Verdict

[SouthernDZ]

There's no better metaphor for San Francisco's liberal policies than last evening's verdict where the rights of an illegal alien were protected above all else and there was no justice for this young woman, an American citizen. Let's hope this left coast city can still be crippled in a civil suit.

[Box]

Lets not beat ourselves up over this - the left went about the business of corrupting the legal and judicial systems generations ago. This is just those efforts finally bearing fruit in a public forum.

The story of Kitty Genovese is a parallel to the way liberals treat crime. They don't want to get involved, they are afraid of consequence. They favor feigned compassion and inaction to anything that vaguely resembles decency and justice.

The people on the left side of this nations political spectrum are morally and ethically corrupt and for the most part they are opposed to ANY level of justice that might detract from their ability to "feel good" or have a good time.

...as long as the votes are in my favor, my aide doesn't blab to the press that I am fucking my employees, and the media champions my cause when I get busted, life will be just fine.

[Golf1echo]

Exactly right, utter madness! Terrible tragedy all around. I can't help think where this will go, it's bad there now, it will become absolutely hellish. Why anyone would do this to the society they live in is beyond contemplation.

[Team Sergeant]

You can't entice cheap mexican slave labor by throwing them in prison. Someone has to pick the avocados, wash the restaurant dishes and do the landscaping. Sure as fuck will not be a white/black californian that does those slave labor jobs.

California, land of the sanctuary cities and the "elites".

[Chucko]

Thinking about this case off and on for two years now, I never ever would have thought anything less than manslaughter would prevail. If I would have pulled the trigger I can guarantee I would at least 10 years. They must have had a very incompetent prosecutor.
Just goes to show you how screwed up this system is today.

[Box]

Don't kid yourself Chucko - the system is functioning EXACTLY the way that Californians want it to function.

If you come upon a scene and there is a broken window - next to the broken window is a liberal standing next to a rock...
...the window is not defective. Liberals would have you believe it is the windows fault.

[bblhead672]

Can't find the article now but seen earlier the feds may charge him. Been deported several tiems, had possesion of a firearm in publc etc. Plenty of federal laws to nail him with.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/12/01/doj-weighing-federal-charges-in-kate-steinle-murder-case-after-not-guilty-verdict.html
U.S. immigration officials had said they would deport Garcia Zarate – also known as Juan Francisco Lopez Sanchez -- who already had been deported five times and was wanted for a sixth deportation when Steinle was fatally shot in the back while walking with her father.

[Old Dog New Trick]

Look on the bright side, California has just created a new definition of case law.

Garcia Zarate vs. The State of California: No person can reasonably be held accountable for the unlawful and unintentional discharge of a firearm that results in the death or serious injury to others. Proximity to others, location or city ordinances and laws banning the intentional or unintentional discharge of firearms is no longer a prosecutorial offense.

All those people who’ve been charged and convicted of killing or maiming someone while handling a firearm that discharged by: manual manipulation, dropping, twirling, caressing, showing off, playing with (loaded, unloaded, or condition unknown) or otherwise shooting one off into the sky...should have their conviction overturned and be set free immediately.

If there was no intent there cannot be a crime.

I’m certain the Ninth Circuit will uphold the decision of the jury against all appeals brought by the (Trump) DOJ.

Note: Even more troubling that you have to deep search the news for this story.

[PSM]

"Forget it, Jake. It's California."

California Governor Jerry Brown To Allow HIV Positive People To Donate Blood

California Governor Jerry Brown is expected to give a green light to a bill allowing HIV positive people to knowingly expose their blood to others.

The bill, SB 239, will reduce the penalties for knowingly exposing someone to HIV without telling them, allowing HIV positive people to donate their blood to others. Lawmakers claim the current felony charge for the crime is ‘discriminatory.’

Foxnews.com reports: State Sen. Scott Wiener, a San Francisco Democrat who introduced the bill, said the current law discriminates against people with HIV because people who expose others with different viruses get only a misdemeanor rather than a felony.

“Right now HIV is singled out for uniquely harsh treatment as a felony,” Wiener said during the floor debate, according to the L.A. Times. He added that modern drugs allow someone with HIV to be noninfectious to others, while the felony charge may discourage some from getting tested.

“These laws do not prevent HIV infections. All they do is stigmatize people living with HIV and reduce access to testing and care.”

http://yournewswire.com/california-jerry-brown-hiv-blood/

Pat

[35NCO]

What was the permitted and presented evidence?

I saw clips discussing that the Sig did not have an external safety which makes me think they were trying to argue it's too easy to discharge and betting on a juries lack of firearms knowlege.

Also, if it was a so called ricochet that killed her what was the trajectory, velocity, and projectile forensics to prove so?


Answering my questions: https://www.redstate.com/sarah-rumpf/2017/11/30/lied-kate-steinle-case/

Lots of push on the gun and dangers of gun safety....because all those police NDs could only be caused by a defective firearm. /sarc

[Team Sergeant]

A bullet that ricochets still must be pointed in that same general direction, especially if the bullet remains intact and with energy to kill.

And before we have a long discussion about bullets ricocheting “straight back”, know this, the lead bullet didn’t ricochet/bounce "straight back" off the concrete or steel, the brass jacket does. (You can view this phenomena via high speed camera video)

And yeah, I’ve been hit with a full bullet “bouncing” off a steel belted “tire” in a shoot house, smarted a bit but didn’t have energy left to kill.

And that brass jacket doesn’t kill, the lead does. I’ve been hit dozens of time by pieces of brass jacket “bouncing” off steel straight back and I’ve heard of folks getting injured by the brass jacket, but not killed.

[Old Dog New Trick]

A bullet that ricochets still must be pointed in that same general direction, especially if the bullet remains intact and with energy to kill.

And before we have a long discussion about bullets ricocheting “straight back”, know this, the lead bullet didn’t ricochet/bounce "straight back" off the concrete or steel, the brass jacket does. (You can view this phenomena via high speed camera video)

And yeah, I’ve been hit with a full bullet “bouncing” off a steel belted “tire” in a shoot house, smarted a bit but didn’t have energy left to kill.

And that brass jacket doesn’t kill, the lead does. I’ve been hit dozens of time by pieces of brass jacket “bouncing” off steel straight back and I’ve heard of folks getting injured by the brass jacket, but not killed.

I’ve been hit numerous times and know of many others who have been hit by bullet fragments coming back from bullet traps both rubber and steel. Yep, it smarts but nothing worse than a bruise or small cut to the skin. ETA: and I’m talking distances of three to twenty yards.

I can’t remember but I thought she got hit (shot) in the head. Kinda makes for a high angle ricochet and an improbable killing velocity. Would like to see the forensic evidence gathered to support the defense.

[35NCO]

[QUOTE=Team Sergeant;636080]A bullet that ricochets ....QUOTE]

This is what I was getting at. I agree for the most part. I disagree in that I think it is not impossible to kill with a jacket ricochet. It must depend on where the hit is, energy, and how it threatens the vitals of the body.

I know first hand of a competition incident where a jacket penetrated the shooter that had a surprising amount of penetration. It was surgically removed at the hospital. It was about a third of a 9mm jacket that ricocheted off of steel at 20 meters. Everything seems it should not have happened with that kind of energy and distance, including the angle of the steel. If it had hit the neck, it could have created a fatal situation. (PSA: Always wear eyepro!)

I do recall an IDPA incident of a ricochet hitting the neck of a safety that required hospitalization....I will have to look for the source. May have been reported on TFB or one of those sites. There was a YouTube video of the incident.

I know there was a case in England of a stray lead pellet rifle pellet killing a woman by lodging in her neck. I do not know all the detail of that, but it was small and not very high velocity. It was a tragic freak accident, took place at the old home of Pink Floyds recording studio, by a new family that purchased the home from them.

I wonder in this case the evidence of the projectile. I also wonder if the weapon still contained the BLM rounds in the magazine. .165 JHP .40. What makes them certain the projectile that killed her was indeed a ricochet?

Its all armchair at this point, it could have really been an accident and or she really was killed by a ricochet. Its tragic and terrible no matter the conclusion.

The above is just IMO. I am not a ballistic or medical expert. I have some related professional experience to draw my conclusions or rather, my questions.

[Team Sergeant]

[QUOTE=Team Sergeant;636080]A bullet that ricochets ....QUOTE]

This is what I was getting at. I agree for the most part. I disagree in that I think it is not impossible to kill with a jacket ricochet. It must depend on where the hit is, energy, and how it threatens the vitals of the body.

I know first hand of a competition incident where a jacket penetrated the shooter that had a surprising amount of penetration. It was surgically removed at the hospital. It was about a third of a 9mm jacket that ricocheted off of steel at 20 meters. Everything seems it should not have happened with that kind of energy and distance, including the angle of the steel. If it had hit the neck, it could have created a fatal situation. (PSA: Always wear eyepro!)

I do recall an IDPA incident of a ricochet hitting the neck of a safety that required hospitalization....I will have to look for the source. May have been reported on TFB or one of those sites. There was a YouTube video of the incident.

I know there was a case in England of a stray lead pellet rifle pellet killing a woman by lodging in her neck. I do not know all the detail of that, but it was small and not very high velocity. It was a tragic freak accident, took place at the old home of Pink Floyds recording studio, by a new family that purchased the home from them.

I wonder in this case the evidence of the projectile. I also wonder if the weapon still contained the BLM rounds in the magazine. .165 JHP .40. What makes them certain the projectile that killed her was indeed a ricochet?

Its all armchair at this point, it could have really been an accident and or she really was killed by a ricochet. Its tragic and terrible no matter the conclusion.

The above is just IMO. I am not a ballistic or medical expert. I have some related professional experience to draw my conclusions or rather, my questions.



And I’m sure if you search the internet long enough you’ll find some story of someone killed by a Chihuahua. Let me know when you find yours.:rolleyes:



Any bullet that ricocheted enough to change its original trajectory would have been damaged in that action.

I’d like to read the ballistics report of her death.

[Bleed Green]

And yeah, I’ve been hit with a full bullet “bouncing” off a steel belted “tire” in a shoot house, smarted a bit but didn’t have energy left to kill.


One of the tools we use are old truck tires strung together to form a triangle with a few cable clamps and some half inch cable. We pull these behind our trucks to wipe away sign and make it easier to cut sign of people crossing. When I was stationed in Az me and a new guy got the enviable task of building these tire drags in the middle of July. He decided that the hole saw we were using was taking way too much time and pulled out his 357 and tried to shoot a hole in the tire. Needless to say that was the last time he tried that stupid stunt as the ricochet hit him just right of the crotch.

My one question after reading this bit of California justice as usual is will California honor the ICE detainer that everybody knows they have on this waste of skin?

[Badger52]

This is the flip-side of their "...but if it saves even one life!" argument.
F that place - nuke it from orbit.

If I were her Dad that guy would need the mother of all PSD's (and a Romulan cloaking device) around him 24/7.

[Ret10Echo]

FYI

The Department of Justice unsealed an arrest warrant Friday for Jose Inez Garcia Zarate, the illegal immigrant acquitted Thursday in Kate Steinle’s murder trial


Here (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/12/01/doj-files-arrest-warrant-for-illegal-immigrant-acquitted-in-kate-steinle-case.html)

[SF_BHT]

FYI

The Department of Justice unsealed an arrest warrant Friday for Jose Inez Garcia Zarate, the illegal immigrant acquitted Thursday in Kate Steinle’s murder trial


Here (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/12/01/doj-files-arrest-warrant-for-illegal-immigrant-acquitted-in-kate-steinle-case.html)

Oh yes... He is going to the Western District of Texas. :eek: He is going to a completely different world that will deal with this quite differently.:D. Finally a good DOJ decision.....

[cbtengr]

FYI

The Department of Justice unsealed an arrest warrant Friday for Jose Inez Garcia Zarate, the illegal immigrant acquitted Thursday in Kate Steinle’s murder trial


Here (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/12/01/doj-files-arrest-warrant-for-illegal-immigrant-acquitted-in-kate-steinle-case.html)

Would it be to much of a stretch to think that Kalifornia would fight the feds when it comes to turning him over? This whole business is sickening. As a country we took back the WH, it's up to the citizens of California to take back their state.

[7624U]

I think it was lower back and exiting the stomach. I call bullshit on richoche

If it was a pistol round defiantly BS with a exit wound from a ricochet.

I have had the full jacket of 9mm round hit me in upper leg and penetrate my pants in BDU's but no skin penetration just a small cut. this was off bullet traps in windows at around 3 meters. (hurt like hell and I was glad it did not hit my junk)

more important sighting I watched a FMJ 5.56 ricochet off a rock right out the barrel of a guy in the prone it pulled the jacket off and the core exploded into the rock the jacket did a 90 degree and hit a Korean soldier that was also in the prone in his backside. It penetrated his cloths and hit him right in the spine caused some light bleeding but the heat of the round is what made him scream not the damage it did. This was all within 3-5 feet of the barrel of the M-4. even if it hit him in the face it would have only lodged into meat maybe 1/2 inch from the wound I looked at on the Korean it was merely a flesh wound. and that was from a rifle almost point blank.

[Badger52]

Well, they could roll up to the jail with overwhelming force and say, "Hi, y'all - we're the Article IV, Section 2 Committee. Give 'im up."

[Surf n Turf]

I'm concerned about the law, as I understand it.

US Constitution, Fifth Amendment
The Double Jeopardy Clause of the Fifth Amendment to the United States Constitution provides: "Nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb . . . ."[1] The four essential protections included are prohibitions against, for the same offense:

retrial after an acquittal;
retrial after a conviction;
retrial after certain mistrials; and
multiple punishment

State Charges
He was acquitted of first- and second-degree murder
He was acquitted of involuntary manslaughter
He was (acquitted) found not guilty of assault with a semi-automatic weapon
He was Found Guilty of possessing a firearm by a felon.

Fed Charges (pending)
Charges of a felon in possession of a firearm
Involuntary manslaughter
Assault with a deadly weapon

If the Feds charge this person, doesn't this state trial count,.... and wouldn't the Fed charges constitute "double jeopardy" on this piece of human garbage.

SnT

[Remington Raidr]

I'm concerned about the law, as I understand it.

US Constitution, Fifth Amendment
The Double Jeopardy Clause of the Fifth Amendment to the United States Constitution provides: "Nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb . . . ."[1] The four essential protections included are prohibitions against, for the same offense:

retrial after an acquittal;
retrial after a conviction;
retrial after certain mistrials; and
multiple punishment

State Charges
He was acquitted of first- and second-degree murder
He was acquitted of involuntary manslaughter
He was (acquitted) found not guilty of assault with a semi-automatic weapon
He was Found Guilty of possessing a firearm by a felon.

Fed Charges (pending)
Charges of a felon in possession of a firearm
Involuntary manslaughter
Assault with a deadly weapon

If the Feds charge this person, doesn't this state trial count,.... and wouldn't the Fed charges constitute "double jeopardy" on this piece of human garbage.

SnT

The State and the Feds are different "sovereigns". Double jeopardy will NOT be an issue here.

[Old Dog New Trick]

His days remaining on this earth are numbered. What that is I don’t know, but Texas will see that it’s as short as possible.

Now it’s up to Kalifornia to not get in the way of a dead man walking.

[Box]

Just look at how wild the prosecutors are allowed to run in a federal case... they have chased Flynn halfway to the poor house to charge him with lying.


If the last year has shown anything, the FBI is just as corrupt as everyone else in DC
...if the feds want to charge Zarate then he is as good as charged

[frostfire]

How on earth...

Even if we emphatize to the fullest and agree that the down on his luck poor man picked up a gun and inadvertently pulled the trigger (seen it a few times in er by those unfamiliar w pistol), that is STILL an involuntary manslaughter!

So is Clinton did not intend = innocent the new standard of justice?

Are SF residents really comfortable with such precedence where they live?

Madness, utterly disgraceful madness

I can’t imagine how the sheriff staff who released him must have felt
Or better yet, do the judge and jury and attorney go to sleep that night affirming that justice he been served??

[Ret10Echo]

Well, they could roll up to the jail with overwhelming force and say, "Hi, y'all - we're the Article IV, Section 2 Committee. Give 'im up."

They'd just throw gun-free-zone posters at them....