Sikhs sue Marine Corps for right to wear turbans and beards

[mojaveman]

A prominent Sikh Marine officer, as well as several Sikh recruits, filed a federal lawsuit Monday that they hope will get the service to let them serve openly with their turban and beards.

"Hey Singh, I heard our brothers in the Army are allowed to wear turbans and have beards. I even found some white turbans we can wear with our dress blues!" :p

https://www.military.com/daily-news/2022/04/12/sikhs-sue-marine-corps-right-wear-turban-beards-all-times.html

[mark46th]

The Sikhs need to remember the line "From the halls of Montezuma to the shores of Tripoli" from the Marine Hymn. The Marines made their bones by defeating bad guys in turbans. Granted, the Sikhs aren't muslim pirates, but the image is clear.

[1stindoor]

A prominent Sikh Marine officer, as well as several Sikh recruits, filed a federal lawsuit Monday that they hope will get the service to let them serve openly with their turban and beards.

"Hey Singh, I heard our brothers in the Army are allowed to have turbans and wear beards. I even found some white turbans we can wear with our dress blues!" :p

https://www.military.com/daily-news/2022/04/12/sikhs-sue-marine-corps-right-wear-turban-beards-all-times.html

I will go ahead and predict that they will eventually win their argument. Then they can start letting the Vikings/Pagans/Wicans/etc. grow their hair out.

[tom kelly]

A Range of Ideas tolerated in public discourse...Developed in the mid 1990's. The Sikhs idea of U S Marine dress with turbans & beards would have been unthinkable in the 1990's, However . today it's being floated by the woke, activist, liberal members in the Military today....lip stick, nail polish, long hair....No end in sight...We the U S A are more divided today than ever and I don't see the pendulum swinging back to "The Way It Was".....

[Scimitar]

I don't know...

We need good people. - It's becoming harder and harder to meet recruiting goals.

Sikhs are good people - Consistently the best staff members I have are Mormons and Sikhs. I may not agree with their crazy ideas on God, but they sure know how to raise character filled, hard working kids.

For Sikhs the turban is not really optional, it's a core part of their religious identity. They will rarely enlist if they have to cut their hair and do without the turban. This is a GOOD male population of 250,000 in the US that we're missing out on.

This isn't women in combat arms, or BS 52 pronouns, this is simply removing barriers to good people. I liken it to a med waiver for a quality recruit.

S

[PRB]

Question.

Can you wear a Turban under a helmet? With a protective mask on...

I do get that Sikhs have a long military tradition and orientation.

I just hate opening the door to every 'whatever' belief system that requires special attention and garb. Once the door is open it is open.

We've been down this road before and it has never ended well.

[Scimitar]

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing, while I posted above.

Precedent is a two edged sword...
..."But Mommy!, Bobby got some juice, so I should get some vodka, it's only fair!"

S

[PSM]

We've been here before: https://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23734&highlight=Sikhs

[7624U]

Question.

I just hate opening the door to every 'whatever' belief system that requires special attention and garb. Once the door is open it is open.

We've been down this road before and it has never ended well.

That door in AR 670-1 has been open for years now, I say go full beards, it will look good with all the makeup for the LGBTQIRSOV"s. :rolleyes:

[Swoop]

Before you know it they’ll cave to “wear whatever the hell you want to…”. It’ll be something like an everyday ComiCon. :munchin

[1stindoor]

We've been here before: https://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23734&highlight=Sikhs

I thought we had discussed this before ad nauseum. Nice to see some "old" members; and apparently nothing's changed.

[JJ_BPK]

Question.

Can you wear a Turban under a helmet? With a protective mask on...



I am not in favor of individual-ness based on religious dictate(s) BUTT,,

The Canucks have some experience with beards, turbans, & gasmasks..

As I think have the UK and Indian Armies..

https://www.sikhnet.com/news/defense-minister-sajjan-patented-military-sikh-gas-mask


The US Army and West Point have been struggling for many years with the problem.

https://www.sikhcoalition.org/our-work/legal-and-policy/major-simratpal-singh/


The Sikh Coalition has taken a strong position on all things Sikh/Army

Personally,, I like my hands in my pockets and beards, as did Grant.

IDK, Change my mind.. :munchin

[Box]

Just a few thoughts...

Men are already allowed to wear clear nail polish.

The restriction of needing an 84 inch reach to be a Jump master (so you can reach the fucking pip pin and the anchor line cables) has been attacked as "anti-woman"

The restriction to have over a 160 pound drop weight (so that fucking physical science can help your body defeat the two turns of 80 pound cotton webbing) has been attacked as anti-woman

Directing that the newly authorized "long ponytails" be tucked into your fatigue top during airborne operations so that it doesn't become entangled in your fucking risers during the deployment sequence is being attacked as discriminatory.

Clearly Overtons window is having the desired effect at slowly dismantling the military's age old purpose of training killers to defeat any enemy on any battlefield.

What long military tradition do the Sikhs have in the United States Army that has allowed beards and turbans to be described as "long and traditional" ?

We allowed folks to have beards during the civil war - why not now - there is a LONG tradition of letting troops have facial hair. In fact - American warriors have been able to have facial hair for longer than they have NOT been able to have facial hair. We had a pretty good history of Americans taking their own arms into battle too but we put an end to that craziness as well.

I'm not against "history and tradition" when it makes sense and does not impede actual - battle field proven - combat readiness.
...do the russians still have a doctrine that suggests they may slime the FEBA before they advance their columns?
If so - your hair and headgear better fit under a mask that seals - because "your god" may protect you from chemical and biological weapons but "my god" has warned me not to tempt his divinity with such foolishness as "gotta have a turban and beard because 'muh religion will protect me from harm"

Enough already.

Prepare your mind and body to kill people and break their shit. Prepare yourself to place hardship and uncertainty on their innocent populace to discredit their leaders and objectives. Prepare yourself to accept a level of collateral damage when the enemy starts building tanks in a civilian factory. Prepare yourself to say "cleared hot" on the enemy position that is attacking your unit even when you know that a few civilians might get baked by the fireball...

...or fucking stay home and go to the mall.

[1stindoor]

Before you know it they’ll cave to “wear whatever the hell you want to…”. It’ll be something like an everyday ComiCon. :munchin

Brother...you have no idea how close to the truth you are.

[Badger52]

Just a few thoughts...
Now that's by God motivation to go shave, right there.
:cool: