America's Second Civil War

[tonyz]

An interesting article given the left's reaction to the Trump presidency - California secession discussion, sanctuary city/state discussion, national security issues, border issues, trade policy, healthcare policy, tax policy, spending and nation debt/deficit policy, Europe's issues...etc., etc., interesting times...

America’s Second Civil War
Tuesday, Jan 24, 2017
Dennis Prager

It is time for our society to acknowledge a sad truth: America is currently fighting its second Civil War.

In fact, with the obvious and enormous exception of attitudes toward slavery, Americans are more divided morally, ideologically and politically today than they were during the Civil War. For that reason, just as the Great War came to be known as World War I once there was World War II, the Civil War will become known as the First Civil War when more Americans come to regard the current battle as the Second Civil War.

This Second Civil War, fortunately, differs in another critically important way: It has thus far been largely nonviolent. But given increasing left-wing violence, such as riots, the taking over of college presidents’ offices and the illegal occupation of state capitols, nonviolence is not guaranteed to be a permanent characteristic of the Second Civil War.

There are those on both the left and right who call for American unity. But these calls are either naive or disingenuous. Unity was possible between the right and liberals, but not between the right and the left.

Liberalism — which was anti-left, pro-American and deeply committed to the Judeo-Christian foundations of America; and which regarded the melting pot as the American ideal, fought for free speech for its opponents, regarded Western civilization as the greatest moral and artistic human achievement and viewed the celebration of racial identity as racism — is now affirmed almost exclusively on the right and among a handful of people who don’t call themselves conservative.

The left, however, is opposed to every one of those core principles of liberalism.
Like the left in every other country, the left in America essentially sees America as a racist, xenophobic, colonialist, imperialist, warmongering, money-worshipping, moronically religious nation.

Just as in Western Europe, the left in America seeks to erase America’s Judeo-Christian foundations. The melting pot is regarded as nothing more than an anti-black, anti-Muslim, anti-Hispanic meme. The left suppresses free speech wherever possible for those who oppose it, labeling all non-left speech “hate speech.” To cite only one example, if you think Shakespeare is the greatest playwright or Bach is the greatest composer, you are a proponent of dead white European males and therefore racist.

Without any important value held in common, how can there be unity between left and non-left? Obviously, there cannot.

There will be unity only when the left vanquishes the right or the right vanquishes the left. Using the First Civil War analogy, American unity was achieved only after the South was vanquished and slavery was abolished.

How are those of us who oppose left-wing nihilism — there is no other word for an ideology that holds Western civilization and America’s core values in contempt — supposed to unite with “educators” who instruct elementary school teachers to cease calling their students “boys” and “girls” because that implies gender identity? With English departments that don’t require reading Shakespeare in order to receive a degree in English? With those who regard virtually every war America has fought as imperialist and immoral? With those who regard the free market as a form of oppression? With those who want the state to control as much of American life as possible? With those who repeatedly tell America and its black minority that the greatest problems afflicting black Americans are caused by white racism, “white privilege” and “systemic racism”? With those who think that the nuclear family ideal is inherently misogynistic and homophobic? With those who hold that Israel is the villain in the Middle East? With those who claim that the term “Islamic terrorist” is an expression of religious bigotry?

The third significant difference between the First and Second Civil Wars is that in the Second Civil war, one side has been doing nearly all the fighting. That is how it has been able to take over schools — from elementary schools, to high schools, to universities — and indoctrinate America’s young people; how it has taken over nearly all the news media; and how it has taken over entertainment media.

The conservative side has lost on every one of these fronts because it has rarely fought back with anything near the ferocity with which the left fights. Name a Republican politician who has run against the left as opposed to running solely against his or her Democratic opponent. And nearly all American conservatives, people who are proud of America and affirm its basic tenets, readily send their children to schools that indoctrinate their children against everything the parents hold precious. A mere handful protest when their child’s teacher ceases calling their son a boy or their daughter a girl, or makes “slave owner” the defining characteristic of the Founding Fathers.

With the defeat of the left in the last presidential election, the defeat of the left in two-thirds of the gubernatorial elections and the defeat of the left in a majority of House and Senate elections, this is likely the last chance liberals, conservatives and the right have to defeat the American left. But it will not happen until these groups understand that we are fighting for the survival of America no less than the Union troops were in the First Civil War.

http://www.dennisprager.com/americas-second-civil-war/

This column was originally posted on Townhall.com.

[tonyz]

We have arguably been in a domestic Cold War for a long time. The left may now be on a path to drag political differences into the street. What a mess.

[Trapper John]

I was going to post this same article this morning........too slow. :D

Great post Tonyz, and right on target. Prager hits the nail on the head IMO.

And for cross-thread points see my post in the Trump, Trade, and Diplomacy thread.

[tonyz]

TJ read your post in the other thread and concur.

I saw the Prager article and thought it a bit provocative...last week...what a difference a week makes.

The Statist/Globalists and Schumer's of the world are indeed shitting themselves with Trump, Brexit and perhaps Le Pen...

ETA wanna see Statist heads explode - just wait until Trump nominates his pick for the Supreme Court, tonight.

[tonyz]

The excerpt below is from an opinion piece in a U.K. publication - it provides some insight into plans for discomfort and inconvenience - aka more subversion. The entire article at link below.

Forget protest. Trump's actions warrant a general national strike
Francine Prose
The Guardian
Monday 30 January 2017 07.06 EST
Political movements rarely succeed without causing discomfort and inconvenience

Since Trump’s election, we’ve seen dozens of demonstrations – most notably, the Women’s March on Washington – that have reinforced our sense of solidarity and provided encouraging evidence of how many Americans oppose our government’s fundamentally anti-American agenda.

But the trouble is that these protests are too easily ignored and forgotten by those who wish to ignore and forget them. The barriers go up, the march takes place, the barriers come down. Everyone goes home happier.

One reason that Saturday’s protests were so effective was that, while peaceful, they were disruptive. Terminal Four was closed, incoming flights were delayed. One traveller wrote, on Twitter, that his fellow passengers applauded when their pilot announced the reason why their plane would be landing an hour behind schedule.

Taxi drivers went on strike in solidarity with the detainees, and arriving passengers were forced to find alternate ways on getting home. Many used Uber, a company whose CEO, Travis Kalanick, serves on Trump’s economic advisory board, and which thoughtfully suspended “surge pricing” to make it easier and cheaper to subvert the taxi strike.

The struggles for civil rights and Indian independence, against apartheid and the Vietnam war – it’s hard to think of a nonviolent movement that has succeeded without causing its opponents a certain amount of trouble, discomfort and inconvenience.

And economic boycotts – another sort of trouble and inconvenience – have proved remarkably successful in persuading companies to cease supporting repressive governments. Of course, nonviolence has often been met with violence, but one can only hope that our hearts have not so hardened that we, as a nation, would not be troubled and shamed by the spectacle of peaceful people being arrested and bloodied, as they were in Selma and Birmingham.

So what can we do to protest our current government’s callousness about our environment and our health, its rampant greed, its disrespect for life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?

I believe that what we need is a nonviolent national general strike of the kind that has been more common in Europe than here. Let’s designate a day on which no one (that is, anyone who can do so without being fired) goes to work, a day when no one shops or spends money, a day on which we truly make our economic and political power felt, a day when we make it clear: how many of us there are, how strong and committed we are, how much we can accomplish.

Meanwhile, I’m deleting my Uber account and adding Lyft (which donated generously to the ACLU) in its stead. Leaving Uber is not uncomplicated, and it’s taken me the better part of a day to persuade them to let me go. But in the process, the site asks subscribers why they are leaving, and it’s a pleasure – a small pleasure, but a pleasure nonetheless – to let them know.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/30/travel-ban-airport-protests-disruption

[bblhead672]

It's sad all these progressives actually believe the drivel they produce.

[GratefulCitizen]

Trump sees it for what it is.
He's forcing their hand before they're ready.

The Constitution slowed the progressives and globalists just enough to allow for a response which need not be openly violent.
It's almost like the Founding Fathers designed the Constitution that way on purpose...

[cbtengr]

The left has had 24 years of appeasement, Clinton, Bush and Obama, I include Bush because I think he was anything but a fiscal conservative. Now we have DJT and he is handing out some tough love and the lefties are beside themselves. I feel their pain.

[tonyz]

Unhinged and subverting Trump at every turn...excerpt below - complete list of rules at link. Unbelievable.

7 Rules for Resistance
Huffington Post
01/31/2017 11:40 am ET

Now you may think that some of these practices are extreme. End friendships? Shame family members? But let me ask you this: if it were 1933, and you had a friend who was a Nazi fanboy, and you knew the havoc that Hitler would wreak upon the world, is there anything you would stop short of to change his mind? Use that as your guide. Yeah, it’s that kind of emergency. Your cause is just: 7 billion earthlings think so. So be bold; the rest of the planet has your back. Go make your descendants proud.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/7-rules-for-resistance_us_58901202e4b080b3dad6fb08

[cbtengr]

Only 7 Billion?

[Roguish Lawyer]

Spot on

[Badger52]

Go ahead snowflakes; I guarantee the HuffBlo has your back. I don't think I know anyone who would try to shame me and end our friendship publicly over this tripe. My reaction would be like Curly Bill anyway. I feel so alone.

[Paslode]

Trump sees it for what it is.
He's forcing their hand before they're ready.

The Constitution slowed the progressives and globalists just enough to allow for a response which need not be openly violent.
It's almost like the Founding Fathers designed the Constitution that way on purpose...

Trump does seem to be forcing their hand, but what is he going to do with it and how far are people willing to go to back him up?


We have arguably been in a domestic Cold War for a long time. The left may now be on a path to drag political differences into the street. What a mess.

What is going on kind of reminds me of the Arab Spring and the Color Revolutions.

[tonyz]

The support for opposition to the Statist/Globalist agenda appears strong but the left is well organized, well funded and ruthless.

[tonyz]

Well Brush...in 2014, a liberal immigration organization sure thought that Obama had very broad authority in the area of immigration law...

The President’s Broad Legal Authority to Act on Immigration
AUGUST 2014

https://www.nilc.org/issues/immigration-enforcement/execauthorityimm/

[tonyz]

Totally different, it was Obama,. Here is one for you from Cornell law center.

https://www.nilc.org/issues/immigration-enforcement/execauthorityimm/

You miss my point...what is good for the goose...libs should have realized that result oriented reasoning can someday come back to bite them in the ass. That time has come and that is one reason they are wailing so loudly and gnashing teeth...elections have consequences...even for libs...

what is best in life...

"Crush your enemies. See them driven before you. Hear the lamentations of their sissy boy ex-president."

[tonyz]

I didn't miss your point I just didn't think I needed pink font. my link was in support of your post, or was intended that way.

I agree 100%. I like pointing out to liberals that were so happy about the Obama care that Donald Trump is now in charge of their healthcare. I think I am going to give one of them a stoke some day they way their faces turn red

My apologies. Anyway, so much is going to haunt libs..."nuclear option" - "executive authority" etc., etc. ...this is not going to be pretty.

[Flagg]

I have a considerable number of social media contacts, mostly former co-worker peers and employees, who have taken a very active role in immediately protesting the new administration.

The overall group average is strongly supportive of the disruption and inconvenience theme, particularly airports.

I am finding it hard to come up with a worse idea to generate support for an opposition movement than to mess with people traveling for work or personal reasons.

The 90% in the middle will grow to hate them.

So I'm all for the left messing with airport travel, as the negative 1st, 2nd, 3rd order effects for the lefty opposition will "be huuuuuge"(I'm my Trump voice).

I only hope they don't learn from their mistakes and don't iterate.

Much like the horrible failure of the Occupy Movement.

Forget about the nuclear clock, I'd like to see someone take a crack at building one for civil insurrection/war.

[Old Dog New Trick]

I'm just waiting for the lefties to go all "FerguMoreLand" and find out the police have new orders and the DOJ only ask...was there any discrimination involved? No! We treated all the violent protesters the same, and they all bled the same color red.



BTW - whatever happened to Sheriff Clark?

FerguMoreLand = Ferguson+Baltimore+Cleveland

[Divemaster]

CWII? That could also stand for Cold War Part Deaux since the opposing philosphies are about the same as in Cold War, the Prequel. Just like in WWII, the other side got a early start. Only this time that headstart was something like 50+ years.

Let's meet a member of the offensive team. A graduate of Marxist State and expelled from the Socialist Workers for being too radical, it's Socialist Action (https://socialistaction.org/).

Here are some key notes from SA's playbook (on their About page):

Class Struggle & Independence: We believe that the world is divided into opposing social classes, and that the main driving force of modern history is the struggle between the working class and the capitalist class. We are active partisans of the working class and believe in the need for independent working class politics – not alliances with the capitalists, or any wing of that class. That is why we call for workers to break from the Democratic Party to build a Labor Party based on the trade unions (they're coming for you too, Pelosi). In all of our political work we seek to get workers to see and think of themselves in terms of class, and to recognize that their class interests are diametrically opposed to that of the capitalists.

Revolution: We believe that the state and all of its institutions are instruments of the ruling class, and that therefore they cannot be used as tools of the working class, but have to be smashed. That is why we fight for revolution, instead of for seeking to merely reform or work within the system. When we fight for specific reforms we do so only with the understanding that in the final analysis real social change can only come about with the overthrow of capitalism (they mean the US and western civilization), and the establishment of a workers’ government.

Here comes identity politics folks. Divide an conquer. Doesn't this next section sound a lot like every progressive or Democrat you've ever heard?
The Specially Oppressed & Oppressed Nationalities: We support the struggles of those who are specially oppressed under capitalism – women, queers, national minorities, etc. We support and help build autonomous movements for the oppressed so that they can articulate their own demands, and develop political consciousness as a group. We support the right of self-determination for oppressed nationalities, including Blacks, Chicanos & Puerto Ricans.

Permanent Revolution: This famous theory by Leon Trotsky (yes, that Trotsky!) holds that revolution in modern times, even in under-developed countries, has to be led by the working class and has to be a fully fledged socialist revolution – revolution cannot go through stages and cannot be made in alliance with any wing of the capitalist class. To be ultimately successful it also needs to be an international revolution. We believe that a successful socialist revolution will result in a workers’ government that is based on elected workers’ councils.

If you still think they sound like a lovely bunch, this Socialist Action, then I invite you to read this article posted on their website: How to Make a Revolution (https://socialistaction.org/2011/08/12/how-to-make-a-revolution/).

[Old Dog New Trick]

^^^Working Class my ASS! These F_cksticks have never had a real job their entire lives and they want to fight for the right to live off their parents and the system (simply) put forth by capitalists with guilty feelings from their success.

These are the same people that drive a f_cking Prius (with a Gore'08 bumper sticker) in the HOV lane and slow down to the same speed as the general purpose lanes in slog hour filled with the working class to show unity. HOV guilt!!!

Also I thought SA stood for Sal Alinsky or maybe it does. 8-rules for radicals.

Ya know the next thing these SJW are gonna sport is Green Beret so they can say they are fighting for the Oppressed. (Better buy stock in Rainbow tie-dye Che Guvera shirts, there's gonna be run on them.)

[Divemaster]

^^^Working Class my ASS! These F_cksticks have never had a real job their entire lives and they want to fight for the right to live off their parents and the system (simply) put forth by capitalists with guilty feelings from their success.

These are the same people that drive a f_cking Prius (with a Gore'08 bumper sticker) in the HOV lane and slow down to the same speed as the general purpose lanes in slog hour filled with the working class to show unity. HOV guilt!!!

Also I thought SA stood for Sal Alinsky or maybe it does. 8-rules for radicals.

Ya know the next thing these SJW are gonna sport is Green Beret so they can say they are fighting for the Oppressed. (Better buy stock in Rainbow tie-dye Che Guvera shirts, there's gonna be run on them.)

I love your viseral reply, brother! Go to their website (use a proxy!) and really get pissed off. BTW, I always associated SA with Hitler's Sturmabteilung, also called the Brownshirts. To me, this seems apropos given the similar tactics.

[Trapper John]

I love your viseral reply, brother! Go to their website (use a proxy!) and really get pissed off. BTW, I always associated SA with Hitler's Sturmabteilung, also called the Brownshirts. To me, this seems apropos given the similar tactics.

Your and ODNT assessments are right on point! These are the neo-fascists, and the alignment of the progressive Left with these clowns will spell the demise of the Democrat party IMO.

I say that because if you listen to the rhetoric coming from candidates for the DNC Chair, they are doubling down on the failed identity politics.

Liberalism, at least in the sense represented by the likes of Archibald Macleish (1930's) and JFK/RFK (1960s) is dead!

Liberalism of old is being co-opted by organizations like Occupy Democrats (neo-fascists) and they are following Saul Alinsky's playbook. If these fools think that the unions will align with them they have really misread the shifting dynamic here. Even in a union town like Philadelphia, the union leadership is shifting towards the Trump brand of Populism. (The membership did that in the last election).

My guess is that these neo-fascist groups are organized with and by Soros money. I say go for it boys and girls. This will ultimately result in your self-marginalization and I won't have to listen to the likes of Pocahontas Warren or Crooked Hillary ever again!

Bottom line: If Trump is successful, and I believe he will be, there will be a realignment of global politics that will last for at least the next 50 years.

[Streck-Fu]

.... a successful socialist revolution will result in a workers’ government that is based on elected workers’ councils.

Some never learn the lessons from Animal Farm. The Perpetual Revolution only begets a new elite class. Eventually, one of them does not want to let go of the power and kills all the opposition.

[mojaveman]

Forget about the nuclear clock, I'd like to see someone take a crack at building one for civil insurrection/war.

My gut instinct right now is telling me the same. ;)

[Divemaster]

Your and ODNT assessments are right on point! These are the neo-fascists, and the alignment of the progressive Left with these clowns will spell the demise of the Democrat party IMO.

I say that because if you listen to the rhetoric coming from candidates for the DNC Chair, they are doubling down on the failed identity politics.

Liberalism, at least in the sense represented by the likes of Archibald Macleish (1930's) and JFK/RFK (1960s) is dead! Or shellshocked and looking for a home.

Liberalism of old is being co-opted by organizations like Occupy Democrats (neo-fascists) and they are following Saul Alinski's playbook. Alinsky, Cloward & Piven, but most importantly Marx & Trotsky. If these fools think that the unions will align with them they have really misread the shifting dynamic here. Even in a union town like Philadelphia, the union leadership is shifting towards the Trump brand of Populism. (The membership did that in the last election). I don't expect the unions to be onboard with Trump for long. Let's not mistake support for a specific action or policy as a sea change in Union politics. SEIU never did get on board; they were a Women's March on Washington sponsor, if I'm not mistaken.

My guess is that these neo-fascist groups are organized with and by Soros money. I say go for it boys and girls. This will ultimately result in your self-marginalization and I won't have to listen to the likes of Pocahontas Warren or Crooked Hillary ever again!

Bottom line: If Trump is successful, and I believe he will be, there will be a realignment of global politics that will last for at least the next 50 years. I wager that 50 years is far, far too optimistic.

Is the conservative side finially joining the fight? Well, there is no conservative side if we're referring anything resembling an organized political movement. Conservatives tend to come together in short-term crisis mode, then return to their lives once that particular crisis has passed.

[ddoering]

My apologies. Anyway, so much is going to haunt libs..."nuclear option" - "executive authority" etc., etc. ...this is not going to be pretty.

Fuck them. Who cares what they feel.

[tonyz]

No reason whatsoever to care how they feel (particularly after the past 8 years) but we conservatives generally hold ourselves to higher standards than liberals. Timely article below recognizes this phenomena.

That valuable middle ground of voters will undoubtably recognize this as well - if the liberal legislators continue their current immature behavior.

We have the high ground, all three branches of governement, and the best ideas. We do need to minimize cannablizing our own and push through a productive agenda. No gridlock. Limited government, lower taxes, strong national security, safe cities, improved education for all, better healthcare, individual liberty, energy independence, strong borders, fair trade, E pluribus unum.

BLM, Occupy Wall Street, high taxes, Obamacare, multicutluralism, open borders, unbridled immigration, anarchy and street violence...not so much. One need only look around the world...

Lower Conduct Standards for Liberals
Walter E. WilliamsWalter E. Williams|Posted: Feb 01, 2017 12:01 AM
Town hall

One can only imagine the widespread media, political and intellectual condemnation of Republicans and conservatives if, after the inauguration of Barack Obama, they had gone on a violent and vicious tear all over the nation as did Democrats and liberals after the inauguration of President Donald Trump. They committed acts such as assaulting Trump supporters, setting fires and stoning police.

Suppose Republicans/conservatives had carried signs that read "F--- Obama" or talked about "blowing up the White House." The news media, instead of calling them protesters, would have labeled them evil racists, obstructionists and everything else except a child of God. The reason for the difference in treatment is simple. Republicans and conservatives are held -- and hold themselves -- to higher standards of behavior. By contrast, Democrats and liberals are held -- and hold themselves -- to less civilized standards of behavior. Let's look at some of the history of conservative and liberal behavior.

One of the nastiest more recent liberal events was the Occupy movement around the nation. During Occupy protests, there were rapes, assaults, robberies and holdups. These people publicly defecated and urinated on police cars. The mess they left after their demonstrations can be described as no more than a pigsty. Does anybody recall any Democratic official, from the president on down, admonishing them to behave? Contrast their behavior with that of tea party protesters. Tea partyers didn't set fires, stone police or engage in the other kinds of despicable behavior the liberal Democrats did. On top of that, they left the areas where they protested clean.

Ask yourself whether you have ever seen Republicans/conservatives rioting, turning over police cars, looting, setting places of business on fire and shouting obscenities while marching. Have you ever seen conservatives marching with chants calling for the murder of police officers? You may have heard liberals yelling, "What do we want? Dead cops! When do we want it? Now!" In fact, virtually all of the violence against police -- whether it's throwing stones, ambushing or murdering -- is committed by liberals or people who'd identify as Democrats. The fact of the matter is that if we were to examine criminality in America -- whether talking about murderers, muggers or prisoners -- it would be dominated by people who would be described as liberals, Democrats and Hillary Clinton supporters.

Democrats and liberals accuse Republicans of conducting a war on women. Assault, rape and murder are the worst things that can be done to a woman. I would bet a lot of money that most of the assaults, rapes and murders of women are done by people who identify as liberals, and if they voted or had a party affiliation, it would be Democratic.

One of the most glaring examples of how liberals are held to lower standards comes when we look at what they control. The nation's most dangerous big cities in 2012 were Detroit, Oakland, St. Louis, Memphis, Stockton, Birmingham, Baltimore, Cleveland, Atlanta and Milwaukee. The most common characteristic of these cities is that for decades, all of them have been run by Democratic and presumably liberal administrations. Some cities -- such as Detroit, Buffalo, Newark and Philadelphia -- haven't elected a Republican mayor for more than a half-century. It's not just personal safety. These Democratic-controlled cities have the poorest-quality public education despite the fact that they have large and growing school budgets. Most of these dangerous cities have suffered massive decreases in population. Some observers have suggested that racism has caused white flight to the suburbs. But these observers ignore the fact that black flight has become increasingly significant. It turns out that black people do not like to be mugged and live in unsafe neighborhoods any more than white people.

Republicans and conservatives, including President Trump, should not gripe or whine about different treatment by the liberal media. Magnanimity commands that we have compassion and try to understand our fallen brethren. We should make every effort to sell them on the moral superiority of personal liberty and its main ingredient -- limited government.

http://townhall.com/columnists/walterewilliams/2017/02/01/lower-conduct-standards-for-liberals-n2278593?utm_source=thdailypm&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=nl_pm&newsletterad=

[ddoering]

I'm afraid the nuance is lost on liberals. What they do understand though is a good ass kicking.

[Trapper John]

I know it's a minor point, but I suggest we no longer refer to the Occupy Democrats and various other agi-prop groups as Liberals. This would also include the new Democrat party - i.e. Schumer, Warren, Pelozi, and the like.

These clowns are anything but in the true meaning of Liberal as exemplified by Archibald Macleish (1930' and 40's) or John F. Kennedy (1960's).

Their tactics, their messaging, their rhetoric, and their philosophy is more accurately called "Neo-Fascist". Therefore, from now on, I will refer to these clowns as either the "Left" or more accurately, "Neo-Fascists". They simply are not worthy of being referred to as Liberal.

YMMV

[Divemaster]

I know it's a minor point, but I suggest we no longer refer to the Occupy Democrats and various other agi-prop groups as Liberals. This would also include the new Democrat party - i.e. Schumer, Warren, Pelozi, and the like.

These clowns are anything but in the true meaning of Liberal as exemplified by Archibald Macleish (1930' and 40's) or John F. Kennedy (1960's).

Their tactics, their messaging, their rhetoric, and their philosophy is more accurately called "Neo-Fascist". Therefore, from now on, I will refer to these clowns as either the "Left" or more accurately, "Neo-Fascists". They simply are not worthy of being referred to as Liberal.

YMMV

Why not "communists" or "socialists"? Many of them adhere to Marx's teachings. Socialist Action even has a Marxist Education (https://socialistaction.org/marxist-education/) section on their website. One of Lenin's main tactics in bringing down the Czar (before open warfare) was anarchy. Today we're seeing the same playbook.

[bblhead672]

Sarah Silverman calls for military overthrow of legitimate government.

http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2017/02/02/sarah-silverman-calls-for-military-to-overthrow-president-trump.html

Sounds like Ms. Silverman should be indicted for sedition. These people need to be taught a lesson about the rule of law.

[tonyz]

Sarah Silverman calls for military overthrow of legitimate government.

http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2017/02/02/sarah-silverman-calls-for-military-to-overthrow-president-trump.html

Sounds like Ms. Silverman should be indicted for sedition. These people need to be taught a lesson about the rule of law.

I've gotta think that calling for a Coup and inciting violence warrants a visit and temporary survellience at least. These useful idiots all walk so close to the line they have chalk on their shoes...these idiots (Madonna, Handler, Silverman, etc.,) must know that they whip up the masses.

[DIYPatriot]

Didn't George cLOONEY and several of his friends call for a Hollywood strike until Trump resigns? Really wish they'd go ahead and follow through with that...of course, I'm sure most of them are living in their beloved Canada, now. Oh...that's right, Canada's immigration policies prevented them from easily walking in and setting up shop. It's strange how they never say, "I'm moving to Mexico!" or Venezuela, where so many of them advocated for Maduro and his brand of socialism. Maybe we can convince them to rally in the forgiving streets of Asadabad.

[Old Dog New Trick]

I've gotta think that calling for a Coup and inciting violence warrants a visit and temporary survellience at least. These useful idiots all walk so close to the line they have chalk on their shoes...these idiots (Madonna, Handler, Silverman, etc.,) must know that they whip up the masses.

I'd rather like to see it as a chalk outline. :D

[Team Sergeant]

Sarah Silverman calls for military overthrow of legitimate government.

http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2017/02/02/sarah-silverman-calls-for-military-to-overthrow-president-trump.html

Sounds like Ms. Silverman should be indicted for sedition. These people need to be taught a lesson about the rule of law.

And the people that actually listen to her, even lower.

[Box]

Sarah Silverman has the IQ of a condom



...now seriously. Do you really believe that? I think you are just posting that out of sheer spite. You read something that caused your temper to flare and decided to post something abrasive and divisive.
Being divisive out of spite is what neo-fascists like 'fake tears schumer' and 'tell them youre a muslim pelosi' do.
You're better than that.

A condom protects the user and the partner from disease...
...it helps prevent unwanted pregnancy
...it is versatile - you can use it to keep dirt out of a gun barrel
...it is pliable - one size will fit a wide range of people
...it is blind to race, creed, and religion - it doesn't discriminate
...it doesn't interfere with your activity
...it doesn't judge - you can use it on whoever you please
...if you are imaginative, you can even use it like a party balloon
...it understands that once you are finished with it, you get rid of it

Sarah Silverman is not very versatile at all - her way or the highway.
...she doesn't safeguard health, she encourages violence
...she isn't very versatile - her comedy is weak and her hit movies are nonexistent
...she is obsessed by categorizing people by their "identity group"
...she is clearly hyper-judgmental and prejudiced of those who don't fit into her 'mold'
...she cant help but interfere in the lives of others - and even dares to incite insurrection
...her "foil wrapper" was ripped open and cast away decades ago

Yet, you would still put her on the same pedestal as a condom.
...even the free generic condoms that the Army gives away have satisfied more people than Ms Silverman.

You should apologize to the lowly prophylactic for being so dismissive of its value.

[Trapper John]

Why not "communists" or "socialists"? Many of them adhere to Marx's teachings. Socialist Action even has a Marxist Education (https://socialistaction.org/marxist-education/) section on their website. One of Lenin's main tactics in bringing down the Czar (before open warfare) was anarchy. Today we're seeing the same playbook.

True, but neo-Fascist has a more visceral reaction attached to it and I think a more widely recognized means and methods that is associated with it.

Also, I think that extremism at either end becomes a distinction without a difference. For example, the neo-Nazi's and white supremacists compared with these extreme Leftists is just that - a distinction without a difference. Both are driving to dominate and oppress the masses to implement their ideology and they employ the same means and methods.

I am thinking in terms of messaging and suggesting that "neo-Fascist" is an accurate descriptor and a good label for eliciting the appropriate emotive reaction. No further explanation is needed by the receiver or from the communicator. Both parties understand exactly what is being communicated.

[Airbornelawyer]

I know it's a minor point, but I suggest we no longer refer to the Occupy Democrats and various other agi-prop groups as Liberals. This would also include the new Democrat party - i.e. Schumer, Warren, Pelozi, and the like.

These clowns are anything but in the true meaning of Liberal as exemplified by Archibald Macleish (1930' and 40's) or John F. Kennedy (1960's).

Their tactics, their messaging, their rhetoric, and their philosophy is more accurately called "Neo-Fascist". Therefore, from now on, I will refer to these clowns as either the "Left" or more accurately, "Neo-Fascists". They simply are not worthy of being referred to as Liberal.

YMMV
Why not "communists" or "socialists"? Many of them adhere to Marx's teachings. Socialist Action even has a Marxist Education (https://socialistaction.org/marxist-education/) section on their website. One of Lenin's main tactics in bringing down the Czar (before open warfare) was anarchy. Today we're seeing the same playbook.
One of the main tenets of Communism is the withering away of the state. Many socialists concluded that this would not happen on its own; rather, they concluded that the State itself would become the embodiment of and vehicle for socialism. One of the main proponents of this view was an Italian socialist by the name of Benito Mussolini. For him, the State was paramount - "everything within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." He, of course, named his system of state socialism "fascism", after the bundle of sticks which since the Romans symbolized strength through unity. One of his disciples, a man named Adolf Hitler, rebranded his own party under the label of "National Socialist", since in Europe the modern state system and the concept of ethnic nationalism rose alongside each other.

Other fascist parties also embraced not merely statism, but ethnic nationalism, as they saw ethnicity as the strongest base by which the state could ensure the unity which would create strength. This was primarily a European phenomenon, since Europe had already moved so far in the direction of nation-states, although non-European fascist movements such as the Ba'ath in Mesopotamia and the Levant also embraced ethnic nationalism.

Elsewhere, such as in the United States, ethnic nationalism was not as important, but state socialism still had its appeal. American Progressives have pretty much whitewashed their own history, but before World War II, they were quite enamored of Mussolini and even Hitler, though Hitler's far more aggressively ethnic nationalism and anti-Semitism was a turn-off, especially after the Nuremberg Laws and later the Kristallnacht. Even then, after the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact, American Communists dutifully followed Moscow's lead and defended Nazi Germany up until the Wehrmacht crossed the Soviet frontier in June 1941.

While Mussolini is practically viewed as a buffoon since World War II, it is useful to remember that his image before the mid-1930s was quite favorable in many circles. He was portrayed as a manly pillar of strength, and often photographed shirtless. His image was very much like that of another shirtless tough-guy by the name of Putin, who reflects a more recent incarnation of fascism.

After World War II, American Progressives and the rest of the Western left again took their direction from Moscow and its surrogates, as Stalin determined that henceforth fascism would always and everywhere be defined as a "right wing" movement. And, to be fair, there were probably many right-wingers, especially in Europe, who did see fascism as a more extreme version of what could be described as "right wing" values - support for a strong state and a proud military, defense of a common heritage and tradition, and aversion to economic liberalism's treatment of humans as barely more than commodities in a market.

This idea is, however, a hard sell in the United States, since we were created a nation of immigrants fleeing despotism and our common heritage and tradition are rooted in our shared Constitutional values of limited-government democratic republicanism, and not our ethnic origins. That of course, hasn't stopped the American left from constantly labeling the American right as fascist, no matter how utterly ignorant it is to label strong advocates of limited government as "fascist". Although Georg Orwell, certainly an expert on how language can be misused politically, observed decades ago that "fascist" had pretty much been reduced to mean, "anything I don't like".

One of the bigger trends in American politics since the 1960s, with the rise of the conservative revolution and the shift of conservative Democrats away from their old party affiliations, has been the realignment of the two major parties into more ideologically-aligned movements. There are few conservative Democrats and liberal Republicans left. Perhaps without fully realizing its implications, the modern American left has become rather fascist, in the sense of embracing state socialism. This is especially the case for the ones who embrace the "Progressive" label, who are merely returning to their movement's roots in the 1920s and 1930s. I wouldn't label all Democrats thusly; I imagine like Republicans, most rank-and-file Democrats probably don't sit around debating political theory.

I doubt most could identify the Mussolini quote above, but these modern-day Progressives do seem to share his view of the state and embody what is properly a fascist ideology. Based on their rhetoric and policy prescriptions, they appear to believe that there is no problem for which the solution is not more government, and, consequently, if you oppose the "government" solution, you clearly do not care about the problem. If you oppose particular environmental regulations, you obviously favor dirty air and water. If you question the effectiveness of state-run or state-controlled health insurance and pension programs, you obviously want to push little old ladies in wheelchairs over cliffs. And to the extent they ever even admit there may be a problem with failing public schools, the problem is only ever a few bad apples, and of course can be solved by more government spending, so if you favor school choice obviously you are the one who is an extremist. Oddly, national defense is one of the few areas where the left seems hostile to state power, although when they have the reins of government they seem perfectly content to use the armed forces and intelligence services to their ends.

Of course, having spent the last eight years content with having the power of the state on hand to target the enemies of progress, whether through IRS investigations or targeting journalists under the Espionage Act, it remains to be seen how the Progressive movement will react when out of power. So far, early indications are impotent rage and petulant obstructionism. And, of course, rank hypocrisy, although to be fair hypocrisy is one of the few constants in politics.

[Old Dog New Trick]

^^^^as the world turns.

What really has me confused is that the "Left" or "Neo-Fascists" and/or New Social Order can't even see that they are espousing so much love (lust) for all that they claim to hate so much, has become their mantra.

You'd think they should be loving Vladimir Putin or even Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi as their spiritual Imam.

I think I'll just continue to call them "assholes" and hopefully provoke them into a fight.

[Trapper John]

........

I think I'll just continue to call them "assholes" and hopefully provoke them into a fight.

That works too! :D :D

Oh, and Airborne Lawyer, your post was "finest kind". :lifter

[Roguish Lawyer]

I think I'll just continue to call them "assholes" and hopefully provoke them into a fight.

:D

[bblhead672]

I think I'll just continue to call them "assholes" and hopefully provoke them into a fight.

And when they get riled up, grab 'em by their man bun (or vagina headgear), take their smartphone away and smash it. They'll have to retreat to a safe place and restore their ability to tweet and other social media apps.

[GratefulCitizen]

Last, desperate acts of a group losing power.
Look at the State governments.

The dream is over and will not be realized for the older leftists.
But, they are still dangerous.

They are filled with wrath, because they know their time is short.

[Divemaster]

Airborne Lawyer,

Brilliant post! Thank you for not leaving me feeling alone at doing a deep dive into today's enemies of our Republic. Your post reminds me of Ray (http://longmarch.sid-hill.us/hitler_musso/1m/1m.htm) looking into the Left through a Mussolini lens.

I think Vietnam was the catalyst that handed the Democrat party to the radical left. The once mainstream liberals who differed from conservatives on domestic policy, but who agreed on opposing the spread of communism have been displaced in the ensuing decades.

[Streck-Fu]

American Progressives have pretty much whitewashed their own history, but before World War II, they were quite enamored of Mussolini and even Hitler, though Hitler's far more aggressively ethnic nationalism and anti-Semitism was a turn-off, especially after the Nuremberg Laws and later the Kristallnacht.

FDR, and his adminstration, was very much a fan of of German Nationalism through the 30s even after hostilities broke out in Europe. Programs like the NRA (National Recovery Act) and the Works Progress Administration were modeleld after Nazi work programs.



..... it remains to be seen how the Progressive movement will react when out of power. So far, early indications are impotent rage and petulant obstructionism. And, of course, rank hypocrisy, although to be fair hypocrisy is one of the few constants in politics.

The following was posted on SOCNET and I found it an interesting history of radical violence and speculation into what may come: LINK (https://status451.com/2017/01/20/days-of-rage/)

[Guymullins]

This article is by an interesting person. He was at one time a Communist academic, both in South Africa and Britain. He now lives in South Africa and has seen what his old ideas have brought to the country. He has now become a political realist and I admire his knack of summarising a complex subject and seeing through the BS on both sides of an argument. I would be interested on your views on the accuracy of the views voiced here.
http://www.politicsweb.co.za/opinion/talking-sense-about-trump

[rsdengler]

:D

(Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Dog New Trick View Post
I think I'll just continue to call them "assholes" and hopefully provoke them into a fight.)


Ha...I could even beat up that guy in the "Bernie" tee-shirt....:)

[Trapper John]

Guy- Lew Johnson's analysis, although more of a 30,000 ft view, is as typical of other things I have read by him, a very good assessment of what is happening here.

Towards the end of the article he began to get into the weeds a bit and opined as the long term effect of Trumps brand of Populism. He correctly (IMO) identified the key to the development of a long term strategy - Steve Bannon!

I think he is correct in his statement: Trump does not read books, has no knowledge of history, no intellectual depth and probably only dimly descries what Bannon's strategy is and what its historical roots are.

Trump is an action guy focusing on the short-term action items that he can affect. Bannon, IMO, is a brilliant strategist. He is the key to the long-term strategy and will face increasingly extreme attacks from the neo-Fascists and the establishment politicos within the Republican party.

As Johnson alluded to, the neo-Fascists have been playing the long game for some time now (50-60 years). They are dug in within the politics of the inner cities, academia, primary/secondary education institutions. Routing the neo-Fascists out of these bastions will be critical for the long-term. A difficult task, but definitely doable. Once the immediate goals are met, this is where the battle space will be!

[Guymullins]

Guy- Lew Johnson's analysis, although more of a 30,000 ft view, is as typical of other things I have read by him, a very good assessment of what is happening here.

Towards the end of the article he began to get into the weeds a bit and opined as the long term effect of Trumps brand of Populism. He correctly (IMO) identified the key to the development of a long term strategy - Steve Bannon!

I think he is correct in his statement:

Trump is an action guy focusing on the short-term action items that he can affect. Bannon, IMO, is a brilliant strategist. He is the key to the long-term strategy and will face increasingly extreme attacks from the neo-Fascists and the establishment politicos within the Republican party.

As Johnson alluded to, the neo-Fascists have been playing the long game for some time now (50-60 years). They are dug in within the politics of the inner cities, academia, primary/secondary education institutions. Routing the neo-Fascists out of these bastions will be critical for the long-term. A difficult task, but definitely doable. Once the immediate goals are met, this is where the battle space will be!

Thanks Trapper, it is always good to get the opinion of those at the coalface. RW Johnson's view is , as you say, from 30 000 ft, but the distance is in fact a lot more than that. All we do in Africa is get a cold when America sneezes.

[GratefulCitizen]

The Sarah Silverman thing is congruent with statements by Rosa Brooks.
Do they come up with this on their own, or is someone else issuing talking points?

[Paslode]

The Sarah Silverman thing is congruent with statements by Rosa Brooks.
Do they come up with this on their own, or is someone else issuing talking points?

I have noticed that much of the time what you hear coming out of the MSM and/or someone like Silverman can generally be found days, sometimes weeks earlier on the Media Matters chat.

[Badger52]

I have noticed that much of the time what you hear coming out of the MSM and/or someone like Silverman can generally be found days, sometimes weeks earlier on the Media Matters chat.The new MFIC at Foggy Bottom should have a personally-vetted IT substance make sure that isn't still tied into the same peer-to-peer chat network that handles WH "talking points."

[Paslode]

The new MFIC at Foggy Bottom should have a personally-vetted IT substance make sure that isn't still tied into the same peer-to-peer chat network that handles WH "talking points."

You would think, but with the recent leaks it makes you wonder.

The libs knew Trump was going to curtail immigration, they have been planning for months and they just hosed him big time. Since the Ninth Circuit is the next stop chances are they will send him on to the SCOTUS.......and all the while it travels through the courts immigrants will be filling all those new apartment complexes that are spouting up in the suburbs.

I don't fault Trump too much. He knowingly walked into a mind field, he has tried to get things accomplished, but unfortunately for him the wheels of the bureaucracy are avidly working against him.....

The libs overall goal is to get Trump impeached.

[GratefulCitizen]

A reasonable assessment of the leftist true believer:

https://townhall.com/columnists/kurtschlichter/2017/02/06/the-left-hates-you-act-accordingly-n2281602

This gave me a chuckle:
"And the frightening thing is that the Left is so foolish, so stuck in its bubble that it has no understanding that it can only push so far before the people with all the guns and all the training push back.
That’s the problem with kids who were raised on participation trophies and who never got into a fistfight – they don’t consider the possibility that they will lose, and lose hard."

[frostfire]

The libs overall goal is to get Trump impeached.

.....they'd rather have Pence :confused:

[Box]

What kills me about the chuckleheads on the left how much they forget that Trump is probably the closest thing they could have gotten to a republican with a past that might have liberal sympathies.

With the exception of Bush or Rubio, every other republican would have been far more right than Trump. Trump just happens to be the only one that isn't afraid to say "ILLEGAL" when he talks about immigration problems.
...mainstream republicans succumbed to brain washing and acceptance of the term 'undocumented' instead of 'illegal' years ago - as a result, some of them just SEEM more palatable than Trump.
Not that the left is really interested in political or vocal diversity - because they aren't

If Teddy had won the Whitehouse, the liberals would be in a full-on uprising by now instead of just busying themselves with passive aggressive TV commercials and snarky sound bytes on the morning talk show circuit. The nation would be on fire if we had an honest to goodness right wing conservative in the white house.

The left really doesn't even understand how good they've got it.

[DJ Urbanovsky]

1) Most people don't have any real understanding of what fascism is. It's just a convenient metaphor that they like to throw around along with Hitler comparisons. It's virtue signaling. If you put Trump on a sliding scale along with actual fascists like Hitler or Mussolini, you'll see that he actually ranks pretty low on that scale.

2) Most people don't have any real understanding of what actual war is like, and how bad things could really get. And most of the people banging that drum have neither the skills nor the materials to make such a thing happen in the first place.

3) Most of these people who are saying these things claim to be pillars of inclusion and tolerance. That is, until you start asking them difficult questions, saying things that they disagree with or asking them to engage in actual, rational thought. Then you're a bad person.

Basically, this is just a bunch of spoiled children who didn't get their way, and now they are throwing a tantrum. Sometimes democracy is a real bitch, kids. Welcome to the adult world where there are no participation medals.

I know people right now who are just completely losing their shit about this whole thing. I tell them "Look, the guy just took office. How about we give him a chance and see what he does, just like we did with the last guy? That would be the reasonable thing to do, yeah? If he screws up, then you can crucify him." They do not enjoy hearing things like that.

It's like that girl at the UC Berkley riot that ended up shutting down Milo's talk. Somebody blasted her in the face with mace while a reporter was interviewing her because they thought she was wearing a MAGA hat. But somebody skipped basic reading comprehension, because her hat didn't say MAGA. It said "Make Bitcoin Great Again." And that's the kind of irrational behavior that we're dealing with.

[rsdengler]

1) Most people don't have any real understanding of what fascism is. It's just a convenient metaphor that they like to throw around along with Hitler comparisons. It's virtue signaling. If you put Trump on a sliding scale along with actual fascists like Hitler or Mussolini, you'll see that he actually ranks pretty low on that scale.


Basically, this is just a bunch of spoiled children who didn't get their way, and now they are throwing a tantrum. Sometimes democracy is a real bitch, kids. Welcome to the adult world where there are no participation medals.


You are correct when you state people in this country do not know the real understanding of the word Fascism. My father grew up in Nazi Germany in the 1930's and he was in the Luftwaffe. My father was just a kid who was drafted, he was not a Nazi, he was not a Fascist; he was just a 19 year old. He used to tell us stories about growing up under Hitler, and people who compare Trump to Fascism are clueless. I remember to this day growing up with my friends always saying "Hey, wasn't your dad a Nazi"...so wrong, so misinformed, and so stupid. Same like those people today who try to make the same comparison of the current administration. Spoiled, selfish, non-sacrificing babies. They really need to grow up and be responsible for their actions, and words. But, hey look at their parents, I am sure the rotten apple does not fall far from the tree. We should just label them "Idiots"....:D

Rita

[bblhead672]

You are correct when you state people in this country do not know the real understanding of the word Fascism. My father grew up in Nazi Germany in the 1930's and he was in the Luftwaffe. My father was just a kid who was drafted, he was not a Nazi, he was not a Fascist; he was just a 19 year old. He used to tell us stories about growing up under Hitler, and people who compare Trump to Fascism are clueless. I remember to this day growing up with my friends always saying "Hey, wasn't your dad a Nazi"...so wrong, so misinformed, and so stupid. Same like those people today who try to make the same comparison of the current administration. Spoiled, selfish, non-sacrificing babies. They really need to grow up and be responsible for their actions, and words. But, hey look at their parents, I am sure the rotten apple does not fall far from the tree. We should just label them "Idiots"....:D

Rita

The radical left's cries of "fascists" in regards to those of us who do not hold their belief systems is really pissing me off. My father fought in WW2 - across north Africa, into Sicily and Italy, then Europe. He went into battle against real fascism. That today he would be labeled a fascist for his love of this country and the ideals we hold is maddening.

[Badger52]

The radical left's cries of "fascists" in regards to those of us who do not hold their belief systems is really pissing me off. My father fought in WW2 - across north Africa, into Sicily and Italy, then Europe. He went into battle against real fascism. That today he would be labeled a fascist for his love of this country and the ideals we hold is maddening.What many need to wrap their head around is this: They HATE you. This is a zero-sum game for them; there is no acceptable outcome for them other than you are nulled out. Period.

[atticus finch]

This article is by an interesting person. He was at one time a Communist academic, both in South Africa and Britain. He now lives in South Africa and has seen what his old ideas have brought to the country. He has now become a political realist and I admire his knack of summarising a complex subject and seeing through the BS on both sides of an argument. I would be interested on your views on the accuracy of the views voiced here.
http://www.politicsweb.co.za/opinion/talking-sense-about-trump

The institutions are spread wide, but thin. Lose the $ for the institutions and/or lose the appearance of credibility, they are finished.

Berkeley / Milo just started that process.


Another weakness of the left has yet to surface, the jury, that will come at some point depending on how far the left takes the violence.

The left escalates the violence from this point? Good luck finding a jury to convict an ordinary citizen for use-of-force.
When the left finds out we can engage the bonafide use-of-force without fear of the legal system, everything changes.....
I saw this first-hand in LA in `92.

[ddoering]

I think we are entering a period similar to the post WW1 period in Germany. Call it the American Freicorp Period. The left only understands violence. Sooner or later they will push it and receive a reaction that they will regret.

[1stindoor]

....Let’s designate a day on which no one (that is, anyone who can do so without being fired) goes to work, a day when no one shops or spends money, a day on which we truly make our economic and political power felt, a day when we make it clear: how many of us there are, how strong and committed we are, how much we can accomplish....


I think this is a wonderful idea, truly brilliant. And in turn, on the same day, let's have the federal government stop the payment of every person on welfare.

[rsdengler]

I think this is a wonderful idea, truly brilliant. And in turn, on the same day, let's have the federal government stop the payment of every person on welfare.

Ha, I am all for that......and have them stop paying our Congress and Senate as well. :)

Rita

[tonyz]

I think this is a wonderful idea, truly brilliant. And in turn, on the same day, let's have the federal government stop the payment of every person on welfare.

Just to be clear that was the view from Guardian author Francine Prose in post #6 ...I on the other hand advocate for a paid take your family to the range day.

[Old Dog New Trick]

What many need to wrap their head around is this: They HATE you. This is a zero-sum game for them; there is no acceptable outcome for them other than you are nulled out. Period.

Let them HATE!

The only inclusive and tolerant people I know genuinely believe in the ideals this country was founded on.

The ignorance of the Left on display and perpetrated by the Left-wing media will continue to isolate and ultimately destroy them.

They cannot survive without the financial support of the hard working Americans that send their children off to these brainwashing institutions that are making themselves the targets of discrimination and violence.

Mizzu lost an estimated $35M in enrollment fees after last year. (I read that somewhere)

Our psyop campaign needs to point out that George Soros is and was a Nazi sympathizer and a traitor to his own people during WW2 and that he and his ilk have led to the deaths of many more immigrants than anything the US has been responsible for. He should be their poster child for intolerance and slavery.

The DOJ needs to go after him and the Clinton Foundation using all available resources to tie the whole affair together. This (JMHO) will shine a light on 9/11/01 the Saudis and collusion of several political families dating back to the post Eisenhower period. I'm generally not a conspiracy theorist but I also don't think things are as black and white as we've been told beginning with the assassination of JFK. Everything happens for a reason - circumstance - and consequence - are what follows.

Unfortunately this will be a generational struggle if not as some are saying Civil War II followed by 'reconstruction' established by the victors.

[Badger52]

Let them HATE!I agree; their emotional state bothers me not one whit. My point is that they're not to be reasoned with - just win, because they have been the ones historically to have people kneeling before the ditch.
;)

[Sohei]

Many of them - if not most - are herd animals and scared to act on their own. There is a reason that many of us refer to them as sheep. Sheep are truly pathetic little creatures who can't even truly find strength within the herd.

There is a percentage of them that will or could lash out, but IMO, that percentage isn't that high when they are confronted by the lions that won't cower in their presence.

As ODNT stated, "Let them hate." Their idiocy hasn't changed my life in the slightest.

[1stindoor]

Just to be clear that was the view from Guardian author Francine Prose in post #6 ...I on the other hand advocate for a paid take your family to the range day.

Sorry Tony...I should have been more specific when I cut and pasted from your post.

[rsdengler]

I agree; their emotional state bothers me not one whit. My point is that they're not to be reasoned with - just win, because they have been the ones historically to have people kneeling before the ditch.
;)

You are so correct, except I get emotional; but what bothers me the most about them is that you are the guys who have sacrificed so much for this country. They continue to show no respect towards our men and women in the military. It makes my blood boil when I hear/and see these people do and say such asinine things. I am honored to know such great men (and women) as yourselves and I am deeply committed to offer my respect, and my support for all of you who deserve so much more. :) Rita

[tonyz]

Sorry Tony...I should have been more specific when I cut and pasted from your post.

No worries.

I've been thinking...8 hours paid leave might be a little much...so fielders choice...5.56 hours paid or 7.62 hours of comp time.

And, while we are at it...how about sanctuary ranges...you can shoot at targets depicting anything you want.

[VVVV]

Spoiled, selfish, non-sacrificing baby

You nailed it...the perfect description...of Donald Trump.

[Airbornelawyer]

Sheep are truly pathetic little creatures who can't even truly find strength within the herd.
Some sheep resent your remarks :cool:

[Guymullins]

Some sheep resent your remarks :cool:

Oh my goodness. Blackface! Thats a hate crime in my country.

[Sohei]

Some sheep resent your remarks :cool:

I stand corrected....:D

[pcfixer]

The support for opposition to the Statist/Globalist agenda appears strong but the left is well organized, well funded and ruthless.

It is time for our society to acknowledge a sad truth: America is currently fighting its second Civil War.

In fact, with the obvious and enormous exception of attitudes toward slavery, Americans are more divided morally, ideologically and politically today than they were during the Civil War. For that reason, just as the Great War came to be known as World War I once there was World War II, the Civil War will become known as the First Civil War when more Americans come to regard the current battle as the Second Civil War.


I agree tonyz. Mainly of open boarders and globalism. Socialist tendency and government gives people a free ride in society with the elitism.

[tonyz]

Duke University Training Students For Anti-Trump Activism

PETER HASSON
Reporter, Associate Editor
Daily Caller
2/09/17

Duke University is sponsoring a workshop for the purpose of training students to engage in activism against President Trump’s administration.

LGBTQA activist Mandy Carter will lead the February 15 event, which is titled “Ideas for Activism in the Time of Trump.”

The university-sponsored event will focus on “Understanding the importance of the changing of hearts and minds and the changing of public policy in social justice movements,” and “How our North Carolina Moral Monday Movement can be a model of a diverse coalition that brings together social justice people to take a stand against the Trump Administration.”

One of the recommended resources on the event’s Facebook page is an online “practical guide for resisting the Trump agenda.”

The website includes a variety of how-to documents on opposing Trump, as well as a listing of liberal anti-Trump organizations around the country.

The event is sponsored by the university’s Program in Gender, Sexuality, and Feminist Studies, which is “dedicated to exploring gender identities, relations, practices, theories and institutions.” (RELATED: Duke Student Columnist: America’s First Amendment ‘Obsession’ Is ‘Expression Of White Supremacy’)

The university did not return a request for comment by press time.

The event is just the latest way in which universities have taken a clear anti-Trump position.

The University of New Hampshire had to issue an apology in the wake of Trump’s election after using official university resources to promote anti-Trump protests. (RELATED: College Students Think They May Die Because Trump Got Elected)

After Trump’s election last November the University of Texas set up a “therapy wall” for students upset the election outcome. Students used the wall to post sticky notes documenting how distraught they were that Trump got elected.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/02/09/duke-university-training-students-for-anti-trump-activism/

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2017/02/09/duke-university-training-students-for-anti-trump-activism/#ixzz4YO0KdXnW

[GratefulCitizen]

It makes for fun sport to call those on the left irrational.
Their behavior is quite rational.

This civil war, like many, is in part a war for control of resources.
This video is common knowledge to many here, but it could be quite fun to send it to various leftists and watch the meltdown.

**TRIGGER WARNING**
https://youtu.be/O5FA2Mq7mgk

[cbtengr]

Duke University Training Students For Anti-Trump Activism

PETER HASSON
Reporter, Associate Editor
Daily Caller
2/09/17

Duke University is sponsoring a workshop for the purpose of training students to engage in activism against President Trump’s administration.

LGBTQA activist Mandy Carter will lead the February 15 event, which is titled “Ideas for Activism in the Time of Trump.”

The university-sponsored event will focus on “Understanding the importance of the changing of hearts and minds and the changing of public policy in social justice movements,” and “How our North Carolina Moral Monday Movement can be a model of a diverse coalition that brings together social justice people to take a stand against the Trump Administration.”

One of the recommended resources on the event’s Facebook page is an online “practical guide for resisting the Trump agenda.”

The website includes a variety of how-to documents on opposing Trump, as well as a listing of liberal anti-Trump organizations around the country.

The event is sponsored by the university’s Program in Gender, Sexuality, and Feminist Studies, which is “dedicated to exploring gender identities, relations, practices, theories and institutions.” (RELATED: Duke Student Columnist: America’s First Amendment ‘Obsession’ Is ‘Expression Of White Supremacy’)

The university did not return a request for comment by press time.

The event is just the latest way in which universities have taken a clear anti-Trump position.

The University of New Hampshire had to issue an apology in the wake of Trump’s election after using official university resources to promote anti-Trump protests. (RELATED: College Students Think They May Die Because Trump Got Elected)

After Trump’s election last November the University of Texas set up a “therapy wall” for students upset the election outcome. Students used the wall to post sticky notes documenting how distraught they were that Trump got elected.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/02/09/duke-university-training-students-for-anti-trump-activism/

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2017/02/09/duke-university-training-students-for-anti-trump-activism/#ixzz4YO0KdXnW

If DUKE is getting any sort of federal funding then I would say it is time to pull the plug on it.

[Badger52]

If DUKE is getting any sort of federal funding then I would say it is time to pull the plug on it.A few of the comments were interesting. One guy mentioned that it's pretty much a private university, but with a large percentage of students from the NE, and referred to as "university of South Jersey."

In seeing these things in various media firms I'm guessing (literally) that it's a relatively lower fraction at these High Churches of Akademia that get the coverage with these activities. I mean, what news outlet is doing an article about Joe Schmo engineering student quietly trying to navigate his way around the SJW's and just get his degree & make some money? Wonder if anyone has done an article on a student (and perhaps the Mom & Dad con$ortium helping) who's decided to pop smoke on a school & go somewhere else simply because of the bullshit.

[tonyz]

who's decided to pop smoke on a school & go somewhere else simply because of the bullshit.

I was recently asked to apply for a position at a major university by the chair of a 3 person hiring committee...I asked if he was crazy (prolly just needed another qualified but ultimately non-hirable white male applicant)...too much bullshit to navigate and I'm certainly not near politically correct enough to tolerate the atmosphere on campus today. So, yes. I believe folks are opting out of the hypocrisy.

You got it right in an earlier post somewhere...they (Statist/Globalist/Communist/most Academics) HATE us.

Pick your friends and associations carefully - buy more ammo.

[Paslode]

I watched this video and thought of this thread....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzeTZSEesXY

[lexxylargo]

The excerpt below is from an opinion piece in a U.K. publication - it provides some insight into plans for discomfort and inconvenience - aka more subversion. The entire article at link below.

Forget protest. Trump's actions warrant a general national strike
Francine Prose
The Guardian
Monday 30 January 2017 07.06 EST
Political movements rarely succeed without causing discomfort and inconvenience

Since Trump’s election, we’ve seen dozens of demonstrations – most notably, the Women’s March on Washington – that have reinforced our sense of solidarity and provided encouraging evidence of how many Americans oppose our government’s fundamentally anti-American agenda.

But the trouble is that these protests are too easily ignored and forgotten by those who wish to ignore and forget them. The barriers go up, the march takes place, the barriers come down. Everyone goes home happier.

One reason that Saturday’s protests were so effective was that, while peaceful, they were disruptive. Terminal Four was closed, incoming flights were delayed. One traveller wrote, on Twitter, that his fellow passengers applauded when their pilot announced the reason why their plane would be landing an hour behind schedule.

Taxi drivers went on strike in solidarity with the detainees, and arriving passengers were forced to find alternate ways on getting home. Many used Uber, a company whose CEO, Travis Kalanick, serves on Trump’s economic advisory board, and which thoughtfully suspended “surge pricing” to make it easier and cheaper to subvert the taxi strike.

The struggles for civil rights and Indian independence, against apartheid and the Vietnam war – it’s hard to think of a nonviolent movement that has succeeded without causing its opponents a certain amount of trouble, discomfort and inconvenience.

And economic boycotts – another sort of trouble and inconvenience – have proved remarkably successful in persuading companies to cease supporting repressive governments. Of course, nonviolence has often been met with violence, but one can only hope that our hearts have not so hardened that we, as a nation, would not be troubled and shamed by the spectacle of peaceful people being arrested and bloodied, as they were in Selma and Birmingham.

So what can we do to protest our current government’s callousness about our environment and our health, its rampant greed, its disrespect for life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?

I believe that what we need is a nonviolent national general strike of the kind that has been more common in Europe than here. Let’s designate a day on which no one (that is, anyone who can do so without being fired) goes to work, a day when no one shops or spends money, a day on which we truly make our economic and political power felt, a day when we make it clear: how many of us there are, how strong and committed we are, how much we can accomplish.

Meanwhile, I’m deleting my Uber account and adding Lyft (which donated generously to the ACLU) in its stead. Leaving Uber is not uncomplicated, and it’s taken me the better part of a day to persuade them to let me go. But in the process, the site asks subscribers why they are leaving, and it’s a pleasure – a small pleasure, but a pleasure nonetheless – to let them know.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/30/travel-ban-airport-protests-disruption
Seems like we are heading that way, unfortunately.

[scooter]

Seems like we are heading that way, unfortunately.

Yawn.

Who is going to strike? We have employment at will in most of the US. The places that don't are run by democrat strangleholds. Shut down businesses, and they will replace their workers or new businesses will replace the ones that can't get their shit together.

[tonyz]

The great propagandists of the past century could not have said it better. Many in the MSM media have misled the people and have played a significant role in getting us into the mess we are in. And here, one of the press basically admits it.

Mika Brzezinski: Media’s Job Is to ‘Control Exactly What People Think’
Washington Free Beacon
BY: Chandler Gill
February 22, 2017 11:49 am

MSNBC's Mika Brzezinski criticized President Donald Trump on Wednesday for undermining the media's message by creating his own facts, adding that the "job" of the media is to "control exactly what people think."

Brzezinski made the comment on "Morning Joe" after co-host Joe Scarborough said that he agreed with a panelist's view that Trump supporters are wondering why people are so upset over what the president is doing since he is implementing exactly what he campaigned on.

"What Yamiche [Alcindor] said is what I hear from all the Trump supporters that I talk to, who were Trump voters and are still Trump supporters," Scarborough said. "They go, ‘Yeah, you guys are going crazy. He's doing–what are you so surprised about? He's doing exactly what he said he's going to do.'"

Brzezinski said she is concerned about what Trump's presidency may mean for the media.

"Well, and I think that the dangerous, you know, edges here are that he's trying to undermine the media, trying to make up his own facts," she said.

Brzezinski then appeared to argue that the media's job is to control what people think, adding that the president is interfering with it.

"And it could be that while unemployment and the economy worsens, he could have undermined the messaging so much that he can actually control exactly what people think. And that, that is our job," she said.

<snip>

http://freebeacon.com/politics/mika-brzezinski-medias-job-control-what-people-think/

[cbtengr]

The great propagandists of the past century could not have said it better. Many in the MSM media have misled the people and have played a significant role in getting us into the mess we are in. And here, one of the press basically admits it.

Mika Brzezinski: Media’s Job Is to ‘Control Exactly What People Think’
Washington Free Beacon
BY: Chandler Gill
February 22, 2017 11:49 am

MSNBC's Mika Brzezinski criticized President Donald Trump on Wednesday for undermining the media's message by creating his own facts, adding that the "job" of the media is to "control exactly what people think."

Brzezinski made the comment on "Morning Joe" after co-host Joe Scarborough said that he agreed with a panelist's view that Trump supporters are wondering why people are so upset over what the president is doing since he is implementing exactly what he campaigned on.

"What Yamiche [Alcindor] said is what I hear from all the Trump supporters that I talk to, who were Trump voters and are still Trump supporters," Scarborough said. "They go, ‘Yeah, you guys are going crazy. He's doing–what are you so surprised about? He's doing exactly what he said he's going to do.'"

Brzezinski said she is concerned about what Trump's presidency may mean for the media.

"Well, and I think that the dangerous, you know, edges here are that he's trying to undermine the media, trying to make up his own facts," she said.

Brzezinski then appeared to argue that the media's job is to control what people think, adding that the president is interfering with it.

"And it could be that while unemployment and the economy worsens, he could have undermined the messaging so much that he can actually control exactly what people think. And that, that is our job," she said.

<snip>

http://freebeacon.com/politics/mika-brzezinski-medias-job-control-what-people-think/

Talk about a bunch of elitists, I will do my own thinking thank you very much. None of this surprises me though. At the very least Trump and his rabid support have thrown them into a tizzy of epic proportions. They are not getting the same type of thrill up their leg from Trump like they got from Barry, its' more akin to pissing their pants and they don't like it.

[Paslode]

Mika's way of thinking is a big part of the reason why Trump prevailed. One would think that these High IQ M-Fer's would have the SA to figure out the rules have changed and the only people they are controlling are those in their social bubble.

[Badger52]

Loss of relevance is a helluva hangover that the little shot of Jaeger on the brunch table won't cure. But they breed; a whole generation like them is right behind. In our individual interactions, daily, with young people who look up to us we need to be better. Each sweeping their own doorstep so to speak.

[Penn]

Imagine a civil war scenario in America and pursuing those individuals who have consciously harmed America. Operating on a McChrystal type success in Iraq that connected nodes of influences, a similar method/purge would have to be instituted in any conflict where strategic decapitation to remove the capacity to effect outcome was necessary.

For example the recent article exposing Jonathan Gruber, the Obamacare Architect who Bragged about lying to The CBO, sighted the — ‘Lack Of Transparency Is A Political Advantage’

“This bill was written in a tortured way to make sure CBO did not score the mandate as taxes,” Gruber flatly stated. “If CBO scored the mandate as taxes, the bill dies.”

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2017/03/14/2014-obamacare-architect-brags-about-duping-the-cbo-lack-of-transparency-is-a-political-advantage-video/#ixzz4bRTKc54B

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2017/03/14/2014-obamacare-architect-brags-about-duping-the-cbo-lack-of-transparency-is-a-political-advantage-video/#ixzz4bRQD84SW

http://economics.mit.edu/faculty/gruberj/opinion

[tonyz]

Imagine a civil war scenario in America and pursuing those individuals who have consciously harmed America. Operating on a McChrystal type success in Iraq that connected nodes of influences, a similar method/purge would have to be instituted in any conflict where strategic decapitation to remove the capacity to effect outcome was necessary.

For example the recent article exposing Jonathan Gruber, the Obamacare Architect who Bragged about lying to The CBO, sighted the — ‘Lack Of Transparency Is A Political Advantage’

Lol, if you created "most wanted" pictorials on playing cards in this country - it would take fricken multiple 8 deck shoes to hold 'em all.

House still got da edge. :D

https://www.discountcasinogear.com/8-Deck-Wooden-Blackjack-Shoe-p/BB2835.htm?gclid=CLzU1vGp29ICFUgdgQodB_kArw

[TOMAHAWK9521]

With the left going hog wild with all the death threats, calls for coups, and violence against Trump and his supporters, I wonder how they would react if someone were to publish decks of cards for the "Most Wanted" of anti-American socio/commie/fascist subversives. As previously stated, there would need to be multiple decks to cover the lot of them. There would have to be sets to cover "elected officials" deck, "financial backers/influencers" deck, "street/race hunters" deck, "celebrity activist" deck, etc.

Imagine the widespread bowel-loosening and high pitch shrills of anxiety from the aforementioned low-lifes and/or their followers when these decks of cards with their faces on them begin showing up all over the country. Hollywood celeb "so-and-so" is leading a violent protest to prevent someone with an alternative POV from speaking at a college campus and then said celebrity is handed a blank envelope from an unknown member of the crowd. Inside is a card with their face and name with a note informing them that the cards are not being collected sequentially.

A guy can dream........

[Old Dog New Trick]

^^^maybe they'd finally live up to their pledges and leave the country.

Buh bye...

[rsdengler]

With the left going hog wild with all the death threats, calls for coups, and violence against Trump and his supporters, I wonder how they would react if someone were to publish decks of cards for the "Most Wanted" of anti-American socio/commie/fascist subversives. As previously stated, there would need to be multiple decks to cover the lot of them. There would have to be sets to cover "elected officials" deck, "financial backers/influencers" deck, "street/race hunters" deck, "celebrity activist" deck, etc.

Imagine the widespread bowel-loosening and high pitch shrills of anxiety from the aforementioned low-lifes and/or their followers when these decks of cards with their faces on them begin showing up all over the country. Hollywood celeb "so-and-so" is leading a violent protest to prevent someone with an alternative POV from speaking at a college campus and then said celebrity is handed a blank envelope from an unknown member of the crowd. Inside is a card with their face and name with a note informing them that the cards are not being collected sequentially.

A guy can dream........

I would gladly hand them their "card".....:D

[bblhead672]

George Soros as "The Joker"?

Reminds of the book by Vince Flynn "Term Limits."

[The Reaper]

And Joe McCarthy was right.

TR

[tonyz]

Communist subversion at home and abroad is alive and well.

[Cobwebs]

I wonder if these folks have taken the time to understand the fight they wish to undertake are against those who truly understand " lock and load "and we know what "rock and roll is" and it ain't in Cleveland!!!! (Good Luck Bro):rolleyes:

[SC Pete]

tonyz, spot on. Seen firsthand civ wars , revos, etc. The usual is 10-20% on either side are "true believers". Most in the middle just want to be left alone. Where it gets nasty, is the non aligned middle who are opportunists, and score settlers. Anyone with a grudge, real or perceived, will use a breakdown of order to get personal justice. and the opportunists will whack their neighbor to snatch the neighbor's "upper 40 acres". Pity the non-gun owner who POed their neighbor by letting their dog crap on his lawn...

[tonyz]

tonyz, spot on. Seen firsthand civ wars , revos, etc. The usual is 10-20% on either side are "true believers". Most in the middle just want to be left alone. Where it gets nasty, is the non aligned middle who are opportunists, and score settlers. Anyone with a grudge, real or perceived, will use a breakdown of order to get personal justice. and the opportunists will whack their neighbor to snatch the neighbor's "upper 40 acres". Pity the non-gun owner who POed their neighbor by letting their dog crap on his lawn...

Awesome insight.

Unfortunately, most in the middle have been bombarded daily (for decades) with the Statist/globalist message.

Many are surrounded by half-baked intellectuals who have been immersed in subversive university environments. Add to that much of "reporting" by the MSM, much of Hollywood, the PC movement, social experiments being jammed down the throats of many fine institutions and you begin to see why the middle feels bombarded.

We as a nation have done been Grubered.

[Badger52]

We as a nation have done been Grubered.Just a subset, but how many "average" people (personally-owned, private-sector, or .gov/.mil) have as their internet baseline reference:

"My computer boots up into Windows. Internet Explorer is my browser. MSNBC is my default news source." As well as "I watch my nightly news on my (fill-in Big-3 affiliate) local channel."

[tonyz]

Just a subset, but how many "average" people (personally-owned, private-sector, or .gov/.mil) have as their internet baseline reference:

"My computer boots up into Windows. Internet Explorer is my browser. MSNBC is my default news source." As well as "I watch my nightly news on my (fill-in Big-3 affiliate) local channel."

Absolutely.

...they also get some of their "news" from the comedy channel.

[SC Pete]

Agree, the only plus of the middle being bombarded by agitprop, is the American version, (part of the plan) was to foster a non-critical thinking short attention span sheep-person. The short attention span can be used to advantage. I still say, the Left needs beware the score settlers.

[tonyz]

I still say, the Left needs beware the score settlers.

Concur.

[SC Pete]

BTW, I hate hearing about how Sol Alinski (sp?) was so insightful with his book "Rules for Radicals". One of the Soviet Internationals in the 1920s had a tactical planning meeting and developed COAs for the commie movement. Read it in Russian years ago, can't find it now in English. But they outlined it all, plagerist Alinski translated it, boiled it down, and claimed it as his own. When did a leftist ever have an original idea? Took a committee to figure it out. Hate these turds.

[tonyz]

Interesting.

Saul Alinsky reportedly corresponded regularly with a young Hillary Clinton...we dodged a bullet when she was defeated.

[tonyz]

Speaking of Klinton...her crew (inner circle) alone could complete an entire deck of cards by themselves.

[SC Pete]

No big surprise there. Funny, (not really) how the left never admits to their past/heroes/ideological mentors, yet our side does proudly. Evil Communists. Reminds me of something my Uncle once said. Fallschirmjager MG42 gunner at Cassino, "we knew we couldn't hold them off forever, but we were going to make them pay."

[tonyz]

One of the upsides to the mask coming off of the Statist/Commies here at home...is that decent, hardworking folks are going to continue questioning why they are always being demonized, and why they don’t have just as much right as anyone else to stick up for themselves.

[SC Pete]

Amen. Think the average working Joe has had a snootfull for a long time. Don't you think if TSHTF they aren't going to settle with those who made their lives miserable?

[Cobwebs]

Without a doubt we have reached a point of no return...neither side is going to budge and we are at a point of put up or shut up. A point that clearly favours those who have been in the arena. Let the games begin...:munchin

[tonyz]

SC Pete, I do. If the divide as described in the article cited in the original post continues - there will be a day of reckoning.

Honest, hardworking people can only be abused for so long before there will be calls for retribution.

Let's hope that Trump's economic policies thrive and everyone is working and keeping more of what they earn. A healthy economy and secure country filled with pride and optimism will sideline these Statist/commies for a while.

A Supreme Court that respects the Second Amendment will preserve the tools needed to keep the bad guys sidelined or at least thinking twice.

ETA: And, to incorporate Cobwebs observation - those tools (and the folks who have been in the arena using them) may be (as they always are) the things that continue to ensure our freedom.

[SC Pete]

Been all across the Country, and it breaks my heart that all the good folks in "flyover country" may have to get dirty. No hard working people deserves any of that. But it happens when good people ignore the obvious.

[Team Sergeant]

Interesting.

Saul Alinsky reportedly corresponded regularly with a young Hillary Clinton...we dodged a bullet when she was defeated.

I'd say it was the other way around...... but what d I know. :munchin

[SC Pete]

Ha ha Team Sgt... I have daughters, the younger ones (21 and 24) and their large circle of friends were all Trump supporters. The only person who was despised more than Hillary was Michelle. There is still hope among the Millennial. They are on the right side, not always knowing why.

[tonyz]

I'd say it was the other way around...... but what d I know. :munchin

Lol, yeah, I'd say things worked out.

[SC Pete]

Tonyz,
Like the way you and Tm Sgt think. was out wandering in the intellectual desert for a long time, thinking I was alone. Old 7th team mate turned me on to this site. Aaahh, like sliding into a hot tub after a 10th GP January FTX...

[Old Dog New Trick]

The more I see about Trump's foreign policy the more I like. I also see all the divisive work the liberals are using to undermine his presidency and I wish them well. They will fail and that's a good thing.

I hope everyday that his domestic policies will take root and grow in a positive way and everyone will get a chance to see the apparent failures of the last "do nothing" politics of the left. Actually, they didn't do nothing, they just didn't do anything for the Americans that pay the bills. The middle class has shrunk and poverty has grown under Democratic control and Trump has come out trying to reverse years of disparity between those who pay the bills and those who only take.

You can only spend OPM until there is no OPM. Democrats never figure that out until it's too late. Unfortunately, some Republicans in office don't know the difference.

News will say 24-million will be without 'health insurance' well, the number should probably be 150-million are without affordable health insurance and that would reflect a sustainable future.

As far as the next Civil War it will be between those who have something to lose and those who have nothing to lose. The winner is already known.

[tonyz]

Tonyz,
Like the way you and Tm Sgt think. was out wandering in the intellectual desert for a long time, thinking I was alone. Old 7th team mate turned me on to this site. Aaahh, like sliding into a hot tub after a 10th GP January FTX...

Lol, this site provided a similar experience for me years ago.

Seems like so many folks enjoy this platform in a universe of web sites that are poorly run and full of shit.

Enjoy the stay.

[SC Pete]

I can see already I will. But back to the subject at hand. Revos are always a tricky business, and never turn out how the people who start them want them to turn out. Look at history, with the exception of the American Revo, they usually eat their own. The left, when winners, know that the right are independent, hard to organize, not a great threat. The left, on the other hand, are agitators and organizers. Who do you get rid of first? Always. Controllers of the useful idiots on the streets are the first to go. Then get rid of opposing leftist leaders. Idiots on the streets make good workers on a Siberian Peat Moss cutting gulag. Kommie Kolledge Kids never get it until it's too late.

[ddoering]

Been all across the Country, and it breaks my heart that all the good folks in "flyover country" may have to get dirty. No hard working people deserves any of that. But it happens when good people ignore the obvious.

Insurgencies always begin in the rural ares.

[Badger52]

Kommie Kolledge Kids never get it until it's too late.Invite them to a non-partisan event; host a showing of this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3owk7vEEOvs) (allowing an intermission or 2 because it's longer than Avatar or an Oprah re-run). Lay-in as much popcorn, taquitos, and high-priced fad drinks as you want and let them get mad about something besides their confusion between which bathroom to use.

:munchin

[SC Pete]

dd, funny you should say that. I read an Army research study paper back in the 1980s (U), and they looked at what a USA civil war would look like. Long ass dissertation, but the gist of it was this: shy of any outside intervention, the war would be almost all UW, and it would be Rural vs City. Large population centers would be trying to supply off the hinterlands. The Rurals would resist. Military force could be pressed in limited direct point areas only, and couldn't hold them. Move in, take what you can for the cities, move out. Would finally settle into the coastal areas against the interior. Weird, that I don't remember how it ended.

[Trapper John]

dd, funny you should say that. I read an Army research study paper back in the 1980s (U), and they looked at what a USA civil war would look like. Long ass dissertation, but the gist of it was this: shy of any outside intervention, the war would be almost all UW, and it would be Rural vs City. Large population centers would be trying to supply off the hinterlands. The Rurals would resist. Military force could be pressed in limited direct point areas only, and couldn't hold them. Move in, take what you can for the cities, move out. Would finally settle into the coastal areas against the interior. Weird, that I don't remember how it ended.

Do you have a copy of the research paper you referenced or a link to it? From your brief summary of the conclusion, I agree. We are in the pre-Phase I or early Phase I of that right now IMO.

BTW, welcome aboard.

[GratefulCitizen]

Pondering the rural vs urban divide, and the dependence of the latter upon the former for food, fuel, etc.;
A certain quote from one of the Mad Max movies comes to mind:

"Who run Bartertown?"

[The Reaper]

Pondering the rural vs urban divide, and the dependence of the latter upon the former for food, fuel, etc.;
A certain quote from one of the Mad Max movies comes to mind:

"Who run Bartertown?"

Master Blaster run Bartertown!

Now who is the Duke of New York?

TR

[Swoop]

A # 1. :cool:

[Ret10Echo]

Master Blaster run Bartertown!

Now who is the Duke of New York?

TR

Isaac Hayes....

But the POTUS took him out at the wall so Plissken could escape.

[Paslode]

Pondering the rural vs urban divide, and the dependence of the latter upon the former for food, fuel, etc.;
A certain quote from one of the Mad Max movies comes to mind:

"Who run Bartertown?"


There is a growing divide between the urban dwellers and the rural folks, but It would seem with the corporatization of farming (Monsanto, ADM, Tysons, etc.) that the divide based on the dependence of urban on rural isn't near much as it was 30 plus years ago.

The complaint I hear from rural folks is that the City folks want to tell us how to live our lives, that is very difficult to eek out a living on the farm because they cannot compete with corporate faming and government regulations are too burdensome.

[GratefulCitizen]

There is a growing divide between the urban dwellers and the rural folks, but It would seem with the corporatization of farming (Monsanto, ADM, Tysons, etc.) that the divide based on the dependence of urban on rural isn't near much as it was 30 plus years ago.

The complaint I hear from rural folks is that the City folks want to tell us how to live our lives, that is very difficult to eek out a living on the farm because they cannot compete with corporate faming and government regulations are too burdensome.

The economy as a whole, and the cities in particular, are dependent upon trucking.
Opportunism will thrive in any chaos.

Doesn't matter who "legally" owns the goods.
There's a reason trade routes have been so important through history.

[TOMAHAWK9521]

The economy as a whole, and the cities in particular, are dependent upon trucking.
Opportunism will thrive in any chaos.

Doesn't matter who "legally" owns the goods.
There's a reason trade routes have been so important through history.

That has already become apparent with the Chicago gang bangers recently raiding freight trains hauling commercial firearms.

[The Reaper]

That has already become apparent with the Chicago gang bangers recently raiding freight trains hauling commercial firearms.

I saw that as an exaggerated fluff piece.

The ATF probably lost more of their own guns in the same period.

I don't know of any manufacturer shipping firearms by rail. And all the stores I know ship in and out by UPS or Fedex.

TR

[Badger52]

I saw that as an exaggerated fluff piece.

The ATF probably lost more of their own guns in the same period.

I don't know of any manufacturer shipping firearms by rail. And all the stores I know ship in and out by UPS or Fedex.

TRConcur as to known shipment methods by stores.

Maybe the tip on the rail shipment is part of Freight & Furious. Or someone's good idea faerie was watching the latter part of "McClintock!"

[sfshooter]

I was a railroad freight conductor working for the BNSF out of Kansas City almost 20 years ago. There was a mass section of rails that passed through the city so all the different freight trains could go through. Very slow process because of the congestion and trains would sit for hours trying to get across town. Trains were robbed all the time and I remember one particular incident where a bunch of firearms were stolen from a train. They were destined for a large sporting goods store. Rumor was that it was an inside job because the perps knew which car to hit and only took the guns.....so, it has happened in the past.

I'm not familiar with the Chicago story, but I agree that shipment methods of this type would have changed by now.

[Team Sergeant]

That has already become apparent with the Chicago gang bangers recently raiding freight trains hauling commercial firearms.

Kinda makes one wonder what left-wing socialist union member was paid by the gangs of Chicago for that information.......

Cause the gangs of Chicago don't have the intellectual capacity to pull that off on their own. :munchin

[Paslode]

The economy as a whole, and the cities in particular, are dependent upon trucking.
Opportunism will thrive in any chaos.

Doesn't matter who "legally" owns the goods.
There's a reason trade routes have been so important through history.

Living in a smaller city in flyover country versus living in a city like LA or NYC probably skews my vision on that, but now that you mention it I can see where my section of flyover country could hold sway over the big cities West of the Rockies and East of the Mississippi.

[Flagg]

Master Blaster run Bartertown!

Now who is the Duke of New York?

TR

Haha....I've been using that Mad Max 3 quote in recent years....referring to Putin and energy politics in Western Europe.

Megacities, even their smaller(in population, but not value creation) western equivalents, need to be fed and watered.

[Remington Raidr]

Kinda makes one wonder what left-wing socialist union member was paid by the gangs of Chicago for that information.......

Cause the gangs of Chicago don't have the intellectual capacity to pull that off on their own. :munchin

It might take someone of talent and education that didn't have a regular gig . . . maybe a Community Organizer?? Just spitballin' here.

[DJ Urbanovsky]

They know exactly where those are. In Mexico.




The ATF probably lost more of their own guns in the same period.

[SC Pete]

If one looks at the voting pattern, gives you a real clear idea on how it would break down. Earlier post mentioned Agri-business. True enough, still like to think the farmers know how to survive, and will side with family values. Answer to earlier question about the Civ War Army study-- alas, read and swiped it out of a waiting room at a TMC. Disappeared when 1/2 my household goods were stolen moving back to Bragg. Don't it figure...

[bblhead672]

Gun-totin' leftists in Arizona at a MAGA rally.
http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news/lemons-gun-totin-left-wingers-demonstrate-trump-rally-bloodshed-on-the-horizon-9192965

[Badger52]

Gun-totin' leftists in Arizona at a MAGA rally.Their operating principles. (https://www.redneckrevolt.org/principles)They are Bolsheviks. Glad they pulled the curtain back.

[Paslode]

Gun-totin' leftists in Arizona at a MAGA rally.
http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news/lemons-gun-totin-left-wingers-demonstrate-trump-rally-bloodshed-on-the-horizon-9192965


Many of those pictured could use some PT.

[The Reaper]

Gun-totin' leftists in Arizona at a MAGA rally.
http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news/lemons-gun-totin-left-wingers-demonstrate-trump-rally-bloodshed-on-the-horizon-9192965

It occurs to me that carrying a firearm in public is pretty easy.

Being able to employ it effectively (and the will to), especially when someone is shooting back at you is a much different (and more difficult) proposition.

Most people who carry have little, if any training beyond the minimums. There might be a vet or two among them, but if so, probably not infantry or SF.

The anarchists are not above shooting the sheeple (or their own), and blaming it on the other side.

Just my .02, YMMV.

TR

[Peregrino]

It occurs to me that carrying a firearm in public is pretty easy.

Being able to employ it effectively (and the will to), especially when someone is shooting back at you is a much different (and more difficult) proposition.

Most people who carry have little, if any training beyond the minimums. There might be a vet or two among them, but if so, probably not infantry or SF.

The anarchists are not above shooting the sheeple (or their own), and blaming it on the other side.
Just my .02, YMMV.

TR

In their enthusiasm, the "Useful Idiots" always forget to read the fine print. Martyrdom is something that happens to somebody else - ignoring the fact that the people pulling their strings aren't anywhere near the front lines.

[bblhead672]

In their enthusiasm, the "Useful Idiots" always forget to read the fine print. Martyrdom is something that happens to somebody else - ignoring the fact that the people pulling their strings aren't anywhere near the front lines.

Agreed...and apparently the members of the "John Brown Gun Club" failed to read the entirety of Mr. Brown's story to the part where he was hanged.

[Team Sergeant]

And it would appear that if called upon to "haul-ass" to a firefight, some of them would need to make at least 3-4 trips....... :munchin

[PSM]

Seems like that could be considered brandishing (not that there's anything wrong with that). I'm sure the LEOs will use the same restrained enforcement when Trump supporters protect their rallies.

Pat

[Team Sergeant]

Seems like that could be considered brandishing (not that there's anything wrong with that). I'm sure the LEOs will use the same restrained enforcement when Trump supporters protect their rallies.

Pat

Brandishing only applies to older white males. I'm surprised you didn't read that right in Arizona's gun laws......... :munchin

[rsdengler]

Many of those pictured could use some PT.

LOL....And a Month of fasting......:munchin

[DJ Urbanovsky]

That's being generous.

Many of those pictured could use some PT.

[Paslode]

That's being generous.

Well, most of those kids look like they exercise with a Xbox controller in one hand and a BigGulp in the other hand.

I really like the chick that had the AR with the long gun scope!

[tonyz]

Some additional insight into why reasonable compromise now seems nearly impossible. Complete article at link.

THE CIVIL WAR IS HERE
The left doesn’t want to secede. It wants to rule.
March 27, 2017 Daniel Greenfield
FrontPage MAG

A civil war has begun.

This civil war is very different than the last one. There are no cannons or cavalry charges. The left doesn’t want to secede. It wants to rule. Political conflicts become civil wars when one side refuses to accept the existing authority. The left has rejected all forms of authority that it doesn’t control.

The left has rejected the outcome of the last two presidential elections won by Republicans. It has rejected the judicial authority of the Supreme Court when it decisions don’t accord with its agenda. It rejects the legislative authority of Congress when it is not dominated by the left.

It rejected the Constitution so long ago that it hardly bears mentioning.

It was for total unilateral executive authority under Obama. And now it’s for states unilaterally deciding what laws they will follow. (As long as that involves defying immigration laws under Trump, not following them under Obama.) It was for the sacrosanct authority of the Senate when it held the majority. Then it decried the Senate as an outmoded institution when the Republicans took it over.

It was for Obama defying the orders of Federal judges, no matter how well grounded in existing law, and it is for Federal judges overriding any order by Trump on any grounds whatsoever. It was for Obama penalizing whistleblowers, but now undermining the government from within has become “patriotic”.

There is no form of legal authority that the left accepts as a permanent institution. It only utilizes forms of authority selectively when it controls them. But when government officials refuse the orders of the duly elected government because their allegiance is to an ideology whose agenda is in conflict with the President and Congress, that’s not activism, protest, politics or civil disobedience; it’s treason.

After losing Congress, the left consolidated its authority in the White House. After losing the White House, the left shifted its center of authority to Federal judges and unelected government officials. Each defeat led the radicalized Democrats to relocate from more democratic to less democratic institutions.

This isn’t just hypocrisy. That’s a common political sin. Hypocrites maneuver within the system. The left has no allegiance to the system. It accepts no laws other than those dictated by its ideology.

Democrats have become radicalized by the left. This doesn’t just mean that they pursue all sorts of bad policies. It means that their first and foremost allegiance is to an ideology, not the Constitution, not our country or our system of government. All of those are only to be used as vehicles for their ideology.

That’s why compromise has become impossible.

Our system of government was designed to allow different groups to negotiate their differences. But those differences were supposed to be based around finding shared interests. The most profound of these shared interests was that of a common country based around certain civilizational values. The left has replaced these Founding ideas with radically different notions and principles. It has rejected the primary importance of the country. As a result it shares little in the way of interests or values.

Instead it has retreated to cultural urban and suburban enclaves where it has centralized tremendous amounts of power while disregarding the interests and values of most of the country. If it considers them at all, it is convinced that they will shortly disappear to be replaced by compliant immigrants and college indoctrinated leftists who will form a permanent demographic majority for its agenda.

But it couldn’t wait that long because it is animated by the conviction that enforcing its ideas is urgent and inevitable. And so it turned what had been a hidden transition into an open break.

In the hidden transition, its authority figures had hijacked the law and every political office they held to pursue their ideological agenda. The left had used its vast cultural power to manufacture a consensus that was slowly transitioning the country from American values to its values and agendas. The right had proven largely impotent in the face of a program which corrupted and subverted from within.

The left was enormously successful in this regard. It was so successful that it lost all sense of proportion and decided to be open about its views and to launch a political power struggle after losing an election.

The Democrats were no longer being slowly injected with leftist ideology. Instead the left openly took over and demanded allegiance to open borders, identity politics and environmental fanaticism. The exodus of voters wiped out the Democrats across much of what the left deemed flyover country.

The left responded to democratic defeats by retreating deeper into undemocratic institutions, whether it was the bureaucracy or the corporate media, while doubling down on its political radicalism. It is now openly defying the outcome of a national election using a coalition of bureaucrats, corporations, unelected officials, celebrities and reporters that are based out of its cultural and political enclaves.

It has responded to a lost election by constructing sanctuary cities and states thereby turning a cultural and ideological secession into a legal secession. But while secessionists want to be left alone authoritarians want everyone to follow their laws. The left is an authoritarian movement that wants total compliance with its dictates with severe punishments for those who disobey.

The left describes its actions as principled. But more accurately they are ideological. Officials at various levels of government have rejected the authority of the President of the United States, of Congress and of the Constitution because those are at odds with their radical ideology. Judges have cloaked this rejection in law. Mayors and governors are not even pretending that their actions are lawful.

The choices of this civil war are painfully clear.

We can have a system of government based around the Constitution with democratically elected representatives. Or we can have one based on the ideological principles of the left in which all laws and processes, including elections and the Constitution, are fig leaves for enforcing social justice.

But we cannot have both.

Some civil wars happen when a political conflict can’t be resolved at the political level. The really bad ones happen when an irresolvable political conflict combines with an irresolvable cultural conflict.

That is what we have now.

<snip>

http://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/266197/civil-war-here-daniel-greenfield

[ddoering]

When do we start shooting?

[Badger52]

Or we can have one based on the ideological principles of the right in which all laws and processes, including elections and the Constitution, are fig leaves for enforcing social justice.
Hell, in mid-1864 these well-funded carpetbaggers would've been Republicans, able to suspend the Constitution, perform ethnic cleansing, confiscate property, and declare martial law in friendly states in order to jail political opponents. Frankly, only the color of the statist of the moment has changed. What goes around comes around sometimes...

When do we start shooting?but this time it might be RH twist.
:cool:

[bubba]

"It's too late to work within the system, and too early to start shooting the bastards." - Claire Wolfe

[Badger52]

"It's too late to work within the system, and too early to start shooting the bastards." - Claire WolfeI think she said that in 1996 or so; gosh we've been accomodating.

[SC Pete]

Once again Tonyz is right on the mark. The new left really thinks that it is all going their way. Could be. But there are a lot of "Quiet Professionals" of all stripes, in all sorts of positions who keep their politics to themselves. A monkey wrench dropped in the gears at the right time will do more damage than 100 gun toting patriots. It's a new age, and the bunker and guns in the hills mentality is obsolete. Think "drone", and "cyber war". Unless there is a EMT killshot, US UW won't be settled with guns. Although the first phases will be. And as my earlier post this thread pointed out, revos are more about score settling than ideology.

[sfshooter]

The more the left gets their ass handed to them the more radical they will become. The divide is too great between Americans and the left's ideology for there to be a halfway meeting point.(I make a definite distinction between Americans and leftists as they are not for what this country was founded on!) Differences that draw this far apart can have no positive outcome other than a violent resolution.
The prelude to our first Civil War shows the same setup with only the issues being different. As the article stated, it's not about succession but a take over of the whole country.
At some point the line will be drawn. We Americans have a lot of patience, I don't think the left does though.:munchin

[SC Pete]

Shooter, agree with your post. I think it is way past the point of any reconciliation with the left. With Obamee, they were sure they had won. Hillary was supposed to ice the cake. Crush Middle America. Oh my, the backbone of America didn't go along. While they think they are undermining Trump with the temper tantrums, what they are really doing is awakening the slumbering working class, who have had enough. Soros paid punks are going to have a rude awakening if they keep it up.

[Paslode]

And as my earlier post this thread pointed out, revos are more about score settling than ideology.


Making a list, checking it twice, going to find out who is naughty and nice......

[SC Pete]

If you are serious, really am laughing out loud. if not, oh, well..

[Paslode]

If you are serious, really am laughing out loud. if not, oh, well..

Lets call it a mental check list :D

[tonyz]

Prager follows up on his earlier column - which was the subject of the OP.

Will the Second Civil War Turn Violent?
Dennis Prager
TownHall
May 02, 2017 12:01 AM

In a recent column, I made the case that Americans are fighting the Second Civil War. The deep chasm that has opened up between the left -- not liberals, the left -- and the rest of the country is so wide and so unbridgeable that there is no other way to describe what is happening. But I noted that at least thus far, unlike the First Civil War, this war is not violent.

Unfortunately, there is now reason to believe that violence is coming. In fact, it's already here. But as of now, it's only coming from one direction.

Left-wing thugs engage in violence and threats of violence with utter impunity. They shut down speakers at colleges; block highways, bridges and airport terminals; take over college buildings and offices; occupy state capitals; and terrorize individuals at their homes.

In order to understand why more violence may be coming, it is essential to understand that left-wing mobs are almost never stopped, arrested or punished. Colleges do nothing to stop them, and civil authorities do nothing to stop them on campuses or anywhere else. Police are reduced to spectators as they watch left-wing gangs loot stores, smash business and car windows, and even take over state capitals (as in Madison, Wisconsin).

It's beginning to dawn on many Americans that mayors, police chiefs and college presidents have no interest in stopping this violence. Left-wing officials sympathize with the lawbreakers, and the police, who rarely sympathize with thugs of any ideology, are ordered to do nothing by emasculated police chiefs.

Consequently, given the abdication by all these authorities of their role to protect the public, some members of the public will inevitably decide that they will protect themselves and others.

This ability of the left to get away with violence is one of the gravest threats to American society in its modern history. Since the Civil War, I can think of only two comparable eruptions of mob violence that authorities allowed. One was when white mobs lynched blacks. The other was the rioting by blacks, such as the Los Angeles riots 25 years ago, and the recent riots in Ferguson, Missouri, and Baltimore, Maryland.

Today, authorities in what we once proudly proclaimed the "Land of the Free and Home of the Brave" are intimidated to the point of paralysis.

And exactly what do they fear? Not violence -- they have made peace with left-wing violence. What they fear is the left-wing media. If the Black Lives Matter movement is forcefully prevented from blocking tens of thousands of cars from entering or leaving San Francisco, the police and local authorities will be labeled racist by black leaders, a smear that will then be echoed by The New York Times and rest of the left-wing media.

Likewise, if a college president requests enough police to come to a college campus so that a Heather Mac Donald, a Charles Murray or an Ann Coulter can deliver a lecture, some of the student-gangsters engaged in violence might be injured -- and that college president will then be pilloried by the mainstream media.

Furthermore, left-wing violence doesn't only succeed where it takes place. It succeeds where nothing happens. The left can now shut down places and events just by threatening violence. This is what happened last week in Portland, Oregon. One leftist called in a threat to the 82nd Avenue of Roses Parade, saying that the Republican Party contingent marching in the parade would be beaten up. The business leaders organizing the parade canceled the whole event for the first time in its 10-year history. If they'd had any reason to believe that the police would have adequately protected the marchers in left-wing Portland, one assumes (hopes?) that they would not have canceled the parade.

An email sent to parade organizers perfectly summed up the left's dominance of America through violence. It said, "You have seen how much power we have downtown and that the police cannot stop us from shutting down roads so please consider your decision wisely."

Meanwhile, the press lies about alleged white supremacists in President Trump's administration and an alleged massive surge in anti-Semitism in order to do what the left has done since Lenin: blame others while it alone organizes violence.

So, here's a prediction: If college presidents, mayors and police chiefs won't stop left-wing mobs, other Americans will. I hope this doesn't happen, because electing conservative Republicans and not donating money to colleges will be more effective. But it is almost inevitable.

Then the left-wing media -- the mainstream media -- will enter hysteria mode with reports that "right-wing fascists" are violently attacking America.

And that's when mayors and college presidents will finally order in the police.

https://townhall.com/columnists/dennisprager/2017/05/02/will-the-second-civil-war-turn-violent-n2320819?utm_source=thdailypm&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=nl_pm&newsletterad=

[Cobwebs]

Your post are both enlightening and frightening. It's almost ludicrous to imagine they have come from protest marches in the 60's to controlling our democracy and way of life. I love spending my winters in the warm climate of Florida, but I like my chances in the Michigan northwoods when the s--t hits the fan.

[tonyz]

Your post are both enlightening and frightening. It's almost ludicrous to imagine they have come from protest marches in the 60's to controlling our democracy and way of life. I love spending my winters in the warm climate of Florida, but I like my chances in the Michigan northwoods when the s--t hits the fan.

As they say...forewarned is forearmed.

I still expect the best for the nation but prepare for the worst.

[Badger52]

Thanks for that one.

[frostfire]

http://www.bbc.com/news/video_and_audio/headlines/39785767/portland-protests-turn-violent

[tonyz]

http://www.bbc.com/news/video_and_audio/headlines/39785767/portland-protests-turn-violent

Thanks for that clip. The subversives are pushing to see how far civilized folks let them go...and then they will tout the chaos as "victories" used for recruiting and propagandizing.

[Badger52]

Thanks for that clip. The subversives are pushing to see how far civilized folks let them go...and then they will tout the chaos as "victories" used for recruiting and propagandizing.As you pointed out in the previous article, it will be incumbent upon others to administer the mother of all beatdowns since the powers that be will not bring their authority under color of law to bear. Frostfire's video shows a nice charge of attempted murder at 0:28 (in most places attempted arson of a building that a reasonable person would believe to be occupied is attempted murder). Gang tackle, rip mask, photograph, plaster online. (It's Portland so I don't expect those guppies to go all Korean on 'em.)

[tonyz]

As you pointed out in the previous article, it will be incumbent upon others to administer the mother of all beatdowns since the powers that be will not bring their authority under color of law to bear. Frostfire's video shows a nice charge of attempted murder at 0:28 (in most places attempted arson of a building that a reasonable person would believe to be occupied is attempted murder). Gang tackle, rip mask, photograph, plaster online. (It's Portland so I don't expect those guppies to go all Korean on 'em.)

Thank you Badger. That video does tend to clearly illustrate that these thugs are professional insurgent criminals and also that those actions as illustrated have nothing to do with exercising First Amendment rights.

The light of day may galvanize the good people's opposition (and the necessity) to stop these thugs before lives are lost.

Unless the authorities put a quick stop to the subversive thug's clearly criminal activities - I do see the very real potential for a "Korean Shopkeeper" response evolving.

[bblhead672]

If we actually had the kind of fascist country and rulers that these people say we do I would expect the leaders of the group to start disappearing never to be seen again.

[frostfire]

(It's Portland so I don't expect those guppies to go all Korean on 'em.)




Unless the authorities put a quick stop to the subversive thug's clearly criminal activities - I do see the very real potential for a "Korean Shopkeeper" response evolving.

that's wascist! :D Are Koreans supposed to be synonymous with violence? Where's the Korean Lives Matter?!?

[Flagg]

that's wascist! :D Are Koreans supposed to be synonymous with violence? Where's the Korean Lives Matter?!?

The Koreans are too busy studying to gain entry into CalTech, MIT, and Stanford out of fear that their family will be ashamed of them if they don't get accepted.

Seriously, visit the bookstores of top tier hard science brand name schools and just watch. It's like Disneyland for families that beat their kids for getting an A-.

Maybe media should ask THOSE families what they think.

[Badger52]

that's wascist! :D Are Koreans supposed to be synonymous with violence? Where's the Korean Lives Matter?!?All this Rodney King stuff is a yawn. Perhaps telling of my age, no one was photographing those of us in the San Fernando Valley who were quietly arming up during Watts-One ('65)* in case it spilled over the foothills.


* Oh, yeah; M2AP was $6/100 in cans. :D

[frostfire]

The Koreans are too busy studying to gain entry into CalTech, MIT, and Stanford out of fear that their family will be ashamed of them if they don't get accepted.

Double wascist!!! Just because Koreans are Asians and Asians are known to have such practice, that doesn't mean you can generalize that to the Koreans! Even though I am not Korean, it makes my blood boil to see such social injustice coming from an ignorant online poster who fail to check their privilege!

How's my left logic :D ? I've been practicing. Is it good enough to join the left/radical feminist/pro blm chat groups and stir things up :munchin


That video does tend to clearly illustrate that these thugs are professional insurgent criminals and also that those actions as illustrated have nothing to do with exercising First Amendment rights.

I would love to have a friendly chat with these folks and get to know what's in it for them. Shouldn't be that hard to infiltrate this group. If the hacker Hector Monsegur and black panther Saeed Torres can be turned, surely these goons are not invulnerable to MICE-RC-RASCLS

[tonyz]

Reportedly from Boston...go figure.

Could just as well have been from Berkeley.

https://i1.wp.com/knuckledraggin.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/iver-boston.jpg?w=951

[SC Pete]

Oh, the topic that keeps on giving... This sword has two sides: the left is riling themselves up and still throwing their tantrums, hoping to take over once and for all. The right, even with the last election, are quietly hoping for the best, preparing for the worst. Sadly, I don't see any of this ending well. Still think if it goes bad, it will be city vs rural.

[sg1987]

Still think if it goes bad, it will be city vs rural.

I'd like to think that the country boys would kick ass, but it did'nt work out that way in the "War of Northern Agression". :munchin

[Old Dog New Trick]

I'd like to think that the country boys would kick ass, but it did'nt work out that way in the "War of Northern Agression". :munchin

When the ranchers and farmers slaughter their herds and till the crop to a scorched earth platform and then someone comes along and blows the bridges leading to and from urban areas...the cities will eat their young as they wage street battles for dominance of nothing.

I hope to be eating steak and potatoes with a green salad while that phase is going on. :D

[Badger52]

I'd like to think that the country boys would kick ass, but it did'nt work out that way in the "War of Northern Agression". :munchinActually in many circumstances they did, whether "on the line" or the Yankees being out-general'd for quite awhile; ultimately they were simply out-resourced in a variety of ways.

Follow-up to ODNT's nice idea, I don't imagine the metro denizens would be happy when their feel-good diversity-espousing "betters" in city hall turn into full-blown despots in front of their eyes to hold onto their own rice bowls. And those having sought sanctuary get hungry too. What do you mean those Walmart Distr Center trucks won't make deliveries? Logistics; it's what's for dinner.

[frostfire]

this thread got me into soul-searching mode, and this guy got a pretty level-headed perspective. Are we becoming useful idiots too? Is right vs left just a media built construct?

Thinking Strategically & Evading Engineered Conflict in a Manipulative World
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PgiqO5H4bM

[ddoering]

I'd like to think that the country boys would kick ass, but it did'nt work out that way in the "War of Northern Agression". :munchin

Back then the north was a manufacturing giant compared to the south. Now, not so much.

[Old Dog New Trick]

Frostfire,

Thanks for posting that link. I have a long drive coming up think I'll listen to this guy (Rex) talk for awhile. He seems to get it.

[Old Dog New Trick]

Farmers and Ranchers would not even need a scorched earth. Blowing bridges and cutting off the urban areas would do the trick. Imagine NYC alone if the incoming bridges were blown and power was cut in 24 hours it would be one big Charlie Foxtrot.

Well, I was thinking of the psychological aspects of what that would do. On the plus side the city folks would be less inclined to stampede to the flyover states if they felt the food was all gone.

[bblhead672]

Is it probable that the "country" boys will have far better training and more rifles than the typical big city armed citizen?

I'd put bets on the country riflemen vs a pack of pistol packing city thugs.

[Go Devil]

As long as there is cable television and internet, this topic has no teeth.

[Badger52]

this thread got me into soul-searching mode, and this guy got a pretty level-headed perspective. Are we becoming useful idiots too? Is right vs left just a media built construct?
That's a great question. I don't think just media, but it's useful to them and their consumers because it lets people rack & stack and (however it shakes out) being able to do so lends a comfort of sort (even when perhaps they should be not aligning with either one).

I recall some reading while proofing a friend's manuscript on the Polish Brygada during WW-II and they didn't play along with that construct as some other resistance groups did who, ultimately, paid the price for collaboration when the Germans were gone & the NKVD moved in & no longer needed them except in Siberia. The Brygada didn't buy "enemy of my enemy is my friend b.s." They regarded both as the enemy & their primary goal was to ensure survival of their culture in the face of extermination w/o getting into no-win actions that would call down the wrath from above. Objectivity is a bitch sometimes.

Go Devil, lol; yeah, till the EBT cards stop workin'... :D

[tonyz]

As long as there is cable television and internet, this topic has no teeth.

Fair observation...while we still have both...could this topic then be considered electronic teething...?

[bblhead672]

Texas A&M Professor says white people may have to be killed (http://narrative-collapse.com/2017/05/09/texas-am-professor-says-white-people-may-have-to-be-killed/)

Among other things, Curry says that black people should talk openly about murdering white people. In a youtube interview, he says that the murder of white people may be necessary for “black liberation.” Further, he suggests that white people need to fear blacks so much that they believe “death could come for them at any moment.”

Not hate speech according to the left. Reverse the colors and the professor is looking for a job tomorrow.

[tonyz]

Texas A&M Professor says white people may have to be killed (http://narrative-collapse.com/2017/05/09/texas-am-professor-says-white-people-may-have-to-be-killed/)



Not hate speech according to the left. Reverse the colors and the professor is looking for a job tomorrow.

Racism...alive and well.

They've even changed the definition to (wrongly) suggest that only certain groups can be racist - another farce attempted to be shoved down people's throats.

[tom kelly]

I hope Tommy is in the fight and not behind the action and just urging other's to do his bidding. I can envision tommy being stopped by white poo-lice for DUI, possession of a controlled substance with intent to distribute and surprise a stolen loaded 9mm pistol, That the Poo-lice planted on him. This is a prelude to Tommy writing his autobiography"The Black-Boy- Not have any common sense....GIVE ME A F---ing BREAK.....tom kelly

[Badger52]

Racism...alive and well.

They've even changed the definition to (wrongly) suggest that only certain groups can be racist - another farce attempted to be shoved down people's throats.Yes, the dicta from the pie-hole of Eric Holder rings on.

[rsdengler]

Texas A&M Professor says white people may have to be killed (http://narrative-collapse.com/2017/05/09/texas-am-professor-says-white-people-may-have-to-be-killed/)



Not hate speech according to the left. Reverse the colors and the professor is looking for a job tomorrow.

What an arrogant POS that guy is. And of course you will never hear anyone from the left condemning his message; what do you say, Al "Plastic Wig " Sharpton. Chirp, chirp....he would probably say that it is not racist because the "black men" in this country are being oppressed by the white man; honkies. :munchin

[Old Dog New Trick]

The professor is always welcome speak his mind at my house; I'll just tell him he acted stupidly.

[Paslode]

What an arrogant POS that guy is. And of course you will never hear anyone from the left condemning his message; what do you say, Al "Plastic Wig " Sharpton. Chirp, chirp....he would probably say that it is not racist because the "black men" in this country are being oppressed by the white man; honkies. :munchin


I believe there was a Not for Profit 503c lead by a child molestor named Morris Dees and a mutt named Mark Potok that claims only those in the Majority can be bigots and racist, and only White and Conservative groups can be extremists.

Then again I could be wrong.

[Team Sergeant]

http://narrative-collapse.com/2017/05/09/texas-am-professor-says-white-people-may-have-to-be-killed/


LOL, I enjoy reading these racist rants.

Doesn't it make you wonder how Dr. Tommy "Shit for Brains" Curry got his degree? My guess would be from the same people that gave barry soetoro his college degree/ nobel peace prize.

This is social justice, giving morons a college degree and turning them loose on society.

[Divemaster]

What's more remarkable is that A & M is one of only six United States Senior Military Colleges. I wonder how the Corps of Cadets feels about the good professor.

[SC Pete]

Funny how Warriors think along the same lines. Always figured "blowing the bridges" to major cities would be needed in the early stages of discord. Yeah, the war of Yankee Aggression didn't work out for the Southern Lads. Yankee industry and population numbers should of crushed them the first year, but didn't. Not going to be North/South next time. Know folks not far from Chicago, rural, with the same mind set. City thugs get nervous whence outside their AO. Big plus to fellas who ain't scared being in the woods at night. Pray we don't end up there....

[Pericles]

What's more remarkable is that A & M is one of only six United States Senior Military Colleges. I wonder how the Corps of Cadets feels about the good professor.

Since you asked - I was in the Corps of Cadets and my degree is in Philosophy (1982). When I was there, the Philosophy Department head was a former paratrooper in the 82nd Airborne, and we were taught to be disciplined thinkers. Obviously, there was an emphasis on military ethics. Many of us used to keep up with the Department, which took a nosedive in quality post 2000. Those educated in the traditional disciplines of Philosophy, Theory of Knowledge, Truth Theory, Religion, Logic, and Aesthetics, have retired and are being replaced by kooks. It is easy to ID a kook in the Philosophy Department because he will list a specialty that is not one of the 5 traditional disciplines.

I have as a personal project, an open letter to the Department. They are negating the value of my degree with this silliness.

[bblhead672]

The Left’s War on Free Speech/ (https://imprimis.hillsdale.edu/lefts-war-free-speech/)

Clearly lays out how (and why) the left is attacking free speech.

Then it was the five-year-old’s turn. You could tell she’d been thinking hard about her answer. She fixed both her brother and sister with a ferocious stare and said: “Free speech is that you can say what you want—as long as I like it.”

It was at this moment that I had one of those sudden insights as a parent. I realized that my oldest was a constitutional conservative, my middle child a libertarian, and my youngest a socialist with totalitarian tendencies.

[bblhead672]

The War of Two Americas by Daniel Greenfield:
http://www.frontpagemag.com/sites/default/files/uploads/2017/05/the_war_of_two_americas.pdf

[TJ11B]

http://www.theeagle.com/news/local/texas-a-m-professors-call-for-president-young-to-apologize/article_4fc51990-34f5-595a-99e9-ba90284226cf.html

WTF OVER!

Sorry for being brief gentlemen but I'm working on a tight deadline and I thought the article pretty well speaks for itself. Suffice it to say, I'm disgusted with these so called "professors" at A&M. :mad:

[Badger52]

http://www.theeagle.com/news/local/texas-a-m-professors-call-for-president-young-to-apologize/article_4fc51990-34f5-595a-99e9-ba90284226cf.html

WTF OVER! From the article you reference, RE the letter to the president from other department faculty (as if you'd get a balanced perspective from the most university press these days):

"You have chosen to acknowledge as truth a mischaracterization of Dr. Curry that was deliberately created by white supremacists and disseminated on websites associated with the alternative right and its agenda," the letter states,1. They are liars; Curry made those remarks as a regular invited guest of a black podcast host & is operating from (and so states) the precept that white people can't be reasoned with in the first place.
2. This "only blacks can appreciate black history" shit started long before & at least in the late 60's was entrenched in the UC system. By all means Professor, go your segregationist way & make room for someone who might want to teach, say, a welding class.

Here is the actual article (http://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/when-is-it-ok-to-kill-whites/) put forth by The American Conservative.

I will, however, offer that if the best American Conservative can do is pull the cloth back on stuff from 5 years ago that's a pretty crusty spoon they're stirring with.
:rolleyes:

[Pericles]

I will, however, offer that if the best American Conservative can do is pull the cloth back on stuff from 5 years ago that's a pretty crusty spoon they're stirring with.
:rolleyes:


True, but that means the Department did not really check the back ground on this guy before hire, or they agree with what he said. You can be certain I will ask which it is.

[Old Dog New Trick]

http://www.theeagle.com/news/local/texas-a-m-professors-call-for-president-young-to-apologize/article_4fc51990-34f5-595a-99e9-ba90284226cf.html

WTF OVER!

SNIP - Suffice it to say, I'm disgusted with these so called "professors" at A&M. :mad:

Diversity - it's what happens when only your social/racial constructs support your critical ways of thinking.

[frostfire]

From the article you reference, RE the letter to the president from other department faculty (as if you'd get a balanced perspective from the most university press these days)

The title:
"Texas A&M professors call for President Young to apologize to Curry "

The truth:
"The letter given to Young on Monday that asks him to apologize carries the names of 23 A&M professors who support their colleague....The letter signed by three professors -- Violet M. Johnson, director of Africana Studies; Shona N. Jackson, associate professor of English, and Carmela Garritano, associate professor of Africana Studies and Film Studies -- includes the names of 20 other professors associated with Africana Studies."

I bet the engineering and political science professors won't care for such BS.
Africana studies, gender studies, lesbian studies, transgender studies...
I guess this is what job creations means. I should teach pattern study of wart formation on the mollusk...

pathetic....



but not surprising given the lack of critical thinking in the general mass.

[Old Dog New Trick]

I still holdout hope that Gingrich will get to be WH Chief of Staff and soon. He is perhaps one of the smartest U.S. Historians in the history of the United States.

Opinion piece from Newt: Surrender or Fight... (worth the read)

Opinion: Gingrich: Surrender or fight - our country is at stake - Fox News
https://apple.news/AgmPUh3PjS_2PO0eNJqRrMA

[tonyz]

The president has warts - but the subversive barrage of divisive bullshit the nation is being subjected to right now is truly astounding.

This Is A Coup Against Our Right To Govern Ourselves
TownHall
Kurt Schlichter
Posted: May 18, 2017 12:01 AM

The blizzard of lies and distraction blowing through Washington is not just any routine stuffstorm, but a calculated attempt to bring down a president – our president, not the establishment’s president. And more than that, it’s an attempt to ensure that we never again have the ability to disrupt the bipartisan D.C. cabal’s permanent supremacy by inserting a chief executive who refuses to kiss their collective Reid.

This is a coup against us. It’s a coordinated campaign by liberals and their allies in the bureaucracy and media to once and for all ensure their perpetual rule over us. We need to fight it, here and now, so we don’t have to fight it down at the bottom of this slippery slope.

It’s brazen. It’s bold. It’s insulting to our intelligence. They aren’t even trying to hide their lies anymore. Truth is irrelevant; this is a choreographed dance routine and everyone has his moves. Call it Breakin’ 2: Electric Leakaroo, except instead of trying to save the community center they’re trying to save their power and prestige.

To buy the media narrative on this latest Russian nonsense, you must believe:

1. That whatever was revealed was super-secret, though we don’t know exactly what it was. When in doubt, assume it’s on par with the nuclear codes!

2. That there was no good reason to share this info with Russia, like coordinating our fight against our joint enemy or to prevent another Russian airliner massacre. Because why would we want another power fighting ISIS or civilians not to be blown out of the sky?

3. That LTG McMaster, who literally wrote the book on soldiers standing up to misbehaving civilian leaders and displayed immense personal courage in battle, turned chicken and sat there silently as Trump monologued about this unknown mystery info of doomsday-level import.

4. That LTG McMaster lied on camera. Twice. And that Secretary of State Tillerson lied too.

5. That random anonymous sources in an intelligence community that hates Trump with a burning passion must be believed without question, though we don’t know their identities or their motives.

6. That these anonymous randos must be believed, even though they were not actually in the room to, you know, actually hear what happened. The traditional bar on hearsay is apparently now just a bourgeois conceit.

7. That when the Washington Post and the rest of the media publishes classified stuff (including intelligence provided by allies) leaked by anyone not named “Donald Trump,” it’s awesome.

8. That the Washington Post and the rest of the media, which has been wrong over and over again in their reporting, are not wrong again.

9. That the Washington Post and the rest of the media are objective and have no anti-Trump bias, even though they are literally cheering the hits on the president.

10. That there are unicorns.

The latest pseudo-scandal is that Trump doesn’t think Mike Flynn did anything wrong, and told James Comey so back in February. So basically, Trump expressed the same view he had of the whole Flynn nonsense to Comey as he has expressed to every interviewer. Comey did nothing, and said nothing (even when testifying to Congress) for nearly three months, because it was nothing. The Russian snipe hunt continued throughout unabated. That off-hand comment was a pretty poor attempt at obstruction of justice since it didn’t obstruct anything – to the limited extent these Russian witch hunts can be confused with “justice” at all.

So the Menschian thinkers who usually scream “Treason!” are now screaming “Obstruction of Justice!” It’s adorable when they learn new terms and try to use them correctly; they’re so proud of themselves and their vocabulary building that you almost feel bad having to point out that they sound like idiots.

It is nice, though, to have liberals finally come out against the abuse of executive power, misuse of classified material, and Russians. Welcome to the party, except we know you’re full of Schumer.

It’s all lies, and they know it and we know it. Normal people just shake their heads and wonder why Washington is so consumed with political nonsense instead of solving problems. But then, Washington does not produce solutions. It produces only political nonsense.

This is a concentrated, coordinated effort by elite insiders to take down not this president – Trump’s not the point here – but to take down us, the normal American they seek to rule. Someone came to Washington who wasn’t part of the club, and that’s intolerable. So they are desperate to expel him, and by extension, us.

Every day will be a crisis, every action he takes will be the worst thing that has ever happened, and every step towards keeping his promises a crime.

Repeal Obamacare? TRUMP’S SENTENCING MILLIONS TO DEATH!

Talk to Russians? IT’S TREASON!

Telling Comey he wishes this nonsense would stop? OBSTRUTION OF JUSTICE EVEN THOUGH NOTHING WAS OBSTRUCTED!

Now, this campaign isn’t aimed at us. Normal people, people who don’t live in DC or NYC or LA, just tune it out. After all these years, and with the help of the web, we normals know the game. We’re woke, as the dorky leftists say.

The target of this constant barrage is the soft and the stupid, the smug and the sanctimonious, the wusses and the surrender flunkies. That’s why you get the girlish-handed likes of David Brooks writing dainty columns that give Trump such a pinch! That’s why David Frum starts using words like “courage” to impugn actual men who have done actual man-things, like LTG McMaster. That’s why Kasich spews his bilious funk of sanctimony and submission, among other funks. It’s all to appeal to the Fredocons, the soft-headed RINOs who are smart, not dumb like everyone says, who just want something for themselves – attention, approval, and media pats on their pointy little heads.

So these fussy ninnies, fresh from having some v-capped crone screeching at them that they will vote to take away her right to have taxpayers fork cash over to kill the baby no man will ever give her, wander outside into a wall of mics and cameras and pause. Then they talk, and when what they say trashes Trump sufficiently, the smiles from the press come, and the nods, and then the faux respect. Now they are no longer mean old Rethuglicans but dauntless heroes, at least in Georgetown, because they are willing to dance and caper to the tune of the establishment.

This tsunami of baloney isn’t aimed at us. It’s aimed at them, the Republicans who are foolish enough to believe their new friends when they whisper words like “honor” and “patriotism.” Some of the marks are real patriots who fall prey to these liars when they couch their bogus narrative in national defense terms. But the majority of the marks are just morons.

When targeting the dummies, the goal is simple. Draw off enough weak, attention-addicted RINOs to make it impossible for the President to govern. Then, hopefully, us normals will shrug, and slink away, having relearned our place. After all, we’re deplorable.

And when the liberal establishment retakes power, and the mavericks and goody-goodies get tossed aside, the bureaucracy, media and the Democrats will conspire to ensure that no one can ever take their power from them again. But they haven’t considered the consequences. We’ll object.

So we have to fight against this cable network coup. Because, if we don’t fight now, we all may end up fighting later.

https://townhall.com/columnists/kurtschlichter/2017/05/18/this-is-a-coup-against-our-right-to-govern-ourselves-n2328059?utm_source=thdailypm&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=nl_pm&newsletterad=

[tonyz]

I still holdout hope that Gingrich will get to be WH Chief of Staff and soon. He is perhaps one of the smartest U.S. Historians in the history of the United States.

Opinion piece from Newt: Surrender or Fight... (worth the read)

Opinion: Gingrich: Surrender or fight - our country is at stake - Fox News
https://apple.news/AgmPUh3PjS_2PO0eNJqRrMA

Gingrich gets it.

[tonyz]

Daniel Greenfield: "Guns Are How A Civil War Ends... Politics Is How It Starts"

Zero Hedge
by Tyler Durden
Sat, 01/27/2018

Authored by Daniel Greenfield via Sultan Knish blog,

(The following is the speech that I delivered this Sunday at the South Carolina Tea Party Coalition Convention in Myrtle Beach.)

There aren’t any soldiers marching on Charleston… or Myrtle Beach. Nobody’s getting shot in the streets. Except in Chicago… and Baltimore, Detroit and Washington D.C.

But that’s not a civil war. It’s just what happens when Democrats run a city into the ground. And then they dig a hole in the ground so they can bury it even deeper.

If you look deep enough into that great big Democrat hole, you might even see where Jimmy Hoffa is buried.

But it’s not guns that make a civil war. It’s politics.

Guns are how a civil war ends. Politics is how it begins.

How do civil wars happen?

Two or more sides disagree on who runs the country. And they can’t settle the question through elections because they don’t even agree that elections are how you decide who’s in charge.

That’s the basic issue here. Who decides who runs the country? When you hate each other but accept the election results, you have a country. When you stop accepting election results, you have a countdown to a civil war.

I know you’re all thinking about President Trump.

He won and the establishment, the media, the democrats, rejected the results. They came up with a whole bunch of conspiracy theories to explain why he didn’t really win. It was the Russians. And the FBI. And sexism, Obama, Bernie Sanders and white people.

It’s easier to make a list of the things that Hillary Clinton doesn’t blame for losing the election. It’s going to be a short list.

A really short list. Herself.

The Mueller investigation is about removing President Trump from office and overturning the results of an election. We all know that. But it’s not the first time they’ve done this.

The first time a Republican president was elected this century, they said he didn’t really win. The Supreme Court gave him the election. There’s a pattern here.

Trump didn’t really win the election. Bush didn’t really win the election. Every time a Republican president won an election this century, the Democrats insist he didn’t really win.

Now say a third Republican president wins an election in say, 2024.

What are the odds that they’ll say that he didn’t really win? Right now, it looks like 100 percent.

What do sure odds of the Dems rejecting the next Republican president really mean? It means they don’t accept the results of any election that they don’t win.

It means they don’t believe that transfers of power in this country are determined by elections.

That’s a civil war.

There’s no shooting. At least not unless you count the attempt to kill a bunch of Republicans at a charity baseball game practice. But the Democrats have rejected our system of government.

This isn’t dissent. It’s not disagreement.

You can hate the other party. You can think they’re the worst thing that ever happened to the country. But then you work harder to win the next election. When you consistently reject the results of elections that you don’t win, what you want is a dictatorship.

Your very own dictatorship.

The only legitimate exercise of power in this country, according to the left, is its own. Whenever Republicans exercise power, it’s inherently illegitimate.

The attacks on Trump show that elections don’t matter to the left.

Republicans can win an election, but they have a major flaw. They’re not leftists.

That’s what the leftist dictatorship looks like.

The left lost Congress. They lost the White House. So what did they do? They began trying to run the country through Federal judges and bureaucrats.

Every time that a Federal judge issues an order saying that the President of the United States can’t scratch his own back without his say so, that’s the civil war.

Our system of government is based on the constitution, but that’s not the system that runs this country.

The left’s system is that any part of government that it runs gets total and unlimited power over the country.

If it’s in the White House, then the president can do anything. And I mean anything. He can have his own amnesty for illegal aliens. He can fine you for not having health insurance. His power is unlimited.

He’s a dictator.

But when Republicans get into the White House, suddenly the President can’t do anything. He isn’t even allowed to undo the illegal alien amnesty that his predecessor illegally invented.

A Democrat in the White House has “discretion” to completely decide every aspect of immigration policy. A Republican doesn’t even have the “discretion” to reverse him.

That’s how the game is played. That’s how our country is run.

When Democrats control the Senate, then Harry Reid and his boys and girls are the sane, wise heads that keep the crazy guys in the House in check.

But when Republicans control the Senate, then it’s an outmoded body inspired by racism.

When Democrats run the Supreme Court, then it has the power to decide everything in the country. But when Republicans control the Supreme Court, it’s a dangerous body that no one should pay attention to.

When a Democrat is in the White House, states aren’t even allowed to enforce immigration law. But when a Republican is in the White House, states can create their own immigration laws.

Under Obama, a state wasn’t allowed to go to the bathroom without asking permission. But under Trump, Jerry Brown can go around saying that California is an independent republic and sign treaties with other countries.

The Constitution has something to say about that.

Whether it’s Federal or State, Executive, Legislative or Judiciary, the left moves power around to run the country. If it controls an institution, then that institution is suddenly the supreme power in the land.

This is what I call a moving dictatorship.

There isn’t one guy in a room somewhere issuing the orders. Instead there’s a network of them. And the network moves around.

If the guys and girls in the network win elections, they can do it from the White House. If they lose the White House, they’ll do it from Congress. If they don’t have either one, they’ll use the Supreme Court.

If they don’t have either the White House, Congress or the Supreme Court, they’re screwed. Right?

Nope.

They just go on issuing them through circuit courts and the bureaucracy. State governments announce that they’re independent republics. Corporations begin threatening and suing the government.

There’s no consistent legal standard. Only a political one.

Under Obama, states weren’t allowed to enforce immigration laws. That was the job of the Federal government. And the states weren’t allowed to interfere with the job that the Feds weren’t doing.

Okay.

Now Trump comes into office and starts enforcing immigration laws again. And California announces it’s a sanctuary state and passes a law punishing businesses that cooperate with Federal immigration enforcement.

So what do we have here?

It’s illegal for states to enforce immigration law because that’s the province of the Federal government. But it’s legal for states to ban the Federal government from enforcing immigration law.

The only consistent pattern here is that the left decided to make it illegal to enforce immigration law.

It may do that sometimes under the guise of Federal power or states rights. But those are just fronts. The only consistent thing is that leftist policies are mandatory and opposing them is illegal.

Everything else is just a song and dance routine.

That’s how it works. It’s the moving dictatorship. It’s the tyranny of the network.

You can’t pin it down. There’s no one office or one guy. It’s a network of them. It’s an ideological dictatorship. Some people call it the deep state. But that doesn’t even begin to capture what it is.

To understand it, you have to think about things like the Cold War and Communist infiltration.

A better term than Deep State is Shadow Government.

Parts of the Shadow Government aren’t even in the government. They are wherever the left holds power. It can be in the non-profit sector and among major corporations. Power gets moved around like a New York City shell game. Where’s the quarter? Nope, it’s not there anymore.

The shadow government is an ideological network. These days it calls itself by a hashtag #Resistance. Under any name, it runs the country. Most of the time we don’t realize that. When things are normal, when there’s a Democrat in the White House or a bunch of Democrats in Congress, it’s business as usual.

Even with most Republican presidents, you didn’t notice anything too out of the ordinary. Sure, the Democrats got their way most of the time. But that’s how the game is usually played.

It’s only when someone came on the scene who didn’t play the game by the same rules, that the network exposed itself. The shadow government emerged out of hiding and came for Trump.

And that’s the civil war.

This is a war over who runs the country. Do the people who vote run the country or does this network that can lose an election, but still get its agenda through, run the country?

We’ve been having this fight for a while. But this century things have escalated.

They escalated a whole lot after Trump’s win because the network isn’t pretending anymore. It sees the opportunity to delegitimize the whole idea of elections.

Now the network isn’t running the country from cover. It’s actually out here trying to overturn the results of an election and remove the president from office.

It’s rejected the victories of two Republican presidents this century.

[tonyz]

Part 2

And if we don’t stand up and confront it, and expose it for what it is, it’s going to go on doing it in every election. And eventually Federal judges are going to gain enough power that they really will overturn elections.

It happens in other countries. If you think it can’t happen here, you haven’t been paying attention to the left.

Right now, Federal judges are declaring that President Trump isn’t allowed to govern because his Tweets show he’s a racist. How long until they say that a president isn’t even allowed to take office because they don’t like his views?

That’s where we’re headed.

Civil wars swing around a very basic question. The most basic question of them all. Who runs the country?

Is it me? Is it you? Is it Grandma? Or is it bunch of people who made running the government into their career?

America was founded on getting away from professional government. The British monarchy was a professional government. Like all professional governments, it was hereditary. Professional classes eventually decide to pass down their privileges to their kids.

America was different. We had a volunteer government. That’s what the Founding Fathers built.

This is a civil war between volunteer governments elected by the people and professional governments elected by… well… uh… themselves.

Of the establishment, by the establishment and for the establishment.

You know, the people who always say they know better, no matter how many times they screw up, because they’re the professionals. They’ve been in Washington D.C. politics since they were in diapers.

Freedom can only exist under a volunteer government. Because everyone is in charge. Power belongs to the people.

A professional government is going to have to stamp out freedom sooner or later. Freedom under a professional government can only be a fiction. Whenever the people disagree with the professionals, they’re going to have to get put down. That’s just how it is. No matter how it’s disguised, a professional government is tyranny.

Ours is really well disguised, but if it walks like a duck and locks you up like a duck, it’s a tyranny.

Now what’s the left.

Forget all the deep answers. The left is a professional government.

It’s whole idea is that everything needs to be controlled by a big central government to make society just. That means everything from your soda sizes to whether you can mow your lawn needs to be decided in Washington D.C.

Volunteer governments are unjust. Professional governments are fair. That’s the credo of the left.

Its network, the one we were just discussing, it takes over professional governments because it shares their basic ideas. Professional governments, no matter who runs them, are convinced that everything should run through the professionals. And the professionals are usually lefties. If they aren’t, they will be.

Just ask Mueller and establishment guys like him.

What infuriates professional government more than anything else? An amateur, someone like President Trump who didn’t spend his entire adult life practicing to be president, taking over the job.

President Trump is what volunteer government is all about.

When you’re a government professional, you’re invested in keeping the system going. But when you’re a volunteer, you can do all the things that the experts tell you can’t be done. You can look at the mess we’re in with fresh eyes and do the common sense things that President Trump is doing.

And common sense is the enemy of government professionals. It’s why Trump is such a threat.

A Republican government professional would be bad enough. But a Republican government volunteer does that thing you’re not supposed to do in government… think differently.

Professional government is a guild. Like medieval guilds. You can’t serve in if you’re not a member. If you haven’t been indoctrinated into its arcane rituals. If you aren’t in the club.

And Trump isn’t in the club. He brought in a bunch of people who aren’t in the club with him.

Now we’re seeing what the pros do when amateurs try to walk in on them. They spy on them, they investigate them and they send them to jail. They use the tools of power to bring them down.

That’s not a free country.

It’s not a free country when FBI agents who support Hillary take out an “insurance policy” against Trump winning the election. It’s not a free country when Obama officials engage in massive unmasking of the opposition. It’s not a free country when the media responds to the other guy winning by trying to ban the conservative media that supported him from social media. It’s not a free country when all of the above collude together to overturn an election because the guy who wasn’t supposed to win, won.

We’re in a civil war between conservative volunteer government and leftist professional government.

The pros have made it clear that they’re not going to accept election results anymore. They’re just going to make us do whatever they want. They’re in charge and we better do what they say.

That’s the war we’re in. And it’s important that we understand that.

Because this isn’t a shooting war yet. And I don’t want to see it become one.

And before the shooting starts, civil wars are fought with arguments. To win, you have to understand what the big picture argument is. It’s easy to get bogged down in arguments that don’t matter or won’t really change anything.

This is the argument that changes everything.

Do we have a government of the people and by the people? Or do we have a tyranny of the professionals?

The Democrats try to dress up this argument in leftist social justice babble. Those fights are worth having. But sometimes we need to pull back the curtain on what this is really about.

They’ve tried to rig the system. They’ve done it by gerrymandering, by changing the demographics of entire states through immigration, by abusing the judiciary and by a thousand different tricks.

But civil wars come down to an easy question. Who runs the country?

They’ve given us their answer and we need to give them our answer.

Both sides talk about taking back the country. But who are they taking it back for?

The left uses identity politics. It puts supposed representatives of entire identity groups up front. We’re taking the country back for women and for black people, and so on and so forth…

But nobody elected their representatives.

Identity groups don’t vote for leaders. All the black people in the country never voted to make Shaun King al Al Sharpton their representative. And women sure as hell didn’t vote for Hillary Clinton.

What we have in America is a representative government. A representative government makes freedom possible because it actually represents people, instead of representing ideas.

The left’s identity politics only represents ideas. Nobody gets to vote on them.

Instead the left puts out representatives from different identity politics groups, there’s your gay guy, there’s three women, there’s a black man, as fronts for their professional government system.

When they’re taking back the country, it’s always for professional government. It’s never for the people.

When conservatives fight to take back the country, it’s for the people. It’s for volunteer government the way that the Founding Fathers wanted it to be.

This is a civil war over whether the American people are going to govern themselves. Or are they going to be governed.

Are we going to have a government of the people, by the people and for the people… or are we going to have a government.

The kind of government that most countries have where a few special people decide what’s best for everyone.

We tried that kind of government under the British monarchy. And we had a revolution because we didn’t like it.

But that revolution was met with a counterrevolution by the left. The left wants a monarchy. It wants King Obama or Queen Oprah.

It wants to end government of the people, by the people and for the people. That’s what they’re fighting for. That’s what we’re fighting against. The stakes are as big as they’re ever going to get. Do elections matter anymore?

I live in the state of Ronald Reagan. I can go visit the Ronald Reagan Library any time I want to. But today California has one party elections. There are lots of elections and propositions. There’s all the theater of democracy, but none of the substance. Its political system is as free and open as the Soviet Union.

And that can be America.

The Trump years are going to decide if America survives. When his time in office is done, we’re either going to be California or a free nation once again.

The civil war is out in the open now and we need to fight the good fight. And we must fight to win.

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-01-27/daniel-greenfield-guns-are-how-civil-war-ends-politics-how-it-starts

[Box]

Here is another look at how Greenfield sees this:

"The left is a treasonous movement. The Democrats became a treasonous organization when they fell under the sway of a movement that rejects our system of government, its laws, and its elections. Now their treason is coming to a head."


I don't think he is wrong.

[sfshooter]

If we the people of this great nation cannot get an Article V Convention of States together, and impose term limits and length of stay in politics, then we will forever be burdened by professional politicians hence tyranny. And that will last until enough armed citizenry decide to end such.

[TWITCHY]

SFSHOOTER- I agree with you that term limits are needed to reverse the course of our Nation. The other day, I had a gentleman come to my door and ask if I would be voting for my Republican representative. I told him that I have voted for him over the past 8-12 years, but I have instituted my own term limit police and will no longer vote for most incumbent (professional) politicians. The bad thing is, the politician has actually done some good for this region and he supports my positions; however, I am sick and tired of the “ruling” class. Unfortunately, it will probably amount to a wasted vote on an unknown, as most people are too lazy to evaluate other candidates. I truly hope for a term limit legislation, soon, but I doubt it will happen. They’re sure as hell not going to vote for their own term limits!

[sfshooter]

SFSHOOTER- I agree with you that term limits are needed to reverse the course of our Nation. The other day, I had a gentleman come to my door and ask if I would be voting for my Republican representative. I told him that I have voted for him over the past 8-12 years, but I have instituted my own term limit police and will no longer vote for most incumbent (professional) politicians. The bad thing is, the politician has actually done some good for this region and he supports my positions; however, I am sick and tired of the “ruling” class. Unfortunately, it will probably amount to a wasted vote on an unknown, as most people are too lazy to evaluate other candidates. I truly hope for a term limit legislation, soon, but I doubt it will happen. They’re sure as hell not going to vote for their own term limits!



That is why it has to be done with a Convention of States. The reason it seems such a hard task to get together 3/4 of the states for an Article V convention is because all the damn state people are career politicians too and most probably entertain a federal political spot.

[CloseDanger]

Yes. Article 5 this leviathan (http://newbooksinbrief.com/2013/09/24/43-a-summary-of-the-liberty-amendments-restoring-the-american-republic-by-mark-r-levin/) before it eats all of US whole.

[Penn]

Concise, factual, a 2 minute warning - Stand Up - in my mind.

The country is terrified about having a rational and logical discussion about almost every great issue of our times: unsustainable national debts and deficits, the new nexus between leftwing plutocracy and populism, the viability of Social Security and Medicare, deteriorating race relations, the Soviet-style American campus, global warming, and the deterioration of medical care. Instead, to preclude honest talk, we offer perfunctory charges of sexism and racism, and seek cover in “fairness” and “equality.”
The redistributionist, equality-of-result state — fueled by a national progressive ideology — is the new deity that determines what is free expression. Blasphemy is now defined as daring to use logic and evidence to expose the state’s failed, deductive tenets.


http://victorhanson.com/wordpress/building-the-new-dark-age-mind/

[sfshooter]

I am reminded of The Fountainhead and Atlas Shrugged. Our society is deteriorating and our elected officials (the vast majority) are participating in the degradation of our country. I'm not sure how we can climb back up from the abyss we have fallen into.

[Trapper John]

Concise, factual, a 2 minute warning - Stand Up - in my mind.



http://victorhanson.com/wordpress/building-the-new-dark-age-mind/

Finest Kind, Penn! Poignant, well argued, and precisely on point IMHO.

And, sfshooter, you are correct in your analogy, but don't despair.

Hold Fast, the leftist agenda is coming unraveled. One thing is for certain, us "Deplorables" can sense the Truth, we readily recognize BS and we don't back down so easily.

It's a culture war that will be a long haul and it will get ugly from time-to-time. Take heart in that DJT is Galt-like, so in the end we will prevail!

I've said it before, I think this forum is Galt's Gulch so keep the Faith!

[sfshooter]

Finest Kind, Penn! Poignant, well argued, and precisely on point IMHO.

And, sfshooter, you are correct in your analogy, but don't despair.

Hold Fast, the leftist agenda is coming unraveled. One thing is for certain, us "Deplorables" can sense the Truth, we readily recognize BS and we don't back down so easily.

It's a culture war that will be a long haul and it will get ugly from time-to-time. Take heart in that DJT is Galt-like, so in the end we will prevail!

I've said it before, I think this forum is Galt's Gulch so keep the Faith!

Well, TJ, I do get disgusted at times but I have never truly lost the faith in this country. I know we will prevail or I will go down fighting to ensure we do. The true patriots in this country really don't have a voice that can drown out the Pravda networks. Not to say there is no voice, just that the unaware of our society never hear them.

[miclo18d]

Well, TJ, I do get disgusted at times but I have never truly lost the faith in this country. I know we will prevail or I will go down fighting to ensure we do. The true patriots in this country really don't have a voice that can drown out the Pravda networks. Not to say there is no voice, just that the unaware of our society never hear them.
They don’t need to be drown out. They are failing with their message. People are running to the internet in droves. As seen in viewership and the fact NYT is stating print will be dead in 10 yrs. they killed it with partisan reporting.

Once on the internet, you are presented with Ben Shapiro, Mark Dice, Steven Crowder, et.al. Once they start hearing REAL conservatism and not the RINO party line on Fox or the American Pravda propaganda on the other stations, they are in for an awakening.

The sleepers are awakening (woking, for the millennials on here).

I find it funny that the libs think THEY are the Resistance. It’s all part of the communist playbook. They are always the down trodden, they are always for the struggle. But, THEY are the government right now, they are the deep state, they have the president against the ropes. They are NOT the resistance! They are the disease, they are big gubmint. Government has always been the problem and the founding fathers knew this. They tried to explain it but we were to stupid to listen.

“A Republic, if you can keep it!”

ETA: They have NO IDEA what a/the resistance really is/means. The Masters of Chaos that roam these boards would have a field day.

[Golf1echo]

^
Insightful, I'm seeing the same...it's hard to keep believing that same old propaganda when it goes nowhere productive.

I continue to marvel at our Founding Fathers and the results of their work.

You said it and it does take work it's not ever a given...

“A Republic, if you can keep it!”

[Trapper John]

..........

ETA: They have NO IDEA what a/the resistance really is/means. The Masters of Chaos that roam these boards would have a field day.

:lifter:lifter

[Trapper John]

miclo18d, I take issue with one thing you said they have the president against the ropes. .

Nope, and I hope they think so! He has them chasing the next shiny object at his will. DJT is a master of misdirection and they fall for it every time.

Meanwhile he is moving his agenda forward step by step. His tactics have put them in the "no message" position. The real truth is emerging and that coupled with his successes (tax reform, immigration reform, infrastructure rebuilding, not to mention the foreign policy successes, balancing trade, and repatriation of $Trilions) will redefine the political landscape forever.

Look for the real draining of the swamp to begin in 2019. Then they will wake up to the reality that is upon them , but it will be too late. JMHO

[echoes]

miclo18d, I take issue with one thing you said .

Nope, and I hope they think so! He has them chasing the next shiny object at his will. DJT is a master of misdirection and they fall for it every time.

Meanwhile he is moving his agenda forward step by step. His tactics have put them in the "no message" position. The real truth is emerging and that coupled with his successes (tax reform, immigration reform, infrastructure rebuilding, not to mention the foreign policy successes, balancing trade, and repatriation of $Trilions) will redefine the political landscape forever.

Look for the real draining of the swamp to begin in 2019. Then they will wake up to the reality that is upon them , but it will be too late. JMHO

TJ, very inspiring words! It is a tremendous thing when someone can articulate so well, the truth!:lifter


The financial sector does not lie, and indeed finally Our Country is seeing gains for the first time in a long time. Go-Trump-Go! And guess what, the big zero needs to face reality; Trump is your President, so suck it up buttercup!:p

JMHO,

Holly

[miclo18d]

miclo18d, I take issue with one thing you said .

Nope, and I hope they think so! He has them chasing the next shiny object at his will. DJT is a master of misdirection and they fall for it every time.

Meanwhile he is moving his agenda forward step by step. His tactics have put them in the "no message" position. The real truth is emerging and that coupled with his successes (tax reform, immigration reform, infrastructure rebuilding, not to mention the foreign policy successes, balancing trade, and repatriation of $Trilions) will redefine the political landscape forever.

Look for the real draining of the swamp to begin in 2019. Then they will wake up to the reality that is upon them , but it will be too late. JMHO

I guess what I mean by against the ropes is that he is assailed on all sides. Of course the dems, the meadia, but also his own administration (deep state) and the RINOs. He has a tough road ahead and I support him in that! I’m wringing my hands in anticipation for when the tide completely turns and all the skinny dippers are exposed.

[tom kelly]

START WITH, DOJ HOLDOVERS LIKE ROB ROSENSTEIN,ANDREW WEISSMAN, ANDREW McCARTHY & ALL ASST.U S ATTORNEYS APPOINTED BY BARRY OBAMA. THE F B I LEFT OVERS LISA PAGE & PETER STRUCK.....FIRE MULLER NOW.....................TOM KELLY

[Box]

instead of trying to drain the swamp... maybe just flood it

drown the mammals - they deserve it - without a food source, the reptiles will start eating themselves

win-win

[tonyz]

7 Forces Driving America Toward Civil War
John Hawkins|Posted: Apr 21, 2018 7:40 AM
TownHall.com

I was interviewed by a mainstream media reporter yesterday. I thought he wanted to talk tech issues, but we actually spent almost the entire conversation discussing the feeling that many conservatives have that America has gone off the tracks and is headed toward dissolution or alternately, a civil war one day. Obviously, this would be a terrible thing and ironically, twenty years ago, it would have been laughable. Today, the joke isn’t so funny because we are a deeply unhealthy society with a dysfunctional government and for all our money, success and storied history, we seem to be on an increasingly dangerous trajectory.

1) A Post-Constitutional Era: Liberals don’t believe in the Constitution. Typically they deny this, but that’s exactly what a “living” Constitution means. You make it up as you go along. The Founders foresaw the instability and danger that would be created by this approach, which is why they wanted us to be a constitutional republic, not a democracy. Unfortunately, America has in many ways already become a post-constitutional democracy and we’re one liberal judge away from abandoning the Constitution altogether. Once we get to that point, America just becomes the representation of that old saying, “Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to have for dinner.” Of course people are not lambs and when large numbers of them believe they aren’t being treated fairly, they do have the option of getting away from the wolves.

2) Tribalism: The “you only have to listen to people you already agree with” nature of social media has dramatically ramped up the level of tribalism in the United States. The Right has gotten much more tribal since Donald Trump rose to prominence and the Left has taken tribalism into hyper-drive. Increasingly, liberals treat a range of opinion between Elizabeth Warren and Hillary Clinton as legitimate while everyone else is viewed as a white supremacist Nazi primitive that must be driven down into the gutter for society to move forward. This makes any sort of dialogue or cooperation nearly impossible. When every issue is a zero sum war where one tribe must win or lose, a lot of people quite understandably ask, “What do we gain by staying allied to this other tribe?”

3) Federal Government Too Powerful: Federalism is a safety valve on the American pressure cooker. As long as people in San Francisco can, for the most part, live the way they want to live while the people in rural North Carolina can, for the most part, live the way they want to live, it’s much easier for everyone to get along. When people are unnecessarily forced to live under rules they find abhorrent because the federal government has become an octopus that has inserted its tentacles into every minute crevice of American life, it creates discontent on a wide scale. If most Americans wanted to live like people in San Francisco, they’d live in San Francisco.

4) Moral Decline: As Samuel Adams once noted, “A general dissolution of principles and manners will more surely overthrow the liberties of America than the whole force of the common enemy. While the people are virtuous they cannot be subdued; but when once they lose their virtue then will be ready to surrender their liberties to the first external or internal invader.”

A large number of Americans HAVE LOST their principles, manners and virtue and it shows through from the sort of politicians they elect, to their rudeness online, to the sort of shallow hedonism and fame whoring they find appealing. Americans are increasingly becoming a soft and decadent people which is problematic because the challenges may change, but we can be certain that Americans will face future challenges every bit as difficult as the ones past generations had to tackle. This is frightening because if you look at the “principles, manners and virtue” of Americans today, they don’t seem capable of dealing with monumental events like the War of 1812, the Civil War, the Depression or World War II. Most people in their twenties probably couldn’t tell you why all those events were such challenges in the first place. When America faces a challenge bigger than we can handle because of ineffective politicians and our “amusing ourselves to death” population, there are no guarantees our republic will survive.

5) The Debt: America is a freight train heading toward a cliff, but because we’re not moving toward the edge at lightning speed, no one seems all that concerned. However, the fact of the matter is that a reckoning is coming. At some point, probably within the next decade or two, we will face a debt-driven economic collapse; borrowed money will stop flowing into the United States and Medicare/Social Security as we know it will fall apart because we will not have the money to pay it. If and when we get to that point, all bets are off because if regions of the country see an advantage to splitting off from the United States at that point, they will do it.

6) Lack Of A Shared Culture: There has never been a time when American culture was more fragmented than it is today. By that, I mean that there are legions of people with millions of fans or followers on the Internet that the vast majority of Americans have never heard of in their lives. We don’t have that shared love of anybody or for that matter, anything. Conservatives and liberals disagree on economics (capitalist/socialist), religion (friendly to Christianity/hostile to Christianity), the Constitution (support/believe in a living Constitution i.e. no Constitution), etc., on and on. The average conservative and the average liberal disagree on 95% of the issues and in the few limited cases where they do look at things the same, they won’t support a proposal by the other out of sheer tribalism. Over the long haul, there has be something more to hold a country together than, “We wear Nikes, like pop music and play golf.”

7) Gun Grabbing: Liberals have fallen in love with the idea of ignoring the 2nd Amendment and confiscating all firearms. The logistics of doing this in a nation with hundreds of millions of guns (many of which are off the books) when many police departments and tens of millions of Americans would not cooperate is seldom discussed. Another thing that seldom seems brought up is that large numbers of conservatives would see this as a prelude to the government’s use of force against the citizenry. When it is discussed on the Left, there seems to be an assumption that lone resisters might get into firefights with dozens of police or soldiers, as opposed to ganging up with other formerly law-abiding Americans to waylay gun confiscators, politicians and anti-gun activists at THEIR HOMES in guerrilla actions that would be silently applauded and supported by hundreds of millions of Americans concerned about their freedom. Confiscating guns is a dangerous and stupid idea that could in and of itself end our republic if a serious attempt were ever made to implement it.

https://townhall.com/columnists/johnhawkins/2018/04/21/draft-n2473193

[Trapper John]

^^^ Finest Kind tonyz! :lifter

[Badger52]

That's a good find Tony, thanks.
:cool:

Another thing that seldom seems brought up is that large numbers of conservatives would see this as a prelude to the government’s use of force against the citizenry.Prelude my ass. They have been using the threat of force for a very long time. But no one wants to play the tape to the end if someone stands, in the face of some regulatory check-box on a form, and repeatedly says, simply, "No." As in,

No I will not pay your fine for not buying your shitty health insurance.
No you cannot garnish my money because it's no longer anywhere you can reach.
No I will not honor your warrant to appear.
No I will not be arrested on this day.

[Badger52]

‘The only thing we learn from history,’ it has been said, ‘is that men never learn from history’...

26 pages (incl titles & intro), so not too long.
Interesting comparison of the phases & durations of various "empires" by Lieutenant-General Sir John Bagot Glubb, KCB, CMG, DSO, OBE, MC, KStJ, KPM, nom de guerre "Glubb Pasha" b.1897 d. 1986.

From the closing:
(d) The stages of the rise and fall of great nations seem to be:
The Age of Pioneers (outburst)
The Age of Conquests
The Age of Commerce
The Age of Affluence
The Age of Intellect
The Age of Decadence
(e) Decadence is marked by:
Defensiveness
Pessimism
Materialism
Frivolity
An influx of foreigners
The Welfare State
A weakening of religion.
(f) Decadence is due to:
Too long a period of wealth and power
Selfishness
Love of money
The loss of a sense of duty.

[Trapper John]

^^^ Great post Badger, Finest Kind :lifter

[Paslode]

7) Gun Grabbing: Liberals have fallen in love with the idea of ignoring the 2nd Amendment and confiscating all firearms. The logistics of doing this in a nation with hundreds of millions of guns (many of which are off the books) when many police departments and tens of millions of Americans would not cooperate is seldom discussed. Another thing that seldom seems brought up is that large numbers of conservatives would see this as a prelude to the government’s use of force against the citizenry. When it is discussed on the Left, there seems to be an assumption that lone resisters might get into firefights with dozens of police or soldiers, as opposed to ganging up with other formerly law-abiding Americans to waylay gun confiscators, politicians and anti-gun activists at THEIR HOMES in guerrilla actions that would be silently applauded and supported by hundreds of millions of Americans concerned about their freedom. Confiscating guns is a dangerous and stupid idea that could in and of itself end our republic if a serious attempt were ever made to implement it.



It is down the road a ways, but I believe the development of AI could be a game changer. It was only last week I read about the development of autonomous killer drones, so it is not too far fetched to consider the federal, state and local governments employing AI to police the unruly humans.

[tonyz]

It is down the road a ways, but I believe the development of AI could be a game changer. It was only last week I read about the development of autonomous killer drones, so it is not too far fetched to consider the federal, state and local governments employing AI to police the unruly humans.

All the more reason for the importance of the Bill of Rights.

Free speech and the Second Amendment are fundamental to liberty and yet they are under attack daily.

It has not gone unnoticed that BIGGOV seems to grow no matter which party might be in charge.

Technology, as in your comment referencing AI, in the hands of despots often gets turned on the people.

While the heart of a tyrant doesn’t change...the means to subjugate the people certainly may.

[Badger52]

All the more reason for the importance of the Bill of Rights.

Free speech and the Second Amendment are fundamental to liberty and yet they are under attack daily.

It has not gone unnoticed that BIGGOV seems to grow no matter which party might be in charge.

Technology, as in your comment referencing AI, in the hands of despots often gets turned on the people.

While the heart of a tyrant doesn’t change...the means to subjugate the people certainly may.Much of the data to be leveraged has already been willingly offered by the future victims.

[tonyz]

Much of the data to be leveraged has already been willingly offered by the future victims.

Concur.

Although I’d like to believe all will not be victims.

[Paslode]

Much of the data to be leveraged has already been willingly offered by the future victims.

Yes indeed, and it is not a one sided affair. There is enough data on any person or group of persons to start the round up, who gets rounded up for re-education camp or the mass grave depends on who is in power and what their leanings are.

[Old Dog New Trick]

JMHO -

I think the author is wrong about a few things. First the Civil War has already started. The assault from the Left on civil liberties, rights and freedoms have never been more evident than shortly after the 2016 election and the loss of their candidate. The student protests, the Antifa movement and the anti white peoples movement that culminated in Charlottesville are all examples of the progressive leftists assault on our collective rights and freedom.

The re-education camps already exist - they are and have been the schools and higher learning academic campuses across America. While it has been a long time coming (50-years) it has accelerated rapidly the last 20+ years. Reaching a breakneck pace under Barry.

The mass graves and genocide will not be an issue for the Left (or the far-right) it will happen all by itself - first in the inner cities then in the poor rural and desert communities through disease and violent crime. Eventually the wealthy suburbs will either have to defend in place or evacuate to hardened encampments run by whichever government agency you believe in most.

I strongly believe that the people who are strongest (most independent) and the kind of people on this board will hunker down in places (coast to coast and border to border) that support a sustainable simpler life in places that will be forgotten by the extreme powers and will emerge much later after the whole thing burns itself out.

The military and police if called upon will be too busy and overwhelmed just maintaining Marshal Law in big cities to go hunting small “rebel” groups who will undoubtedly rule the local landscape. They will tire quickly of having their asses handed to them and go back to keeping watch within the walls.

Again, JMO

[bblhead672]

JMHO -

I think the author is wrong about a few things. First the Civil War has already started. The assault from the Left on civil liberties, rights and freedoms have never been more evident than shortly after the 2016 election and the loss of their candidate. The student protests, the Antifa movement and the anti white peoples movement that culminated in Charlottesville are all examples of the progressive leftists assault on our collective rights and freedom.

The re-education camps already exist - they are and have been the schools and higher learning academic campuses across America. While it has been a long time coming (50-years) it has accelerated rapidly the last 20+ years. Reaching a breakneck pace under Barry.

The mass graves and genocide will not be an issue for the Left (or the far-right) it will happen all by itself - first in the inner cities then in the poor rural and desert communities through disease and violent crime. Eventually the wealthy suburbs will either have to defend in place or evacuate to hardened encampments run by whichever government agency you believe in most.

I strongly believe that the people who are strongest (most independent) and the kind of people on this board will hunker down in places (coast to coast and border to border) that support a sustainable simpler life in places that will be forgotten by the extreme powers and will emerge much later after the whole thing burns itself out.

The military and police if called upon will be too busy and overwhelmed just maintaining Marshal Law in big cities to go hunting small “rebel” groups who will undoubtedly rule the local landscape. They will tire quickly of having their asses handed to them and go back to keeping watch within the walls.

Again, JMO

But, but...the big and powerful US Military will mobilize and crush the rebel groups. At least that's what I read it seems like every day from some one on either the left or the right.
The left believes that just because the right has taken everything shoved down their throats so far without bloodshed, that rendering the 2A void by either political action, black robed tyrants or corporate policies will yield the same results.
What I haven't read is where anyone on the left is volunteering themselves or their sons and daughters to enforce their will upon the rest of the country. Most of them are talkers and typers, unwilling to actually embrace the required action, as evidenced by this comment I read elsewhere this morning:
A very good friend of mine, a small business owner, had several marchers in a previous gun banning march stop in his shop to refresh themselves and celebrate. He engaged them in conversation regarding the march and their thoughts in what is to follow. They said total confiscation, nothing less. He asked what would be done with those that didn’t comply. They said “We’ll kill them.” He brought up that those that didn’t comply will have a say in that process. They paused for a moment and replied that they were “ just kidding.”

ODNT is right, we are in a civil war already. It just hasn't progressed (digressed?) from talk to action to response. I believe unless the left decides that it's not in their best long term heath interests to continue to push this will eventually go hot.

We need wise men like the founders to write a second Declaration of Independence to remind the left of the stakes involved for those who love liberty and freedom more than the "kings and princes" in DC and state capitals.

[exsquid]

What we need is some patriots with deep pockets and a real commitment to recruit and pay for skilled individuals to actively go after the enemy. Data mine to expose every dirty secret, post every detail of their life on the internet, overt surveillance anytime they step out the door of their home, find any excuse plausible to sue them in court, etc.

x/S

[Badger52]

What we need is some patriots with deep pockets and a real commitment to recruit and pay for skilled individuals to actively go after the enemy. Data mine to expose every dirty secret, post every detail of their life on the internet, overt surveillance anytime they step out the door of their home, find any excuse plausible to sue them in court, etc.

x/SThen feed the info to local cells of the 18th-century style "Committees of Safety."

[WarriorDiplomat]

What we need is some patriots with deep pockets and a real commitment to recruit and pay for skilled individuals to actively go after the enemy. Data mine to expose every dirty secret, post every detail of their life on the internet, overt surveillance anytime they step out the door of their home, find any excuse plausible to sue them in court, etc.

x/S

You mean like the deep pockets that are on craigslist paying upwards of 500-900 perweek as a activist on behalf of LGBT or whatever other hot topic?

Mar 30 🌈Summer Activist Jobs Standing Up for LGBTQ Rights!🌈 (den > Capitol Hill) img map

Apr 26 Progressive Activists Wanted!! $2200 a Month plus Bonuses!! (den > Denver) pic map

Apr 24 Progressive Activists Wanted!! $2200 a Month plus Bonuses!! (den > Denver) pic map

[GratefulCitizen]

It would be interesting to see a website which proposed and discussed, in the event of a "hypothetical" hot civil war, a "hypothetical" ranked target list.

Two categories:
-Persons and organizations which needed to be neutralized during a hot conflict in the pursuit of victory.
-Persons and organizations which would need to be addressed post-conflict in the pursuit of justice and lasting peace.

If any targets felt threatened by such a list, they can rest easy knowing that there is not currently a hot civil war.
It's just hypothetical.

[Badger52]

If any targets felt threatened by such a list, they can rest easy knowing that there is not currently a hot civil war.
It's just hypothetical.New meaning to the word "triggered." :eek:

[exsquid]

WD:

That is exactly what I mean. If only there were individuals with the skills and knowledge to seek out susceptible (due to either money, ideology, coercion, or ego) individuals inside these left-wing groups, turn them, control them, and use them to weaken our adversaries. Or guys who could run "charities" and/or "outreach" programs that could help spread our line of thinking to the masses. Or guys that know how to craft & publicize our message while also spreading disinformation. I wonder if guys like that exist anywhere? ;)

x/S

[tonyz]

The deep division has very thoughtful people considering the same question over and over.

The Obama’s and the Klinton’s weaponizing our FBI, IRS, DOJ, etc., etc., has done more damage than they could ever imagine. After all, if Klinton had won the presidency none of the divisive matters before the nation would most likely even be an issue. But, she lost...and the curtain has been pulled back to illuminate the corruption and filth that is DC and beyond. We need as much sunlight on the DC swamp as is reasonable in order to restore faith in institutions and dial these feelings and discussions down a bit.

Commentary: Are we on the verge of civil war?
Victor Davis Hanson
Chicago Tribune
9/21/18

Americans keep dividing into two hostile camps.

It seems the country is back to 1860 on the eve of the Civil War, rather than in 2018, during the greatest age of affluence, leisure and freedom in the history of civilization.

The ancient historian Thucydides called the civil discord that tore apart the fifth-century B.C. Greek city-states “stasis.” He saw stasis as a bitter civil war between the revolutionary masses and the traditionalist middle and upper classes.

Something like that ancient divide is now infecting every aspect of American life.

Americans increasingly are either proud of past U.S. traditions, ongoing reform and current American exceptionalism or they insist that the country was hopelessly flawed at its birth and must be radically reinvented to rectify its original sins.

No sphere of life is immune from the subsequent politicization: not movies, television, professional sports, late-night comedy or colleges. Even hurricanes are typically leveraged to advance political agendas.

What is causing America to turn differences into these bitter hatreds — and why now?

The internet and social media often descend into an electronic lynch mob. In a nanosecond, an insignificant local news story goes viral. Immediately hundreds of millions of people use it to drum up the evils or virtues of either progressivism or conservatism.

Anonymity is a force multiplier of these tensions. Fake online identities provide cover for ever-greater extremism — on the logic that no one is ever called to account for his or her words.

Speed is also the enemy of common sense and restraint. Millions of bloggers rush to be the first to post their take on a news event, without much worry about whether it soon becomes a “fake news” moment of unsubstantiated gossip and fiction.

Globalization has both enriched and impoverished — and also further divided — America. Those whose muscular labor could be outsourced abroad to less expensive, less regulated countries were liable to lose their jobs or find their wages slashed. They were written off as “losers.” Americans whose professional expertise profited from vast new world markets became even richer and preened as “winners.”

Geography — history’s intensifier of civil strife — further fueled the growing economic and cultural divide. Americans are increasingly self-selecting as red and blue states

Liberals gravitate to urban coastal-corridor communities of hip culture, progressive lifestyles and lots of government services.

Conservatives increasingly move to the lower-tax, smaller-government and more traditional heartland.

Lifestyles in San Francisco and Toledo are so different that it’s almost as if they’re two different planets.

Legal, diverse, meritocratic and measured immigration has always been America’s great strength. Assimilation, integration and intermarriage within the melting pot used to turn new arrivals into grateful Americans in a generation or two.

But when immigration is often illegal, not diverse and massive, then Balkanization follows. Currently, the country hosts 60 million non-natives — the largest number of immigrants in America's history.

Yet unlike in the past, America often does not ask new immigrants to learn English and assimilate as quickly as possible. Immigration is instead politicized. Newcomers are seen as potentially useful voting blocs.

Tribalism is the new American norm. Gender, sexual orientation, religion, race and ethnicity are now essential, not incidental, to who we are.

Americans scramble to divide into victimized blocs. Hyphenated and newly accented names serve as advertisements that particular groups have unique affiliations beyond their shared Americanism.

America is often the target of unrealistic criticism — as if it is suddenly toxic because it is not perfect. Few appreciate that the far worse alternatives abroad are rife with racism, sexism, civil strife, corruption and poverty unimaginable in the U.S.

The last few elections added to the growing abyss.

The old Democratic Party of John Kennedy and Bill Clinton is now trending into a radical democratic socialist party. Meanwhile, the old Republican Party is mostly gone, replaced by tea party movements and the new Donald Trump base.

Former President Barack Obama came into office from Congress with the most left-wing voting record in the Senate. Trump was elected as the first president without either prior military or political experience.

Obama issued dozens of controversial “pen and phone” executive orders, bypassing Congress. And Trump is systematically overturning them — doing so with similar executive orders.

Will America keep dividing and soon resort to open violence, as happened in 1861? Or will Americans reunite and bind up our wounds, as we did following the upheavals of the 1930s Great Depression or after the protests of the 1960s?

The answer lies within each of us.

Every day we will either treat each other as fellow Americans, with far more uniting than dividing us, or we will continue on the present path that eventually ends in something like a hate-filled Iraq, Rwanda or the Balkans.

Tribune Content Agency
Victor Davis Hanson is a classicist and historian at the Hoover Institution, Stanford University, and the author of the soon-to-be released “The Second World Wars: How the First Global Conflict Was Fought and Won,” to appear in October from Basic Books.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/commentary/ct-perspec-hanson-civil-war-polarized-america-0920-20180919-story.html

[bblhead672]

The deep division has very thoughtful people considering the same question over and over.

The Obama’s and the Klinton’s weaponizing our FBI, IRS, DOJ, etc., etc., has done more damage than they could ever imagine. After all, if Klinton had won the presidency none of the divisive matters before the nation would most likely even be an issue. But, she lost...and the curtain has been pulled back to illuminate the corruption and filth that is DC and beyond. We need as much sunlight on the DC swamp as is reasonable in order to restore faith in institutions and dial these feelings and discussions down a bit.

Commentary: Are we on the verge of civil war?
Victor Davis Hanson
Chicago Tribune
9/21/18

Americans keep dividing into two hostile camps.

It seems the country is back to 1860 on the eve of the Civil War, rather than in 2018, during the greatest age of affluence, leisure and freedom in the history of civilization.

The ancient historian Thucydides called the civil discord that tore apart the fifth-century B.C. Greek city-states “stasis.” He saw stasis as a bitter civil war between the revolutionary masses and the traditionalist middle and upper classes.

Something like that ancient divide is now infecting every aspect of American life.

Americans increasingly are either proud of past U.S. traditions, ongoing reform and current American exceptionalism or they insist that the country was hopelessly flawed at its birth and must be radically reinvented to rectify its original sins.

No sphere of life is immune from the subsequent politicization: not movies, television, professional sports, late-night comedy or colleges. Even hurricanes are typically leveraged to advance political agendas.

What is causing America to turn differences into these bitter hatreds — and why now?

The internet and social media often descend into an electronic lynch mob. In a nanosecond, an insignificant local news story goes viral. Immediately hundreds of millions of people use it to drum up the evils or virtues of either progressivism or conservatism.

Anonymity is a force multiplier of these tensions. Fake online identities provide cover for ever-greater extremism — on the logic that no one is ever called to account for his or her words.

Speed is also the enemy of common sense and restraint. Millions of bloggers rush to be the first to post their take on a news event, without much worry about whether it soon becomes a “fake news” moment of unsubstantiated gossip and fiction.

Globalization has both enriched and impoverished — and also further divided — America. Those whose muscular labor could be outsourced abroad to less expensive, less regulated countries were liable to lose their jobs or find their wages slashed. They were written off as “losers.” Americans whose professional expertise profited from vast new world markets became even richer and preened as “winners.”

Geography — history’s intensifier of civil strife — further fueled the growing economic and cultural divide. Americans are increasingly self-selecting as red and blue states

Liberals gravitate to urban coastal-corridor communities of hip culture, progressive lifestyles and lots of government services.

Conservatives increasingly move to the lower-tax, smaller-government and more traditional heartland.

Lifestyles in San Francisco and Toledo are so different that it’s almost as if they’re two different planets.

Legal, diverse, meritocratic and measured immigration has always been America’s great strength. Assimilation, integration and intermarriage within the melting pot used to turn new arrivals into grateful Americans in a generation or two.

But when immigration is often illegal, not diverse and massive, then Balkanization follows. Currently, the country hosts 60 million non-natives — the largest number of immigrants in America's history.

Yet unlike in the past, America often does not ask new immigrants to learn English and assimilate as quickly as possible. Immigration is instead politicized. Newcomers are seen as potentially useful voting blocs.

Tribalism is the new American norm. Gender, sexual orientation, religion, race and ethnicity are now essential, not incidental, to who we are.

Americans scramble to divide into victimized blocs. Hyphenated and newly accented names serve as advertisements that particular groups have unique affiliations beyond their shared Americanism.

America is often the target of unrealistic criticism — as if it is suddenly toxic because it is not perfect. Few appreciate that the far worse alternatives abroad are rife with racism, sexism, civil strife, corruption and poverty unimaginable in the U.S.

The last few elections added to the growing abyss.

The old Democratic Party of John Kennedy and Bill Clinton is now trending into a radical democratic socialist party. Meanwhile, the old Republican Party is mostly gone, replaced by tea party movements and the new Donald Trump base.

Former President Barack Obama came into office from Congress with the most left-wing voting record in the Senate. Trump was elected as the first president without either prior military or political experience.

Obama issued dozens of controversial “pen and phone” executive orders, bypassing Congress. And Trump is systematically overturning them — doing so with similar executive orders.

Will America keep dividing and soon resort to open violence, as happened in 1861? Or will Americans reunite and bind up our wounds, as we did following the upheavals of the 1930s Great Depression or after the protests of the 1960s?

The answer lies within each of us.

Every day we will either treat each other as fellow Americans, with far more uniting than dividing us, or we will continue on the present path that eventually ends in something like a hate-filled Iraq, Rwanda or the Balkans.

Tribune Content Agency
Victor Davis Hanson is a classicist and historian at the Hoover Institution, Stanford University, and the author of the soon-to-be released “The Second World Wars: How the First Global Conflict Was Fought and Won,” to appear in October from Basic Books.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/commentary/ct-perspec-hanson-civil-war-polarized-america-0920-20180919-story.html

The communists on the left are not interested in compromise, being nice or retreating. They want the train to take the left fork and continue down the tracks toward the destroyed bridge that crosses the canyon of Rwanda times Bosnia.

[tonyz]

The communists on the left are not interested in compromise, being nice or retreating. They want the train to take the left fork and continue down the tracks toward the destroyed bridge that crosses the canyon of Rwanda times Bosnia.

Many are concerned that your assessment is correct.

http://www.bamn.com

“By Any Means Necessary”

http://www.bamn.com/bamn-pledge-2