View Full Version : "You Will Not Disrespect Obama in this Classroom!"
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/n-c-teacher-tells-student-he-could-be-arrested-for-talking-badly-about-obama/
lol Somebody needs to "partner" with this "teacher" and "dialogue" with her about the fact that "disrespect" isn't a verb. What a maroon..
Last Monday, a high school student in North Carolina engaged his social studies teacher in a heated debate about politics and the two leading presidential candidates. During the exchange, the teacher (an obvious Obama supporter) got very angry with the student and accused him of disrespecting the president. She even went so far as to tell the boy that he could be jailed for speaking ill of Obama.
Sarah Campbell of the Salisbury Post first reported on the story. She claims that the school district is not releasing the name of the teacher and that she is not responding to requests for public comment (although the two students identified her to the newspaper). According to Campbell’s story, the teacher will not be suspended or even face disciplinary action for what was heard on the recording. A statement from the school was released at the end of the week:
“The Rowan-Salisbury School System expects all students and employees to be respectful in the school environment and for all teachers to maintain their professionalism in the classroom. This incident should serve as an education for all teachers to stop and reflect on their interaction with students. Due to personnel and student confidentiality, we cannot discuss the matter publicly.”
So, how bad was the exchange? It got fairly heated, with the teacher shouting at times. The kerfuffle started after one student asked a question about the teacher’s “fact of the day” that said Romney was a bully back in high school. A student asked:
"Didn’t Obama bully somebody, though?”
The teacher started to get angry and said:
"Not to my knowledge.”
A couple of students relayed the story about Obama admitting that he bullied someone when he was younger. And that seemed to light the fuse on his teacher’s anger. A couple of the students exchanged words with the angry teacher.
“Stop! Stop! Because there’s no comparison. He’s running for president. Obama is the president.”
As one student attempted to argue for a fair, two-sided debate on the history of the candidates, he was shouted down and talked over by the teacher. She continued:
“You got to realize, this man is wanting to be what Obama is. There’s no comparison.”
Once again, the students pressed for equal discussion of the histories of both men, with one saying:
“If you’re gonna talk trash about one side, you gotta talk trash about the other.”
The teacher just seemed to dig her heels in deeper and press her defense of Obama telling the defiant teen:
“You will not disrespect the president of the United States in this classroom.”
Again the student persisted and invoked his First Amendment right.
“I’ll say what I want.”
The still unidentified teacher read the student her rules…her Obama rules.
“Not about him, you won’t!”
The back and forth continued and the most strident of the two students reminded his teacher that President Bush was constantly treated to negative statements about him while he was in office:
“Whenever Bush was president, everybody talked sh-t about him.”
To which the teacher responded:
“Because he was sh-tty.”
The social studies educator went on for a full minute with more ranting, saying that people were arrested for saying derogatory things about President Bush. The student correctly reminded the teacher that opinions are protected, but you cannot be arrested unless you threaten the president.
Our research has not turned up a single case of anyone in America being arrested for speaking ill of former President Bush. The local newspaper story also mentioned that their discussions about the story with a political science professor could not recall the arrests that the teacher was speaking about.
The entire confrontation was recorded by a student and posted on YouTube. Listen below; slight content warning for language.
Click for vid.
Snip
Don't know wether to laugh or cry.....the school system around Bragg was/is populated with degree'd Maroons.....
Don't know wether to laugh or cry.....the school system around Bragg was/is populated with degree'd Maroons.....
It's interesting that the students were fighting back, though.
Pat
It's interesting that the students were fighting back, though.
Pat
lol They didn't seem to be overly intimidated by her majestic intellect, did they? :D
A classic example of when teaching is not teaching. A teachers job...those with the college degree in their field, and in educating, should be to engage the child at every possible level, and then to offer them suggestions to further their (those of the student and the teacher, I know...I live in a bubble) ideas, not to shut them down, or to force them to think or conform to the teachers line or any other particular form of thinking. The student must eventually make their own choices.
This could have been a great springboard into assignments and discussion, but under the current pedagogy of learning is a garunteed breakdown.
greenberetTFS
05-21-2012, 07:26
I'm interested in what my"teacher QP's" think about this matter (Richard,Zonie and Dozer)......:rolleyes:
Big Teddy :munchin
ZonieDiver
05-21-2012, 10:49
I'm interested in what my"teacher QP's" think about this matter (Richard,Zonie and Dozer)......:rolleyes:
Big Teddy :munchin
MOO, this "teacher" is a moron with minimal education in history and government who never engages adults in conversation who have opinions differing from hers, and is probably protected by the administrative hierarchy of her school/district by those who share her views (and they are legion).
Futhermore, she had the misfortune to be in front of a class with more than one student possessing the intellectual prowess and knowledge base - gained either at home, on his/her own, or from another teacher - (thank goodness there are many of these students), as well as the 'cojones' to not only initially seek to offer a contrary viewpoint, but to pursue the discussion and possibly incur the "teacher's" wrath (in my experience, unfortunately, there are too few of these students).
There are many bullies in school, and not all of them are students.
I grew up in a very small mormon community in Utah. I was always in trouble with the sunday school teachers because I was asking hard questions. Usually ended with an angry teacher telling me to shut-up and just believe. Not an environment for an enquiring mind and I was not just going to drink the kool-aid. Good these kids challenged her, the school system should be taking action to retrain or get rid of the teacher.
FWIW: in 1989 my ex-wife's daughter was attending an elementary school north of Spring Lake and I often had to deal with her teachers. One day she brought me an assignment she could not make heads nor tails out of. I look it over and it was the worst instruction I have ever seen full of mis-spellings and grammatical problems. After correcting it using red ink, I met with the principal who asked what I wanted her to do. I told her that either I wanted the girl moved to another specific class or we would go to the district. The principal resolved it right then, guess she didn't want to go to the District.
MVP
My boy has the privilege of going to NC public school. He had a similar teacher in 5th grade who believed O was the savoir. He was questioning her on the Stimulus and it's effect. She began to yell at him and told him that he didn't know what he was talking about. He raised his hand to ask and question and the teacher sad, "WHAT?" "How many zero's are in a trillion?" her response, "I'm not a math teacher!"
They're reporting on Drudge now that she was suspended. No need to link; it's just the same story.
longrange1947
05-21-2012, 22:20
They're reporting on Drudge now that she was suspended. No need to link; it's just the same story.
She'll be back on the job in a couple of days after this settles down and just as dumb. The Admins will protect her as will the union.
MOO, the school system is more than just broke by the union and the progressives that have taken it over.
As with any large organization, the school systems (public, private, parochial) all suffer the fate of having some fools like the teacher recorded in that video. The reasons are many. Some don't have the personality traits required of an effective teacher, some don't have the proper training to be an effective teacher, some don't have the ability to manage their classrooms in a way that allows them to be an effective teacher, and so forth. And then there are the systemic issues, the administrative flaws which can allow such teachers to enter and remain in the system within a department, a school, a district, or the career field itself. When you think about it all, it is amazing that we have so many truly good, committed, effective teachers out there and the Ms. Dixon-Neely's are in the minority.
I was doing two Pre-AP US History (juniors) and three Pre-AP World History (sophomores) classes yesterday while their teachers were at a district appreciation event. We were discussing the holocaust and the Kony situation in Africa in the World History classes, and finished watching the last 15 minutes of the movie Forest Gump (they had been watching it for several days as they sorted through their accumulated work for the semester, did their reflective papers on the value of the course, and organized it all for submission as their final project prior to exams) and discussing the 60's/70's and Vietnam in the US History classes. I had a great time and the students were respectful, interested, inquisitive, insightful, and thanked me for being their sub as they left at the end of class. Such encounters always makes my day and reinforces the soapbox I stand upon whenever somebody - based upon a news story like this one under discussion - tells me our educational system is 'broken' vice being 'worn from high mileage and needing a bit of scheduled maintenance.'
As we all know here, politics can easily become a 'hot button' topic of discussion where - intentional or not - personal feelings often come to the surface in heated argument, especially when the discussion is over someone as polarizing as a WJC, a GWB, or a BHO and their behaviors or policies. In a classroom setting among high school students, it takes skill, preparation, and a sense of disinterested reserve to Socratically engage students in a meaningful way when having such a discussion - all traits Ms. Dixon-Neely seems to be lacking.
I'm not sure we know the entire context of this particular teacher and the dynamics of the situation and her class, but, based upon what I listened to in that video, she wouldn't have been working for me.
And so it goes...
Richard :munchin
I had been somewhat following this story from the beginning.
As I understand it - the student in question had been IDed as one of three (?) conservatives in the class.
The conservatives had been picked on - poked throughout the class, not the first time.
There may have been an idea of "enough is enough" from them and they decided to poke a little back and get it on tape.
Just the results of affirmative action rearing its ugly head. We're reaping what we've sown. The "teacher" is on paid suspension....., guess that'll show her. :rolleyes:
greenberetTFS
05-22-2012, 07:26
I had been somewhat following this story from the beginning.
As I understand it - the student in question had been IDed as one of three (?) conservatives in the class.
The conservatives had been picked on - poked throughout the class, not the first time.
There may have been an idea of "enough is enough" from them and they decided to poke a little back and get it on tape.
I'm sure this won't be the end to this situation..........:rolleyes:
Big Teddy :munchin
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I'm sure this won't be the end to this situation..........:rolleyes:
Big Teddy :munchin
Nope, Farrakhan and Jackson are probably on they're way as we speak...:rolleyes:
PedOncoDoc
05-22-2012, 08:13
I had been somewhat following this story from the beginning.
As I understand it - the student in question had been IDed as one of three (?) conservatives in the class.
The conservatives had been picked on - poked throughout the class, not the first time.
There may have been an idea of "enough is enough" from them and they decided to poke a little back and get it on tape.
And I thought schools had a zero tolerance to bullying rule. :rolleyes:
Destrier
05-22-2012, 08:45
Interview with the young man.
http://video.foxnews.com/v/1649697646001/report-teacher-suspended-for-silencing-obama-critic/?playlist_id=87485
Anybody who doesn't think there will be reprisals from blacks when Obama gets rousted is kidding themselves.
Dusty - we're screwed either way. If he gets reelected we are done as a Constitutional Republic. If he gets defeated, cities will burn.
Luckily - I don't live in a city; too many liberals who've not learned how not to foul their nest. Maybe burning them down won't be suich a bad thing....
greenberetTFS
05-22-2012, 09:26
Anybody who doesn't think there will be reprisals from blacks when Obama gets rousted is kidding themselves.
Again I believe Dusty is right on target,after he loses we're going to see another "Watts".........:mad:
Big Teddy :munchin
longrange1947
05-22-2012, 10:10
Again I believe Dusty is right on target,after he loses we're going to see another "Watts".........:mad:
Big Teddy :munchin
This is a terrible thing to say, but I am to the point where I just don't give a s**t. Let them burn down their own homes. That is what they did in Watts and almost every other riot.
Maybe the non-home-boys, which I am sure are in the majority, will move away from the enablers.
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt.
And so it goes...
Richard :munchin
greenberetTFS
05-22-2012, 13:34
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt.
And so it goes...
Richard :munchin
You realize Richard you're the only one who deciphers your posts.......:D ;)
Big Teddy :munchin
Badger52
05-22-2012, 13:37
Again I believe Dusty is right on target,after he loses we're going to see another "Watts".........:mad:
Big Teddy :munchinThey'd better harken back to '65 - the Korean community is even better armed now than they were in '92. Funny, each one was about 6 days.
GratefulCitizen
05-22-2012, 13:41
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt.
And so it goes...
Richard :munchin
My classroom would be just fine and the world would be a better place if these kids would just shut up and realize I'm right.
ZonieDiver
05-22-2012, 13:51
You realize Richard you're the only one who deciphers your posts.......:D ;)
Big Teddy :munchin
Hell, no, Big Teddy! Richard's Latin blurbs long ago caused me to download a Latin-English translator.
I put this one into it and it translated as:
"Please be patient."
:D
Ooops! It finally came in:
Men readily believe what they wish
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt.
And so it goes...
Richard :munchin
I don't know; the latent hostility is bubbling up.
Just wait 'til about August.
http://www.wtsp.com/news/watercooler/article/256102/58/Woman-attacked-while-ordering-lunch-at-drive-thru
I don't know; the latent hostility is bubbling up.
For those of us who came of age in the 60's, this ain't like the 60's - so meh...unless, of course, GWB happens to be re-elected on write-ins. ;)
As for that teacher, I wonder how she would've handled someone like me back before I had my soul removed to make more room for sarcasm.
Teacher**: Richard - and what comes after sixty-nine?
Richard: Mouthwash.
Teacher: Richard - go to the office!
And so it goes...
Richard :munchin
** Ms Fox, my Algebra teacher - we did not think much of each other - she thought I was a wise @$$ and I thought she was a dumb @$$.
I sincerely hope we can all sit back and chuckle about this race-hate shit in the next few months, but I seriously doubt it.
I believe that particular "teacher" is a microcosm of a large percentage of blacks who have "claimed" the presidency for Obama, and will have a case of the ass, big time, when he gets replaced by a white guy. The ones who don't exactly crave to "get along" with whites are gonna be awfully frustrated.
The fact that blacks make up only 12% of the general population is irrelevant when you take the concentration in urban areas into consideration.
The media and most (IMO) educators in these areas feed the ignorance, anger and resentment through misdirection and outright lies.
Liberal democrats need the black people, so they use this ignorance to oppress them.
GratefulCitizen
05-22-2012, 15:47
I sincerely hope we can all sit back and chuckle about this race-hate shit in the next few months, but I seriously doubt it.
I believe that particular "teacher" is a microcosm of a large percentage of blacks who have "claimed" the presidency for Obama, and will have a case of the ass, big time, when he gets replaced by a white guy. The ones who don't exactly crave to "get along" with whites are gonna be awfully frustrated.
The fact that blacks make up only 12% of the general population is irrelevant when you take the concentration in urban areas into consideration.
The media and most (IMO) educators in these areas feed the ignorance, anger and resentment through misdirection and outright lies.
Liberal democrats need the black people, so they use this ignorance to oppress them.
Crime expands, contracts, and moves for various reasons.
The people with poor SA will always be the targets.
We all do what we can to protect those within our circle of influence.
Sometimes crime moves or expands in such a way that it intrudes on our circles.
During potentially dangerous times, stay closer to base.
If that is insufficient, move.
No sense swimming against the current.
We all do what we can to protect those within our circle of influence.
Sometimes crime moves or expands in such a way that it intrudes on our circles.
How big is your circle of influence?
GratefulCitizen
05-22-2012, 16:19
How big is your circle of influence?
Not a fixed boundary.
It diminishes with range and relationship degrees.
More precisely, by "circle of influence" I meant those things over which we have direct control.
This should be the primary concern for most people.
I am well aware of the indirect control which comes through the influence of others.
See it quietly put into action by professionals on a daily basis.
;)
Not a fixed boundary.
It diminishes with range and relationship degrees.
More precisely, by "circle of influence" I meant those things over which we have direct control.
This should be the primary concern for most people.
I am well aware of the indirect control which comes through the influence of others.
See it quietly put into action by professionals on a daily basis.
;)
So, how big would this idiot "professional educator's" circle of influence be?
I'm not trying to trap you-I agree with you for the most part-I'm saying that the bullshit being force-fed minorities and kids needs to be countered with the truth whenever possible.
GratefulCitizen
05-22-2012, 17:11
So, how big would this idiot "professional educator's" circle of influence be?
Too big, unfortunately.
I'm not trying to trap you-I agree with you for the most part-I'm saying that the bullshit being force-fed minorities and kids needs to be countered with the truth whenever possible.
Wasn't trying to contradict you, only trying to supplement.
Not sure that directly countering will be effective over the long term.
That being said, countering is still necessary in the short term.
Over the long term, the public education system cannot be fixed.
Probably wouldn't be effective to try and dismantle or directly replace it.
I believe the solution lies in gradually displacing it and diminishing its influence.
Communication through the internet is one part of this.
I believe the solution lies in gradually displacing it and diminishing its influence.
Communication through the internet is one part of this.
Ten Four
The Reaper
05-22-2012, 17:35
How big is your circle of influence?
Depending on the line of sight, I would say out to at least 1200 meters.
TR
Depending on the line of sight, I would say out to at least 1200 meters.
TR
:D I knew you'd say that. (Plus or minus 200 yards.)
Destrier
05-22-2012, 18:02
Would be nice to see the troops to teachers program reinforced. Have not heard of it in a long while. But honestly had not looked into it personally.
Would be nice to see the troops to teachers program reinforced. Have not heard of it in a long while. But honestly had not looked into it personally.
So would I, Destrier.
The idiots-to-teachers program is evidently in full force. :D
Would be nice to see the troops to teachers program reinforced.
I saw on RV.net that GreenSalsa (on PS.com) is looking into going that route when he retires.
Pat
GratefulCitizen
05-22-2012, 21:26
Depending on the line of sight, I would say out to at least 1200 meters.
TR
Hmmm...
The line of sight in my area of the world isn't a problem.
Let's see...400 inches drop...133 clicks for range...
If there's no wind and perfect conditions...
I'll succeed in giving away my position.
Hmmm...
The line of sight in my area of the world isn't a problem.
Let's see...400 inches drop...133 clicks for range...
If there's no wind and perfect conditions...
I'll succeed in giving away my position.
You MOA guys,,,,,,Mil is so much easier.
I can see the powder keg brewing, just waiting for the ignition source. Some will be prepared, others will suffer.
ZonieDiver
05-23-2012, 09:56
Re: Troops to Teachers
Remember, "It takes all kinds of critters to make Farmer Vincent's fritters."
There are many people of varying political persuasions and intellectual abilities in the US military establishment.
A couple of the worst, most ill-informed, biased teachers I ever worked with came out of this program.
1stindoor
05-23-2012, 11:17
Would be nice to see the troops to teachers program reinforced. Have not heard of it in a long while. But honestly had not looked into it personally.
It's still going strong, I just picked up a packet of information about it at my retirement briefing.
Too big, unfortunately.
Wasn't trying to contradict you, only trying to supplement.
Not sure that directly countering will be effective over the long term.
That being said, countering is still necessary in the short term.
Over the long term, the public education system cannot be fixed.
Probably wouldn't be effective to try and dismantle or directly replace it.
I believe the solution lies in gradually displacing it and diminishing its influence.
Communication through the internet is one part of this.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/may/23/romney-backs-vouchers-expanded-school-choice/
Mitt Romney said Wednesday he will expand Washington’s endangered voucher program as part of a broad push for more school choice nationwide, setting up a dramatic contrast with President Obama, who has called for the D.C. program to be phased out, and with teachers unions, which have fought against expanded choice.
Mr. Romney announced the push on education in a speech in Washington as he made overtures to Hispanic voters, who regularly tell pollsters that access to education is one of their top concerns — even above immigration — and who generally support vouchers.
“Here we are in the most prosperous nation, but millions of kids are getting a Third World education. And America’s minority children suffer the most,” Mr. Romney said in a speech to the Latino Coalition, a conservative Hispanic organization. “This is the civil rights issue of our era. And it’s the great challenge of our time.”
And he declared war on teachers unions, saying they “are the clearest example of a group that has lost its way.” He said Mr. Obama is too beholden to the unions to be able to reform the school system.
“President Obama has been unable to stand up to union bosses — and unwilling to stand up for kids,” Mr. Romney said, accusing the president of putting the unions’ campaign donations ahead of the needs of students those teachers are teaching.
Driving his message home, Mr. Romney plans to visit a charter school in Philadelphia on Thursday.
Mr. Romney’s nationwide plan calls for giving students who receive federal education assistance the ability to choose from among any public and charter schools in their districts. He said he would push for states to offer enough options so that the choice would be meaningful.
He said he will streamline teacher-quality programs at the federal level and award them to states based on how well they promote good teachers. He also said he would demand better transparency from schools — such as a more useful grading of public schools’ performance — which he said lets parents make better choices.
Overall, his plan relies heavily on giving parents more choices in schools as a way to push reforms on troubled school systems.
White House press secretary Jay Carney said Mr. Romney has been slow to mention education during the campaign, appearing to question the GOP’s commitment to the issue.
“It’s the first time I’ve heard of it. As I recall, education never came up in the Republican primaries in any of the debates. Or if it did, it came up almost never,” Mr. Carney said.
He said Mr. Obama has pursued bipartisan education reforms that the president will defend during the campaign.
In supporting D.C.’s Opportunity Scholarship Program, Mr. Romney is setting up one of the clearest differences between the two.
Mr. Romney said he wants to expand the program and make it a model for other jurisdictions.
The program, which was created and funded by Congress, has been politically contentious from the start, with the powerful teachers unions opposing it but city parents in support.
Snip
Snip
The program, which was created and funded by Congress, has been politically contentious from the start, with the powerful teachers unions opposing it but city parents in support.
And herein lies the rub, typical. We the unions know better how to educate your kids than you do, (and we need to maintain our cash cows as well). :mad:
It's about more than just unions - there's a lot of $$ involved and many charter schools have failed miserably attempting to live up to their claims...
And so it goes...
Richard :munchin
It's about more than just unions - there's a lot of $$ involved and many charter schools have failed miserably attempting to live up to their claims...
And so it goes...
Richard :munchin
It's mainly about the NEA. Which sucks huge.
More than one charter school has gone Tango Uniform around here but the private schools seem to be doing OK.
And Wake County schools are hosed again now that the libs are back in change. Once again there are no stable school districts, they are trying to come up with a plan, maybe everybody can pick whatever school they want - oh, wait, we might end up with the wrong numbers - but we ain't counting numbers - but we are - no we're not.
Real Estate in the area is in the tank because none of the new home buyers know where their kids might be going to school this fall - so they are holding out on buying a home.
From wiki: (yes, I use wiki for stupid shit)
"In recent decades the NEA has increased its visibility in party politics, endorsing more Democratic Party candidates and contributing funds and other assistance to political campaigns. The NEA asserts itself as "non-partisan", but critics point out that the NEA has endorsed and provided support for every Democratic Party presidential nominee from Jimmy Carter to Barack Obama and has never endorsed any Republican or third party candidate for the presidency."
greenberetTFS
05-23-2012, 17:51
From wiki: (yes, I use wiki for stupid shit)
"In recent decades the NEA has increased its visibility in party politics, endorsing more Democratic Party candidates and contributing funds and other assistance to political campaigns. The NEA asserts itself as "non-partisan", but critics point out that the NEA has endorsed and provided support for every Democratic Party presidential nominee from Jimmy Carter to Barack Obama and has never endorsed any Republican or third party candidate for the presidency."
Enough said........:(
Big Teddy :munchin
It's about more than just unions - there's a lot of $$ involved and many charter schools have failed miserably attempting to live up to their claims...
And so it goes...
Richard :munchin
QP Richard,
To clarify, I was referring to the voucher program, I don't know enough about the charter school system to form an opinion. Some private schools utilize vouchers, especially religious schools in my area, and unfortunately, at least in NY(C), if the charter schools can't have them, then no one can. IIRC, when I was in middle school in NJ, private schools were able to utilize them , however, there was quite a bit of contention with the teachers unions(who had no control over the private schools, but did have control - indirectly - over the government voucher funds), and there was a year or two where the program was suspended due to union lobbying.
My .02
........ I don't know enough about the charter school system to form an opinion.................
A Charter School is still a "public" school. It is funded by tax payer money. The public schools came up with the idea to try and head off a migration to private schools.
http://www.publicschoolreview.com/articles/3
As the article states they don't have to prove anything for 3-5 years. 3-5 years? A little kid just starting out in 1st grade - 4 years later the school tanks because it's crap and the students aren't learning - what happened to little Joey?
Hey - it's just tax payer money. Let's start another one.
Private schools have to pay the bills with money they take in from the students, not the government, so they pay a little more attention to standards - otherwise the parents will pull their kids and put them in another school - because it's their money they are spending - above their taxes.
PedOncoDoc
05-24-2012, 04:27
My concern for a program like the one proposed by Romney is that you'll have over-crowding of the better performing schools, and all the problems inherent within, which will cause the kids, their education and the schools to suffer.
I think it's better to aggressively drop the "dead weight" - that is, underperforming teachers and useless administrators. There is an overabundance of people with teaching degrees in my AO who are unable to find teaching jobs - make job retention a challenge with 360-degree evaluation and the problem should self-correct.
ZonieDiver
05-24-2012, 05:42
Private schools have to pay the bills with money they take in from the students, not the government, so they pay a little more attention to standards - otherwise the parents will pull their kids and put them in another school - because it's their money they are spending - above their taxes.
While the above is very true, the reasons for private school successes go beyond that mentioned. For me, the major factor in private school success is the fact that parents who care enough to spend the extra $$ to send their child to a private school are the same kinds of parents who are actively involved in their child's education from day one of that child's life. They have books in the home, start reading to their child early and often, encourage their child to read, help develop a desire to learn, follow up on student homework or school projects, and keep in close contact with the school, admin, teacher(s), and parent organization.
Charter schools that are successful seek to enroll students with parents like those described above. When I was changing teaching jobs in 2005, I interviewed at a relatively new charter school in NW Phoenix. It had been, as the Ass't Principal described, a "bonehead" charter. It took the cast-offs, drop-outs, and suspended/expelled students from 'regular' public schools - and had ALL kinds of headaches. After two years, they changed their business model. They upgraded their curriculum, sought better teachers, required Unit/Lesson Plans in support of state standards, and... importantly... backed up those good teachers. They required parents to sign an agreement stating they would devote a set number of hours volunteering at the school and required the parents to have a phone number at which they could be reached during the school day. They had no trouble attracting students whose parents wanted the advantages of a private school, without the extra cost.
Parental involvement is crucial, although I have seen very many students rise above home situations that would make you cringe. They usually found some kind of adult mentor/role model elsehwere - school, church, or kin. Someone in the family - parent or child - has to have the "Wanna"!
QPs Pete and ZonieDiver,
Thanks for the information, makes sense, but as you have stated, I could see why many fail. MOO: With regards to private schools, at least in my experience(that is going to them, and now sending my child to one), they have the union power problem in reverse: it's the small but vocal and wealthy segment of parents who push their agenda, with the rest of the parents and the educators unable to get a word in edgewise.
My .02
Badger52
05-24-2012, 14:02
QPs Pete and ZonieDiver,
Thanks for the information, makes sense, but as you have stated, I could see why many fail. MOO: With regards to private schools, at least in my experience(that is going to them, and now sending my child to one), they have the union power problem in reverse: it's the small but vocal and wealthy segment of parents who push their agenda, with the rest of the parents and the educators unable to get a word in edgewise.
My .02#1 kids have seen this to a very slight extent, but are hard-headed enough to fight through it. The gk's didn't miss a beat whether in priv school or - for a time while some jobs got sorted out - being home-schooled. From there I think ZonieDiver's post sums it up - parental involvement in all the areas he mentioned is key; the school is just geography.
As a result I have a couple of grand-daughters that are flippin' geniuses.
I am being objective here, really. :D
GratefulCitizen
05-25-2012, 22:13
Corruption, poor outcomes, and government spending are related.
The federal government shouldn't try to fix anything in education.
The starting point for a solution: axe the dept of education and reduce federal spending on education until it reaches $0.
Where does the federal government get its money? From the states.
So instead of states spending money in the way they feel is appropriate, the feds take money from the states and give it back to them with strings attached.
Where exactly in the Constitution is the congress delegated the power to spend money on education?
Anybody here ever read "Savage Inequalities: Children in America's Schools" by Jonathan Sokol? Some might find it of interest...
There are valid reasons why the DofEd came into being and why, IMO, it needs to exist in spite of it's numerous flaws.
As far as things like parental involvement go, that sword also has two edges and over-involvement by so-called "helicopter parents" (those with money, connections, influence, used to having their way, hyperbolically driven, etc) is as BIG a problem among schools as is the lack of involvement by parents in many areas. I've experienced both sides of that one, and both can be equally as detrimental to the educational process no matter where their child attends school.
As far as lack of involvement is concerned, a point to consider and seldom brought into play is the ability of parents to act as educational role models for their children...or their lack of ability in many cases. For example, when I was teaching in a large urban district rife with poverty, gang influence, single parent families trying to make a living and raise children, large numbers of substandard teachers and administrators, etc, we ran evening and weekend schools for parents or grandparents who were unable to do the work we were demanding of their 6th grade children/grandchildren. As for the students, they'd look around at an environment they only ventured beyond in the virtual world and saw little reason for believing what we were trying to give them - the opportunity to achieve a better life for themselves and their futures.
It's complicated - and I have no simple or singular solution(s) to it beyond a belief that we must ensure the 'opportunity' for Americans to take part in educating themselves will exist in spite of our seeming tendency to resort to hyperbole and snake oil cure-all solutions to a dynamically changing and enormously complicated matter.
Richard :munchin