View Full Version : ISIS
BMT (RIP)
08-29-2014, 09:53
“We cannot appease this ideology. We have to confront it at home and abroad ... We are in the middle of a generational struggle against a poisonous and extremist ideology that I believe we will be fighting for years and probably decades.”
British Prime Minister David Cameron addressed the threat of ISIS and Islamic extremism during a press conference in London.
I wonder if ZERO an Kerry understands what the PM said?
BMT
Trapper John
08-29-2014, 10:16
I don't doubt that they (Zero and Son of Zero) understand. However, they are so far over their heads on this issue I really doubt that they have a clue as to how to handle the problem and, more importantly, I am certain they will not do what is necessary to meet the threat.
i heard a comment yesterday from someone that I respect and I think there is lot of truth in it: "We have gone from a pacifist culture that can win wars to an aggressive culture that lose wars."
DIYPatriot
08-29-2014, 10:25
“We cannot appease this ideology. We have to confront it at home and abroad ... We are in the middle of a generational struggle against a poisonous and extremist ideology that I believe we will be fighting for years and probably decades.”
British Prime Minister David Cameron addressed the threat of ISIS and Islamic extremism during a press conference in London.
I wonder if ZERO an Kerry understands what the PM said?
BMT
Meanwhile, back on the farm....
“We don’t have a strategy yet,” Obama said in a Thursday news conference. The startling — and troubling — admission came hours after videos surfaced showing the militants marching at least 150 Syrian soldiers through the desert — stripped to their underwear and barefoot. The troops were then executed, their bullet-riddled and slashed bodies arranged in a crescent moon that stretched across the desert. “Yes, we have executed them all,” an ISIS fighter told Reuters.
Hours after the disturbing images were released, Police Commissioner Bill Bratton said the NYPD was keeping an eye on the Middle East. He was particularly concerned about American jihadists — some from our area — returning to wreak havoc back home.
Full Article (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/don-strategy-obama-isis-death-march-video-article-1.1920527)
Lighthouse
08-29-2014, 10:33
"We have gone from a pacifist culture that can win wars to an aggressive culture that lose wars."
That's a hard pill to swallow. Letting this sink is really heartbreaking. The short memory of our countrymen and women is the downfall. Does it take something seriously dramatic happening here in the homeland for people to let men like you and others to the business that you all do best? As much as I would love to see ME action die down, the other side will never stop. They just seem to regroup.
BTW thank you guys for making it easy for my family to sleep at night.
Old Dog New Trick
08-29-2014, 11:19
No, sadly our country is currently operating without a rudder. Captain Obvious is standing at the helm swinging hard left and right (like an amusement park kiddy ride) and there is no linkage between the wheel and the rudder.
Somehow I doubt the British PM even grasps the magnitude of these events in history and history will be published for all to see the failures of inaction at a time when action is necessary - on all fronts!
Team Sergeant
08-29-2014, 12:51
“We cannot appease this ideology. We have to confront it at home and abroad ... We are in the middle of a generational struggle against a poisonous and extremist ideology that I believe we will be fighting for years and probably decades.”
British Prime Minister David Cameron addressed the threat of ISIS and Islamic extremism during a press conference in London.
I wonder if ZERO an Kerry understands what the PM said?
BMT
Wow, I've been saying this for years...... and finally a real Western head of state says the same thing.......
Sorry, but it applies to all islam, it should not be treated as a religion but as a extremist ideology that needs to be neutralized, globally.
This is why Zero is not acting, he's a mooslem at heart and we are a nation of idiots.
Trapper John
08-29-2014, 12:56
Does it take something seriously dramatic happening here in the homeland for people to let men like you and others to the business that you all do best?
Short answer IMHO: Yes! Recent history seems to bear out that opinion too.
]We have a president that does not have a strategy on Iraq Syria Egypt Ukraine Libya isis or our southern border. By contrast, Cameron is showing leadership and decisiveness... It's embarrassing.
]We have a president that does not have a strategy on Iraq Syria Egypt Ukraine Libya isis or our southern border.
The appearance of not having a strategy could be a strategy.
CDRODA396
08-29-2014, 14:02
Does it take something seriously dramatic happening here in the homeland for people to let men like you and others to the business that you all do best?
Not only yes, but sadly also recurring. Something needs to happen every couple of years or the American Public's memory will fade and the will to do what's right quickly follows. We've seen this in our lifetime. 9/11 might as well been a hundred years ago in the minds of too many...oh, they celebrate the fallen on the day, but the will to continue to press the fight globally to prevent a similar attack is all but a forgotten sentiment in most. The question is will enough warriors be left when the threat shows up on our shore in mass..?
Trapper John
08-29-2014, 14:08
The question is will enough warriors be left when the threat shows up on our shore in mass..?
BINGO!!
Old Dog New Trick
08-29-2014, 14:21
The question is will enough warriors be left when the threat shows up on our shore in mass..?
Yes, but, several thousand more sheep will need to be sacrificed along the way. I fear that more social and constitutional liberties will be squashed and squandered by the political elite and liberal media before they wake up and realize they are in deep trouble and in need of warriors to restore the peace through bloodshed and violence. Sometimes, it's the only thing some animals respect and submit to.
It’s clear that the Executive Branch will not have the means (the “partners” the “coalition”) overseas or at home to deal with the threat. It’s coming. Heard a talking head last night say the greater threat in this environment is from PRC. For instance, with all the hoopla going on everywhere else this would be the time to annex the Paracel Islands. For that matter, any thug-run camp can choose this moment in history to make its move. Golf Boy and Pinhead won’t do shit. They couldn’t find their willie with both hands.
Yes, but, several thousand more sheep will need to be sacrificed along the way. I fear that more social and constitutional liberties will be squashed and squandered by the political elite and liberal media before they wake up and realize they are in deep trouble and in need of warriors to restore the peace through bloodshed and violence. Sometimes, it's the only thing some animals respect and submit to.
You're right, ODNT. DoJ and DHS are not coordinated enough to manage or even grasp the disaster in time to do anything about it at home. So, what can an old gas bag in rural Virginia do? Keep a watchful eye on the goings on, stock up on jerky, then lock & load and standby to standby. I’m gray and dusty but I can still learn. Lead the way, y’all. (Sitting on my ass ain't an option.) Mindset and treachery are trump.
Lighthouse
08-29-2014, 14:59
Not only yes, but sadly also recurring. Something needs to happen every couple of years or the American Public's memory will fade and the will to do what's right quickly follows. We've seen this in our lifetime. 9/11 might as well been a hundred years ago in the minds of too many...oh, they celebrate the fallen on the day, but the will to continue to press the fight globally to prevent a similar attack is all but a forgotten sentiment in most. The question is will enough warriors be left when the threat shows up on our shore in mass..?
The most ironic thing about this is it was two of the most tolerant states in the nation that were last attacked. Go figure. The you have this guy being charged with workplace violence
http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/28/us/isis-fort-hood-shooter/index.html
:confused:
Wow, imagine that...here's a little heads up from your favorite source golf boy - full article at link below.
Britain Raises Terrorism Threat Level to ‘Severe’
By ALAN COWELLAUG. 29, 2014
LONDON — Alarmed by the suspected presence of hundreds of British jihadis among Sunni militants in Syria and Iraq, Britain increased its assessment of the terrorism threat on its own soil on Friday and said new laws would be introduced to counter what Prime Minister David Cameron called “a greater threat to our security than we have seen before.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/30/world/europe/britain-raises-terrorism-threat-level-to-severe.html?action=click&pgtype=Homepage&version=HpHeadline&module=first-column-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0
Go Devil
08-29-2014, 15:24
I can confirm that, should that black flag be raised near my nest in the states, there'd be little waiting on TPTB and those ass hats would readily be smoked and swinging from street lights.
The Reaper
08-29-2014, 16:57
First, if you do not have a strategy, you never admit that. You can always say that you are working on it. Let them guess whether you actually do or not.
Second, I am pretty sure that there was no strategy in place on 9/11 stating that if Al Qaeda hijacked and crashed four airplanes in the US and killed 3,000 Americans, our plan was to invade Afghanistan and go after them.
Nonetheless, and like him or not, President Bush and his administration put boots on the ground in country working to overthrow the Taliban and attack Al Qaeda in fourteen days.
The first SF ODA hit the ground and went to doing our jobs in 39 days. The evidence of their success is evident, and the Taliban quickly fell.
What is the current administration doing to destroy ISIL and remove them from Iraqi territory? Who knows?
Do they have a plan, if not a strategy? How many people work in government for just such contingencies and strategy development, and what are they doing to earn their paychecks lately?
Next, the wussification of America and the military is evident. We have dropped combat effectiveness for a grand social experiment. We want a bloodless war, like people got used to in Desert Storm. What these thugs need to see is Old Testament violence and punishment. No mercy, no quarter. Bomb them even further into the Stone Age, shoot every one of them, unleash Hell fire, and salt the earth of their people. Hamburg. Berlin. Tokyo. Dresden. Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Give the residents a couple of days to force out the ISIL scum on their own, and then we punish them. Make an example of the first few cities, so that they fear us more than ISIL. Use the Iraqi Army to fight and secure the population centers. Kill deserters. Create a highway of death and a string of burning vehicles and dead bodies all the way back to the Syrian border like DS. Then offer to continue the attack inside Syria if there are any more problems with ISIL. Seize their funds. Attack their infrastructure. Initiate PSYOP messaging to those who might be inclined to support our enemies, or oppose us. Divide their alliances. I don't want Americans on the ground again in Iraq, but since I want ISIL on the ground in the US even less, we will do what we have to.
You want a strategy? Here you go. Or strategy is to use every means at our disposal to kill every ISIL member and sympathizer we can find who remains inside Iraq in 72 hours. We reserve the right to start early if it pleases us. Go home now or die. And here is another thing. I don't want to hear any shit about departure plans and dates till victory has been achieved. We are staying till the job is done and the last shot is fired. By us.
Finally, if you travel outside the US to attend this party, you are immediately and permanently stripped of your US passport and citizenship. And your families go on the watch list as potential collaborators.
BTW, the rest of the military not involved in this action are deploying to secure our southern border. Better late then never.
That is all.
TR
Old Dog New Trick
08-29-2014, 17:12
TR - Hell yea's!!!
Anyone and I mean anyone's found here after dark with a weapon, mask, hoodie, or up to no good will be killed. Anyone in close proximity may also be killed!
Insah Allah!
...Your Post...
No truer words have been spoken!
Old Dog New Trick
08-29-2014, 18:40
My strategy if I were POTUS or SECDEF would be to say enough of this crap. I would put every non-state sponsored "terrorist" group in the world on notice that their time has come to an end. Work feverishly with the governments in control of the areas and announce that, at a time of my choosing swoop in and destroy the maximum numbers of terrorist members for as long as it takes to change their ways.
ISIL - ISIS - Boca Haram - Al Qaeda (and all affiliated groups) - Abu Sayyaf - Al Shabaab - etc...etc... We know where you are or soon will, and we will use the full force of the American intelligence and armed forces to eliminate you, and anyone associated with you, from the face of this earth. The end is near, your time is over!
This is not a - repeat - not a whack a mole (terrorist) campaign, it's smash the entire nest and kill the eggs. It will go on as long as it takes and each attack will last only long enough to destroy what's found then return to bases and prepare and train for the next raid. It will be carried out with our Special Operations Forces, ground troops, air power, and stand off weapon systems unique to the only world super power and why we are a world super power you have mistakenly choosen to mess with. We will not get bogged down or distracted with nation building, but each nation that agrees to allow us to eradicate a cancer that grows within their border will benefit from a mutual desire for world peace and prosperity.
We have officially declared war on terrorism and there will be an end this time, not an open ended proposition without a clear end state. "Your death, our survival, your choice."
Anyway, that's a start...it's easy to achieve just have to set the wheels in motion and commit to it.
dollarbill
08-29-2014, 19:21
http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/911-anniversary-chatter-terror/2014/08/29/id/591592/?ns_mail_uid=80867762&ns_mail_job=1583860_08292014&promo_code=11onmblf
For those that think the 2nd Amendment wasn't written for our modern times. You might want to pull your head out of the sand, buy a weapon or two and get to the f'ing range. As we all know,the ass wipes are here. It's just a matter of when and will they be two fighting fronts. One on our soil the other in the Mid-East.
Trapper John
08-30-2014, 06:11
.... entire Post......TR
NOW THAT'S A PLAN!!! Allah Fubar!
Remington Raidr
08-30-2014, 08:23
Allah Fubar!
I am SO stealing that . . .:D
dollarbill
08-30-2014, 09:20
What ever happened to the good ole days? Our elected officials would sit at the round table and come up with contingent plans. You remember, if this happens we'll react this way. If that happens, this is the best way to approach it. Our play book seems to be empty,we're looseing face with our allies and the country is going to hell. Zero, the son's and daughters of Zero seem to be the top players on the opposing team. TR seems to have about the best contingent plan there is. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that if you don't have a starting point, you'll be hard pressed to have a finishing point. Maybe TR should consider finding an office in DC. I'd be willing to bet that's been passed across the table a few times.
ISIS members aren't rational and can't be rationalized with. They are lunatics with weapons and impunity who are running around like juveniles in a toy store and no one there to stop them from doing whatever it is they want to.
The only way to deal with them is to terminate them from existence.
When I read about ISIS it reminds me of the old testament and makes sense why God commanded the eradication of entire towns. It makes more sense to me now more than ever. You have to eradicate evil or it will grow back. Giving into or trying to make peace with evil only weakens your position. It has been proven time and time again with Hitler, Stalin and now ISIS.
That's what we need...some Old Testament justice. I'm for fire and brimstoning ISIS no matter where they appear. Green glass is beautiful.
While you're at it you might as well include Putin on that list. He's revealed himself to be a shit stain.
frostfire
08-31-2014, 15:28
perhaps al-Baghdadi can meet the same fate as Ahmad Shah Massoud. We don't saction it, but give them a taste of their own medicine. With that much brutality towards non-sunni-extremist-commited, there are no shortage of volunteer I'm sure. Full deniability on our part.
tom kelly
09-02-2014, 18:37
Joe Biden is in charge; He is working on a plan that will be ready by Jan.20,2017.
cetheridge
09-02-2014, 22:56
Senator Johnny Isakson (Rep., Georgia) seems to have read TR's post.
http://www.11alive.com/story/news/nation-now/military/2014/09/02/isis-isakson-kill-exterminate/15002753/
Now, let's see if some action will be taken by Congress, because it certainly won't be by the Golf Boy who just jetted off to Europe....probably to play a round at St. Andrews.
TR's message was excellent. To that I would add the message of John Wayne's character in the movie The Longest Day: "Send 'em to hell."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfpqSxEAJDA
:lifter
Lighthouse
09-03-2014, 07:40
This seems to be on the path to getting worse before it gets better. Do you think its time for the general population to seriously consider learning the enemy language to remain vigilant or should we just continue range time and a serious look at disaster plans?
Lighthouse said: "This seems to be on the path to getting worse before it gets better. Do you think its time for the general population to seriously consider learning the enemy language to remain vigilant or should we just continue range time and a serious look at disaster plans?"
I think some of the QPs on this site could answer that question far better than I could. I would say this however, than non-muzlims should read the quran and haddiths to get some idea of what izlam really is all about. And I can assure you that it is not a "religion of peace".
Keep in mind when you read the quran that it is not sequenced chronologically, but from longest to shortest suras. Keep in mind also that the concept of "abrogation" applies - meaning that the earlier, more peaceful and tolerant (Meccan) suras have been abrogated by the later bloodthirsty (Medina) suras. Which is why you need additional references of the life and the sayings of Mad Mo to figure out izlam.
Lighthouse said: "This seems to be on the path to getting worse before it gets better. Do you think its time for the general population to seriously consider learning the enemy language to remain vigilant or should we just continue range time and a serious look at disaster plans?"
I think some of the QPs on this site could answer that question far better than I could. I would say this however, than non-muzlims should read the quran and haddiths to get some idea of what izlam really is all about. And I can assure you that it is not a "religion of peace".
Keep in mind when you read the quran that it is not sequenced chronologically, but from longest to shortest suras. Keep in mind also that the concept of "abrogation" applies - meaning that the earlier, more peaceful and tolerant (Meccan) suras have been abrogated by the later bloodthirsty (Medina) suras. Which is why you need additional references of the life and the sayings of Mad Mo to figure out izlam.
A very brief refresher on the enemy at link below - there are pages and pages of additional discussions and links on this board.
"This is the unedited version of Fitna prior to Live Leak editing it down after receiving death threats if they did not remove FITNA immediately. Geert Wilders brings us the truth about Islam and the Koran."
http://vimeo.com/20710133
Thanks TonyZ, for that timely reminder. I did watch Fitna last year; but it is always good to be reminded of just what we are up against - the longest running con Satan ever pulled! Muzlims are its first victims; but they are too brainwashed into this cult of evil to realize or understand that. It generally takes an epiphany of the highest magnitude for any of them to take a long and critical look at the evil they have embraced. When that happens - when Jesus has touched them with grace, the transformation is astonishing.
The pictures below depict muzlim, and muzlim convert to Christianity.
Stobey, I was pretty sure that you had seen FITNA - but others passing through may not have - and there is also a wealth of previous discussion on this board - and the initial question to you allowed an opportunity for me to refer to this wealth of discussion. Here is but a small sample that will keep those interested busy for hours.
http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45130&highlight=Radical+Islam
http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25501&highlight=Radical+Islam
http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1033&highlight=Radical+Islam
http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37860&highlight=Radical+Islam
http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29876&highlight=Radical+Islam
http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34000&highlight=Radical+Islam
Nonstop24/7
09-03-2014, 17:19
TR has the right idea...Talking heads have made announcements about Pentagon having plans for months, that Zero was briefed for many months about rapid expansion of ISIIS. Zero apparently doesn't want to offend any Muslims at this point.
His constant effort to avoid saying Islamic Extremists, or Radical Islam seems to show where he is either being loyal to his beliefs or politically correct.
What has happened to the US intelligence community?
They haven't refuted the line of Zero and his robots.
No doubt it will have to come to the total destruction of ISIS, no matter how long it takes.
We desperately need some leadership with our military on the front burner.
A short interview from a few years back (I doubt that similar views have softened) illustrating the perspective of those that seek world domination.
The WH proposes we "manage" this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KE7aKk6hgV4&app=desktop
DIYPatriot
09-04-2014, 11:59
While zero plays golf and works on a manageable low-footprint plan to play nicely with his muslim counterparts in the newly formed caliphate, the Chechens are looking forward to unleashing hell on ISIS. I wouldn't mind seeing these two go at it. :munchin
The latest recipients of an Islamic State threat are responding in kind, with Chechen leader Ramzan Kadyrov vowing that "these bastards" will be "destroyed." Kadyrov, a close ally of Russian President Vladimir Putin, went on an Instagram rant after Islamic State posted a video threatening Putin over his support for Syria's Bashar al-Assad and vowing to liberate Chechnya. The Muslim strongman, who has fought Islamic militants in his backyard for years, seemed to take special umbrage at a threat aimed at his patron in Moscow.
"I state with full responsibility that the one who had the idea to express a threat to Russia and say the name of the president of the country Vladimir Putin, will be destroyed, where he did it," Kadyrov seethed. "I emphasize that they finish their days under the hot sun in Syria and Iraq, and in the first instant of death meet their eternal flames of Hell. Allahu Akbar!"
"I want to remind everyone who is planning something against our country, that Russia has worthy sons, ready to fulfill any order, wring the neck of any enemy in his own lair, wherever he may be," Kadyrov wrote. "And we find ourselves with happiness ridding the world of these scum."
Full Article (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/09/03/report-credible-information-isis-aqap-planning-11-anniversary-attack-abroad/)
What makes these people tick? This guy dreamed of being in the 82D and being SF. Hagel says we have 100 known American citizens serving in ISIS, I think it's time to revoke some citizenships.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2743475/Mujahid-pledging-allegiance-ISIS-How-Catholic-born-American-bodybuilder-went-planning-career-U-S-military-trying-join-Islamic-terrorists.html
He failed to pass the grade, and with his childhood dream in tatters he turned instead to a career in law enforcement, becoming a sheriff's deputy.
He said: 'My entire life growing up was surrounded by the idea that I would be 82nd Airborne, I would be Special Forces, I would serve dutifully – duty, honor and country.
'Later I thought that I would make this [law enforcement] my substitution for what I thought was going to be, in the beginning, a military career, an achievement, leadership.'
What makes these people tick?
A narcissistic loser found a group with low entry requirements.
The promise of stomping some skulls, no polygraph...no SFAS...rank by virtue of language skills...war beard...wow...this MF loser was all in - now a full page spread...this is better than his wildest wet dreams.
I wish Hellfires tied directly to facial recognition software.
frostfire
09-05-2014, 11:35
'Later I thought that I would make this [law enforcement] my substitution for what I thought was going to be, in the beginning, a military career, an achievement, leadership.'
I won't discount him immediately. I dare to bet 72 virgins is of little interest to him also. His life pattern shows a consistent vulnerability. The concept of Ego, Scarcity, and Social Proof can be used to turn around this poor misunderstood fellow. The pitch will be be along the line of "make everything you have done and suffered through worth it. Fulfill your original calling of duty, honor, country and finally give meaning to your existence"
BMT (RIP)
09-08-2014, 07:02
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-only-way-to-defeat-the-islamic-state/2014/09/05/4b2d7bd4-3459-11e4-a723-fa3895a25d02_story.html
Comments!!
BMT
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-only-way-to-defeat-the-islamic-state/2014/09/05/4b2d7bd4-3459-11e4-a723-fa3895a25d02_story.html
Comments!!
BMT
Excellent read.
http://digitalcommons.unl.edu/managementfacpub/9/?utm_source=digitalcommons.unl.edu%2Fmanagementfac pub%2F9&utm_medium=PDF&utm_campaign=PDFCoverPages
My interest is organizational structure, specifically, management/leadership. I am also interested in the process by which individual, groups, and communities organize, communicate and create social constructs.
To that end, I follow dynamic management social theorist such as R.L. Ackoff (1994), “Enterprise as Social Systems” and “System Theory”.
Currently, I have been reading Russ Marion and Mary Uhl-Bien, “Complexity Theory and Al Qaeda” (2003) and Ackoff’s “Complexity Leadership Theory: “Shifting leadership from the industrial age to the knowledge era”, in relationship to system theory, where networks are complex adaptive systems, such as Al Qaeda. In conjunction with Uri Bronfenbrenner’s (1979) work, “The Ecological System of Human Developmental”, a theory on the five stages of human development in context.
My intent was to investigate systemically, the mutual nesting systems and interrelationships affecting action and interaction, successful, or not, in network, or small team perspective and formation, in relationship to the socio-demographic worldview, where members culturalization effects outcome. The question of internalized cultural views, are they deterministic, and/or, intrinsically link to success, or failure, in collaborative environments has become secondary, as this attached article answers that directly. Concluding that the success of Al Qaeda is tied to an overarching binding mechanism of religious belief, negating competition between groups for limited resources, for the larger prize of defeating its enemies. This understanding of network formation, function, and endurance that Al Qaeda examples is organic rather than synthetic; and therein. lies its weakness.
With the complete upending of my premise, and informed with this new perspective of what and how Al Qaeda functions, I do not see the AQ organization being defeated. Rather, through attrition, wear, and the loss of treasures, on our part, much like Afghanistan, retiring to fight another day. Of some interest is OBL, who stated exactly what would occur when we invaded, the interview and outcome is recorded and can be viewed on youtube.
With that in mind, and with reference to this thread topic of strategy to confront ISIS, this may be of some interest.
In a come to Jesus moment, we must concluded that everything OBL predicated, stated, and explained on the outcome of Iraq and Afghanistan has proven to be true. For the sake of argument, let us assume that everything that Russ Marion and Mary Uhl-Bien, “Complexity Theory and Al Qaeda” (2003) is also factual. Al Qaeda is a phenomenon, an organic non-traditional social organism, complex, self-adapting social structure capable of pivoting as needed.
Can AQ elements be defeated in individual battles, yes? There is no doubt to that answer, but what occurs is a retreat, the licking of wounds and adaptation to a long war view. This has been the outcome and has led to our withdrawal, proving OBL point.
AQ having accomplished that goal, now is morphing into a more structured social organization, one that is becoming less organic, one that has hierarchical leadership, consolidates gains, and holds territory. An organization that examples those traits is synthetic, and therefore, a large fixed target.
One consideration might be to afford ISIS the opportunity to consolidate to the extreme, then reintroduce the last 48hrs of the Iraq war in living color, it’s one way to defeat ISIS, that was once the phenomenon Al Qaeda.
Old Dog New Trick
09-08-2014, 18:47
Penn -
(Don't mean to denigrate what you posted but,) bla bla bla...
Al-Qaeda is a belief in the boogyman himself. If you believe in the boogyman than he lives. We have been fighting the boogyman since 9/11/01.
ISIS/ISIL - IS is now much bigger and much more lethal than al-Qaeda. They are in my opinion very much like Nazi (Natzi) Germany under Hitler. While Hitler believed there was a supreme race, Islam and the current wannabe Caliphates believe there is a supreme religion.
While OBL thought and believed there was a trespass and violation through tolerance of religion by western and middle east powers, the current crop want to restore an absolute faith in Islam and death to anyone who feels there is room for tolerance.
To them there is no room for acceptance and tolerant views and much like Nazism there is no second place. Totalitarian acceptance or death of an impure culture.
As seen before this does not end well, but millions will die.
JMHO
Old Dog New Trick
09-08-2014, 18:57
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-only-way-to-defeat-the-islamic-state/2014/09/05/4b2d7bd4-3459-11e4-a723-fa3895a25d02_story.html
Comments!!
BMT
I think the General is giving them too much credit. But in his defense, you cannot simply cut off the head and expect this to go away. This is a societal culture that will take a generation or two of understanding and education to prevail against. And, even then there will still be difference requiring strength and possible fighting to resolve.
I think this is as old as the Bible and will not simply be solved with firepower and death of the lessor equipped.
JMHO
The Reaper
09-08-2014, 20:25
I agree.
Without the war against their political, informational, and economic means at the same time, there is no viable military solution.
Without the national will to fight for our survival, there is no road to eventual victory.
With our own elected leadership ignoring the threat, if not actually sympathizing with them, I do not see how we can have a successful strategy, or a path to victory.
Maybe when the war comes to our shores, we will get serious about it. Until then, we are just pissing into the wind.
TR
We have to stop the countries that are funding ISIS. Guess who is the number 1 country that has been funding them?
If they do not stop double dealing as they always do nothing will improve.
...so are our leaders almost ready to discuss the possibility of talking openly about the remote chance that this all might actually be about radical islamo-fascism?
Or are we still content to say that terrorism is just international crime?
frostfire
09-08-2014, 22:58
another good analysis taking into account the geopolitical and historical backdrops
http://mondediplo.com/2014/09/04islamicstate
Call me crazy, but as hard as it is to do, it is possible to empathize (not sympathize) with ISIS aka the Sunni's inferior/minority complex as driving factor
"In the moment when I truly understand my enemy, understand him well enough to defeat him, then in that very moment I also love him. I think it's impossible to really understand somebody, what they want, what they believe, and not love them the way they love themselves. And then, in that very moment when I love them .... I destroy them-"
~Orson Scott Card, Ender Games
On a related note, AQ has made moves to counter ISIS claim as the champion of the caliphate cause....the next 12 months is bound to be interesting for sure (job security!)
http://news.yahoo.com/al-qaeda-declares-branch-indian-sub-continent-190808390.html
http://warontherocks.com/2014/09/zawahiris-counter-caliphate/
Marion and Uhl-Bien paper clearly describes AQ. They succinctly demonstrate that due to the organic nature of the AQ organization and its ability to function without top down C&C, but as independent units aligned in a common cause, strategic decapitation in fruitless. It disrupts, but does not defeat the movement, much like removing your hand from a bucket of water, it leaves no holes.
In my mind, unless we are willing to move to the same state of commitment that AQ and ISIS occupy: total war, we haven’t a chance in hell of containing, or winning the fight.
On both sides the interaction between Islam and the West is seen as a clash of civilizations. The West's "next confrontation," observes M. J. Akbar, an Indian Muslim author, "is definitely going to come from the Muslim world. It is in the sweep of the Islamic nations from the Maghreb to Pakistan that the struggle for a new world order will begin."
Bernard Lewis comes to a similar conclusion: “We are facing a mood and a movement far transcending the level of issues and policies and the governments that pursue them. This is no less than a clash of civilizations-the perhaps irrational but surely historic reaction of an ancient rival against our Judeo-Christian heritage, our secular present, and the worldwide expansion of both”.
http://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/48950/samuel-p-huntington/the-clash-of-civilizations Foreign Affairs Summer issue 1993
My advocacy is for total war. Its the only sensible solution.
Trapper John
09-09-2014, 15:11
I agree.
.........
Without the national will to fight for our survival, there is no road to eventual victory.
With our own elected leadership ignoring the threat, if not actually sympathizing with them, I do not see how we can have a successful strategy, or a path to victory.
..........
TR
I think you are absolutely correct in that assessment. If you still hold to the naive notion that our elected leadership is a reflection of the will of the people (I think I still do), then to get out in front of this threat we need to do some serious education at home.
People are still naive as to the ISIS threat. But educating theme through social media seems to work. I have been trying an experiment here in a small social group (mostly liberals). There has been a change in perceptions since I started a couple of months ago. Not surprisingly, the first to get it were the Jewish members of the group. They have picked up the banner and are carrying forward.
A few lessons learned: messaging is everything, keep the message simple and educational, graphic violence can have a strong impact if couched properly within the message, selected subgroups are more receptive than others (Jewish population for instance) and they can carry the message to others.
Of great help in this effort has been the ISIS Study Group by Greg West and several other Brothers. Very thoughtful and informative blog IMHO.
I would think that if we each start posting to a small circle of our friends (the ones that are sleep walking) and wake them up, we might just have a chance at getting ahead of this threat and even achieving the public will to sustain the fight to the very end for once.
Of this I am certain, though, if we do not do the leg work to prep the battle space first, the outcome will be like every other conflict we have engaged in over the past 50 years.
graphic violence can have a strong impact if couched properly within the message
Like this?
Trapper John
09-10-2014, 11:21
Although I detest these two words being used together as it is an obvious oxymoron, a Holy War seems to be what our enemy is declaring. I have been thinking a lot about that lately and exactly what it means and how it does, or even if it should affect a strategy for addressing ISIS? Here are some more or less random thoughts I think worthy of discussion in this forum.
To the best of my knowledge the coming conflict with ISIS will be the first war to be fought by our nation on fundamentally ideological grounds. Most if not all previous conflicts that led to war had at their roots the struggle for control of economic resources.
Much has been made of the ISIS manner and means of conducting war as compared to to that of the Nazis. A comparison to the Holocaust perpetrated by the Nazis and ISIS is obvious, but is only superficial IMO.
The Nazi’s arose as a political party from a hyper-nationalistic fervor to achieve an economic end not an ideological end. Atrocities committed by the Nazis (crimes against humanity) were a means to an end, not the end in and of itself. ISIS, on the other hand, is driven purely by ideology and the manner and means ISIS uses to affect its stated goals are ends in and of themselves. That is to say that the brutal oppression is part of the desired end-state and not merely the manner and means for achieving the end-state.
It seems to me that this is a wholly unique challenge for us and the chosen strategy for dealing with ISIS cannot be predicated on how we have dealt with any other threat in the past. In other words, simply bombing ISIS with the belief that at some point they will cease is not realistic. You simply cannot kill an idea.
I certainly do not have the answer to what strategy will work, but I do know that if we do not clearly and completely understand the enemy and the root motivations that drive the enemy, we cannot truly defeat them. I also know that this is going to be a generational conflict and that if we do not properly understand that fact we will not be able to defeat them either.
My gut is telling me that we are about to enter a struggle like no other – one of good versus evil. Two of the axioms put forth by Sun Tzu are most important here. First, know ourselves. Our weakness is Tolerance. As Thomas Mann said, “Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil.” We, as a culture, will need to embrace that.
Second is to know your enemy. By that he meant not just who he is, but what he is, how he thinks, and why he thinks what he thinks. Towards that end I have attached what I think is pretty insightful article into anthropological psychology of the Muslim culture.
As I said none of this provides an answer to the strategic questions, but it is a starting point towards developing a sustainable strategy.
http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/176673/emotional-nakba?all=1
De Oppresso Liber
OK, dog pile :D
Trapper John, it’s hard not to agree with you on the points you’re making, but I v/r submit that the conflict we are about to join is more similar to the one fought against organized crime in the 60’s and 70’s. If you lump all the Islam Extremists into one bowl (while the mantras vary wildly) you’ll find very little difference in one glaring aspect: they are competing with one another. Not just for recruits (while that is certainly one of the obvious tools), but more for market shares. They are making billions and billions of dollars in plain old neighborhood extortion. The spectrum of extreme Islam is less to do with ideology and more to do with money and the power associated with great sums of cash on hand (not stocks and bonds…cash). By posing as an ideology it makes the fighting of it appear more difficult. It's them wrapping their faces in black grease rags. If you see the fight as destroying their cash on hand and denying them additional cash the struggle will be less opaque. I agree that this conflict will be like nothing we have fought before on the battlefield, but that we need to recognize the goal of the enemy is to attain the greatest amount of cash for the ranking leaders and a goodly amount for the Capos. They have no passion for the fighters, for Islam, for Sunni, or Shia, or Allah, not for mosques, or even their families, or anything else, although they sure put on some good theater that theirs is wrapped in a noble ideal. I think this is the first step in “knowing our enemy”. Knowing ourselves surely includes acknowledging our weakness for “tolerance”, but also our “impatience”.
I damned sure don’t know the strategic approach to win this contest, but I’d love to get some of the Mafia family in a think tank and put the subject to them while Rudy Giuliani acts as the facilitator.
In the meantime, introduce a sudden change in the appearance of the Euro and dollar. Print up a bunch of new middle denomination bills. Turn what they have into worthless paper. They'd start trying to dump or exchange it and might just reveal themselves. Then we could smash them like the vermin they are. Just a thought admittedly based on nothing but wildassed notions and probably too much salt in my diet.
Trapper John
09-10-2014, 13:30
Larry, the mafia analogy is an interesting one. Although, probably correct in the competition between families as compared to factions and tribes in Islam, I don't think the mafia was interested in new converts. They just wanted to operate in the shadows and control their territory.
Of course there is an economic interest at play here - always is in human endeavor. It's just not the prime mover IMO. I still think that ideological factor is the prime driving force. These guys are true zealots and little that the say or do leads me to believe that they are rational actors. At least the mafia acted, reacted, and behaved in a rational manner.
But to use your analogy, maybe a better comparison would be with inner city gangs? Albeit a huge over simplification.
Know your enemy.
What monetary/power motivation exists in a suicide bomber?
What fiscal motivation is there for the young kids drawn to Syria/Iraq to participate in this endeavor?
This IS an ideologically motivated entity and to compare it to a western crime organization is dangerous and misleading.
Radical Islam does not exist...it is simply a literal reading of Islam's books.
This is a theologically driven world wide conflict that does not begin or end with ISIS.
As long as Islam is read/interpreted literally and practicing Islam equals sharia we will be in a state of conflict.
That is the problem and the enemy all in one......but no one presently in our Govt. has the balls to ID it.
Agree with PRB's observations above.
In anticipation of golf boy's address to the nation this evening I found a very short primer that might be of interest - at link below.
The Birth of a Jihadist Caliphate
By Daniel Atzori
http://poseidon01.ssrn.com/delivery.php?ID=7281191260660640640701210750060880 22025045004018028059126002115101120115112010124086 10102011110204505104408610007110208709411905308704 70210611230720991270300040810030890050411240180890 78114013119002021104&EXT=pdf
Old Dog New Trick
09-11-2014, 07:13
There is I believe an economic factor tied to this current Sunni Islamic "Fascism" at least at the upper levels of C2. If it is correct that Saudi Arabia is or has funded ISIS in Syria and has blessed their "Blitzkrieg" invasion of Sunni controlled Northen Iraq with tactical encursions into the Kurdish region (long detested by the former Baath party.)
Then it should stand to reason that those holding the reigns are in this for control of the oil fields and the money associated with them.
Starting a "Holy War" with the current ferver of anti-American hatred is as seen in our current state of global weakness, the time for land grabs and regional control.
The family of Saud, is not stupid (I did like the Mafia connection) and they are acting with "implied consent" exempt from their US handlers.
As far as a UW approach to long term sustainability. Thirteen years ago today, a handful of Saudi hijackers crashed four American airplanes into US financial and military headquarters and started a ball rolling we have been chasing ever since.
Think about it?
Just an opinion.
Know your enemy.
What monetary/power motivation exists in a suicide bomber?
What fiscal motivation is there for the young kids drawn to Syria/Iraq to participate in this endeavor?
This IS an ideologically motivated entity and to compare it to a western crime organization is dangerous and misleading.
Radical Islam does not exist...it is simply a literal reading of Islam's books.
This is a theologically driven world wide conflict that does not begin or end with ISIS.
As long as Islam is read/interpreted literally and practicing Islam equals sharia we will be in a state of conflict.
That is the problem and the enemy all in one......but no one presently in our Govt. has the balls to ID it.
When I think of "know your enemy" regarding the Arab people, I can't help but think of this article:
WESTERN INFLUENCE ON ARAB MILITARIES: POUNDING SQUARE PEGS INTO ROUND HOLES
BY NORVELL B. DE ATKINE MARCH 18, 2013
http://www.gloria-center.org/2013/03/western-influence-on-arab-militaries-pounding-square-pegs-into-round-holes/
To me it looks like the collapse of arbitrary Arab states(Iraq) is coinciding with the collapse/failure of western emulating Arab militaries and the rise of a largely decentralized Arab/Islamic flavored smart phone equipped Khmer Rouge.
I just don't see western construct emulations surviving beyond the departure of western influence and aid.
They are already of questionable performance WITH western influence and aid.
Even with the US disengaging from the region and it's reliance on GCC energy waning(albeit no guarantee of permanence), do you allow an Islamic Khmer Rouge to seize globally relevant oil fields?
On the topic of the Khmer Rouge, would Cambodian Norodom Sihanouk and his bouncing around amongst the US, China, and the Khmer Rouge be worth studying on maybe what might be expected from ruling families if ISIS floods the GCC?
-----
One thing I am keen on watching is if public perceptions/opinions on countering ISIS mirrors the changes to public perceptions/opinions on the BP Deepwater Horizon oil spill a few years back.
Everyone went nuts protesting it. Then the price of energy exploded and shot past $110 a barrel within 12 months. All those SUV gas hog driving part-time Greenies shut up REAL quick.
I wonder how public perception will change towards taking the gloves off IF pump prices start to hurt.
I suspect opposition to aggressive kinetic action will fade if climbing pump prices are perceived to be related.
Will rising pump prices provide scope for a temporary permit(if not a license) to kill?
And if so, would the permit come too late?
One thing I am keen on watching is if public perceptions/opinions on countering ISIS mirrors the changes to public perceptions/opinions on the BP Deepwater Horizon oil spill a few years back.
Everyone went nuts protesting it. Then the price of energy exploded and shot past $110 a barrel within 12 months. All those SUV gas hog driving part-time Greenies shut up REAL quick.
I wonder how public perception will change towards taking the gloves off IF pump prices start to hurt.
I suspect opposition to aggressive kinetic action will fade if climbing pump prices are perceived to be related.
Will rising pump prices provide scope for a temporary permit(if not a license) to kill?
And if so, would the permit come too late?
For me the pump prices shouldn't go up, yet they will. But I hear what you're saying. I feel the world, Arab League, and even OPEC should have been doing something about the stealing of oil on the "black market." With all the open sorce reporting and articles you know who is buying it and general amounts they are getting them per barrel at.
I would be targeting the trucks leaving oil refineries on top of ISI/ISIL/ISIS/IS "units and Formations."
For me the pump prices shouldn't go up, yet they will. But I hear what you're saying. I feel the world, Arab League, and even OPEC should have been doing something about the stealing of oil on the "black market." With all the open sorce reporting and articles you know who is buying it and general amounts they are getting them per barrel at.
I would be targeting the trucks leaving oil refineries on top of ISI/ISIL/ISIS/IS "units and Formations."
Here's an article I find pretty interesting:
http://www.newsweek.com/2014/09/19/exclusive-how-istanbul-became-recruiting-ground-islamic-state-269247.html
I know it's Newsweek.....but I reckon they did a decent job on it.
I know Turkey is dealing with some nasty anti-secular momentum and the emasculation of the Turkish military's power to protect Ataturk's reforms and prevent the return of the caliphate.
But it's a bit of a shocker to read this article.
While a lot of it is to be expected(government tacit support , vulnerable underclass, and islamic civil war on the border), the volume of recruiting in Turkey is frightening.
And leaves me thinking Turkey might someday go full retard caliphate, or iron fisted total war Algeria.
I could see how Sahin Aktan's ex wife could be recruited into ISIS reading between the lines.
But a 25 year old Kyrgyz Christian chick going full retard ISIS, damaged goods/socially vulnerable or not, is Invasion of the Body Snatchers kind of spooky.
I'm aware a few girls in the US have done the same and been pinched(they seem to fit the same damaged goods/socially vulnerable/easily recruitable ).
I'v got my own opinions on things, but without being an SME on the topic.....I'm pretty confident pretty much everyone seems to be doing it wrong based on open source.
Who(if anyone) is doing it right?
Here's an article I find pretty interesting:
http://www.newsweek.com/2014/09/19/exclusive-how-istanbul-became-recruiting-ground-islamic-state-269247.html
I know it's Newsweek.....but I reckon they did a decent job on it.
I know Turkey is dealing with some nasty anti-secular momentum and the emasculation of the Turkish military's power to protect Ataturk's reforms and prevent the return of the caliphate.
But it's a bit of a shocker to read this article.
While a lot of it is to be expected(government tacit support , vulnerable underclass, and islamic civil war on the border), the volume of recruiting in Turkey is frightening.
And leaves me thinking Turkey might someday go full retard caliphate, or iron fisted total war Algeria.
I could see how Sahin Aktan's ex wife could be recruited into ISIS reading between the lines.
But a 25 year old Kyrgyz Christian chick going full retard ISIS, damaged goods/socially vulnerable or not, is Invasion of the Body Snatchers kind of spooky.
I'm aware a few girls in the US have done the same and been pinched(they seem to fit the same damaged goods/socially vulnerable/easily recruitable ).
I'v got my own opinions on things, but without being an SME on the topic.....I'm pretty confident pretty much everyone seems to be doing it wrong based on open source.
Who(if anyone) is doing it right?
I can understand on how a male is recruited into ISIL or into any Islamic movement. The bigger issue is how they can get females to leave their homes and families. That is the surprising one. Yes you could be right on the lines on how “same damaged goods/socially vulnerable/easily recruitable.” Just as a Drug dealer or Pimp will make a Girl “Work” for him or her.
The article that TR posted about their funding and drive behind it, makes for me of a reason. But Still.
FlagDayNCO
09-16-2014, 11:04
There is I believe an economic factor tied to this current Sunni Islamic "Fascism" at least at the upper levels of C2. If it is correct that Saudi Arabia is or has funded ISIS in Syria and has blessed their "Blitzkrieg" invasion of Sunni controlled Northen Iraq with tactical encursions into the Kurdish region (long detested by the former Baath party.)
Then it should stand to reason that those holding the reigns are in this for control of the oil fields and the money associated with them.
Starting a "Holy War" with the current ferver of anti-American hatred is as seen in our current state of global weakness, the time for land grabs and regional control.
The family of Saud, is not stupid (I did like the Mafia connection) and they are acting with "implied consent" exempt from their US handlers.
As far as a UW approach to long term sustainability. Thirteen years ago today, a handful of Saudi hijackers crashed four American airplanes into US financial and military headquarters and started a ball rolling we have been chasing ever since.
Think about it?
Just an opinion.
O.D.N.T. puts a light on what the Feds are NOT telling anyone. The implied consent. The financial and political influence of Saud.
The religous fanaticism is just a fuel, the effort is to gain control over an entire region. They are focused on the oil rich and financially supportive areas of the region.
Our basic instruction is to remember Islam is not just a religion, it is a form of governing and a form of banking. The religion is used by the governing elite to gain control of the finances. Which buy religous support, to gain control of the governed, to obtain more financial support... and on and on.
Islamic State spokesman again threatens West in new speech
By CALEB WEISS
September 21, 2014 7:39 PM
Long War Journal
Abu Muhammad al Adnani, the spokesman for the Islamic State has released a new speech today entitled "Indeed Your Lord is Ever Watchful". In this new fiery speech, al Adnani threatens not only America, but also European countries for supporting US airstrikes in Iraq against the Islamic State.
"O America, O allies of America, and O crusaders, know that the matter is more dangerous than you have imagined and greater than you have envisioned", Adnani says, "We have warned you that today we are in a new era, an era where the State, its soldiers, and its sons are leaders not slaves. They are a people who through the ages have not known defeat".
Adnani then goes on to say, "O crusaders, you have realized the threat of the Islamic State, but you have not become aware of the cure, and you will not discover the cure because there is no cure. If you fight it, it becomes stronger and tougher. If you leave it alone, it grows and expands". In the next paragraph he warns that "this campaign will be your final campaign. It will be broken and defeated, just as all your previous campaigns were broken and defeated, except that this time we will raid you thereafter, and you will never raid us. We will conquer your Rome, break your crosses, and enslave your women, by the permission of Allah, the Exalted."
Adnani then mentions President Obama directly when he says, "And O Obama, O mule of the jews. You are vile. You are vile. You are vile. And you will be disappointed, Obama. Is this all you were capable of doing in this campaign of yours? Is this how far America has reached of incapacity and weakness?"
He then warns American and European citizens for "their governments actions in Iraq". He goes to say, "O Americans, and O Europeans, the Islamic State did not initiate a war against you, as your governments and media try to make you believe. It is you who started the transgression against us, and thus you deserve blame and you will pay a great price. You will pay the price when your economies collapse. You will pay the price when your sons are sent to wage war against us and they return to you as disabled amputees, or inside coffins, or mentally ill".
Adnani then calls on Muslims who support the Islamic State from around the world to "defend the Islamic State". "So rise O muwahhid [monotheists]. Rise and defend your state from your place wherever you may be. Rise and defend your Muslim brothers, for their homes, families, and wealth are threatened and deemed lawful by their enemies."
He then calls on these Muslims to "strike the soldiers, patrons, and troops of the tawāghīt [those who cross the limits of Allah]. Strike their police, security, and intelligence members, as well as their treacherous agents. Destroy their beds. Embitter their lives for them and busy them with themselves. If you can kill a disbelieving American or European - especially the spiteful and filthy French - or an Australian, or a Canadian, or any other disbeliever from the disbelievers waging war, including the citizens of the countries that entered into a coalition against the Islamic State, then rely upon Allah, and kill him in any manner or way however it may be."
Threatening the United States or Europe in speeches is nothing new for Adnani or the Islamic State. In a recent propaganda video released earlier this week, the Islamic State threatened to "attack the White House and kill US troops".
When the Islamic State beheaded US reporters James Foley and Steven Sotloff, it said "So any attempt by you, Obama, to deny the Muslims their rights of living in safety under the Islamic Caliphate will result in the bloodshed of your people". And when the Islamic State beheaded UK aid worker David Haines, they warned, "[Britain's] evil alliance with America, which continues to strike the Muslims of Iraq and most recently bombed the Haditha Dam, will only accelerate your destruction" and "will only drag you and your people into another bloody and un-winnable war."
In a documentary released by VICE News in August, an Islamic State press officer in Raqqa went on camera saying, "Don't be cowards and attack us with drones. Instead, send your soldiers, the ones we humiliated in Iraq. We will humiliate them everywhere, God wiling, and we will raise the flag of Allah in the White House."
More importantly, in Abu Bakr al Baghdadi's first recorded speech, he threatened the United States by saying, "As for your security, your citizens cannot travel to any country without being afraid. The mujahideen have launched after your armies, and have swore to make you taste something harder than what Usama had made you taste. You will see them in your home, Allah permitting. Our war with you has only begun, so wait."
Read more: http://www.longwarjournal.org/threat-matrix/archives/2014/09/islamic_state_spokesman_again.php#ixzz3E50N1Gyg
From the article posted above: " You will see them in your home, Allah permitting. Our war with you has only begun, so wait."
Don't force us to fight; because you're not going to like the way we fight once the PC gloves come off. We're waiting you Satan-worshiping mfers. Bring it on if you dare!
Lighthouse
09-30-2014, 12:47
I can't even take that threat seriously. All these [insert extremists group name here] guys are the same. They think they are really hard men from what they do to the those who don't possess the means to defend themselves. Then the lease comes off and they are all turned to dust.
helicom6
10-04-2014, 04:26
We will never be able to politicize and collaborate for peace with these demons on earth....It is time humanity took back the earth from these hounds of hell!! I'm no religiously-minded man, but I can only sum up that this is a battle against the greatest type of evil humanity will ever face!
First, if you do not have a strategy, you never admit that. You can always say that you are working on it. Let them guess whether you actually do or not.
Second, I am pretty sure that there was no strategy in place on 9/11 stating that if Al Qaeda hijacked and crashed four airplanes in the US and killed 3,000 Americans, our plan was to invade Afghanistan and go after them.
Nonetheless, and like him or not, President Bush and his administration put boots on the ground in country working to overthrow the Taliban and attack Al Qaeda in fourteen days.
The first SF ODA hit the ground and went to doing our jobs in 39 days. The evidence of their success is evident, and the Taliban quickly fell.
What is the current administration doing to destroy ISIL and remove them from Iraqi territory? Who knows?
Do they have a plan, if not a strategy? How many people work in government for just such contingencies and strategy development, and what are they doing to earn their paychecks lately?
Next, the wussification of America and the military is evident. We have dropped combat effectiveness for a grand social experiment. We want a bloodless war, like people got used to in Desert Storm. What these thugs need to see is Old Testament violence and punishment. No mercy, no quarter. Bomb them even further into the Stone Age, shoot every one of them, unleash Hell fire, and salt the earth of their people. Hamburg. Berlin. Tokyo. Dresden. Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Give the residents a couple of days to force out the ISIL scum on their own, and then we punish them. Make an example of the first few cities, so that they fear us more than ISIL. Use the Iraqi Army to fight and secure the population centers. Kill deserters. Create a highway of death and a string of burning vehicles and dead bodies all the way back to the Syrian border like DS. Then offer to continue the attack inside Syria if there are any more problems with ISIL. Seize their funds. Attack their infrastructure. Initiate PSYOP messaging to those who might be inclined to support our enemies, or oppose us. Divide their alliances. I don't want Americans on the ground again in Iraq, but since I want ISIL on the ground in the US even less, we will do what we have to.
You want a strategy? Here you go. Or strategy is to use every means at our disposal to kill every ISIL member and sympathizer we can find who remains inside Iraq in 72 hours. We reserve the right to start early if it pleases us. Go home now or die. And here is another thing. I don't want to hear any shit about departure plans and dates till victory has been achieved. We are staying till the job is done and the last shot is fired. By us.
Finally, if you travel outside the US to attend this party, you are immediately and permanently stripped of your US passport and citizenship. And your families go on the watch list as potential collaborators.
BTW, the rest of the military not involved in this action are deploying to secure our southern border. Better late then never.
That is all.
TR
I applaud this guy for putting his money where his mouth is, but I can't help but wonder why he was discharged from the Army so early. I'm thinking a mental disorder.
Wisconsin man decides to join YPG to fight ISIS (http://fox6now.com/2014/10/04/racine-man-decides-to-do-something-about-isis/)
Guymullins
10-06-2014, 09:51
The parallels are amazing. An unprovoked attack on American soil by a fanatical enemy who is prone to suicide missions and beheading prisoners. An enemy whose belief in their leader as a demigod and their ruthlessness in following orders and their extreme cruelty to captives. Japanese or Muslim? Take your pick. From experience, we know what stopped the Japanese and turned them into model citizens.
I am afraid that the cure for Muslim extremism will need to be more drastic. My reasoning is , the Japanese had and have many admirable social and industrial ethics which, when redirected , produced an admirable society. The Muslims on the other hand, have very little to commend them and less that will turn them into model citizens once defeated.
That Muslims are poor soldiers is a truism plain to anyone. The Israelis beat almost the entire Arab world in 6 days. America has run over the Iraqis twice without any significant bother. The Afghanis are exceptions to the rule and should be left to their own devices and only bombed into submission once every hundred years or so.
Otherwise, the path forward is plain for anyone to see, but I am afraid that America, with a crypto-Muslim leading it, is not in the right place to effect the cure.
frostfire
01-20-2015, 06:58
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-30893735
Let's see, a banzai charge against ISIS fanatics...or give them a taste of their own medicine via kamikaze....or let''s have ISIS experience an assault with the same resolve as 442nd RCT when rescuing the Lost Batallion
In a "way,' this is good. I want to see ISIS kidnap citizens from every single country. That way, they can be labeled as world's #1 menace (if not already)...and eradicated with extreme prejudice
Complete article at link - VDH again makes some interesting observations regarding our complex problem dealing with radical Islam.
Muslims and Islamists
How do extremists relate to the population in which they live?
VDH 1/20/15 NRO
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/396697/muslims-and-islamists-victor-davis-hanson
The terrorism in Paris is yet another bad chapter in an ongoing Western debate over a seeming paradox. Almost all recent global terrorism is attributable to Islamic-inspired violence — much of it directed against Muslims. And yet the vast majority of the world’s 1.5 billion Muslims do not directly aid and abet the spate of Islamic extremism.
How then to focus on the Islamic terrorists without polluting the surrounding sea in which these sharks swim?
Do history’s radical movements assume initial or even ongoing popular majorities to ensure their viability? Obviously, the vast majority of Germans, Japanese, Italians, and Russians did not support the extremists who came to power with Hitler, Tojo, Mussolini, and Lenin.
Indeed, besides carrying out the Holocaust against the Jews, Hitler killed thousands of his own Germans, an array of homosexuals, Communists, domestic critics, and the physically handicapped. Stalin caused more deaths among his own fellow Soviet citizens in the Twenties and Thirties than the Wehrmacht later did.
The point is that extremist movements, even when they become strong enough to reach power, are not always particularly kind to their own or well liked among them. That Muslim radicals kill Muslims in their midst does not necessarily mean that they do not prefer to kill non-Muslims.
The continued influence of radical Muslims who engage in terrorism hinges on whether they bring power, prestige, and resources to the people that they otherwise usually oppress. Islamic theocrats control governments only in the Gulf, Iran, and Gaza, and are trying to cobble together a caliphate largely in Syria and Iraq. Turkey likewise is moving toward theocracy. But Islamists are active, both above and below the radar, in almost every Muslim-majority nation — and they can manage this even where they enjoy very little popular support.
A great deal of attention has been given to radically changing views toward Islamic terrorism in the Middle East, after the disintegration of Syria and the rise of the Islamic State, along with the bloody rampage of Boko Haram in central Africa.
But what is even more striking is the large minorities who still either are willing to state their support for terrorists or say they are unconcerned about their activity. According to the Pew Global Attitudes Project, Muslim support for suicide bombing has dropped in recent years. Yet even so, in 2014 in major Islamic countries — Palestine, Lebanon, Egypt, and Jordan — somewhere between 18 and 46 percent of the population expressed approval for the proposition that suicide bombing against civilian targets can “often/sometimes be justified in order to defend Islam.
Cont'd at link above.
Good reads by Alastair Crooke - a former MI-6 agent and author of Resistance: The Essence of Islamic Revolution.
Richard
You Can't Understand ISIS If You Don't Know the History of Wahhabism in Saudi Arabia
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alastair-crooke/isis-wahhabism-saudi-arabia_b_5717157.html
Middle East Time Bomb: The Real Aim of ISIS Is to Replace the Saud Family as the New Emirs of Arabia
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alastair-crooke/isis-aim-saudi-arabia_b_5748744.html
Perhaps, this may get Barry off the back nine - the JV is certainly on the rise.
ISIS threatens Obama, Japanese and Jordanian hostages in new online messages
Fox News
1/27/2015
“Know, oh Obama, that will reach America,” says one of the fighters, clad in black and wearing a balaclava, in a translation from Arabic provided by MEMRI. “Know also that we will cut off your head in the White House, and transform America into a Muslim Province.”
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2015/01/27/isis-threatens-obama-japanese-and-jordanian-hostages-in-new-online-messages/
Perhaps, this may get Barry off the back nine - the JV is certainly on the rise.
ISIS threatens Obama, Japanese and Jordanian hostages in new online messages
Fox News
1/27/2015
“Know, oh Obama, that will reach America,” says one of the fighters, clad in black and wearing a balaclava, in a translation from Arabic provided by MEMRI. “Know also that we will cut off your head in the White House, and transform America into a Muslim Province.”
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2015/01/27/isis-threatens-obama-japanese-and-jordanian-hostages-in-new-online-messages/
These idiots need to watch a bunch of our westerns and gangster movies. They have no idea how many guns will be trained on them if they were to get together and try to take terrain here. Even in The Communist state of NY and NYC would overwhelm a unch of black pajama wearing camel jockeys on US terrain. I would love to see a battalion of flag waiving idiots along the southern border when they cross. Open season commences on ISIS with out a bag limit.....
ISIS aint stupid...
...they'll just wait until after all US gun owners have been labeled as criminlal for not registering their guns.
THEN, after a few probing attacks to get the "criminals" to discharge their "illegal" firearms, ISIS will be able to walk in relatively unopposed.
...because by then the police force will be busy oppressing the citizenship for owning firearms and speaking out against the government.
So, NO, don't expect ISIS on our shores just yet. There is still work to be done prepping battlefield USA.
...but give it some time; our leaders can only move so fast.
Good reads by Alastair Crooke - a former MI-6 agent and author of Resistance: The Essence of Islamic Revolution.
Richard
You Can't Understand ISIS If You Don't Know the History of Wahhabism in Saudi Arabia
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alastair-crooke/isis-wahhabism-saudi-arabia_b_5717157.html
Middle East Time Bomb: The Real Aim of ISIS Is to Replace the Saud Family as the New Emirs of Arabia
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alastair-crooke/isis-aim-saudi-arabia_b_5748744.html
These are some really good reads Richard. THANKS!!
I also like this one here
http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21606284-civilisation-used-lead-world-ruinsand-only-locals-can-rebuild-it
If our so called leaders have any doubt that these ISIS savages will use nukes on us...
Jordan pilot hostage Moaz al-Kasasbeh 'burned alive'
3 February 2015 Last updated at 14:24 ET
BBC
Jordan has confirmed the death of pilot Moaz al-Kasasbeh after a video published online by Islamic State (IS) claimed to show him being burned alive.
The video shows a man standing in a cage and engulfed in flames. Intelligence officials are working to confirm it is genuine.
<snip>
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-31121160
The Reaper
02-03-2015, 14:39
Well, that kind of ruins their value as hostages and turns people against the Islamic terrorists, wouldn't you think?
TR
Let's see if the Jordanians follow through on the decision to execute the ISIS prisoner at sun-up...
Jihad goes both ways.
frostfire
04-05-2015, 14:01
"Even with the influx of thousands of foreign fighters, almost all of the leaders of the Islamic State are former Iraqi officers, including the members of its shadowy military and security committees, and the majority of its emirs and princes, according to Iraqis, Syrians and analysts who study the group.
They have brought to the organization the military expertise and some of the agendas of the former Baathists, as well as the smuggling networks developed to avoid sanctions in the 1990s and which now facilitate the Islamic State’s illicit oil trading."
“All the decision makers are Iraqi, and most of them are former Iraqi officers. The Iraqi officers are in command, and they make the tactics and the battle plans,” he said. “But the Iraqis themselves don’t fight. They put the foreign fighters on the front lines.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/the-hidden-hand-behind-the-islamic-state-militants-saddam-husseins/2015/04/04/aa97676c-cc32-11e4-8730-4f473416e759_story.html?tid=trending_strip_2
Yep, the puppet masters allow Baghdadi to live and inspire many in their delusional caliphate, to serve their own agenda
IMHOO, we should not miss this excellent opportunity to create an enduring psyop narrative: #joinISISbeSaddamb*tch, #jointheCaliphatebeaBaathist
You have to look at the Patriarchal Caliphate and Patriarchal Caliphate. ISIL is trying to reset them up. Especially the Patriarchal Caliphate. You have to also look at the Islamic end-times: Yawm al-Qiyāmah "the Day of Resurrection". Their Armageddon called fitnah or malāhim, and it's location is close to Aleppo, Syria.
There are other factors on what should or must happen for "factors" to "make" for fitnah to happen. One is a foreign Army to "fill" in the Arabian peninsula and the lands of Syria. Much more, needs to happen but that a nut shell.