View Full Version : Army raises Reserve/NG enlistment age to 39
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Army Raises Enlistment Age for Reservists to 39
Mon Mar 21, 2:26 PM ET U.S. National - Reuters
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. Army, stung by recruiting shortfalls caused by the Iraq (news - web sites) war, has raised the maximum age for new recruits for the part-time Army Reserve and National Guard by five years to 39, officials said on Monday.
The Army said the move, a three-year experiment, will add about 22 million people to the pool of those eligible to serve, from about 60 million now. Physical standards will not be relaxed for older recruits, who the Army said were valued for their maturity and patriotism.
The Pentagon (news - web sites) has relied heavily on part-time Army Reserve and Army National Guard soldiers summoned from civilian life to maintain troop levels in Iraq and Afghanistan (news - web sites). Roughly 45 percent of U.S. troops currently deployed for those wars are reservists.
At home, the all-volunteer Army has labored to coax potential recruits to volunteer for the Guard and Reserve as well as for active-duty, and to persuade current soldiers to re-enlist when their volunteer commitment ends.
Maj. Elizabeth Robbins, an Army spokeswoman, said the maximum enlistment age for the regular Army will remain 34. While congressional action was not needed to raise the age for the Guard and Reserve, Robbins said, Congress must approve any change for the active-duty force.
"Raising the maximum age for non-prior service enlistment expands the recruiting pool, provides motivated individuals an opportunity to serve, and strengthens the readiness of Reserve units," the Army said in a statement.
Air Force Lt. Col. Ellen Krenke, a Pentagon spokeswoman, said it was possible after the three-year test ends in September 2008 that the Pentagon may consider an enlistment age for Army reservists even older than 39.
RECRUITING GOALS
Recruiters say the Iraq war is making military service a harder sell, and the Army has added recruiters and financial incentives for enlistment.
The Army National Guard missed its recruiting goal for the 2004 fiscal year and trails its year-to-date 2005 targets. The Army Reserve missed January and February goals and is lagging its target for 2005. The regular Army missed its target for February and trails its annual goal.
"Obviously, this decision is being made partly in response to the personnel shortfalls caused by the war in Iraq," said defense analyst Loren Thompson of the Lexington Institute.
But he said U.S. life expectancy increased by 40 percent in the 20th century, adding, "The pressure of wartime has pushed the Army to make a change that may have been overdue anyway."
"Anecdotally, our recruiters have been telling us for years that we've had people who are otherwise qualified but over the age limit who have attempted to enlist," Robbins said. "There are physically fit, health-conscious individuals who can make a positive contribution to our national defense."
The Army said the policy applies to men and women, and older recruits must meet the same physical standards and pass the same medical examination as everyone else.
"Experience has shown that older recruits who can meet the physical demands of military service generally make excellent soldiers based on their maturity, motivation, loyalty and patriotism," the Army said.
Krenke said the change was first considered last fall and approved by the Pentagon last week. She said the Marines, Navy and Air Force had not requested a similar change.
The Army Reserve is made up of federal soldiers who can be mobilized from civilian life for active duty. National Guard soldiers also serve under the control of state governors for roles like disaster relief in their home states.
Jack Moroney (RIP)
03-22-2005, 06:17
Ought to be interesting. Swim test will clog the pool filters with disolving depends, barracks will smell like bengay, day room publication list will be approved by AARP, HUMVEEs and other vehicles will have portable platforms to allow folks to step up and into the vehicle, PX will have a whole new line of products such as grecian formula, preparation H, centrum silver. Troop towns will suffer cause all the "new guys" will be in bed by 2100 hours. Commanders will no longer be referred to as the "old man" because it will now become politically incorrect to have any comments referring to age. The VA will now become the medical provider of choice for the Active Military because they have the best experience in geratrics care. Yep, ought to be interesting. Kind of reminds me of the pictures of the Volkstrum during the waning days of the Third Reich. On the other hand if we are going to have 39 year old privates there may be hope for the rest of us FOGs, someone is going to have to provide adult supervision to the
Great Gray Group of Gentle Gelded Grenadiers.
Jack Moroney-strapping my web gear on the back of my wheel chair
Kyobanim
03-22-2005, 10:32
I'd like to see the age requirement raised for prior service enlistment in the NG. If someone is physically able to do the job I see no reason why they shouldn't be allowed to. In know people between the ages of 40 and 50 that could smoke a lot of the youg-uns, physically and mentally. And remove the "20 years of creditable service before 60" clause
The Reaper
03-22-2005, 12:33
I'd like to see the age requirement raised for prior service enlistment in the NG. If someone is physically able to do the job I see no reason why they shouldn't be allowed to. In know people between the ages of 40 and 50 that could smoke a lot of the youg-uns, physically and mentally. And remove the "20 years of creditable service before 60" clause
I am not sure that I would want a bunch of 60+ year olds in my unit deployed into the CZ.
No offense, as there are capable 70 year olds, but even at 47, I can feel my age, and every hard landing, every day.
Yeah, I'd probably take Ernie T., or Billy Waugh anyway. :D
Just my .02, YMMV.
TR
Jack Moroney (RIP)
03-22-2005, 12:44
I'd like to see the age requirement raised for prior service enlistment in the NG. If someone is physically able to do the job I see no reason why they shouldn't be allowed to. In know people between the ages of 40 and 50 that could smoke a lot of the youg-uns, physically and mentally. And remove the "20 years of creditable service before 60" clause
I went thru Ranger School with a 48 year old Colonel and he did okay, but while he was harder than woodpecker lips he could not compete with the 20 year olds. I am looking at the force as a whole. They day of folks thinking that they are going to get an easier ride because they are in the reserve components are gone and the standards have to be the same across the board. I agree that if they can cut it then they should be brought in with open arms, but I will also tell you that while I could smoke most of my troops when it came to PT at the advanced age of 50 plus my recovery time was longer and landings got harder and harder. While I always strove to lead from the front the day I realized that it wouldn't be much longer before I had to push from the rear I retired.
Jack Moroney
NousDefionsDoc
03-22-2005, 13:06
Well, Crip has to be relieved. I'm sure this was worrying him.
Trip_Wire (RIP)
03-22-2005, 13:21
Ought to be interesting. Swim test will clog the pool filters with disolving depends, barracks will smell like bengay, day room publication list will be approved by AARP, HUMVEEs and other vehicles will have portable platforms to allow folks to step up and into the vehicle, PX will have a whole new line of products such as grecian formula, preparation H, centrum silver. Troop towns will suffer cause all the "new guys" will be in bed by 2100 hours. Commanders will no longer be referred to as the "old man" because it will now become politically incorrect to have any comments referring to age. The VA will now become the medical provider of choice for the Active Military because they have the best experience in geratrics care. Yep, ought to be interesting. Kind of reminds me of the pictures of the Volkstrum during the waning days of the Third Reich. On the other hand if we are going to have 39 year old privates there may be hope for the rest of us FOGs, someone is going to have to provide adult supervision to the
Great Gray Group of Gentle Gelded Grenadiers.
Jack Moroney-strapping my web gear on the back of my wheel chair
LOL!! :D
Yes, COL there might be some hope for us "Old Farts" :lifter
Surgicalcric
03-22-2005, 14:11
Well, Crip has to be relieved. I'm sure this was worrying him.
That's just wrong. Not funny Sarn't...
Damn... Now where did I put my walker...
Crip
Trip_Wire (RIP)
03-22-2005, 18:27
I am not sure that I would want a bunch of 60+ year olds in my unit deployed into the CZ.
No offense, as there are capable 70 year olds, but even at 47, I can feel my age, and every hard landing, every day.
Yeah, I'd probably take Ernie T., or Billy Waugh anyway. :D
Just my .02, YMMV.
TR
TR: I can't see myself on an ODA at 74 and some of the medical problems that I have now either. I suppose that I could handle a desk job in S-4 or other desk job, somewhere at 'Bragg, Campbell or Ft. Lewis, so they could be on an ODA or closer to the team in a support role. I'd be happy doing it too! :D :lifter
let me know when it hits 52.
Well, Crip has to be relieved. I'm sure this was worrying him.
Now I don't care who yer are......thats funny... hooah for the OG's
Team Sergeant
03-23-2005, 09:02
I retired from the military at 39....... ;)
I don't think I'd want to begin a military "combatant" career at that age.
As non-combatants fine, have at it.
TS
Surgicalcric
03-23-2005, 09:43
Now I don't care who yer are......thats funny... hooah for the OG's
Hey now see here... You are older than I am... :D
Crip
Its all about heart. As a 35 year old National Guardsman (light infantry squad leader) I have not felt like I could not keep up or even surpass others much more younger than I am, there are plenty of kids (National Guard or Active duty) without the will to win in the military today. I am sure some of the School House Cadre that browses the board can attest to that.
I have developed some age related problems, specifically shin splints that were so bad I had to have surgery. I am still recovering from that, but I am running again. With the right formula of training, rest, nutrition, heart, and genetics, age can be minimalized. I have read about Soldiers over 40 succeeding at SFAS on this very board.
I had a good deployment to Iraq, as far as my physical perfomance is concerned, and I look forward to other deployments in the future. Age be damned.
The Reaper
03-23-2005, 12:37
Its all about heart. As a 35 year old National Guardsman (light infantry squad leader) I have not felt like I could not keep up or even surpass others much more younger than I am, there are plenty of kids (National Guard or Active duty) without the will to win in the military today. I am sure some of the School House Cadre that browses the board can attest to that.
I have developed some age related problems, specifically shin splints that were so bad I had to have surgery. I am still recovering from that, but I am running again. With the right formula of training, rest, nutrition, heart, and genetics, age can be minimalized. I have read about Soldiers over 40 succeeding at SFAS on this very board.
I had a good deployment to Iraq, as far as my physical perfomance is concerned, and I look forward to other deployments in the future. Age be damned.
It is not the status of the 40 year old who makes it. It is his (and his team's) future.
It is the fact that he is going to be likely more prone to injury, slowing the team down, and frankly, is looking at a very reduced number of years of service on an ODA as payback before he has to move to a desk.
We went through this personally with a worn-out 45 year old Warrant Officer we got stuck with and had to carry until we got him moved to Battalion.
Furthermore, you enter the pipeline at 39, you are not likely to make it to 59 (and retirement) serving on an ODA.
Now you have a guy serving at higher levels with a year or two of time on a team before he wore out. It just isn't worth it.
Just my .02, YMMV.
TR
I can agree that a lengthy career in the Special Forces is certainly out of reach for a 40 year old. And when we examine that piece of the Army from an active duty standpoint I understand your belief.
As a Guardsman, I enjoy being part of the Army, I enjoy going on deployments, Army schools, drill weekends, and being with other patriotic americans. One thing alot of Active guys dont understand is that while you may feel a certain fraternal brotherhood to members of your Career Branch, Officer Corps, Group or what have you. The sense of belonging to and being a part of something bigger than yourself can be alot stronger in the Guard.
Often times in the National Guard, there is a blood relationship to the unit and its history. Here in the 41st, we have Grandfathers and Greatgrandfathers who kicked ass all over the pacific in WWII, that now have Grandsons serving in Iraq and Afganistan. Its a family pride thing that is shared by a great deal of our Soldiers. While that happens from time to time on Active Duty, it is a regular occurrance for the Guard.
We have very strong feelings about the reputation of our 41st Brigade, its more than 'yet another assigned duty station', its Family, many of us have nearly 20 years invested in the same company! Its hard for alot of you to gauge how big a deal that is. I know I ride a little taller in the saddle when I think about who we are and where we come from. It really does make a difference.
A 39 year old guy sometimes has the courage and confidence to make a decision he wasnt able to make at 18. He is at a point in his life where his family is viable, he has succeeded in his community and done well for himself. He may feel a call to contribute. And if he finally had the courage to heed that call at 39, as long as he can pass a PT test, I would gladly serve with him.
I love my unit, and when I think about the sacrifices so many of our Soldiers from Oregon have made recently I do get misty eyed. I am so very proud of them.
The type of guy who is 42 years old, with 15 years in the guard as an E4, who finds people to skillcraft his PT test for him so he can survive on his drill weekend check for a month are at an end. Those guys bailed as soon as they found out they would deploy and might get killed.
CommoGeek
03-23-2005, 20:10
NG_M4:
I'm a former Guard guy turned Contractor in the Stan. I work with AD, Guard, and NG folks over here and I believe those with your mentality about PT are somewhat in the minority.
We had one guy in my SF Support Co: 47 when he re-enlisted, 0311 Marine from Vietnam, hard as woodpecker lips. It took him 2 passes to get though jump school and he had to finish with a concussion (the first was pneumonia). Yearly he rides a bicycle across the state of FL. His 17-21 YO APFT scores are always 260 and above. He is still in uniform, but he is the exception.
Most of the 9-lines over here for chest pains are older Guard and Reserve guys. Not only is their squad now down a man, but a multi-million dollar a/c and crew have to fly out to help this man. Our weather in the winter can be atrocious, especially in the high mountain passes.
The risks outweigh the rewards, IMO.
The Guard has every reason to be proud, but they need to take a realistic look at their manning issues. This problem will not soon go away.
I can agree that a lengthy career in the Special Forces is certainly out of reach for a 40 year old. And when we examine that piece of the Army from an active duty standpoint I understand your belief.
I was 40 years old on an A-Team. It wasn't out of reach. I don't understand what you mean by the Active versus Guard viewpoint.
We have very strong feelings about the reputation of our 41st Brigade, its more than 'yet another assigned duty station', its Family, many of us have nearly 20 years invested in the same company! Its hard for alot of you to gauge how big a deal that is. I know I ride a little taller in the saddle when I think about who we are and where we come from. It really does make a difference.
How many years do you think the average SF guy has in a unit? I along with others on this board did quite a few active years in a SF unit.
The type of guy who is 42 years old, with 15 years in the guard as an E4, who finds people to skillcraft his PT test for him so he can survive on his drill weekend check for a month are at an end.
We get rid of those types at Selection.
The Reaper
03-23-2005, 21:16
I was 40 years old on an A-Team. It wasn't out of reach. I don't understand what you mean by the Active versus Guard viewpoint.
Doc:
I think he was referring to my comment about a guy who goes through selection at 40 not having a full 20 year career ahead of him on an ODA.
Gary O' was on NDD's and my team at 40 something, he was a hoss even then, and he stayed on an ODA for another 10 years or so.
That was very exceptional, I would wager that a comparison of SFAS selection rates has an age component as well, and a significantly greater percentage of the senior soldiers 39 and older there fail than the 21-29 year olds.
Just my .02 based on my observations.
TR
Doc:
I think he was referring to my comment about a guy who goes through selection at 40 not having a full 20 year career ahead of him on an ODA.
Gary O' was on NDD's and my team at 40 something, he was a hoss even then, and he stayed on an ODA for another 10 years or so.
That was very exceptional, I would wager that a comparison of SFAS selection rates has an age component as well, and a significantly greater percentage of the senior soldiers 39 and older there fail than the 21-29 year olds.
Just my .02 based on my observations.
TR
I understand your comment sir.
There are many slots in a GP and the need to fill them always exists. A man doesn't have to pull 20 years on an ODA in my book to help the cause.
Give me an older man with life experiences versus a younger man with not as many lessons learned to fill some of those slots any day.
JMHO. YMV.
Doc
I think in the NG/Reserve there is a place for older enlistees. Idealy they would be someone who had done some active duty earlier. But I remember meeting many men who were in their mid 30s who wished they had been in the military. A few of them I would not have minded having alongside me.
Not everybody has to be "barrel chested, freedom fighter on the front lines of opposing tyranny!" Hell a good 71L (Admin Specialist) is worth his weight in gold. God I hated paperwork!
One note about our society is people are living longer, more productive lives. Career wise I think the military should try to make doing 25 or 30 years in the military more attractive.
But I do think being a Pvt in a combat arms outfit is a young mans game. But being a aircraft refueler, computor guru, not nessacarily
The Reaper
03-24-2005, 09:29
I think in the NG/Reserve there is a place for older enlistees. Idealy they would be someone who had done some active duty earlier. But I remember meeting many men who were in their mid 30s who wished they had been in the military. A few of them I would not have minded having alongside me.
Not everybody has to be "barrel chested, freedom fighter on the front lines of opposing tyranny!" Hell a good 71L (Admin Specialist) is worth his weight in gold. God I hated paperwork!
One note about our society is people are living longer, more productive lives. Career wise I think the military should try to make doing 25 or 30 years in the military more attractive.
But I do think being a Pvt in a combat arms outfit is a young mans game. But being a aircraft refueler, computor guru, not nessacarily
Looks to me like a lot of people who considered themselves non-combatants are patrolling and having to repel boarders on convoys.
That 60 year old PAC clerk better be in shape and jocked up before he/she steps out on patrol. Then when they get hit and have to go hard and fast, we will see how he/she affects the movement of the unit.
TR
There are some older people who can do it...then there are "those" who can not!
The screening process needs to remain the same.
True, true. But I just don't see many 39 year olds enlisting for the first time and staying in for 20. On the other hand I have been wrong on more than one occasion.
But did see a retired SF SGM jumping at Leapfest & he was like 61...looked hard & mean! Heck he is likely on this board somewhere.
The Reaper
03-24-2005, 22:22
I know three retired E-9s over 70 who are still jumping.
They are the exception.
TR
My comments on this thread were in fact a reply to TR's comments. Sorry that I didnt make that clear Doc.
When I say that I agree that a CAREER in active duty SF is out of reach for a 40 year old I am saying that a guy coming off the street at 40 years old, joining the active duty army (with a waiver) getting through basic, inf, abn, schools, being selected at sore feet and shoulders, completing the Q, In MY OPINION doesnt have a chance of completing a 20 year career in active duty special forces. This is a board, just giving my thoughts. I dont mean to say that a guy with x number of years in the Army as a combat arms or SF soldier cannot serve in an SF group. Apples and Oranges I think.
Commo geek, would those patients w/ chest pains be from the Indiana Guard? Just curious. All I can say is that from my experience in the Oregon light infantry national guard, we are fit and capable. Are we a Ranger battalion? NO. Do we have more than a few joes who are capable of excelling in a Ranger Battalion? Yes. IMO. We also have college professors, back hoe operators, electricians, IT administrators, pilots and the like serving as Infantrymen. The guard is a unique group of guys that do some things better than active duty soldiers and some things not so good as active duty soldiers. We don't have a lot of patience with 670-1 nazi's sharpshooting guys whose boots are bloused too low, or whose sideburns are 1/8" too long.
I like being in the guard, and we contribute to this war eyeball to eyeball with bad guys, and in a support role at home too.
There are lots of reasons that these hard chargers don't go on active duty.
A 39 year old guy in shape coming to my company will not be turned away as long as he rucks up, he's good to go. But we arent SF, and don't claim to be. We are slated to see you soon though Commo Geek.
CommoGeek
03-25-2005, 20:14
Commo geek, would those patients w/ chest pains be from the Indiana Guard? Just curious. All I can say is that from my experience in the Oregon light infantry national guard, we are fit and capable. Are we a Ranger battalion? NO. Do we have more than a few joes who are capable of excelling in a Ranger Battalion? Yes. IMO. We also have college professors, back hoe operators, electricians, IT administrators, pilots and the like serving as Infantrymen. The guard is a unique group of guys that do some things better than active duty soldiers and some things not so good as active duty soldiers. We don't have a lot of patience with 670-1 nazi's sharpshooting guys whose boots are bloused too low, or whose sideburns are 1/8" too long.
I like being in the guard, and we contribute to this war eyeball to eyeball with bad guys, and in a support role at home too.
There are lots of reasons that these hard chargers don't go on active duty.
A 39 year old guy in shape coming to my company will not be turned away as long as he rucks up, he's good to go. But we arent SF, and don't claim to be. We are slated to see you soon though Commo Geek.
I hear you. Not all Guard units are bad, some are in fact great and in many respects equal to their AD counterparts. I've seen and used the diversity of talent and backgrounds that you cited when I was in the Guard.
I'm not sure of the precise breakdown in units. I do know the FOBs that are AD soldiers vice those that are NG/ Reserve soldiers so that drove my comments above.
I'm not saying a 39 or 40 YO can't perform, the odds are just stacked against them.
Let me know when you get here. I'm usually at Bagram and would be happy to give you the nickel tour.
Take care.