View Full Version : This is just wrong, everyone look
cszakolczai
10-06-2005, 19:25
Sorry to just post this so fast, but everyone has to look at this
http://cgi.ebay.com/CONGRESSIONAL-MEDAL-OF-HONOR-100-ORIGINAL_W0QQitemZ6567842098QQcategoryZ66534QQrdZ1 QQcmdZViewItem
I know he is outside the US. But I still think that this is wrong to just sell to a random person over the internet. What do you guys think?
Chris
Eagle5US
10-06-2005, 19:32
Seeing as how it is against the law to sell the medal, I hope that the FBI offers the guy a decent bid...IF it is real.
Eagle
Isn't the recipient's name usually engraved on the medal?
Someone may get the shaft while the seller gets the gold mine. :rolleyes:
It also looks faded enough to have set in a window display for some time.
Don't let Kerry see it!!!
miller0331
10-06-2005, 20:00
Yeah... They do have the recipient's name engraved on the back. I wonder whose medal it is? And did the MOH Society contact the seller yet?
I know when my uncle passed away (Doug Miller) I kept waiting for one of my cousins to put the Medal and his ashes up for sale on EBay...
I checked all of the views and there is no engraving.
cszakolczai
10-06-2005, 20:28
Yeah I didn't see an engraving also. I'm going to ask the seller about it and see what info I can get about him and see what one can do about getting someone to pull that auction.
Chris
rubberneck
10-06-2005, 20:36
The seller is from the UK so I doubt the long arm of American law will reach that far unless it is sold to a US Citizen. The seller doesn't have any negative feedback despite hundreds of transactions so I doubt he is a scammer. Either way it is disgusting.
cszakolczai
10-06-2005, 20:42
Contacted the seller and ebay about his item, going to contact who ever else I can. Pisses me off. He even says that at one point there was another Medal of Honor on ebay. Can't believe it, where do you just find one of these?
Chris
The Reaper
10-06-2005, 21:09
Obviously not on eBay anymore, it has been yanked.
Hundreds were handed out during the Civil War and Indian Wars.
TR
miller0331
10-06-2005, 21:22
True, but those medals were of a different design and besides each service has their own version of the Medal. That one advertised looks to be like an Army MOH of the newer design.
Also, prior to WWII, they were awarded for peace time bravery. If I remember correctly, Swede Momsen (sp?), a Navy diver, was awarded the MOH for his actions during the rescue of a crippled sub off the coast of Conneticut.
Also, a lot of repros were sold during the 50's before the Feds put a canc on that.
Anyway, just a little FYI. If you want to know more about the medal, then you should probably check out the website:
www.cmohs.org
Semper Fi
cszakolczai
10-07-2005, 07:52
The man selling the medal has offered to sell it to me, and I am thinking about buying it than giving it to a museum. But by doing this I am breaking the law. What do you guys think I should do? I want this in a museum and out of this guys hands, what options do I have?
Chris
rubberneck
10-07-2005, 08:10
The man selling the medal has offered to sell it to me, and I am thinking about buying it than giving it to a museum. But by doing this I am breaking the law. What do you guys think I should do? I want this in a museum and out of this guys hands, what options do I have?
Chris
No. Even if you weren't breaking the law, which you would be to my understanding, your buying the medal would reward such appaling behavior. The guy is looking for cash and if you give it to him he'll be back next week with another CMOH for sale. If it isn't a CMOH it will be a DSC, SS, BS, PH etc.
cszakolczai
10-07-2005, 15:02
No. Even if you weren't breaking the law, which you would be to my understanding, your buying the medal would reward such appaling behavior. The guy is looking for cash and if you give it to him he'll be back next week with another CMOH for sale. If it isn't a CMOH it will be a DSC, SS, BS, PH etc.
Good point I am going to talk to the guy and see what I can do.
Chris
CoLawman
10-07-2005, 18:20
The man selling the medal has offered to sell it to me, and I am thinking about buying it than giving it to a museum. But by doing this I am breaking the law. What do you guys think I should do? I want this in a museum and out of this guys hands, what options do I have?
Chris
Not to deflate your enthusiasm.......but you are in over your head!
Stick to what you know.......Hockey and chasing skirts!
IMHO
Airbornelawyer
10-07-2005, 19:43
Please explain to me what is "just wrong" about this sale or that of any other decoration. There are thousands of collectors around the world who collect militaria - medals, uniforms, helmets, daggers, badges, documents, etc. The reasons why people collect vary, but most see themselves as preserving history. People collect baseball cards and beanie babies, but to me these are just baubles specifically made for collectors, while militaria is part of history.
I did not see the eBay entry, but based on the descriptions here, I would assume we are talking about an unattributed, unissued MOH. The contractor for the MOH, Lordship Industries, was given a contract to make a certain number of MOHs for the armed forces and was allowed a certain overage, which were sold to collectors and others. After a few frauds used these medals to fake being MOH winners, the government went overboard and effectively criminalized legitimate collectors, lumping them in with the posers. This was not only unjust, but an insult to these collectors, most of whom are as patriotic as you can get and many of whom are themselves veterans.
And these unattributed Medals of Honor are of no interest to museums, any more than the Bronze Stars and ARCOMs you see at Clothing Sales.
But even the sale of an attributed Medal of Honor ought not to arouse this kind of ire. Again, the buyer and seller are preserving history, and many buyers do in fact donate to museums (or even create their own). And in this context, an attributed MOH group is no different than an attributed VC group (although VCs, being rarer, go for astonishing amounts when they show up in UK auctions) or a DSC or Navy Cross group.
While it would be nice if there were lots of museums actually interested in preserving and displaying military history, that is not the case. The Smithsonian has drawers full of donated medals that will never be displayed because of space considerations and indifference by politically correct curators. However, if you visit my friend Seba's house in New Jersey, you can see a reverently displayed collection of militaria he has picked up over the years. Another friend has turned his home into a real museum, where he has displayed among other things one of Rommel's uniforms and a jacket and various items given to him by Dick Winters.
By the way, there is an attributed Medal of Honor group currently being auctioned in Sweden. It was awarded to a Swede who had immigrated to the US, fought and was honored in the Indian Wars and returned to Sweden. Because of US laws treating US collectors as presumptive criminals, the one thing we know is that this particular bit of American history will not return to the United States.
If I sound snippy in this post, it is because I take personally the implication that the buyers or sellers here are some sort of criminals, phonies, or whatever. Here are some of the items in my own modest museum in a couple of display cases in my living room:
1. US, Distinguished Service Cross, early World War Two issue (unattributed).
2. Austria, Cannon Cross (for service in the Napoleonic Wars) with attached miniature campaign medals.
3. Germany, 6-medal bar to a Bavarian aviator in World War One.
4. UK, 5-medal bar to a Boer War and World War One veteran of the Duke of Cornwall's Light Infantry.
I also have some other medals, badges and documents, including one of the largest private collections of propaganda leaflets in the world, and I have donated items to museums and archives, including the USASOC archive, as well as provided consulting services to other museums.
cszakolczai
10-07-2005, 22:24
Airbornelawyer Sir,
I am a collector myself, I have been collecting for a number of years now. I do agree fully that collecting and preserving history is very important. But my worry is just simply the fact that what if it falls into the wrong hands? Thats what gets me. But I will safely say that I agree with you about the collecting aspect and the fact that if it were to go to a museum, it would just sit in the drawer. But the fact that it was so publically displayed and the man who was willing to pay the most would be the winner, is just wrong. Its not the fact that one wants a Medal Of Honor for there own collection, its the fact that anyone could just purchase this Medal off a publically viewed site, and do whatever they wanted with it.
But your point is well taken, and I only hope that the person who purchases the Medal, find a nice home for it where it can be displayed and appreciated for many years to come.
Thank you,
Chris
P.S PM inbound
Often the old soldiers themselves will never sell their medals. It's usually (here anyway) the family after the soldiers have passed on that then sell them.
I've heard stories of North Africa and Cassino vets who were broke, their pension barely covering rent let alone food who would not sell their medals at all, ever.
cszakolczai
10-08-2005, 08:46
Very true Huey,
I am the one who inherits all the medals and Military collectibles from my family and I treasure most of them.
Chris
Team Sergeant
10-08-2005, 09:05
cszakolczai,
The next time I see a title that looks like this I'll ban you first and then the person that placed a thread title of a similar nature. "that This is just wrong, everyone look".
In fact I don't want to see you posting on this board for two months, or I will IP ban you.
Team Sergeant
BTW, Don't PM me and apologize, you'll just piss me off that much more.
This thread is closed.