View Full Version : SF in Tripoli "not told to stand down'
Badger52
06-13-2013, 05:52
Associated Press, Published: June 12
WASHINGTON — The chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff said Wednesday that four members of Army special forces in Tripoli were never told to stand down after last year’s deadly assault on the U.S. diplomatic mission in Benghazi, Libya, disputing a former top diplomat’s claim that the unit might have helped Americans under siege.
Army Gen. Martin Dempsey said timing and the need for the unit to help with casualties from Benghazi resulted in orders for the special forces to remain in Tripoli. Four Americans, including U.S. Ambassador Chris Stevens, died in two separate attacks several hours apart on the night of Sept. 11.
Grrrrr.
Was in my Early Bird; here's the Washington Post link. (http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/top-military-leader-says-army-special-forces-never-told-to-stand-down-after-benghazi-attack/2013/06/12/436b3966-d381-11e2-b3a2-3bf5eb37b9d0_story.html)
Edited to add: CJCS opening his mouth about much of anything these days is bad for the digestion. Another area where the trust-ship has sailed.
So they wanted to go help - Were not told to stand down - but were just told to stay in place.
Maybe the difference splits too many hairs for me.
IMO, there far too many weasel-like responses from current "leadership" - no matter the scandal de jour - to inspire confidence in said "leadership."
<rant off>
Seems like every time I read about Dempsey he is pressing politically correctness or political expedience.....he comes off as a stooge. Makes me wonder what the NSA has on him...
The Benghazi story has changed more times than I can count, the only thing that hasn't changed is the fact the Administration tried to blame the cause and deaths on a trailer for an unknown movie called Innocence of Muslims by Nakoula Basseley Nakoula.
PedOncoDoc
06-13-2013, 07:16
Why don't they have that team come in and testify on the subject?
If the administration did nothing wrong they have nothing to hide, right? :confused:
Not told to stand down, just told to stay? Talk about quibbling. I guess helping with the dead was more important than trying make them not dead.:mad:
ddoering
06-13-2013, 07:51
Not told to stand down, just told to stay? Talk about quibbling. I guess helping with the dead was more important than trying make them not dead.:mad:
I guess the General is already looking towards his next job after retirement.
Why don't they have that team come in and testify on the subject?
If the administration did nothing wrong they have nothing to hide, right? :confused:
Exactly...however, "They" are called Quiet Professionals for a reason.
And this administration is so cowardly, so f--ked up the ass, that they would never admit anything, but rather try and blame Our Best and Bravest! Rediculous.
No dice!:mad:
Holly
p.s....Am sure this is being logged and transferred to my account in Utah.
Badger52
06-13-2013, 10:09
p.s....Am sure this is being logged and transferred to my account in Utah.Holly be sure & let us know when the SS (http://www.examiner.com/article/secret-service-visits-outspoken-critic-of-obama-because-of-twitter#sthash.zvOXZZDX.uxfs)and the IRS stop by (I'm not sure if they'll share rental vans.)
:mad:
UWOA (RIP)
06-13-2013, 11:00
Not told to stand down, just told to stay? Talk about quibbling. I guess helping with the dead was more important than trying make them not dead.:mad:
Just another chapter in "Self-Destruction". Too bad today we don't have another Cincinnatus to chronicle the failure of military leadership on the altar of self-promotion and career advancement. While "Self-Destruction" was an expose of the Vietnam conflict leadership, it seems we are repeating some of the same errors ... and writing new paradigms as well.
I'm beginning to think that academies like West Point (well known for the WPPA or West Point Protective Association) are an anachronism of a young democracy with limited intellectual havens for the repository of military knowledge. Now they inculcate a pseudo-culture of privilege and "best" practices that inspires cronyism and expediency. Perhaps we'd be better off relying on the other two (larger) legs of the officer procurement cycle -- ROTC and OCS. The result would be more truly representative of the excellence produced by this great country.
Today military professionals draw information and experience from a wide array of sources and institutions. I question the need for academies that self-promote and assure that their graduates receive primary consideration for the upper echelons of leadership. It is a Kentucky marriage that insures that the officer corps will rot from within.
And yes, I was ROTC until I was drafted during Vietnam and went to OCS.
End of rant.
Team Sergeant
06-13-2013, 12:21
"WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE NOW"
Paragrouper
06-13-2013, 17:59
such a frigging toady :mad:
Tomato, tomahto. :rolleyes: More total BS from this administration.
Surgicalcric
06-13-2013, 18:47
Gen Dempsey ...he comes off as a stooge.
.
He is a stooge and I haven't met a warrior yet who wouldn't piss on him as he does us.
.....he comes off as a stooge. Makes me wonder what the NSA has on him.
Nothing that these people (current administration and their toadies) tell us any more will ever be taken without wondering what the NSA has on them.
And whatever happened with General Ham? And why did he feel the need (?) to retire?
Did he try to intervene? Actually, that's 3 questions; but I'd really like to know.
Nothing that these people (current administration and their toadies) tell us any more will ever be taken without wondering what the NSA has on them.
The topic is about the Stooge Dempsey, but Stobey brings up General Hamm, and that brings to mind a couple other Generals, plus an Admiral, plus John Roberts decision on Obama Care, John McShames outburst about Syria and all the other people and things that have made you go YGTBSM over the past 4-5 years!
In the wrong hands the NSA data has the potential creating hand puppets like Dempsey or Clapper and the ability to remove obstacles.
Scimitar
06-14-2013, 19:07
J Edgar Hoover-esq on steroids, no?
S
Light_Fighter
06-15-2013, 05:08
Why don't they have that team come in and testify on the subject?
They're considering calling them in to testify.
http://thehill.com/blogs/defcon-hill/operations/301127-house-defense-panel-to-call-special-forces-team-in-libya-to-testify-
From the May 21st story:
House defense panel members are pushing to get the U.S. special operations team ordered to stand down in Libya to testify before the committee's oversight and investigations subpanel.
"We are working with the Defense Department to see if that can happen," a staffer with the House Armed Services oversight and investigations subcommittee told The Hill on Tuesday.
The staffer declined to comment as to how soon that U.S. special operations team could come before the subcommittee, or if its members would testify publicly or brief members behind closed doors.
Destrier
06-15-2013, 18:53
http://www.wnd.com/2013/06/admission-special-forces-were-only-hours-from-benghazi/
Did not see this posted elsewhere.
ironyoshi
06-15-2013, 21:46
Dempsey has:
- pressured Terry Jones to cancel his exercise of free speech (Koran burning)
- wrongly accused the SEALs who made the video about OPSEC of using the "uniform" for political purposes
- said that the military would need to reevaluate the requirements of occupational specialties that excluded women due to reasons of physical fitness
- and more...
Political animal is one of the kindest things one could call him.
I know, it's Gen. Dempsey; but the attached links to articles by Diana West will shed some light on the above-mentioned moniker:
http://www.dianawest.net/Home/tabid/36/EntryId/2108/General-Dempsey-Scrubbing-Jihad-More-Additional-Risk.aspx
http://www.dianawest.net/Home/tabid/36/EntryId/2114/Invasion-of-the-Body-Snatchers-For-Real.aspx
Interesting reads. Thought you gentlemen might enjoy them.
Team Sergeant
06-18-2013, 07:29
They're considering calling them in to testify.
http://thehill.com/blogs/defcon-hill/operations/301127-house-defense-panel-to-call-special-forces-team-in-libya-to-testify-
From the May 21st story:
"considering calling them in to testify"
Might as well place them all in the same helicopter and fly them unarmed over enemy infested territory before they testify....:munchin
They're not going to allow more than one Green Beret to testify on capitol hill, there would be too many embarrassing bowel control problems....
UWOA (RIP)
06-18-2013, 10:31
"considering calling them in to testify"
Might as well place them all in the same helicopter and fly them unarmed over enemy infested territory before they testify....:munchin
They're not going to allow more than one Green Beret to testify on capitol hill, there would be too many embarrassing bowel control problems....
Top,
I almost fell out of my chair when I read the last sentence.
On target! FFE!
.
Surf n Turf
06-26-2013, 21:55
"considering calling them in to testify"
Might as well place them all in the same helicopter and fly them unarmed over enemy infested territory before they testify....:munchin
TS,
All very “hush-hush” these classified briefings
SnT
Readout of House Armed Services Committee, Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations Classified Briefing on Benghazi
WASHINGTON--Today, the House Armed Services Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations received testimony in a classified briefing from three key figures involved in the response to the attack on Americans in Benghazi. General Carter Ham (ret), former Commander, AFRICOM; Lieutenant Colonel S.E. Gibson, former commander of the site security team at the U.S. Embassy in Tripoli; and Rear Admiral Brian Losey, former commander, Special Operations Command Africa, all offered accounts of U.S. force posture and planning ahead of the attack, and actions taken during and after the attack. While the subcommittee will continue to carry out appropriate oversight, today’s witnesses did clarify several matters with respect to the events of September 11 and 12, 2012.
Pre-9/11 Force Posture and Planning: On September 10, 2012 the White House issued a readout of a presidential briefing on 9/11 planning. The readout said the briefing was the culmination of “numerous meetings to review security measures in place” chaired by John Brennan. The readout also reported that the briefing included “steps taken to protect U.S. persons and facilities abroad, as well as force protection.”
When questioned about this process today, General Ham, the combatant commander responsible for one of the most volatile threat environments in the world, stated that neither he or anyone working for him was consulted as part of the Brennan 9/11 planning process.
Response to the Benghazi Attack: In his testimony, LTC Gibson clarified his responsibilities and actions during the attack. Contrary to news reports, Gibson was not ordered to “stand down” by higher command authorities in response to his understandable desire to lead a group of three other Special Forces soldiers to Benghazi. Rather, he was ordered to remain in Tripoli to defend Americans there in anticipation of possible additional attacks, and to assist the survivors as they returned from Benghazi. Gibson acknowledged that had he deployed to Benghazi he would have left Americans in Tripoli undefended. He also stated that in hindsight, he would not have been able to get to Benghazi in time to make a difference, and as it turned out his medic was needed to provide urgent assistance to survivors once they arrived in Tripoli."
http://armedservices.house.gov/index.cfm/press-releases?ContentRecord_id=2da7b67e-088e-462f-93c2-01cab80c562a&ContentType_id=e0c7b822-826f-493d-8cef-1e21aa53e12a&Group_id=12580721-af41-4987-849c-c25b730d096d
TS,
Response to the Benghazi Attack: In his testimony, LTC Gibson clarified his responsibilities and actions during the attack. Contrary to news reports, Gibson was not ordered to “stand down” by higher command authorities in response to his understandable desire to lead a group of three other Special Forces soldiers to Benghazi. Rather, he was ordered to remain in Tripoli to defend Americans there in anticipation of possible additional attacks, and to assist the survivors as they returned from Benghazi. Gibson acknowledged that had he deployed to Benghazi he would have left Americans in Tripoli undefended. He also stated that in hindsight, he would not have been able to get to Benghazi in time to make a difference, and as it turned out his medic was needed to provide urgent assistance to survivors once they arrived in Tripoli."
I don't see the difference between being told to stay in Tripoli and told to stand down from going to Benghazi.
I don't see the difference between being told to stay in Tripoli and told to stand down from going to Benghazi.
He never had a mission to go to Benghazi - he may have wanted to go and volunteered to do so, but his mission was to provide security/support for the embassy and associated personnel in Tripoli. If he had been assigned the Benghazi mission and then told to stay in Tripoli, that would have been being told to "stand down."
Richard
He never had a mission to go to Benghazi - he may have wanted to go and volunteered to do so, but his mission was to provide security/support for the embassy and associated personnel in Tripoli. If he had been assigned the Benghazi mission and then told to stay in Tripoli, that would have been being told to "stand down."
Richard
Sorry, I think your parsing. I still don't see the difference.
Randy Shugart and Gary Gordon were told several times to remain in their assigned helicopter and continue their fire support mission. I'm guessing Mike Durant is eternally grateful that they didn't, and our nation has seen fit to recognize them for their actions, even if those actions may or may not have had any effect on Durant's capture and captivity.