View Full Version : Threat Finance
A question for a quiet professional - what kind of value could someone with a background in threat finance, anti money laundering, OFAC sanctions, etc bring to a team? Is there use for that kind of skillset from a member of a team or would that person be put to better use in an intelligence-specific MOS / role? i.e., the ability to discern Suspicious Activity Reports, identify networks / patterns, understand financial data, and so forth. Thanks in advance.
Ret10Echo
11-23-2020, 19:26
Not specific to the skill and knowledge you have laid out, I would say that it is impossible to discerne what skills might benefit the team given the myriad of circumstances you might find yourself in. What will matter MORE is your ability to perform in your assigned MOS tasks to the best of your abilities in order to accomplish the mission of the team.
If your desire and drive comes from doing the type of work you express then you should find an organization that specifically needs that.
Thanks Ret10Echo, really appreciate the guidance. If I'm understanding correctly, you're essentially saying there's too many variables in terms of what you might be tasked with to come in with some outside skillset saying "I have to use this". Maybe it'll be helpful, maybe not.
In case of interest, my question comes from reading papers like the one linked below about the "DoD's Role in the Interagency Counter Threat Finance Mission" which says "SOCOM is the DoD CTF lead component for synchronizing DoD CTF activities and operations", and being curious as to if and how SF is involved in that.
Thanks again for the answer
https://ssilrc.army.mil/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/Emerging-DoD-Role-in-the-Interagency-Counter-Threat-Finance-Mission.pdf[/url]
LongWire
11-23-2020, 23:18
There are some really big brains down at SOCOM who work in that area. I’ve sat in on a couple of briefs. If you really want to pursue that, then I would think a degree in accounting should help, and then finding how to apply for a DA Civ job at SOCOM.
At the ODA level, it couldn’t hurt.... however it may not really apply to what situation you may find yourself in. Certainly couldn’t hurt in the 18F or 180A MOS, but you’ll need to be 18 something else first.
Ret10Echo
11-24-2020, 00:13
Thanks Ret10Echo, really appreciate the guidance. If I'm understanding correctly, you're essentially saying there's too many variables in terms of what you might be tasked with to come in with some outside skillset saying "I have to use this". Maybe it'll be helpful, maybe not.
https://ssilrc.army.mil/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/Emerging-DoD-Role-in-the-Interagency-Counter-Threat-Finance-Mission.pdf[/url]
It is not always a direct correlation. Having the ability to leverage experiences in a diverse set of skills is always a plus. It may not be cut and dry but adapting a methodology to the circumstances.
As Longwire mentions, there are paths to take based upon your personal desires and goals.
A question for a quiet professional - what kind of value
Agree with all previous suggestions
I would add that if you do want to serve, your stated strengths might better map to the MI (35 series) branch.
Duties of Army Military Intelligence Analysts
Members of the intelligence community interpret and prepare intelligence to support combat commanders. While it sounds like this job would involve a lot of spy-movie stuff, a lot of the work is very complex and time-consuming.
Intelligence support staff assist in establishing and maintaining systematic, cross-referenced intelligence records and files, receive and process incoming reports and messages, and assist in determining the significance and reliability of incoming information.
Here are the Army MOS's (military occupational specialties) that fall into the Military Intelligence Field:
35F - Intelligence Analyst: Prepares sensitive information and assists in establishing and maintaining systematic, cross-referenced intelligence records and files.
35G - Geospatial Intelligence Imagery Analyst: Uses photography and electronic, mechanical, and optical devices to obtain information from imagery. Obtains intelligence by studying and analyzing pictures and videos.
35L - Counter Intelligence Agent: The Counterintelligence (CI) Agent conducts investigations to detect and counter terrorist threats. The agent identifies and counters activities of any foreign adversary that poses a threat to Army forces. The agent also provides counterintelligence reports, estimates, threat assessments, and vulnerability.
35M - Human Intelligence (HUMINT) Collector: Conducts source operations, interrogations and debriefings to collect time-sensitive information about enemy forces.
35N - Signals Intelligence (SIGINT) Analyst: Performs analysis and reporting of foreign communications and non-communications and relays that information by producing combat, strategic and tactical intelligence reports.
35P - Cryptologic Linguist: Primarily responsible for identifying foreign communications using signals equipment. This role is crucial as the nation’s defense depends largely on information that comes from foreign languages.
35Q - Cryptologic Network Warfare Specialist: Performs cryptologic digital analysis to establish target identification and operational patterns and identifies, reports, and maintains intelligence information.
35S - Signals Collector/Analyst: Exploits non-voice communications and other electronic signals and provides intelligence reports and primarily responsible for performing the detection, acquisition, location, and identification of foreign electronic intelligence.
35T - Military Intelligence Systems Maintainer/Integrator: Primarily responsible for maintaining and integrating intelligence gathering systems, computers, and networks used by military intelligence (MI) soldiers.
35X - Intelligence Senior Sergeant/Chief Intelligence Sergeant: Supervises intelligence surveillance, collection, analysis, processing, and distribution activities at the group, division, corps, Army, and comparable or higher echelons.
35Y - Counter-Intelligence/Human Intelligence Senior Sergeant: Supervises the collection, processing, development, and dissemination of counterintelligence, counter-signals intelligence, and human intelligence information.
Ret10Echo
11-24-2020, 17:30
Agree with all previous suggestions
I would add that if you do want to serve, your stated strengths might better map to the MI (35 series) branch.
And to foot-stomp on JJ's comment.
The thought : "I want to do _________ AND I want to be an SF Soldier" never was in my head. Being the best SF Soldier was first and foremost from the time I dropped my packet.
Everything else was gravy
Thanks all, definitely appreciate the guidance once again. One of the reasons for the question is a curiosity about how SF would take on the threat of a nation-state actor like China. I have a hard time pulling my mind away from the image of special operations in the undeveloped world of Iraq / Afghanistan / Vietnam / etc but I have to imagine they'd be able to operate in a modern, urban center of Hong Kong, or Taiwan. I don't know what that looks like but if China's goal is to fight an unconventional and asymmetric war where "the battlefield is next to you, and the enemy is on the network - only there is no smell of gunpowder or the odor of blood" "Unrestricted Warfare" (https://www.c4i.org/unrestricted.pdf), I can't help but be curious as to how SF adapts to that.
https://www.c4i.org/unrestricted.pdf
Old Dog New Trick
11-24-2020, 19:48
ABW, without me going into all kinds of, or any detail at all, a Special Forces Team has an entire country’s intelligence apparatus standing behind it. From the three or four experts on the Team, to the Company, Battalion and Group that provides direct support, to an entire level of three letter alphabet agencies in and around Washington DC.
From the eight expert knuckle-draggers that get the job done they are led by three or four senior well educated and experienced experts that have over 15 or more years of experience each in waging the kind of war you mention.
There is a reason U.S. Army Special Forces is the best and most revered conventional and unconventional warfare specialists in the world. It’s not about the 12 guys on the Team. It’s about the hundreds or thousands that stand behind them. Everyone has an important role in the success of a mission.
Maybe you do too. Whether it’s on the ground or providing the intelligence and analysis that supports it.
I can't help but be curious as to how SF adapts to that.
SF?? BTDT,, use your google-fo
" Special Forces Berlin: Clandestine Cold War Operations of the US Army’s Elite, 1956-1990 (Casemate US/UK, Feb 2017) by James Stejskal. "
and
H-912 transport container for Mk-54, SADM
Surprisingly there are a bunch of these crusty old bastards still with us
and the game(s) continue
:munchin
ABW, without me going into all kinds of, or any detail at all, a Special Forces Team has an entire country’s intelligence apparatus standing behind it. .
Thanks Old Dog New Trick - definitely provides an expansion of my vision / understanding of what's at work and how pieces fit together.
SF?? BTDT,, use your google-fo
Wow, these are both fascinating. I went ahead and bought the "Special Forces Berlin" book just now, looking forward to reading it. Also had no idea about the story of the Green Light Teams.
You also led me to the below quote from another part of this forum that I found interesting -
"Special Forces Berlin: Clandestine Cold War Operations of the US Army's Elite, 1956–1990" by James Stejskal
Considering how little the world knows about DET-A and the resurgence of Cold War 2.0 in Eastern Europe that renews their relevancy
H-912 transport container for Mk-54, SADM
:munchin
Not seeing the SADAM container, JJ.
Badger52
11-26-2020, 15:05
Surprisingly there are a bunch of these crusty old bastards still with us
and the game(s) continue
:munchinCouple of those bring back real memories; I can still see those damn hippies strollin' in & out of Andrews Kaserne, in their fancy local threads.
That town and the surrounding AO was Wild West (or East) back then.
Wheee doggies.
:D
Not seeing the SADAM container, JJ.
Gotta keep some secrets :D
All I can say is - I know who I'm not putting in charge of the Op Fund.
tom kelly
11-27-2020, 14:36
Gotta keep some secrets :D
I wonder how many of those containers with triggers are still in the possession of ?
Gotta keep some secrets :D
I never saw one out of the shipping container. My first gig on Oki once my Secret came through was guarding two EOD guys in bomb suits much like the one used today by LEOs. Turns out that they were training to disarm a Davy Crockett. (I didn't know what it was at the time.) It was mid to late May and I had rolled-up sleeves. They had small tubes at the end of their "sleeves" and "cuffs". Water was running out of them like crazy. We were there a long time. ;)
I ran the CTF as well as the Counter Narcoterrorism and Counter Transnational Organized Crime teams at SOCOM until I retired in Feb. We trained some SF Groups in CTF for specific deployments. We trained the 18s and well as the Intel folks. The best folks I saw that could do the mission were the 18s followed by the SEALs, they immediately saw the nexus and how they could identify the bad guy's sourcing. The reason they are so good is their nonconventional background and thinking (nonlinear). Intel folks tend to think in the linear, A then B then C then D, and get confused when it goes in vastly different directions.
Ah, the stories I can't tell...
Joker (or any others), would you happen to know where I could track down case studies or other reading material about how financial intelligence translates to action on the ground, and/or vice versa? I've found books like "Harpoon" to be informative along those lines. Would be especially interested in anything in the context of SF Groups but understand if that's reaching too far. Just hoping to uncover any stories you can tell.
The DEA's Targeting of Hezbollah's Global Criminal Support Network | The Washington Institute (https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/deas-targeting-hezbollahs-global-criminal-support-network)
Money Laundering at Lebanese Bank With Ties to Hezbollah - Graphic - NYTimes.com (https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011/12/13/world/middleeast/lebanese-money-laundering.html)
Lebanese Bank Is Accused of Money Laundering - The New York Times (nytimes.com) (https://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/11/world/middleeast/11hezbollah.html)
Beirut Bank Seen as a Hub of Hezbollah’s Financing - The New York Times (nytimes.com) (https://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/14/world/middleeast/beirut-bank-seen-as-a-hub-of-hezbollahs-financing.html)
Also search for Robert Mazur.
Everything we did was working with law enforcement. What the Groups did, they did.
Roguish Lawyer
12-18-2020, 09:49
A question for a quiet professional - what kind of value could someone with a background in threat finance, anti money laundering, OFAC sanctions, etc bring to a team? Is there use for that kind of skillset from a member of a team or would that person be put to better use in an intelligence-specific MOS / role? i.e., the ability to discern Suspicious Activity Reports, identify networks / patterns, understand financial data, and so forth. Thanks in advance.
I can't imagine teams needing this at all. These skills are needed at banks and other financial institutions. It's Treasury, not DOD.
I can't imagine teams needing this at all. These skills are needed at banks and other financial institutions. It's Treasury, not DOD.
The banks already have these sections built in, to varying degrees. Treasury to an extent (FinCEN) as well as the federal LEAs do investigations. SOF has used it to identify when IEDs were going to be employed (up-tick in $$) and ultimately rolling up the IED cell. There are other instances too.
Treasury has the responsibility for sanctions and financial designations.
State has the responsibility for demarches and terrorist designations.
FBI has the responsibility for funding of terrorism.
HSI has the responsibility for bulk shipment of cash.
DEA has the responsibility for drug, and drug nexus to terrorism, money.
DOD has the responsibility for CTF in a conflict area.
Everything we did was working with law enforcement. What the Groups did, they did.
Thanks for this. This is really interesting stuff to dig through. One of the things that keeps standing out reading through this is the idea of the "convergence" of actors and threats (and also the convergence of resources to combat them).
"Of the sixty-eight groups designated as Foreign Terrorist Organizations by the State Department, the DEA has linked twenty-five of them to the drug trade"
Colombian cartels > Hezbollah > IRGC > Syria/Assad > Iran > etc...
From the very limited perspective of the seat I sit in, I'm interpreting that as having something to do with what you're saying about why the non conventional background of "18s" could be of particular advantage here.
Intel NCO
12-26-2020, 21:37
Thanks for this. This is really interesting stuff to dig through. One of the things that keeps standing out reading through this is the idea of the "convergence" of actors and threats (and also the convergence of resources to combat them).
"Of the sixty-eight groups designated as Foreign Terrorist Organizations by the State Department, the DEA has linked twenty-five of them to the drug trade"
Colombian cartels > Hezbollah > IRGC > Syria/Assad > Iran > etc...
From the very limited perspective of the seat I sit in, I'm interpreting that as having something to do with what you're saying about why the non conventional background of "18s" could be of particular advantage here.
Don't even get me started on how the drug trade into Europe from South America via Africa fuels terrorism. The nexus between terrorism and criminal activity is well known. Hell, a group formerly run by MBM (took a bunch of French and other hostages in Algeria years ago) was actually called the "Cocaine Jihadists."
I could rant- but will not do so in this venue. Also- your statement about State and DEA indicates a level of information potentially not available to end users or higher customers in the form of fused analysis. It would be worth your time to reach out and forge those connections.
It would be worth your time to reach out and forge those connections.
Makes sense. In light of the below breakdown I can certainly see how those connections would be valuable. I also think civilians in certain roles could and do benefit from that type of fused understanding, eg a bank compliance officer. It's too easy to get tunnel vision and forget (or miss altogether) the context you're working under which, I think, results in missed opportunities.
Treasury has the responsibility for sanctions and financial designations.
State has the responsibility for demarches and terrorist designations.
FBI has the responsibility for funding of terrorism.
HSI has the responsibility for bulk shipment of cash.
DEA has the responsibility for drug, and drug nexus to terrorism, money.
DOD has the responsibility for CTF in a conflict area.