IPB we deal with people.
Try this ............... they were on a Detail to guard documents or radios for a month(s) because they are drops from the SFQC.
Surgicalcric
03-01-2006, 06:00
MtnGoat:
PM inbound.
Crip
Whatever
03-02-2006, 01:52
The prohibition on 18Es is cyclic and will be fixed in time by the brothers running SFQC.
The shortage of 18Ds in the force is more difficult. Anyone that would voluntarily stick his fingers up anothers man's butt and root around is not normal - we had a P.A. here (former 18D) that had a rubber arm and had this "joke"
During the Digital Rectal portion of the Physical Exam he would first put the rubber arm on your left shoulder, use his "real" left hand to take care of business and then put his right hand on your right shoulder. Having a hand on each shoulder and another mystery appendage stuck up your fourth point of contact was a bad thing.
Of course this never happened to me personally.
Eagle5US
03-02-2006, 08:52
The prohibition on 18Es is cyclic and will be fixed in time by the brothers running SFQC.
The shortage of 18Ds in the force is more difficult. Anyone that would voluntarily stick his fingers up anothers man's butt and root around is not normal - we had a P.A. here (former 18D) that had a rubber arm and had this "joke"
During the Digital Rectal portion of the Physical Exam he would first put the rubber arm on your left shoulder, use his "real" left hand to take care of business and then put his right hand on your right shoulder. Having a hand on each shoulder and another mystery appendage stuck up your fourth point of contact was a bad thing.
Of course this never happened to me personally.
EVERY 18D/PA worth his salt has a rubber arm laying around ;)
Eagle
Whatever
03-03-2006, 01:07
Roger that Sir.
I notice that your Avatar has big-ass fingers. Because art ususally imitates life there is no way I will ever get a Physical Exam at Lewis.
I bet when you're done with the prostate check all the guy wants is a cigarette and some smooth music.:eek:
The Reaper
03-03-2006, 08:31
The prohibition on 18Es is cyclic and will be fixed in time by the brothers running SFQC.
The shortage of 18Ds in the force is more difficult. Anyone that would voluntarily stick his fingers up anothers man's butt and root around is not normal - we had a P.A. here (former 18D) that had a rubber arm and had this "joke"
During the Digital Rectal portion of the Physical Exam he would first put the rubber arm on your left shoulder, use his "real" left hand to take care of business and then put his right hand on your right shoulder. Having a hand on each shoulder and another mystery appendage stuck up your fourth point of contact was a bad thing.
Of course this never happened to me personally.
Of course it didn't.:rolleyes:
TR
Let me get this straight. I'm over here in this sand box. No one on my team stepped up to take over the Ops & Intel (18F) piece except me and my Delta. We're working this shit soup to nuts (edited out by admin) making good progress... and neither one of us can go to the Fox course after this? You can't dream of a harder place to OJT this shit than the part of Iraq we're in right now. I hope they unscrew this before I get home. Had I known this, I would have sat in the radio room making coms. Well, probably not. I still would have done this job because the the team needed it but, this news does put a damper on plans when I get home though.:mad:
magician
03-29-2006, 05:34
Never worry like that.
You have got to have faith that the Big Ranger will find a way, and believe me, He will.
It will fall into place for you.
Let me get this straight. I'm over here in this sand box. No one on my team stepped up to take over the Ops & Intel (18F) piece except me and my Delta. We're working this shit soup to nuts (edited out by admin) making good progress... and neither one of us can go to the Fox course after this? You can't dream of a harder place to OJT this shit than the part of Iraq we're in right now. I hope they unscrew this before I get home. Had I known this, I would have sat in the radio room making coms. Well, probably not. I still would have done this job because the the team needed it but, this news does put a damper on plans when I get home though.:mad:
abnremf,
Yes its ture for now. DA put the stop to the MOS change over for 18E/D's. I could see 18Es going to the course sooner than an 18D. But the 18D will be for sometime. Force numbers.
Never worry like that.
You have got to have faith that the Big Ranger will find a way, and believe me, He will.
It will fall into place for you. :
A Good Ranger will always find a way!! Time wil work this out.
VG
Let me get this straight. I'm over here in this sand box. No one on my team stepped up to take over the Ops & Intel (18F) piece except me and my Delta. We're working this shit soup to nuts (edited out by admin) making good progress... and neither one of us can go to the Fox course after this? You can't dream of a harder place to OJT this shit than the part of Iraq we're in right now. I hope they unscrew this before I get home. Had I known this, I would have sat in the radio room making coms. Well, probably not. I still would have done this job because the the team needed it but, this news does put a damper on plans when I get home though.:mad:
What's up!!!!,
Hey you need to talk to JN. We just sent 4 guys.....3 18D, 1 18E, and 1 18C to the F course in the last 9 months. JN, stated that policy only applies to AD and not NG. Oh yeah, JN was the last guy to go. Our company along with bn has so many slots it's not even funny.
Stay safe out there!!!!!
We just sent 4 guys.....3 18D, 1 18E, and 1 18C...
P=Plenty 18C math, I see. :D
magician
04-02-2006, 02:52
I have to say....I am far from plugged into current events at the Schoolhouse, but I just cannot see this policy enduring. Of course, I also have to state that this is just you, me, and the rest of us sitting around the fire shooting the shit. No one cares about my opinion, and that is the way that it should be.
In some doctrinal SF missions, there is a natural synergy between the 18D and 18F MOSs, as practiced in the real world, that cannot be denied.
I understand that some folks believe that they need to take temporary measures to massage the numbers in this MOS or that MOS here and there, but making such measures permanent would be very shortsighted.
Next thing, guys with 18D or 18E primary MOSs will be prohibited from becoming 18Zs. That makes about as much sense as saying that 18Ds and 18Es cannot also be 18Fs.
Do the smart guys at the Schoolhouse then decide that 18Zs and 18Fs cannot transition into the 180A program? None of this makes sense.
I just do not see it lasting.
If you look at the 'box, and the sort of ops that our brothers are running there now, and will be, presumably, for a few more years to come....it makes sense to send as many qualified guys to O&I as possible, (and beyond, 'nuff said), even if they continue to hold down the senior medic or senior demo or senior weapons slot on an ODA. In other words, I am saying that there is nothing wrong with graduates of O&I holding other primary MOSs on ODAs. Remember the principal of cross training? This is just cross training. Wearing multiple hats. It is a good thing.
It can only improve the sophistication of planning, and enhance the sophistication of HUMINT activities practiced on the ground. That shit is critical.
And that gets to this other rumor, that 18Xs with no team time and no other 18-series MOS might be attending the 18F course.
No freakin' way would that even be possible. A guy with no significant team time is not ready for the 18F course by any means.
I had been on an ODA for two years before I went to O&I. Yes, I was lucky, and I went early. I had worked closely with my team sergeant during every planning iteration that came our way, leeching from his experience and his brain, and I also had been to the 18C course. So I was prepared. Not overprepared, but I swam when I got into the 18F course, and I did not sink. Nothing that I had done, at that point, as an 18D had prepared me.
Only actually working on an ODA is suitable preparation for the 18F course. I do not think that it is possible to take a guy right out of training group and send him.
Again, just my opinion, and probably worth nothing, when you consider how out of the loop that I am.
:)
I talked to a buddy back in Colorado. He said I should be fine because of my circumstances. We'll see. I suppose there are bigger things to worry about now ( 5 meter line ). I'll cross that bridge when I get there. I never thought I would say it but 2 months at SWC doesn't sound that bad. At least I don't have to deconflict battle space with big Army to do my job in NC.:mad: By the way 18C4V, can't you e-mail a brother every now and then?
uboat509
04-26-2006, 08:14
The last thing that I heard was as of 1 Jan 06 there was a 1 year moratorium on 18Es going to the course.
SFC W
Briefed my last project in the fox course today. Looks like I'm now officially a nerd, not just an OJT nerd. I went to TAG today but they're all out of three point slings for computer key boards and pocket protectors made out of kydex. Now it's time to go forth and do good things for God and country. :lifter
Nice,
I was just at your neck of the woods with B Co shooting the SR-25 and the 50 cal.
I just got back to my neck of the woods last night. I don't know how many times I've done that drive but it's starting to wear on me. Kansas is the worst part though. Funny story.... I stopped for the night in a town I believe is on the far western side of Kentucky. I saw a sign that said 44.95 a night for a hotel room. "Sweet" I thought. I go in and sign for my room. The red lights all over the place didn't register with me. I go into my room figuring I'll watch some t.v. and doze off. There were (no shit) 200 channels of porn and nothing else. At this point I'm confused. I walk outside and look at the sign I've apparently missed. "Adult Motel and Arcade." I went out to my truck, got my woobie and slept on top of the sheets. My SA was definitely not switched on that night. I took a half dozen showers when I got home.
82ndtrooper
03-24-2007, 17:34
I just got back to my neck of the woods last night. I don't know how many times I've done that drive but it's starting to wear on me. Kansas is the worst part though. Funny story.... I stopped for the night in a town I believe is on the far western side of Kentucky. I saw a sign that said 44.95 a night for a hotel room. "Sweet" I thought. I go in and sign for my room. The red lights all over the place didn't register with me. I go into my room figuring I'll watch some t.v. and doze off. There were (no shit) 200 channels of porn and nothing else. At this point I'm confused. I walk outside and look at the sign I've apparently missed. "Adult Motel and Arcade." I went out to my truck, got my woobie and slept on top of the sheets. My SA was definitely not switched on that night. I took a half dozen showers when I got home.
I believe you may have stopped in Jelico or just across the line from Kentucky. I've been that same place and I didnt' sleep in my POV..............LMAO :D
I think next time I'll pay the extra 20 bucks and stay at a place I'm fairly sure won't give me crabs or Hep C.
I believe you may have stopped in Jelico or just across the line from Kentucky. I've been that same place and I didnt' sleep in my POV..............LMAO :D
I always sleep (in my Jeep) at the Paducah, Kentucky Wal-mart parking lot... That's my half-way point between Colorado Springs & Fayetteville.
Briefed my last project in the fox course today. Looks like I'm now officially a nerd, not just an OJT nerd. I went to TAG today but they're all out of three point slings for computer key boards and pocket protectors made out of kydex. Now it's time to go forth and do good things for God and country. :lifter
Dude, you'll want the Viking Tactics sling for your CF-18, it allows you to cinch it up tight to your kit when going through your 3-day SSE bag. I keep my spare battery in a Blade-Tech kydex holster on my belt and keep my Crossmatch wand (which BTW I affixed a picatinny rail tool) on a dropleg platform. I found my USB mouse fits great in an EDOM strobe pouch. And of course my dongles for Ibase and ANB are around my neck with my thumb drive which has Erasure, Agent Ransack, Zapgrab, Truecript, & Steganos.
Welcome to the "geek squad"... I feel your pain.
Dude, you'll want the Viking Tactics sling for your CF-18, it allows you to cinch it up tight to your kit when going through your 3-day SSE bag. I keep my spare battery in a Blade-Tech kydex holster on my belt and keep my Crossmatch wand (which BTW I affixed a picatinny rail tool) on a dropleg platform. I found my USB mouse fits great in an EDOM strobe pouch. And of course my dongles for Ibase and ANB are around my neck with my thumb drive which has Erasure, Agent Ransack, Zapgrab, Truecript, & Steganos.
Dude, you're seriously scaring me right now.
Did they fit you for the foil helmet yet?? I'd suggest it before you come to your 2 shop for intel synchronization....I'm one of them, so I can't be saved. :D
My TS contacted the NG liaison down at SWC about this, and...
18E can now attend 18F course. SSG and above. SGT needs a waiver with a good justification statement. (As per SOPO).
Has anyone heard of the Fox course being opened up to Deltas? Last I heard was that Deltas were at 98% strength, and for a while we actually had three Echoes on the team. Just wondering if anyone has current info on the matter. There's been talk of trying to send me to the Fox course, and I'm just wondering how feasible that really is.
Thanks!
I'm getting ready to attend the upcoming course. Anyone else going to be there?
alfromcolorado
04-12-2008, 15:35
Let me qualify this question before I pose it. I have been retired for 10 years now and out of the country most of it. Now I am working a contractor SFQC MTT in Hungary with a bunch of other FAGs. Anyway, one guy swears that the SFQC is producing 18Fs and there is some dispute on that. O&I was always that right of passage thing...
From most of the posts I have read here one still has to be QP (took me a few to figure out what that meant) to go to the 18 F course.
True?
Al
IRT pipelining 18Fs, RUMINT had it that the powers that be were kicking around that idea IOT get more mileage from 18F grads. However, as of two months ago when I finished the Q, it was nowhere near implementation. If I was a betting man I would say that it is not going to happen anytime soon, but I certainly am not anyone in the know.
x/S
TEXAS ED
05-01-2008, 19:43
I went to O&I in 1979. Ended up teaching on the O&I committee (late 80 thru late 83) for about 3 years after that. Don't want to get into any OPSEC violations (seem to be tuff on those around here with good reason). edited Any responders please PM me (if this is OK?-no, it isn't okay).
My thanks. Just another old guy.
Please do not ask people to do this. The topic is classified, and as a former cadre member, you, of all people should know that we have no idea who you are or who might be sending you info about this course. I am sure lots of people on the wrong side would like to know what this course teaches. TR
TEXAS ED
05-02-2008, 04:26
Roger, Good Copy. I appreciate it.
BMT (RIP)
05-02-2008, 05:04
O&I Dec '64- Jan '65. The last HARD course. We only had pencil and paper. :D
BMT
D9 (RIP)
06-14-2008, 13:41
I sure hope the prohibition on 18Ds at the F course has been lifted. It really should be company dependent. Since returning from this deployment I've talked to 2 AD companies and 1 other ARNG company about slots, and all three were over strength on Deltas and there was a pool of medics at the B-tm waiting for spots on teams to open up. All of the above were either short 18B or 18C. We didn't even have an 18B on our last trip, but we had 2 18Ds. That was the story (more or less) in the whole company. What gives?
An extra 9 months of school, a mountain of S1 BS to deal with, unique exposure risks w/o compensation (Hep C, HIV, TB, Pesticides, et al), an MOS that requires extensive sustainment to maintain basic skills frustrating attempts at other schools, and now: no opportunities for upward mobility within the company!!! The hits keep coming. I wonder if the guys who complain about attrition are the same ones that come up with these kinds of fantastic incentives?
Surgicalcric
06-14-2008, 14:21
I sure hope the prohibition on 18Ds at the F course has been lifted. It really should be company dependent. Since returning from this deployment I've talked to 2 AD companies and 1 other ARNG company about slots, and all three were over strength on Deltas and there was a pool of medics at the B-tm waiting for spots on teams to open up. All of the above were either short 18B or 18C. We didn't even have an 18B on our last trip, but we had 2 18Ds. That was the story (more or less) in the whole company. What gives?
An extra 9 months of school, a mountain of S1 BS to deal with, unique exposure risks w/o compensation (Hep C, HIV, TB, Pesticides, et al), an MOS that requires extensive sustainment to maintain basic skills frustrating attempts at other schools, and now: no opportunities for upward mobility within the company!!! The hits keep coming. I wonder if the guys who complain about attrition are the same ones that come up with these kinds of fantastic incentives?
So what you are basically saying is you are tired of being over worked, over studied, and under appreciated... :D
Crip
D9 (RIP)
06-14-2008, 14:57
Only for 14 more days. :lifter
The Reaper
06-14-2008, 18:58
I sure hope the prohibition on 18Ds at the F course has been lifted. It really should be company dependent. Since returning from this deployment I've talked to 2 AD companies and 1 other ARNG company about slots, and all three were over strength on Deltas and there was a pool of medics at the B-tm waiting for spots on teams to open up. All of the above were either short 18B or 18C. We didn't even have an 18B on our last trip, but we had 2 18Ds. That was the story (more or less) in the whole company. What gives?
An extra 9 months of school, a mountain of S1 BS to deal with, unique exposure risks w/o compensation (Hep C, HIV, TB, Pesticides, et al), an MOS that requires extensive sustainment to maintain basic skills frustrating attempts at other schools, and now: no opportunities for upward mobility within the company!!! The hits keep coming. I wonder if the guys who complain about attrition are the same ones that come up with these kinds of fantastic incentives?
You know, I remember when guys going to the 18F course, or O&I, or ANCOC had to have several years on a team and a bunch of deployments before they were eligible, regardless of MOS.:D
TR
You know, I remember when guys going to the 18F course, or O&I, or ANCOC had to have several years on a team and a bunch of deployments before they were eligible, regardless of MOS.:D
TR
Not Now TR.... TS are sending guy right out of the Q-course with two weeks to two months on their ODAs.
This is why the 18F is no long the Asst. OPS for the team.
D9 (RIP)
06-15-2008, 10:24
I'm tracking. The 18F should have a good amount of team time. I think everyone would love to see more experience all the way around in the Regt today. But if the personnel are not there, or are they're there but broke and stuck in the rear, then what do you do? Ultimately, I'd rather have a less-experienced 18F on the team to learn from the 18Z than I would have the 18Z trying to wear both hats, although I agree that the situation is not ideal.
It's not just Deltas. The 18F on our last deployment was an 18B w/ a few months out of the Q when he went to the F course. In the end he had a learning curve, but after a few months he did fine.
Main point is that I wish they would lighten up on the 18D MOS. With the MOS overstrength in many companies, I don't see the reason for the prohibition anymore. There are medics in my company now with 5-6 deployments and plenty of team time. At least they should be able to go and free up another spot on a team for a medic.
Sir, I wasn't asking about 18F for myself. Crip told me he needs to get to the 18F course this year if he's going to be an E8 in 8 years. :D
The fox on my team is a stud, did outstanding on this deployment and he's our asst ops guys since he's the senior E-7 on the team. However, he's retiring and I'll be pinning on E-8 and taking over our team really soon and I'll have to figure out who do I send to the fox course?
I got two echo's who expressed interest with less than one year team time. But counting this deployment and his mother army deployment as a 11B, one of them has already 23 months of combat time. I'm leaning towards him since he was helping out our fox this trip. Like the other guys said, the average time time is really low. We got six guys on my team with less than one year team time, but have lots of mother army experience. Anyway I heard there's a shitload of new guys who graduated from the Q-course who signed into the company while we're deployed. So the vicious cycle starts again with the breaking in of new guys!!!
Surgicalcric
06-15-2008, 10:47
...Crip told me he needs to get to the 18F course this year if he's going to be an E8 in 8 years. :D
Dont go tossing me under the bus there dozer killer.
I am happy being a medic and have no desire to go to the Fox course whatsoever... I do wish there was more med courses but thats a different discussion. The intel side of the house isnt for me.
Besides, it will be another 5 years before I can make E7... :munchin
Crip
The ban on 18D's is lifted on the fox course with a caveat. We're allowed to go but they won't change our primary MOS to 18F. I had to do a lot of looking to find that information. Presently I've got a hard slot, but the CSM is saying D's aren't allowed. My Tm SGT talked to the NCOIC of the fox course, and I guess there is some sort of waiver that I need to get. From what I've heard we'll have to stay current with all of our medical requirements until we're allowed to change our primary MOS over to Fox, but little is known about it cause not many if any D's are going to the Fox course. I'll try and keep posting to keep you guys updated on how this turns out.
The ban on 18D's is lifted on the fox course with a caveat. We're allowed to go but they won't change our primary MOS to 18F. I had to do a lot of looking to find that information. Presently I've got a hard slot, but the CSM is saying D's aren't allowed. My Tm SGT talked to the NCOIC of the fox course, and I guess there is some sort of waiver that I need to get. From what I've heard we'll have to stay current with all of our medical requirements until we're allowed to change our primary MOS over to Fox, but little is known about it cause not many if any D's are going to the Fox course. I'll try and keep posting to keep you guys updated on how this turns out.
With 18F at or over a 100% I don't see it lifted with the numbers of 18Ds.