View Full Version : Figure this is the right forum to post this
It is NOT breaking news per say. That's why Im posting here. Expected? Yes. The obivious stated? Yes. Old crap? Yes. Posturing, because of the election success in Iraq (God Bless those that lost thier lives trying to vote and protect same). Da libs are workin' it.... LOL Surprise surprise. This will even get BETTER in the days to come. :cool:
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/afp/20050130/pl_afp/iraqvoteusdemocrats_050130214839
http://www.nypost.com/news/worldnews/39526.htm
This all came from the Drudge Report site..... I realize there is tons more.
Just from an older guy.... this is GREAT ummmmmm stuff. It is what "De Oppresso Liber" is all about!!!
It is NOT breaking news per say. That's why Im posting here. Expected? Yes. The obivious stated? Yes. Old crap? Yes. Posturing, because of the election success in Iraq (God Bless those that lost thier lives trying to vote and protect same). Da libs are workin' it.... LOL Surprise surprise. This will even get BETTER in the days to come. :cool:
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/afp/20050130/pl_afp/iraqvoteusdemocrats_050130214839
I'm sorry 12B4S, I read the article and see nothing so controvertial other than "way off base as usual Kennedy." The fact that this is this just a beginning and perhaps the hardest part is still ahead: installing a self-sufficient government of Iraqi, for Iraqi and by Iraqi. This is what I said yesterday without refering to political parties. You have interjected U.S. politics into the pot. Don't reject or accept what someone says based only upon whether they have an "R" or "D" after their name. As much as I detest the traitor, Kerry pretty well mirrors my thoughts on this one. :munchin
Goggles Pizano
01-31-2005, 08:20
QRQ,
Are you suggesting then that if someone praises what the Iraqis have accomplished that they are somehow interjecting their political beliefs?? I don't believe that observing history in the making, and praising the intestinal fortitude of the people involved regardless of one's political affiliation, should be discounted as "taking sides" if you will. Pessimism is one approach countered by optimism obviously. Which you prefer to take is your choice. It does seem though that many of the naysayers since the beginning of the operation have taken the pessimistic approach. I, like 12B4S, find that amusing. Would you agree that despite Iraq's future difficulties of setting up a government, drafting a constitution, and bringing together a people into a democracy this vote is cause for a little chest thumping from the military and administration?
QRQ,
Are you suggesting then that if someone praises what the Iraqis have accomplished that they are somehow interjecting their political beliefs?? I don't believe that observing history in the making, and praising the intestinal fortitude of the people involved regardless of one's political affiliation, should be discounted as "taking sides" if you will. Pessimism is one approach countered by optimism obviously. Which you prefer to take is your choice. It does seem though that many of the naysayers since the beginning of the operation have taken the pessimistic approach. I, like 12B4S, find that amusing. Would you agree that despite Iraq's future difficulties of setting up a government, drafting a constitution, and bringing together a people into a democracy this vote is cause for a little chest thumping from the military and administration?
You may want to go back and re-read the cited news article:
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=sto...ts_050130214839
I don't see the failure to observe history, the failure to praise the Iraqi people. I don't see the pessimism. Help me, where did I miss it. I see no resentment of military chest beating. Again help me.
With the exception of Kennedy, it seems that all are observing history, praising the Iraqi and giving due credit to the military.
What I see is Democrats saying basically what the Republicans say. In the future there will be political in-fighting over who is going to take the credit, but they both agree that there is credit to be taken.
Again, I'm not pessimistic. I am rather realistic in realizing that this is the beginning and not the end.
To me, one of the most impressive things I saw was the Iraqi voters proudly displaying the indelible marks on their fingers, as if to thumb their noses at the insurgent's threats.
I don't wave political flags, I wave the flag of what I think is right.
Goggles Pizano
01-31-2005, 11:08
Not trying to be cross with you Sir, just trying to reinforce 12B4S's point that Kerry and other's have been...well...reserved in their response as have many Democratic leaders. Kennedy is on Mars but he has been there from the forefront so I ignore him.
Kerry's quote not to "overhype" and the insistance that this be an "international effort at diplomacy" appears to be pessimistic hence my argument. Evan Bayh went as far as to imply he is "concerned that, given the past mistakes, this leadership team is capable of that (Bush admin's effort)". Carl Levin is pushing the idea of exit strategy now after Biden emphatically states we should remain to finish the job (unbelievable from him as we in my state know him well).
With regard to chest thumping I think both the military and Administration deserve credit for carrying this election to fruition. Now it's up to the Iraqi people.
Let me try again:
Massachusetts Senator John Kerry (news - web sites), who lost the November presidential election against Republican President George W. Bush, described the Iraqi elections as "significant" and "important" but said they should not be "overhyped."
"It is significant that there is a vote in Iraq," Kerry said in an interview with NBC television's Meet the Press. "But ... no one in the United States should try to overhype this election.
The key word being "OVER HYPE" I agree.
This election is a sort of demarcation point, and what really counts now is the effort to have a legitimate political reconciliation," Kerry said. "And it's going to take a massive diplomatic effort and a much more significant outreach to the international community than this administration has been willing to engage in.
"Absent that, we will not be successful in Iraq," he said.
Agree somewhat, but I feel the rest of the world will get on the band wagon when they see success without our reaching out and kissing their behinds.
erry also said he did not support fellow Massachusetts Senator Ted Kennedy's call last week for the immediate pullout of at least 12,000 US troops from Iraq following the elections.
"I wouldn't do a specific timetable, but I certainly agree with (Kennedy) in principle, that the goal must be to withdraw American troops," Kerry said.
Another influential Democrat, Delaware Senator Joseph Biden, a member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, also rejected Kennedy's call for an immediate withdrawal of some American forces.
Agree!!
"I think pulling American forces out now would be, quite frankly, a serious mistake," Biden said on CBS television's Face the Nation. "I think it's much too premature. I think there would be a collapse, quite frankly, of any sense of order in the country."
Agree --
Indiana Senator Evan Bayh, whose name has been mentioned as a possible presidential candidate in 2008, described the Iraqi elections as a "great day for democracy" but cautioned that "this is only one step in what is going to be a long and difficult process."
"It's a good day, but we need to see it through to a successful conclusion," Bayh said.
Agree!
"And frankly, I'm concerned, given some of the past mistakes, whether this leadership team will be capable of that."
The leadership is capable but has made mistakes. Cheap political shot!
He said he disagreed with Kennedy's call for the start of a US troop withdrawal from Iraq. "We've planted our flag," Bayh said. "I think that we need to be successful now, and unfortunately that's going to require our presence for some time.
"I think to cut and run at this juncture would be a terrible mistake."
Agree!!
Michigan Senator Carl Levin, a member of the Senate Armed Services Committee (news - web sites), said, challenges remain.
I agree!!
"I'm afraid there were some areas where the turnout is extremely low, and that's the Sunni Triangle areas or parts thereof," he said. "And that's the challenge that we now face.
Wrong! Even in the SUNI areas turnout was 40+%
"But Iraqis that did turn out in large numbers, at least in some areas and in some places, took their lives in their hands in doing so, and we're very delighted with that," he said.
Agree!!
Levin said it was too early to talk about a troop withdrawal. "I think that is putting the cart a little bit ahead of the horse," he said.
Agree!! Also the Rep. viewpoint.
"As important as it is that we finally obtain some kind of an exit strategy, we have to negotiate that with the sovereign government and see whether or not the Iraqis will step up to their own security as well.
"We've got to see whether or not the Iraqi people will put their lives on the line in joining the security forces," Levin said. "There are very few trained Iraqi security forces in Iraq. That is a huge challenge."
By showing up to vote the Iraqi have shown that they are willing to put their lives on the line.
There is a lot of rhetoric here with opposite sides saying basically the same thing but trying to make it look like they are right and the other siide wrong.
Sure a little bit of self congratulation is in order. But I still keep visions of a runner beginning his celebration on the 5 yard line and fumbling on the one. Scoring a touchdown or first down is cause for pats on the back and handshakes, but hold the party for the final win!!The above is the article to which I referred. Any other comments came from other sources.
Goggles Pizano
01-31-2005, 14:22
By showing up to vote the Iraqi have shown that they are willing to put their lives on the line.
There is a lot of rhetoric here with opposite sides saying basically the same thing but trying to make it look like they are right and the other siide wrong.
Sure a little bit of self congratulation is in order. But I still keep visions of a runner beginning his celebration on the 5 yard line and fumbling on the one. Scoring a touchdown or first down is cause for pats on the back and handshakes, but hold the party for the final win!!The above is the article to which I referred. Any other comments came from other sources.
Roger that Sir.
I'm sorry 12B4S, I read the article and see nothing so controvertial other than "way off base as usual Kennedy." The fact that this is this just a beginning and perhaps the hardest part is still ahead: installing a self-sufficient government of Iraqi, for Iraqi and by Iraqi. This is what I said yesterday without refering to political parties. You have interjected U.S. politics into the pot. Don't reject or accept what someone says based only upon whether they have an "R" or "D" after their name. As much as I detest the traitor, Kerry pretty well mirrors my thoughts on this one. :munchin
Terry, What I posted wasn't intended to interject U.S. politics into the pot. I know damn well there is a long road to hoe over there. This recent election was an incredible event in history, especially in our life time. What I was trying to say through this infernal machine was, watch the far lefties, they will be a great source of entertainment. The lieberman's and Zeller's and such are more like the old Dems. I do not accept or reject what people say based on a "R" or a "D" after there name. I simply believe in what I choose to believe, in other words common sense.
That's what Goggles Pizano was getting at. Don't have to go back to far, just the last election here. The libs and most media interject themselves into the pot. Any move toward the middle by the clintons, kerry, and a ton more is nothing but political posturing. "The Pot" in Iraq consists of our guys layin' it on the line and the Iraqis, thier cops, soldiers and citizens, "R" and "D" don't mean crap to them. I was praising thier guts and after some negative lib comments back here... just saying there will be more. That's all.
And Thank you for service Terry. :)
I'm sorry 12B. I was merely commenting in what I saw in the article cited. As for the ongoing trend of conflict, I agree, It is just that I saw nothing contentious in the particular article. That is why I went back and commented on the article line by line.
Yes Da Libs are working on it. Again, I was merely commenting on the particular article. Now they have their wind they are on the attack again. The danger we can fall into is inadvertantly attacking our own ideas because of the source. No one can be wrong all of the time!
BTW: Please don't take my comments personally. I enjoy discussing issues not attacking others. :munchin
I'm sorry 12B. I was merely commenting in what I saw in the article cited. As for the ongoing trend of conflict, I agree, It is just that I saw nothing contentious in the particular article. That is why I went back and commented on the article line by line.
Yes Da Libs are working on it. Again, I was merely commenting on the particular article. Now they have their wind they are on the attack again. The danger we can fall into is inadvertantly attacking our own ideas because of the source. No one can be wrong all of the time!
BTW: Please don't take my comments personally. I enjoy discussing issues not attacking others. :munchin
It's cool Terry, no offense taken. You were quite thorough. :) I agree with alot of what you posted, based on comments in that article. I just believe that some of these folks say what they figure is going to further thier ambitions to try to regain thier power and don't feel it in thier heart and soul. Especially, the kerry's, pellozi's, boxer's and so on. (kennedy the lush is a given). These people use our military, (that are fighting, dying, working thier asses off in all sorts of recontstruction, training, protection, hunting and so on...) as a political stepping stone. At the same time, they despise the Military. As far as "no one can be wrong all of the time", I disagree when it comes to some of these pinheads, but I will also leave it alone. :D
OK, enough of that, I doubt there is a person on this site that doesn't know that in one form or another.
Terry. Came across a website several months ago. You may have as well, but just in case. Ah, never mind. I see it came from the Teamhouse website. A renovation pic of Flint. I know you saw that one,but trying to get the pics from those days from my ex and ex Mother in law. when I can I'll send.
Thanks for the discussion,
Brad
While re-reading that post. I can't get past the pelozi's, boxer's thing. Bet they're in one helluva knot . :D