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Surf n Turf
06-27-2013, 15:04
Interesting Article. There appears to have been a better alignment and results “back in the day”

I sure don’t want to sound like some grumpy FOG, but have things really change this much ?

SnT

The Decline of Dustoff
Medal of Honor Huey pilot bemoans today’s medical air-evacuation process.
BY PATRICK H. BRADY - July 1, 2013

"When I have your wounded."
Those words set the standard and example for generations of Dustoff crews, which provided helicopter aeromedical evacuation from the battlefield. They were also the death rattle of Maj. Charles Kelly. In terms of lives saved, his sacrifice was perhaps the most productive U.S. combat death ever. Kelly’s story may be instructive in demonstrating the shabby state of evacuation and care of wounded warriors today.

Dustoff pilots, of course, were not specially trained. But through repetition, we became specialists in combat pickups at night, in weather and under fire. Through trial and error, we found ways to get patients with an alacrity previously unknown. If we encountered a situation beyond our capability we could call Kelly, but we never left a patient in the field; the welfare of the patient was our universe. We were a free-enterprise operation. Individual initiative ruled. We determined the risk (although I don’t remember ever hearing that word) by launching immediately and flying to the site. We had our own radio frequency and call sign and dealt directly with the grunts at the pickup site. There were no middlemen. Although we had three categories of patients – urgent, priority and routine – we responded to all calls instantly if we had the resources.
Area security was undefinable, and a waste of time, between grunt and crew. We set a simple definition: stand up and help us load, and we will come in.------

The launch standard in my unit in Vietnam was two minutes, and mission completion averaged half an hour. Under the new system, some commanders were so ignorant of reaction time in lifesaving that they confused a patient priority with the golden hour and set two hours as the standard. Thankfully this was changed back to one hour, but the birds were taking more than 20 minutes to get off the ground

According to the new standard, “risk management (not patient well-being) shall be the primary consideration in the planning and execution of every activity.” And the risk management is done far from the action. The middlemen rule. Mission requests now go through a long and tortured evaluation process while the patient waits.

http://www.legion.org/magazine/216261/decline-dustoff

doctom54
06-27-2013, 16:49
A very good article.
I just finished "Dead Men Flying" and it is an excellent book. I have bought a couple of copies and given to friends who were in RVN as aviators

Eagle5US
06-27-2013, 17:17
It would be a better article if it were accurate. Seeing as how I just got back a couple weeks ago, launching and tracking MULTIPLE DUSTOFF missions from our JOC...

Average notification time from the nine line was less than 90 seconds. Lift off time for two aircraft was under 5 minutes (which is significant seeing as how the run up procedures for Blackhawks are more than that of UH1's (and being a flight medic on both at one time or another - yes I am familiar with both).
Once again, someone sees an opportunity based on an interview with PFC Snuffy and his buddy PV2 Tentpeg, and by gum those two "hero's" are the authority.
There are onesy and twosy examples where something was delayed or denied...I denied at least a half dozen requests a week (for Afghans, Civilians, or others not authorized our birds or our care)...but US folks have more safeguards, backstops and redundancies built in (ESPECIALLY with medical) that a mission simply "won't go" if medical isn't "tight".
I won't go into the parameters for OPSEC...but I will say that the above article does not reflect accurate information.

ncart326
06-27-2013, 17:54
It would be a better article if it were accurate. Seeing as how I just got back a couple weeks ago, launching and tracking MULTIPLE DUSTOFF missions from our JOC...

Average notification time from the nine line was less than 90 seconds. Lift off time for two aircraft was under 5 minutes (which is significant seeing as how the run up procedures for Blackhawks are more than that of UH1's (and being a flight medic on both at one time or another - yes I am familiar with both).
Once again, someone sees an opportunity based on an interview with PFC Snuffy and his buddy PV2 Tentpeg, and by gum those two "hero's" are the authority.
There are onesy and twosy examples where something was delayed or denied...I denied at least a half dozen requests a week (for Afghans, Civilians, or others not authorized our birds or our care)...but US folks have more safeguards, backstops and redundancies built in (ESPECIALLY with medical) that a mission simply "won't go" if medical isn't "tight".
I won't go into the parameters for OPSEC...but I will say that the above article does not reflect accurate information.

You are correct about the launch times. I am in Medevac, and just got back in Dec.
The problem that we encountered was the " middleman". Our alarm would sound letting us know there was a 9-line in our AO, and we would sit there with rotors turning waiting on approval from " The Middlemen". Many times at FOB Edi, we were sitting, waiting to launch to a POI 5-10 minutes away, when they would give the mission too Pedro (PJ's), or Tricky ( Brits) even though they were 35-40 minutes away. I understand PJ's are kick ass, but we had a Flt Medic, ( all were paramedics), and a nurse or doctor onboard.

I agree with you about launch times, but I also agree with the book concerning the " Middleman".

BTW, we supported the SF guys up at Cobra. Great bunch of guys, and if any of you are on here, Thank You for the hospitality.

uspsmark
06-28-2013, 05:38
Average notification time from the nine line was less than 90 seconds. Lift off time for two aircraft was under 5 minutes (which is significant seeing as how the run up procedures for Blackhawks are more than that of UH1's (and being a flight medic on both at one time or another - yes I am familiar with both).


I've been a flight medic, UH-1 and UH-60 pilot and went to Aeromedical Evacuation training. 2 minutes liftoff time for a Huey is fast, under five minutes for a Blackhawk is very fast. Nice to know that the Dustoff folks are doing so well.