Why go SF?

[odoylerules]

A lot of guys my age come through this site and SOCNET, interested in going SF. And I always think to myself "well, why do these guys want to be on an ODA?" Almost invariably, their reasoning seems to be very poor (movie inspired, cool sounding title, beret, tab, want to be Rambo, etc). As a result of this, I started to ask myself "why does SF interest you?"

I thought back as far as possible, and realized it was because of a math teacher I had, who'd been a 5th Grouper. Mind you, I was locked on to going to the 82d at this point in time. I spoke with him a lot about the Deuce, but he always seemed to have something "neato" to say about Group. So if not for him, I'd never have even looked into it. Which isn't to say if he'd been a Marine/SEAL/whatever that I'd be looking there, but he was the beginning of my research into SF.

I read a lot, studied a lot and liked what I saw a lot. Not wearing a beret & long tab, having unshined boots and long hair. Not even kicking down doors and doing HSLD Direct Action missions. What I really liked was empitomized by a couple of lines from the History Channel's "Complete History of the Green Berets."
1) "An SF soldier was not recruited for physical prowess. It's not about how many pushups you can do (although that's important), the SF community is comprised of some of the most intelligent individuals I know...that's what influences the cultures where we work."
2) "SF isn't about commando crap (though we can do it), it's about helping people...building schools, churches, teaching how to cultivate the land."

Then I came to SOCNET, and found a lot of guys my age were interested in the same road as I. However, by and large they seemed to want to be "hard" or "HSLD" or whatever you call it. I'm not saying they all were, I can think of a bunch who are great guys with the best of intentions, but in proportion, there seemed to be a lot more assclowns.

And that's where I got this question: why should an individual want to be SF? Why did you? What's a good reason.

As for research I put into this question, I PMed NDD first. He advised me to post here, so I guess you could say this question is approved by the People's Medic.

Thanks,
Doyle

[QRQ 30]

IIRC the desire to be a "heeero" was a prime motive for me. It was only in Training Group that more realistic reasons were drummed into me. "If you want to be a hero, you don't belong here." "We're teachers and diplomats not fighters" etc.

There is nothing wrong with hero worship. It is a prime source of recruits. Once we bag them we can refine and define them. If we were to rely upon the "real", lofty philosophical motives for recruiting we would quickly become extinct.

[NousDefionsDoc]

For me, I kind of always wanted to do it since I was a kid and saw the movie, then read the book. But I really knew while I was in the 82nd. While there, I traveled to a few places and always saw the same exact thing, the rucksack of the guy in front of me. I never knew where we were or what we were supposed to be doing.

The other thing was the confidence I saw from the guys that were SF troops. You never saw anything flashy, they were never in a hurry, they always seemed to be ahead of the game. Always quiet and confident. Like it is their world and everybody else doesn't understand the rules, much less how to win.

After I was there a while, I couldn't imagine serving anywhere else. The Brotherhood was truly incredible. I didn't think about it much at the time, but the things your teammates will do for you or you will do for them without being asked or without even thinking about it you don't see everyday.

[Doc]

Why go SF?

An interesting and very basic question.

My answer would be that it allowed me to be around the best people on the face of the earth. Guys that I still love and respect.

I loved the mental and physical part. I especially liked the humor. Nothing like hearing a classic quote after a memorable event.

You don't leave SF when you retire. You simply apply what you learned and use it wherever you go. I still try to keep up the standard. I PT early in the morning and I give a full days work. On top of that I constantly look for new ways to improve.

If I was 17 years old, I would get parental consent and go 18X Monday morning.

Young people are looking for a way to set them apart from the crowd and do something tough. You'll get both with these people.

Hope that answers your question.

Doc

[QRQ 30]

I think I can make my first even more simple. It was a desire to be the best and among the best. The rest came with increased maturity. In the beginning my chest wasn't big enough for my jump wings and my head wasn't big enough for my beret. But they grew with time. :lifter

[alphamale]

There is nothing wrong with hero worship.Was really glad to see someone say that in this topic. It seems like people feel it's better to minimize this aspect as a motivator. Maybe because any good thing taken to an extreme easily becomes a bad thing.

But most people need heroes and really excellent role models to look up to and pattern behavior after. I certainly do. If you don't have that and need it, then you are just adrift. And who doesn't need it or at least can be better off for it?

Since precious few have the mental + physical ability, all in 1 package, to become heroes in the combat or military sense that we are discussing here, I think there should be no shame in that as a motivator to those who have it. Especially when the result is the security and freedoms of our country.

FrontSight

[brownapple]

I'd read the book, seen the movie...

But in the end, it all came down to three words for me, the motto:

De Oppresso Liber - To Free the Oppressed.

I believed in that. Still do. It's worth doing.

[Desert Fox]

I want to be SF because regular units are boring.

[brownapple]

I want to be SF because regular units are boring.

Then you need to take a handle in making duty in your regular unit not boring.

[Razor]

Desert Fox, what is it about your conventional unit that is boring?

[Ambush Master]

Let's see, 1969, busted out of West Point, had a Flag on my file at the Draft Board that read "NEXT" !!! Knew enough about the system and the Army to know that I did not want to go to RVN as a mere grunt. Enlisted for Airborne SF, never regretted it since. As I have said before, Even moreso than the Marine's "Once a Marine ALWAYS a Marine" SF is not merely an accomplisment and a green hat, it is a MINDSET, ATTITUDE, PHILOSOPHY, WAY OF LIFE kind of thing that represents and embodies "de Opresso Liber" for the rest of your life.


Later
Martin

[Desert Fox]

Why it is boring?

Not enough PT, not enough war spirit, not enough courses and learning, no real-world mission, not enough shooting, not enough realistic training, garrison routine, too much people thinking about sex, weekends, alcohol, too much people thinking about how to gain personal advantages from the army, instead of the opposite, not enough challenges.

What to do to improve my life in my unit?

Apply for SF. Extra PT after work. Bringing books and read it whenever I have time. Bringing pieces of rope to practice my knots. Do Kung-fu and do body renforcement whenever time is available (stay in position for a long time). Making mad my superiors by asking more PT. Bypassing chain of command by asking more PT. Send memorandums asking for more courses. Learn a foreign language (just few words). Ask questions to people who know, and let them talk (people love to talk). Hide cards and TV remote of the break area (no im just kidding).

"Then you need to take a handle in making duty in your regular unit not boring."
It seems i heard that from many officers. :cool:

[The Reaper]

DF:

One minor note, you do not have SF any more than we have SAS.

You may have SOF.

TR

[Desert Fox]

DF:

One minor note, you do not have SF any more than we have SAS.

You may have SOF.

TR


I exactly though about the same thing at this moment. Yes that's true, I just have the bad habit to write SF instead of SOF. Mea Culpa.

[brownapple]

Why it is boring?

Not enough PT, not enough war spirit, not enough courses and learning, no real-world mission, not enough shooting, not enough realistic training, garrison routine, too much people thinking about sex, weekends, alcohol, too much people thinking about how to gain personal advantages from the army, instead of the opposite, not enough challenges.

What to do to improve my life in my unit?

Apply for SF. Extra PT after work. Bringing books and read it whenever I have time. Bringing pieces of rope to practice my knots. Do Kung-fu and do body renforcement whenever time is available (stay in position for a long time). Making mad my superiors by asking more PT. Bypassing chain of command by asking more PT. Send memorandums asking for more courses. Learn a foreign language (just few words). Ask questions to people who know, and let them talk (people love to talk). Hide cards and TV remote of the break area (no im just kidding).

"Then you need to take a handle in making duty in your regular unit not boring."
It seems i heard that from many officers. :cool:

Why doin't you learn something and then offer to give the training?

[magician]

this is actually a hard question.

in my case, I wanted to go SF out of the gate, but my recruiter lied to me and told me that SF was not available as an option to recruits off the street. At this time, it WAS an option. He told me that I needed to go to a Ranger Battalion first, and this I did, and I am glad that my life turned out this way.

after four years in Battalion, I extended to go to the Q-Course, and for assignment to 1SFGA. It was a real relief. I loved it so much that I reenlisted, after six years of duty, and three years of extensions to my original three year enlistment. Do not get me wrong: I loved the Ranger Battalion. But I was slowing down....and I was ready to take the next step in my professional development as a professional soldier. On an ODA, I had time and opportunity to take better care of myself physically, I was never in better physical condition than when I was on an ODA, and I had time and access to resources that enabled me to hone myself as a soldier.

the people....yes, the people are special. But for me, the opportunity to make real investments in my own precision as a soldier was the real attraction. In those days, SF were specialists in the arts of interdiction. I was all over that. I was also attracted to the regional orientation, and the opportunity to get into the meat and potatoes of foreign cultures, as I had always been a relatively cerebral individual. SF in those days was a place for some seriously smart motherfuckers, and I met guys who were true polyglots (George Bell, for example), who could have been "successful" anywhere, doing anything that they chose.

it is a brotherhood, a tribe, and in those days, there was no other place to learn at the feet of survivors of MACVSOG. For a professional soldier, there was no other place to be than in SF, at that time, in my opinion. SF was also a gateway to bigger and better things. Your reputation in SF is everything. If you are not known personally to someone, they know someone who knows you, and if you are a shitbird, word gets around. Likewise, if you are a professional, word gets around, and opportunities come your way.

bottom-line: for whatever reason, I found myself on the path of professional soldiering. If you choose this path, and elect to prepare yourself for combat as a soldier in the service of a country, there is no better place to do so. I would rather fight with a handful of sneaky petes in my hip pocket than as a member of a conventional unit, anyday. It reminds me of the old adage about firepower. Firepower is not carpet-bombing a target. Firepower is placing one single bullet in the brainpan of your nemesis. "One shot, one kill," refers to much more than sniping. It refers to an entire way of warfare, one that is much kinder and gentler on contested societies, far cheaper, far more efficient than the destruction and waste sowed by conventional military formations.

people with an "individual" bent can flourish in SF, where they would feel thwarted and confined by the strictures of the regular Army. For me, growing up in the Ranger Battalion provided me with a foundation of experience that I could not have received anywhere else. And it taught me respect for authority, which was something that I really needed to learn. SF for me was a "finishing school," and while I am now old, fat, and much slower than I used to be, I am still a conniving, dastardly son of a bitch, treacherous to my enemies, extremely deceptive, appearing to be just another old, fat guy walking the streets of a foreign capital. My primary weapon is my brain, and I can pick up the phone or jump on the internet and put into motion plots that would boggle your mind.

it is one thing to be able to pull a trigger. But when you find a guy who can do a clandestine block face survey, then do a target analysis and isolate the single missing screw that will bring an entire system down, and then "arrange" for that screw to mysteriously fall...then you have the ultimate force multiplier. When you take this same guy and teach him how to craft campaign plans incorporating the gamut of force options...then you have a lone guy who can go someplace very quietly, and leave havoc in his wake.

I love my SF brothers. While loyalty, reliability and trustworthiness are our watchwords, we have the mentality of bank robbers. Do we ever misuse our skills? I do not. Nor do I associate with others who do. We have had our "ten percenters." I get the feeling that there are fewer of them than ever before, and this is a good thing. But my brothers are worldwide, they are many of them embedded in careers doing "good works," in accord with our values and code of honor, and it is a delight to work with them, others might say "conspire" with them, in furthering our mutual goals.

SF is not for everybody. The pipeline is long and hard. It culls out those who do not belong.

But it also forms you, and you learn dexterity as you learn to survive.

The first question you have to ask yourself is, do you have the balls to try?

[Max_Tab]

Like a bunch of people on here, I joined because it is what I always wanted to do, hell it's the only thing I ever wanted to do. But as I've been in longer and longer, my motivation has changed a little. It's still the only thing I've ever wanted to do, but now it is more of a calling than a search for adventure. I truly believe in our motto, and all that, that entails.
My wife asked me recently after two of my friends were killed why I have to do this job, and I told her "if not me than who". I know that sounds silly and corny, but it is something that I am proud of, and hope some day when my kids grow up they will be proud also.

[NousDefionsDoc]

Why doin't you learn something and then offer to give the training?
Now there's a novel concept! And how is there "not enough PT"? Do it on your own.

[Desert Fox]

Why don't you learn something and then offer to give the training?

I can't because:
1-I'm not "qualified" on it. If not qualified on something, "I can't do it", and for sure not teach it! Self education or knowlegde doesnt count as a qualification.
2-I'm not an officer, but a junior NCM. That means I have no power on any schedule, even on my own, most of the time.

But of course I'm always avaiblable to share knowledge with persons who are interested.

Now there's a novel concept! And how is there "not enough PT"? Do it on your own.

I can't do PT during work time, except for unit PT, and the rest of the time they dont let individuals go. The solution: do extra PT after work. And this is exactly what I do.

LOL I dont want to start complaining about my unit. This is a good unit, I just want more. "What's next!"

[NousDefionsDoc]

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[brownapple]

I can't because

Young man, you have already illustrated to me that if you were in the US Military, I would expect you to not pass selection for Special Forces. You have been given some guidance here that could help you. It went right over your head. You are not ready to even think about SOF.

[Desert Fox]

Young man, you have already illustrated to me that if you were in the US Military, I would expect you to not pass selection for Special Forces. You have been given some guidance here that could help you. It went right over your head. You are not ready to even think about SOF.

LOL,
Sir,
I was just kidding with my "officers" things. I wasnt really serious about it... ;)
I was obviously talking about official "qualifications". Of course I can share a lot of informations with others, and thats what I do. In the field, per example, I often like to challenge peoples by asking simple questions...like....what if there is an observer on that hill? What is the best direction to take in case of an ambush from that direction? What if, what if ...
The thing is, I just don't have the RIGHT to teach official material. Even if I'm qualified on something (i.e. a weapon), to teach it I still need to be qualified "instructor" on it. Of course, nothing stops me from just signing-in a weapon, put it on the ground, and with partners, challenge each others with fire orders.

Maybe it seemed I was thinking in a "dead-end" way. Forgive me if it is what you understood.

[brownapple]

Professionals do what needs to be done, say what they mean, maintain situational awareness at all times and find solutions. So far, I'm hearing excuses.

[Desert Fox]

Professionals do what needs to be done, say what they mean, maintain situational awareness at all times and find solutions. So far, I'm hearing excuses.`

Mea Culpa,
I should be more serious, you are right sir. That's something I'm working on actually. Forgive me. I'm a nice person though :) . We take a beer?

"say what they mean"....and...mean just what they say.

I remarked that all SOF operators seem to be very very serious. I am too, but sometime...well...I need to kick myself in the ass with both legs at the same time. It just takes me a lot of personal discipline, especially when I am in a good mood LOL. A person who is not showing seriousness don't gives a professional image. But personaly, I like crazy persons. But that is just a personal taste.

By the way, change the "I can't because", by "It is difficult because".

Damn, now all my fooking schedule is screwed, because it takes me a lot of time to answer messages. Papa Tango, end of station, OUT.

[Big Chief]

Hello All,

I liked a majority of posts so far on this topic. Desert Fox, I understand your discontent for line units. Some units have better soldiers than others. The questions I have for you are: Why do you feel the need to beg your unit for more PT, better training, etc.? Does rank make you a leader or is it a quality you have inside?

I am not SF-qual and am hoping to go to Selection in FY05, but that does not mean I do not know a thing or two about warriorhood. As a warrior, a man is responsible for his own training - physical, mental, tactical, spiritual, what have you. You do PT on your own? Great! You tie knots when you have a free moment? Cool! You read books? Groovy! But is that really "Special?"

To me, being SF means realizing my potential as a warrior. A warrior is the utmost public servant. His life is for the good of the people (and team). Many of my elders showed me that its not what a man does in combat that makes him a warrior - its what he does out of combat. SF's mission is teacher/ambassador/leader first and combatant second, right? A warrior is always the first to pick up a shovel in the morning and the last to put it down at night. He is the first to offer his hand in friendship and the last to pick up the lance and go to war.

One man can do so much to improve the efficiency and effectiveness of a line company. The question is: Are you that man?

I love line companies, but being on an ODA means I can be a force multiplier in the grand scheme of things. By being truly awesome at my job (hopefully 18D), and giving everything I got to my team, I can potentially save the lives of thousands of my line buddies. It means I can hopefully create peace instead of make war.

Kung Fu translates to "Hard work over an extended period of time." Being a warrior is Kung Fu. There is no end to the hard work - ever. But, for me, that's ok. The alternative is someone else has to do it - my best friend? my mom? my gramma?

Warriors face the enemy not out of hate, but because they love their people, their way of life, and their land. When a warrior falls in battle, the people are next. That is why I do PT, not to pass some silly test or some Hoowah course. PT means the survival of my team, my family, my tribe, my Earth.

Crazy Horse's last words were "Tell the people they can rely on me no longer." Even in death, his last thoughts were about the wellfare of others and not himself.

That's why I want to go SF.... that and all the hot chicks! ;)

[Jack Moroney (RIP)]

.

And that's where I got this question: why should an individual want to be SF? Why did you? What's a good reason.


Doyle

For me it was a matter of disenchantment with conventional units. When I came in to the military (1965) there was a definite separation between officers and enlisted men and officers where judged more by their ability to look good than to do good. I entered the army to be a soldier but soon found out that my expectations of soldiering were incompatible with what those above me expected a young officer to do. I was counselled often because I chose to lead from the front not push from the rear, because I spent too much time making sure that we actually could perform the tasks expected of us, and had the audacity to have the troops teach me those soldier skills I was severly lacking because they were not "officer tasks". I was foolish enough to actually think that I should never ask a soldier to do something that I could not do our would not do myself if the need arose. I was equally foolish to think that if the troops had to freeze their butts off I had no business sitting in some tent around a stove drinking coffee and God forbid I should take some of that coffee out to the guys on site. While I knew that I was locked into being an officer I just thought the priorities in conventional units were ass backwards. I just had to be a soldier first and an officer second and that outlook was not compatible with the conventional units in the 60s. SF provided that for me and for me it was not only the right choice but the only choice. Had I not been able to enter SF after my first assignment I would have certainly left the military.

Jack Moroney

[Desert Fox]

Does rank make you a leader or is it a quality you have inside?



The answer is obviously INSIDE.


Napoleon said something like:
"Les hommes sont comme des chiffres, ils prennent de la valeur par leur position."

"humans are like numbers, they gain value with their position."

[NousDefionsDoc]

Napoleon was an ass. He was more lucky than he was good. Quote winners.

[Desert Fox]

I just had to be a soldier first and an officer second...




That was a nice one!

[Desert Fox]

Napoleon was an ass. He was more lucky than he was good. Quote winners.

LOL,

I disagree on that point but I think I'm starting to be off-topic.

Frederick II said: "Un général ne doit pas seulement être bon, encore doit-il être chanceux."

"A general not only has to be good, he also has to be lucky".

:lifter

[NousDefionsDoc]

In that dark period, it is said, Frederick was on the verge of suicide. However, the accession (1762) of his admirer, Peter III of Russia, took Russia out of the war and opened Frederick’s way to victory.

Another lucky ass.

[Big Chief]

[QUOTE=Desert Fox]

"Un général ne doit pas seulement être bon, encore doit-il être chanceux."



:confused:

"You don't need big words (or foriegn languages) to speak the truth" -Chief Seatle


What's your point?


(Wile E.) Coyotius Hungrius

[Desert Fox]

In that dark period, it is said, Frederick was on the verge of suicide. However, the accession (1762) of his admirer, Peter III of Russia, took Russia out of the war and opened Frederick’s way to victory.

Another lucky ass.

HAHAHA!!! LOL LOL

Yes you are right on that point.

BUT :p

"La Prusse était à l'époque une nation d'importance moyenne, mais qui en raison de son professionnalisme et de son système de conscription unique, a pu tenir tête à une coalition réunissant les principales puissances de l'époque."

"In those times Prussia was a middle-class nation, but because of her professionalism and her unique conscription system, was able to hold against a coalition composed of the major powers of that time."

LOL

[Desert Fox]

[QUOTE=Desert Fox]

"Un général ne doit pas seulement être bon, encore doit-il être chanceux."



:confused:

"You don't need big words (or foriegn languages) to speak the truth" -Chief Seatle


What's your point?


(Wile E.) Coyotius Hungrius




That's a game. :cool:
Seriously, the French versions are just as references.

[LEStudent]

If I may interject something here, I'd like to:

I'm 27 years old, married, and have been considering going NG SF for some time. What I'd like to say is that, if someone is 18 years old and considering the military, don't be a dumbass (like me) and decide not to go. My wife will tell you - I kick myself every day for being a dumbass at 18 and not joining the Army. When I got a little older and had the opportunity to be around guys that were former SF, I realized, "Damn, that's what I was missing out on. That's what I've been looking for my whole life." Some of the very ideas expressed in this thread - the brotherhood, the comraderie, "To Free the Oppressed" - these are all ideas I concepts I've looked for my whole life. Don't wake up one day staring at 30, and realize that you blew it when you were young. I've never been in the Army, never been SF, but, God as my witness, if I could go back, I'd take life by the balls and join up pronto. I'm really not that old, in the grand scheme of things - 27 is still a young pup. Looking at what I've missed, though, I feel like a damned old man looking back on his life. For you young guys, don't be like this dumbass.

[The Reaper]

If I may interject something here, I'd like to:

I'm 27 years old, married, and have been considering going NG SF for some time. What I'd like to say is that, if someone is 18 years old and considering the military, don't be a dumbass (like me) and decide not to go. My wife will tell you - I kick myself every day for being a dumbass at 18 and not joining the Army. When I got a little older and had the opportunity to be around guys that were former SF, I realized, "Damn, that's what I was missing out on. That's what I've been looking for my whole life." Some of the very ideas expressed in this thread - the brotherhood, the comraderie, "To Free the Oppressed" - these are all ideas I concepts I've looked for my whole life. Don't wake up one day staring at 30, and realize that you blew it when you were young. I've never been in the Army, never been SF, but, God as my witness, if I could go back, I'd take life by the balls and join up pronto. I'm really not that old, in the grand scheme of things - 27 is still a young pup. Looking at what I've missed, though, I feel like a damned old man looking back on his life. For you young guys, don't be like this dumbass.

Crip is over 30 years old.

We have had Guard soldiers at SFAS over 40.

Your mind sets the limit.

TR

[LEStudent]

Really? I didn't know you could get in over 30. I shall have to read your information posts at SOCNET more carefully. I'll go ahead and knock them out now for being unprepared.

[Razor]

When I got to my team, I was the second youngest guy at 28 years old.

[Surgicalcric]

Really? I didn't know you could get in over 30. I shall have to read your information posts at SOCNET more carefully. I'll go ahead and knock them out now for being unprepared.

LEStudent:

As TR stated earlier, I am over 30 now, 32 to be exact and am the third oldest in my PH 1-A class(thats SOPC for you NDD). There are quite a few older guys going thru the pipeline right now so dont let your age alone stop you, it sure is not going to stop me. I am in my prime...or atleast thats what they are telling me here...

Crip

[Desert Fox]

In the JTF-2, canadian SOFs, the average age is 28.

With me that's an "issue" because I am only 23. I heard many rumors saying they tend to refuse young guys.
I know they want mature people. I asked about the age issue to someone who is in a good place to know. The reply I received was...."The average age in the army is even higher, and you are in".
Damn right!

Hey, I have another quote for the situation: :D
"Today is the first day of the rest of your life."

[Guy]

I did it for the challenge! Seen the movie with John Wayne, never knew it was career field.

Found out later it was an occupation and volunteered.

[Big Chief]

I just turned 35 and am planning to go to Selection this summer. :lifter AND go into a guard unit. :rolleyes: I know. I know. I got the lecture from some of my SF buddies....


Stew Smith, trainer to the stars, is my age and says he still goes down to BUDs and smokes the younger guys. The older you get, the longer it takes to recover - ice, rest, and a six pack of liquid asprin. Age means as much as shoe size.

The only thing keeping you from SF is you.

Reaper said it best "Your mind sets the limit."


PS - I am not just planning on going to Selection, I am training to kick it in the ass! :lifter

[Team Sergeant]

Why go SF?

I’m betting you’re reading this and preparing yourself for some deep and meaningful insight as to why I chose to “go SF”. This may alarm some (non SF’ers) but the reason I chose SF was as simple, they didn’t wear helmets in the field.
Having been in the 82nd ABN Div (infantry) for three years left me with a love hate relationship with helmets. In my opinion they’re only good for jumping as they impaired my hearing and sight, both of which I relied heavily on during missions.

Now why I stayed in SF is another story and much of the reason for this website. Special Forces is a unit and a group of men unlike any other I’ve ever seen in training or on the battlefield. It was a pleasure to have served with such honorable men.

Team Sergeant

[Viking]

I grew up in BDUs. Strange childhood, but I was exposed to SF guys at an early age. I knew it's what I wanted to do when I was old enough to join the military. The way of life and comradarie cannot be compared to anything else. I served in the Infantry for ten years before going to SFAS. I even ETSd one time. My wife and I both knew it was a big mistake and one I would regret. I set my mind to it, came back in and less than a year later made it through selection. LEStudent, don't worry about the age. You can do it. Set your mind to it, tighten your bootlaces and come on. You'll enjoy it.

[NousDefionsDoc]

AND go into a guard unit. :rolleyes: I know. I know. I got the lecture from some of my SF buddies....



I don't get this.

[NousDefionsDoc]

Why go SF?

I’m betting you’re reading this and preparing yourself for some deep and meaningful insight as to why I chose to “go SF”. This may alarm some (non SF’ers) but the reason I chose SF was as simple, they didn’t wear helmets in the field.
Having been in the 82nd ABN Div (infantry) for three years left me with a love hate relationship with helmets. In my opinion they’re only good for jumping as they impaired my hearing and sight, both of which I relied heavily on during missions.

Now why I stayed in SF is another story and much of the reason for this website. Special Forces is a unit and a group of men unlike any other I’ve ever seen in training or on the battlefield. It was a pleasure to have served with such honorable men.

Team Sergeant


Actually, I have heard that a lot more than once. It is also on my list, I just don't talk about it much. :o

[Big Chief]

NDD: They chew on me because they think I should go active. :lifter

[magician]

I freakin' HATE helmets.

In fact, I hate body armor.

I know, I know.

Old school.

Passe (how the f*** do you coax accents out of a windoze machine? Anyone?)

Obsolete.

I just feel like I cannot move with that stuff on.

And I still believe that that stuff has no place in the bush. In urban settings, fine. In vehicles, hell, yes.

In the bad bush? No way.

[NousDefionsDoc]

NDD: They chew on me because they think I should go active. :lifter
Ah so. Well, you could always explain to them your personal reasons for choosing the NG. Since you can go active later, its actually a pretty smart choice as well IMO.

Or, you could take my approach:
Do about 30 seconds of research, print the list of KIAs, WIAs, decorations and AARs of the NG Groups in the GWOT. It is fairly extensive, so you will need several sheets - good. Now roll it up and start poking eyes out.

Caveat - I wouldn't take my approach with SF guys if you are not.

You can also point out that since they don't think much of the NG Groups, not to whine next time they don't get to rotate home because there's not going to be anybody to relieve them.

[NousDefionsDoc]

Magico,
OPen word, write your post in there, you can either change the language to Spanish and let the spell check do the work for you, or go to insert, symbol, find the appropriate letter with accent and insert it. You might be able to use Ispell in Spanish, but I haven't tried that one yet.

Signed,
Gringo who has to write some in Spanish but too cheap to buy another keyboard.

[Kyobanim]

If you want to type in spanish and use Word, all you have to do is install the language packs that came on the CD or go to microsoft.com and download them. Then use Word to write your stuff and copy and paste.

Nevermind. I think someone already said that.

[LEStudent]

I grew up in BDUs. Strange childhood, but I was exposed to SF guys at an early age. I knew it's what I wanted to do when I was old enough to join the military. The way of life and comradarie cannot be compared to anything else. I served in the Infantry for ten years before going to SFAS. I even ETSd one time. My wife and I both knew it was a big mistake and one I would regret. I set my mind to it, came back in and less than a year later made it through selection. LEStudent, don't worry about the age. You can do it. Set your mind to it, tighten your bootlaces and come on. You'll enjoy it.

Thank you for your encouragement. My wife has given me the green light to talk to an SF recruiter and see what happens from there, should I choose to do so. My focus ATM is debating on whether or not I'm fit enough to try out. I have shin splints, and my damned right big toe always feels like it needs to pop. It hurts like hell when I run, even short distances. I'm not overly worried about the pain, but it would be unfair to make the teams, only to find out that I can't pull my weight because of a problem I overlooked.

<back to lurk mode>

[Surgicalcric]

Thank you for your encouragement. My wife has given me the green light to talk to an SF recruiter and see what happens from there, should I choose to do so. My focus ATM is debating on whether or not I'm fit enough to try out. I have shin splints, and my damned right big toe always feels like it needs to pop. It hurts like hell when I run, even short distances. I'm not overly worried about the pain, but it would be unfair to make the teams, only to find out that I can't pull my weight because of a problem I overlooked.

<back to lurk mode>


LEStudent:

Pardon my candor, and please excuse me if I am wrong, but it seems as though you are looking for someone to justify your reasoning for moving forward or not with your enlistment and possible career in SF. If you want it, move forward with it. I am 32 and there is not a day that passes that I do not wake with something hurting. It is a difference in what you want and what you are willing to live with.

There is going to be no one here to hold your hand and give you words of encouragement if you begin doubting yourself. SF soldiers are men who are self motivated and reliant, they do not need to be encouraged to complete the mission.

Just my .02 and well worth what you paid for it.

Crip

[NousDefionsDoc]

I am 32 and there is not a day that passes that I do not wake with something hurting.

LOL - you've been on jump status what? A week? You don't know what pain is yet.

You better be doing one-armed chins off the fookin' door frame while you're typing this shit with your other hand.

LEStudent - Crip is right, you're whining. Now shutup and go do PT.

[LEStudent]

LEStudent:

Pardon my candor, and please excuse me if I am wrong, but it seems as though you are looking for someone to justify your reasoning for moving forward or not with your enlistment and possible career in SF. If you want it, move forward with it. I am 32 and there is not a day that passes that I do not wake with something hurting. It is a difference in what you want and what you are willing to live with.

There is going to be no one here to hold your hand and give you words of encouragement if you begin doubting yourself. SF soldiers are men who are self motivated and reliant, they do not need to be encouraged to complete the mission.

Just my .02 and well worth what you paid for it.

Crip

I appreciate your candor. I understand what you're saying 100%. I'm not looking for any justification either way; I was just sort of thinking out loud, as it were.


LEStudent - Crip is right, you're whining. Now shutup and go do PT.


Roger that sir.

[Surgicalcric]

LOL - you've been on jump status what? A week? You don't know what pain is yet.
I am actually not on 'status' anymore. From my understanding SFQC students will not be placed back onto 'status' until Phase-II (thats SUT for you NDD).

You better be doing one-armed chins off the fookin' door frame while you're typing this shit with your other hand. You might be suprised... lol

[NousDefionsDoc]

LEStudent - you call me sir again and you'll have a new user name and title before you can post an apology.

Crip - Nothing about you surprises me anymore.

[Surgicalcric]

LEStudent - you call me sir again and you'll have a new user name and title before you can post an apology.

oooohh...ohhh One more time LEStudent...one more time. NDD needs a new play toy. lol

Crip - Nothing about you surprises me anymore.

Is that so Sarn't? And why would that be?

Crip

[LEStudent]

LEStudent - you call me sir again and you'll have a new user name and title before you can post an apology.

Crip - Nothing about you surprises me anymore.

Noted.

[Jo Sul]

I was once a proud NCO, then I screwed up bad enough and they busted me down to Lieutenant. Now I am a Captain and with one more bad mistake I might get knocked down to Major . . .

Q: What is an oak-leaf cluster?
A: An operation planned by a Major.

[C/S PHOENIX 10]

well, first of all I'm third gen airborne and second gen SF, but that just started the ball rolling. Everyone will have their own reason for joining or not, that's the bottom line. We, as the ones on the inside attempt to size each person that show an interest in the club. I have done this many times myself; that guy is to dumb, he's to into himself, dude could not get lai&*^ in a ore house on payday. The one thing I have learned over the years, that the one common link that all of the great ones have, is that they give a crap, truely care about the men and the mission. Those are the ones that make a great team guy. Now over the years I have met a many of guys that came into the the club and didn't have the right mind set, but grew into the role and are some of the best senior guys and some are leading men in combat as we speak. Another thing I keep hearing people bitching about, is the "Q" stanards are dropping and the quility of of the guys are dropping with it. Well I have yet to see the drop from the receiving end of the "Q". The men that have come out of the course to the team are just as good if not better than what was porduced 14 years ago.


Now back to the real question. SF is a jack of all trade and must master most of them too, the day of say master of none is long gone and will get you killed. I read most of the posts, with some outstanding replies. On the other hand some post I don't agree with, but I do not rate very high in the world so do not lose any sleep over any comments I may have. We are a force mulitplier, not some CA unit, that recruits, trains, assist, advises and leads combat operation in times of war. Those same skill many be employed to prevent war in the form of FID, or may have to conduct unilaterial DA/SR operations. Then you have the "cover letter" of UW that puts all of the above under one blanket. In three tours my team has done at least 5 or 6 full blown unilaterial blowing doors raids, searched well over 400 compounds in a softer manner, 7 special recon mission, called in 15 or so air strikes most without a J-TAC, close to 30 artillery fire missions, led a 500 man host nation "gang" of soldiers across forty km of mountain dismounted receiving airdrops resupplies every two days with only five SF guys, as the only Americans, hunting down pockets AQ/TB in south/central Afghqanistan, issued two ambushes, been ambushed twice, held village meetings, briefed US Generals, state department personnel, PSD duty for both US and Host nation officals, served as QRF for an entire AO, ettended meetings with Paki officials and the list goes on and on. Now this is just normal work for SF in Afghanistan. That's just in resent years, what about in the days prior to the war. Well I've(the detachment as a whole) eaten dinner with two foreign counrties president's, countless ambassador, both US and foreign, and in the same breath planned a teams night out that resulted in rocking the cash bar to the point of passing out in some club of ill rebuked in god only know what country.

Now do you have what it takes

[Achilles]

Thanks for posting that, Phoenix 10. I think I'm going to print out the 2nd paragraph of that post and tack it to the wall for extra motivation.

[alphamale]

Seconding the thanks for your post C/S Phoenix10.

FrontSight

[SERPENT5XX]

I came to SF because I wanted to serve my country as my father and his father did. Ronald Reagan was president and I wanted to be part of his war against communism. I thought the best way to get in on the fight was to be in SF. I figured SF would fight not only in any full out “high intensity conflict” but also in the “low intensity” struggles.

Once I got to SF the reason I stayed was less lofty but just as important to me. It was FUN! LOTS OF FUN!! Traveling to places no one else has even heard of much less gets to go to, jumping out of planes at 24,000 ft, blowing stuff up, fire, shooting guns, fire, driving cars really fast, roaring across the desert in a gun-truck shooting, CQB and all that great high testosterone stuff. Did I say shooting and blowing things up yet?

The most important reason I stayed was because I got a chance to work with and hang out with some really top-notch guys whom I have learned an incredible amount of stuff from (mostly good!). :D

It has been a great time and I would not change it for anything! Sometimes I feel sorry for anyone who has not had the same experiences but they can only blame themselves as ultimately we each control our own destiny and no one in SF arrived there by accident.

SERPENT5XX

[lurch]

May of '69 enlisted so I could choose an MOS rather than be assigned one in the draft. Chose "Image Interpreter" (I've forgotten the MOS number). Arrived at Ft. Ord, CA for processing and Basic. One morning a very impressive looking SFC in Dress Greens with several rows of awards and decorations, CIB, Jump wings and wearing a Green Beret stood in front of the formation of recruits and called off several names (mine included) and said that our test scores were such that we would be allowed to take another series of tests to see if we were good enough to enter the training path for SFQ. I too had read the book and seen the movie and so I took the tests and scored well enough that I was offered the option of ending my enlistment contract and volunteering for parachute taining and the SFQ course. I did and I have never regretted the decision.

I take great pride in the fact that I served my country during the Vietnam war as a member of MACVSOG, CCN and later assignments on an ODA in the 5th SFG and at the USAIMA. I had the opportunity to serve with some of the finest men in the military in those days and made acquaintances that I maintain and treasure to this day.

ps A humorous note? I called home and told my parents of my decision to go into Special Foces and Mom said "that's wonderful dear, you have always had an interest in sports." She of course had confused Special Services with Special Forces. :)

[Ambush Master]

ps A humorous note? I called home and told my parents of my decision to go into Special Foces and Mom said "that's wonderful dear, you have always had an interest in sports." She of course had confused Special Services with Special Forces. :)

I called home from Benning after making my first jump and was attempting to explain to my parents where I was headed. After I told them that I had jumped out of a C-119 "Flying Boxcar" my mom asked me to say that again, I did, and I heard the phone bounce on the floor when she fainted. After she was revived, they called me back and, since I was a Water Safety Instructor, they thought the same thing (Special Services). It wasn't until I told them "Like the Book, the Song, and the Movie !!" GREEN BERET !!! that they realized what I was saying !!!! (Loud phone clunk sound once again !!) :D

[Drew5337]

I want to "go SF" for a lot of the reasons already listed, but most importantly:

The desire to be among the best. If I CAN, then I SHOULD. There is no reason for me to re-enlist unless I plan to go all the way with it.

The brotherhood of such a group holds a great deal of appeal to me.

The desire to serve my country and a greater cause.

The desire to get away from the material world, and obtain something that no amount of money could ever buy.

The desire to explore some of my own personal interests (language, weapons, military history, etc...)

The desire to put boot to ass against a foe that I have a personal vendetta against.


I don't know if some of these are the "right" reasons or not, but thats where I am starting from. I still have a ways to go before I can get there, but the desire and motivation have the fire burning.

[Achilles]

I want to "go SF" for a lot of the reasons already listed, but most importantly:

The desire to be among the best. If I CAN, then I SHOULD. There is no reason for me to re-enlist unless I plan to go all the way with it.

The brotherhood of such a group holds a great deal of appeal to me.

The desire to serve my country and a greater cause.

The desire to get away from the material world, and obtain something that no amount of money could ever buy.

The desire to explore some of my own personal interests (language, weapons, military history, etc...)

The desire to put boot to ass against a foe that I have a personal vendetta against.


I don't know if some of these are the "right" reasons or not, but thats where I am starting from. I still have a ways to go before I can get there, but the desire and motivation have the fire burning.

You have a lot in common with me and other 18X's. Are you contracted yet?

[Drew5337]

Achillles,

Not contracted yet. I had an inguinal hernia repaired this past Monday, two months from that date I will be eligable for a waiver to re enlist. I plan on shipping in about 6 months, that will give me plenty of time to recover and re condition and train. I would go tomorrow if I could.

[Croaker]

(edited for cultural sensitivity....honest )
Sorry about resurrecting an old thread here, but I thought that I may have something constructive to contribute to a topic that will never grow old because there will always be people looking for why go SF. I've been a longtime lurker over on SOCNET and just recently found this site after reading some of the back posts there.


I am personally not in SF yet. I will be sitting down with a NG SF recruiter from the 19th ideally around the NOV/DEC 05. I'm 32 years old. Prior enlisted Navy corpsman. I originally entered the Navy back in '95 under the divefarer program for BUD/s after 4 years of wasting time in college spinning my wheels. It wasn't the difficulty of the course work (Chem Eng/Space Science dual major) although that was tough, it was knowing that that wasn't what I wanted to for the rest of my life. This may sound cliche but ever since I was a kid I always wanted to be the soldier/warrior/protector character. I always wanted to be the good guy, kicking the butts of countless bad guys..you know......to be the kind of person that if something tough came up and everybody else was backing down...I would step up and fill the gap. I realize that probably sounds like a bunch of comic book crap......but hey......what 'man' (notice not 'male'....society's got plenty of males...very few 'men') as they were growing up wanted to be the 'desk jockey' the rest of his life?

I went in to be a SEAL. Challenge was that I entered the Navy in very good shape, got OUT of shape in Navy boot camp (we didn't start PTing until week 3), didn't take the screen test until week 7 and straight up just couldn't cut it. I wasn't ready, period. Reclassed as a corpsman, went to lab school and somehow wound up in Camp Lejeune, NC with 2nd FSSG. While there I seriously got disillusioned about my life in the military and disappointed that I hadn't accomplished what I had set out to do.....still always thinking about SOF and "wishing I would have" done it. Every time I would see one of the guys walk by with that trident I would want to puke. It made me so mad! Anyways...got out in 2000 and met my wife and tried to get into the civy routine.

It hasn't worked. I have thought about it everyday...EVERYDAY. I didn't really believe there was a way to accomplish my goal at that point what with being married and owning a business.....until I found out about the NG SF program. This year my wife finally got fed up with hearing about it and we came to the mutual decision that it was time to get done what needed to get done. I should be sitting down with a recruiter from the 19th around NOV/DEC 05 and beginning the process. I had already talked to one from the 20th up in Virginia but was more interested in the 19th's AOR, even though I know they have been sending the guys from the 20th all over the place. I'd just prefer to learn a language ( I already can speak/read some Russian) other than the native language of North Carolina.....spanish. :munchin I do have enough common sense and have lurked long enough to realize that I had best be in top condition BEFORE I sit down to do the contract. I don't want to waste their time and I not getting any younger so I'd best not waste any more of mine. I've wasted enough trying to deny what I have always wanted to do for the sake of "not rockin' the boat" of life.

We only get one shot at this life (contrary to some people's opinion......) In my mind, I want to pass on with as few regrets in life as possible.....And for me, and I'm sure for many other guys lurking on this board, if I didn't finish what I started......what I have thought about everyday......at least made the attempt......I would have a tough time telling my kids to shoot for their dreams when I hade a chance to make mine happen but instead let it die. I'm tired of being a spectator of the life I have always wanted to live. I want to be a player.....and when I have gained enough wisdom......a coach. Ever looked at a sporting event and notice the number of players/coaches to the number of spectators? Only a few people will choose to be players in life. I choose to be one...

My advice to other guys lurking out there is....don't lurk forever!!! You can lurk and read so much that you get "information constipation" and become a book expert on SF....but you are still not making an impact on the game. At some point we all have to get off the couch and make it happen. I have always been a part of teams in athletics and love the feeling of being a part of not just a winning team......but the #1 team. I can't think of a better team in the military to be a part of and contribute to. And if you are looking for a test of your abilities....well.....this path should be a given. It's doesn't get much tougher. That's another reason for me.....I want to know what 'Todd' can do.

Anyways....sorry guys for such a long post.....just had to get that out there. Back to lurking and PTing and I'll post back when I've signed the deal...

God Bless
Todd

[Pete]

Q. Why go SF? A. The people you will serve with.

Q. Why stay in SF? A. The people you serve with.

Q. Why do I miss being in SF? The people I served with and the people I see serving today.

While SF is a part of the Big Green (Tan) machine it's just not the same. The "FEEL" is different. Smaller, closer, more personal. It's hard to put into words, it's something you just have to do and experience.

Pete

[Blueboy]

I must say how truly inspired I am from reading this thread. I am reminded of the prophetic words of the SWCS CDR spoken at my Q-Course graduation---"Gentlemen, you will earn your beret everyday for the rest of your lives."

To the candidates, you have a tremendous resource in the Quiet Professionals on this site. The Team Sergeant, NDD, Jack Molroney and others are truly national treasures. Learn from them. Then committ yourself utterly to the task, jump through the flaming hoops at Mackall, Bragg, and elsewhere, and get yourself onto an ODA. There is still important work to be done for our country, and the brotherhood you are aspiring to join is in the vanguard.

Stout hearts----Blueboy sends.

[BMT (RIP)]

SF is not a JOB,it's a way of LIFE!!!

BMT

[ender]

Why go SF, or in my case SOF?

First, it's the autonomy. Being in an infantry battalion, you're a very small cog. And what you do is directed by, not common sense, but by what is dictated from above. Just give me the Cdr's intent, or end-state. And let me do the job how I see fit.

Second, everyone is focused on doing the job. How often in a conventional unit as a junior nco, do you have to crack on privates to do the trivial bs? And it allways seems like the same troops are the first ones to get stuck in, with the same ones allways scamming. As a leader, I hate it. I just wish I could give the guys a task, check on the progress. And do a final check when it's done. Or even get in and help them. Sure they might do the job in the field, but it's the prep work, or low level garrison training that will make the difference.

Third, training. I want to freefall, fast-rope, call in fast-air, call in arty strikes. And fire so many live rounds, that i get calluses on my hands from my weapon.

Fourth, op-tempo. I didn't join the army to sit around battalion lines and watch the paint dry.

PT on my own is a nice thought too. Trying to do Pl PT in the mornings and stick to my own schedule in the evenings can be an annoyance.

My two cents.

[bhealy]

Dont know if you'll have seen the introductions post from me or this first, but I am Brian Healy. Grandson of a retired SF leader, Maj Gen Mike Healy.

My dream of becoming SF is to be with others like me. Why go along in life wondering if you could have, without even trying. So i will try, do my best, and if I succeed then I know my ways are set. Training has become my life.

As my grandfather Maj Gen Mike D Healy (Iron Mike of 5th) told me in many of our talks: "You can join the army, and feel proud about what you do, or you can try and do what I know you can do, and become an SF soldier. There you will be amoung your own, who will be your family, friends, and alltime best pals you could ever ask for. You'll feel safer, even in more danger. And you will never forget why you are there. I know you can do it"

He also said in private talk when I decided to go for SF, that you cannot explain why...you just know. Not in a thousand words could I begin to really explain why I want to do this. I guess the only reasons that can be put to words are the brotherhood ,desire, and yeah it'd be fun as hell. Other than that, it's just in my heart...and noone could take that from me. Thanks

[QRQ 30]

it'd be fun as hell. I like that Brian. With all of the lofty reasons put aside, it was fun and I enjoyed. Like we used to say: "To think others have to pay to do this . . . " I even got a thrill out of the challenge of running Recon. :lifter

[Griv]

Trying to explain why i want to become SF in one statement is hard. It goes from being deep within to something that just makes me laugh out loud when ever i think about the possibilities of what can be done. I know a main directive iv had through my whole life was to help people. Iv gone from wanting to be a patrolman for the local police dept, to working at a correctional institute. It wasnt until one sunny day on top of a roof, i was contributing to the rebuilding effort after hurricane Ivan hit Pensacola, FL(where i lived at the time), that i remembered my grandfather talking about SF and what he use to do that it all clicked together. I got this uplifting feeling like there was nothing better i could do with my life. From that point about eight months ago till this moment now when i am finally taking it by the horns has been a self-journey in which each day has only become more and more exciting till the point when i am on the bus to Ft Benning. As the officer at the MEPS station put it after he swore me in, "You are now part of the 3-4% of all citizens in the United States that have taken on the duty to protecting others freedoms. Serve your country well." I intend to do so, whether or not my path leads me to the Special Forces.

[Tubbs]

Hi, I'm new to forums in general but I thought that I'd post a reply becuase I liked what I read.
I am a former Marine. I am interested in becoming a Green Beret. I'm not the fastest and I'm not the strongest (you could probobly tell by my handle). However I don't believe in quitting. I want to be a part of an organization of that will challenge me and make use of my creativity and intellegence. I want to be a professional and work with others of a like mindset. I want to excell at what I do. I don' think that I can find this as a civilian. Is that a good enough reason to consider special forces?

[NousDefionsDoc]

Why would you want to become a hat?

[QRQ 30]

Why would you want to become a hat?

Tubbs: That is a hint. We aren't hats but we earned the right to wear the Green Beret.

Maybe we are twins. My name was "Whale" short for The Great White Whale. "Q**T" is a word that doesn't exist in my vocabulary -- sometimes to a fault. Look at it this way. Sometimes we have to work harder than the skinny little pencil necks and sometimes even have to pull some of their load. It's all in the attitude. :lifter

[Tubbs]

Sorry about that. I'm a jarhead so bear with me. I wasn't sure what you guys like to be called. Figured I'd start with the formal title and work from there. So if you're not all hats what do you prefer to be called?

[NousDefionsDoc]

The Team Sergeant likes to be called "GlockMeister".

[NousDefionsDoc]

Colonel Jack and The Reaper are partial to "Dude"

Ambush Master likes "Hey Man"

[lksteve]

Colonel Jack and The Reaper are partial to "Dude"

The Team Sergeant likes to be called "GlockMeister".

Ambush Master likes "Hey Man"LOL...your minds' bad... :D
second time this weekend i've had to clean my keyboard...

[QRQ 30]

Sorry about that. I'm a jarhead so bear with me. I wasn't sure what you guys like to be called. Figured I'd start with the formal title and work from there. So if you're not all hats what do you prefer to be called?

After 30 years as a civilian I am getting accustomed to Hey. In the Army they called me by my full name: "Hey You!!".

Collectively you can't go wrong with "Special Forces" or SF.

[Tubbs]

So is "Hey Dude" also acceptable, or is that right out?

[NousDefionsDoc]

Depends.

QRQ is being modest, he likes "Dit Da Snookums", but won't come right out and say it.

[QRQ 30]

So is "Hey Dude" also acceptable, or is that right out?
Oh Shit. I was trying to be nice but I think there is a storm brewing on the horizon. :lifter

[The Reaper]

So is "Hey Dude" also acceptable, or is that right out?

You are not going for the Quiet Professional or Grey Man approach, are you?

TR

[lksteve]

So is "Hey Dude" also acceptable, or is that right out?if you know the guy you are referring to as Dude, sure...if you don't know the guy, i probably wouldn't try it...username is a safe bet...before i addressed anyone, i'd see how other folks were addressing that individual...look first...be aware of where you are...watch what the locals do...be aware of where you are...tread lightly...be aware of where you are...

is there an echo here?

[Tubbs]

Well, the full nickname was Tubbalicious...

[NousDefionsDoc]

Sorry. I didn't mean to get you in trouble. :o

[Tubbs]

S'ok...
I do it to myself mostly. As you can tell by the hat thing I have a way with putting my foot in my mouth. I'm working on it though. I've found the best way to fix that is to just keep it shut unless its chow time.

[lksteve]

I've found the best way to fix that is to just keep it shut unless its chow time.that's a start...

[Tubbs]

You are not going for the Quiet Professional or Grey Man approach, are you?

TR

I was joking about the hey dude.
If you don't mind my asking what are the QP or GM approaches...
Or am I just missing an inside joke. Or stupid... I'm not ot proud to admit it when I'm dumb. I did join the Corps after all.

[The Reaper]

I was joking about the hey dude.
If you don't mind my asking what are the QP or GM approaches...
Or am I just missing an inside joke. Or stupid... I'm not ot proud to admit it when I'm dumb. I did join the Corps after all.

Lurk, learn, use the "Search" button, follow instructions, that sort of thing.

Try to fit in and not stand out in the crowd. When you find yourself in a new or potentially unfavorable position, don't draw attention to yourself.

The sort of thing you would do if you were on a mission with a small unit in bad guy country, or trying to keep a quiet, professional appearance and a low profile.

TR

[Tubbs]

Lurk, learn, use the "Search" button, follow instructions, that sort of thing.

Try to fit in and not stand out in the crowd. When you find yourself in a new or potentially unfavorable position, don't draw attention to yourself.

The sort of thing you would do if you were on a mission with a small unit in bad guy country, or trying to keep a quiet, professional appearance and a low profile.

TR

That's a solid copy sir.

[Jack Moroney (RIP)]

Colonel Jack and The Reaper are partial to "Dude"

Ambush Master likes "Hey Man"

LOL! Now I don't think I have ever been called "dude"! Been called a lot of other things and have had my share of troop given nick names but I am absolutely positive that "dude" would not have been one of them. I have even been mistaken for a "Marine" ,which I took as a compliment. Young Leatherneck, you can call me whatever you like.


Jack Moroney-been a Merchant Marine midshipmen but never a Marine-although I have stayed in "a Holiday Inn Express"

[Croaker]

Just wanted to put up a quick update. If this post needs to be moved to another thread, I understand. I had put up a post a few weeks ago about why I wanted to go SF and gave an extended timeline of later this year/early next year. Well, I changed my mind after talking to a few people and last Thursday I drove up from Raleigh, NC to Camp Dawson, WV and on Friday, May 20th, 2005 I signed on as an NQP with the 2/19th SFG West Virginia National Guard. I'll look to be going to selection end of this year/first of next year. I am so excited I can barely stand it!! I got to meet some great folks up there. First drill is next week. The ball is in motion and now the work can begin in ernest. Again, back to lurking and lots and lots of PTing :D

Todd

[QRQ 30]

WTG Todd and the best of luck to you.

Tubbs: Perhaps I misunderstood your original. I thought you were asking what to call Special Forces Soldiers in general. The answer is just what I said, Special Forces or SF. I don't take offense in being called a Green Beret, that is trhe term that most of the public know us by. We just like to be specific in that we are not hats. Hell, it beats the shit out of Green Beanie, Green Weeny, Special Farces and a plethora of other terms I have heard over a 40 year span. "Snake Eater" and "Sneaky Pete" weren't bad, in fact we had our own "Sneaky Pete Air Force" (SPAf) in SOG in 1968.

As to what to call individuals, observation is the best bet. The screen name is always acceptable. :lifter You can call me Terry, you can call me Ray, you can call me di-da-snookems but don't call me Gay. :D :lifter
.
QP abd Gray Profile are ways of saying to be low profile, under the wire, non-descript, blend with the background, etc. Things which are totally foreign to a gung-ho jarhead. :D

[Tubbs]

LOL! Now I don't think I have ever been called "dude"! Been called a lot of other things and have had my share of troop given nick names but I am absolutely positive that "dude" would not have been one of them. I have even been mistaken for a "Marine" ,which I took as a compliment. Young Leatherneck, you can call me whatever you like.

Semper Fi sir.

In response to QRQ 30, I'll try to flush the "gung ho" out of my system. Perhaps not the best mind set to have when trying to transition into the world of quiet professionalilsm.

[lksteve]

In response to QRQ 30, I'll try to flush the "gung ho" out of my system. Perhaps not the best mind set to have when trying to transition into the world of quiet professionalilsm.don't flush it...redirect it...quiet professionalism is not the enemy of bearing and discipline...it is the epitomy of it...

[Ambush Master]

don't flush it...redirect it...quiet professionalism is not the enemy of bearing and discipline...it is the epitomy of it...

Here-Here !! Well said !!!

Having come into SF, as an NCO, after a "Cadet" stint up on the Hudson, redirection is well in ORDER !!!

Even had an EX-Upper classman as an XO in Recon Company (CO was none other than the then Capt. Bob !!) Very interesting to say the least when the "Newbie XO" realized who I was !!! :D

[Tubbs]

don't flush it...redirect it...quiet professionalism is not the enemy of bearing and discipline...it is the epitomy of it...

I feel that I have way to much learing and growth to achieve before I am deserving of the opportunity to become a member of the SF community. That 's why I haven't jumped into it yet. Hopefully I can glean some of that from all of you. Thank you for your patience and your wisdom.

[Cosmic Trigger]

Just wanted to put up a quick update. If this post needs to be moved to another thread, I understand. I had put up a post a few weeks ago about why I wanted to go SF and gave an extended timeline of later this year/early next year. Well, I changed my mind after talking to a few people and last Thursday I drove up from Raleigh, NC to Camp Dawson, WV and on Friday, May 20th, 2005 I signed on as an NQP with the 2/19th SFG West Virginia National Guard. I'll look to be going to selection end of this year/first of next year. I am so excited I can barely stand it!! I got to meet some great folks up there. First drill is next week. The ball is in motion and now the work can begin in ernest. Again, back to lurking and lots and lots of PTing

You're getting into a good unit, my man. I've got friends in 2/19. However, If you live in Raleigh, you should know that B/3/20 is 45 minutes away in Roanoke Rapids, rather than a 6 hour drive through the mountains. Anyway- when you get to drill ask the guys to tell you stories about "The Social Claymore". He's a good friend of mine

[Croaker]

You're getting into a good unit, my man. I've got friends in 2/19. However, If you live in Raleigh, you should know that B/3/20 is 45 minutes away in Roanoke Rapids, rather than a 6 hour drive through the mountains. Anyway- when you get to drill ask the guys to tell you stories about "The Social Claymore". He's a good friend of mine


Will do. I had looked into B/3/20 actually last year but decided on 2/19 because of AO/language preference. Camp Dawson IS in the boonies though :eek: You couldn't ask for prettier country. The place is awesome! I'm sure it's fun up there in the winter, too.

[Cosmic Trigger]

Will do. I had looked into B/3/20 actually last year but decided on 2/19 because of AO/language preference. Camp Dawson IS in the boonies though :eek: You couldn't ask for prettier country. The place is awesome! I'm sure it's fun up there in the winter, too.

Yeah- it can get rough up there in the winter. Its the only place I've ever seen a huge lightning storm in the middle of a blizzard. Get used to ruck-marching in steep terrain, because their NQP program is going to hand you your ass. Its a great place to train, though, and for fishing, camping, rafting, ect. Also, Morgantown is an awesome place to party (I went to college there).

[Abu Jack]

I saw the movie when I was a kid. I think that is what planted the seed. After 7 years in the Infantry, I was ready for a new challenge. I stayed SF because I was continually challenged through the time I have been in SF and the challenges just keep coming.
As for age limitations ol' Firebeef went to Ranger school when he was 39. He is one hard dude.

[CoLawman]

I saw the movie when I was a kid. I think that is what planted the seed. After 7 years in the Infantry, I was ready for a new challenge. I stayed SF because I was continually challenged through the time I have been in SF and the challenges just keep coming.
As for age limitations ol' Firebeef went to Ranger school when he was 39. He is one hard dude.

Yeah and then became a fireman at like 50 or 60 something!!! Should have become a cop. :p

[Trip_Wire (RIP)]

I hope this fits into this Why go SF tread:

I first heard of SF around 1959 - 1960. I read an article in the Readers' Digest about SF. I was impressed. I was in the Air National Guard at the time, and working for the King County Sheriff's Department.

Shortly after reading the article, (April 1961) I noticed a hand made poster on our bulletin board, posted by a Seattle Police Officer, asking for prior service airborne qualified people, who wanted to get back on jump status in the Army reserve. Having been an Airborne Ranger during the Korean war, I was interested in getting back on jump status. (I never did learn to like the Air Force.)

I called him and said I was interested. He advised me, that the openings were in a Special Forces Detachment in the Army Reserve at Ft. Lawton, WA (The detachment was a numbered one like (3----) I can't remember the number.)

So, I decided to ask for a release from the Air Force (ANG) and go back to the Army. I lost rank (1 stripe) going to and coming back to the Army. So, after taking all the tests for SF, I was assigned to the detachment. Shortly, after being assigned we were tasked with a night equipment jump. The last jump I had made, was in April of 1951 this was now July of 1961! (10 or so years) A real thrill! Training? We did some PLFs prior to the jump.

Shortly after this the detachment, became the Group HQs for the 17th SFG(A) still at Ft. Lawton. The 17th SFG(A) was deactivated in the mid 60's and we became the 12th SFG(A) I served in the 12th SFG(A) until 1984 both at Ft. Lawton and Sand Point NAS. I enjoyed every minute of it. I was able to attend some good hooah schools, made some great deployments, etc. Most of all I was able to serve with some great soldiers and be associated with the best unit in the U. S. Army! :lifter :munchin

[lksteve]

When I got to my team, I was the second youngest guy at 28 years old.on the detachment i commanded, you would have been fourth oldest...the team sergeant was 33, i was 30, the senior medic was 29...how the times change...

i am not sure exactly why i went SF...i knew, growing up, i was going to be a soldier...my father was a soldier, a straight-leg infantryman and a damned good one...i didn't want to be just like my dad (very few of us do), but i wanted to be something like him...

i was interested in SF, but at the time of my enlistment, one had to be 20 upon completion of training...i was not quite 19 when i enlisted and found myself at Fort Bragg in the 82nd...in my mind, it was the most chickenshit outfit in the Army...of course, it was also the only outfit in the Army i experienced in my first enlistment...as a PFC spending time as a G on Gobbler Woods, i felt more like a soldier than i did hanging around the company area wearing spit-shined jump boots and starched fatigues (changed both boots and fatigues after the noon meal, so as to not get gigged for working or sweating earlier)...wound up on several details working with SF units and decided if i was going to be a soldier, i'd have to go SF...oddly, i never considered the possibility that i might not make it through the training, never thought about getting hurt, never even considered what may or may not happen...i just went through the course and made it...

the truth is, i loved being a soldier...i just never cared much for the Army...and i loved every day i spent in SF...even though i didn't know it at the time...

[TFM]

When I first decided to pursue the Army, I didn't know much about SF. I had read miraculous tales in time magazine that did hold some truth, which at the time made me feel that the feat was impossible for me. However, in recent times I began to seek out challanges for myself like never before. I am a very technical person, but I am also extremely physical. Tech stuff alone just don't meet the challenge needs. Anyhow, the more I learned, the more I wanted to become one. I have a friend who did it 20 years ago who is also very motivating. Its good to know he thinks I can do it since he has been through it, although it doesn't mean much. I can come up with probably 50 reasons why I want to be SF, but the only reason I need is that I want to do it.

[Warrior-Mentor]

When I got to my team, I was the second youngest guy at 28 years old.

Same here...and I was the Team Leader!

[Warrior-Mentor]

A lot of guys my age come through this site and SOCNET, interested in going SF. And I always think to myself "well, why do these guys want to be on an ODA?" Almost invariably, their reasoning seems to be very poor (movie inspired, cool sounding title, beret, tab, want to be Rambo, etc). As a result of this, I started to ask myself "why does SF interest you?"

Then I came to SOCNET, and found a lot of guys my age were interested in the same road as I. However, by and large they seemed to want to be "hard" or "HSLD" or whatever you call it. I'm not saying they all were, I can think of a bunch who are great guys with the best of intentions, but in proportion, there seemed to be a lot more assclowns.

And that's where I got this question: why should an individual want to be SF? Why did you? What's a good reason.

Thanks,
Doyle

Great Question....shows you're thinking about the right things...things that are important. I went to SFAS with guys who didn't even know what the 5 basic missions were...which amazed me considering some of them were Infantry Officers.

Here's why it's a great question...

Do you know what the #1 reason why people fail SFAS is?

It's because they quit. Period. End of story.

Why do they quit?

Simple. Because they didn't know why they showed up in the first place. Get the answer to this question absolutely clear in your head and you won't faulter when the times are tough. At night, when you're cold, your back is sore, your taint is wet, your feet are tore up and you are generally miserable carrying over 50 pounds of gear to your next point getting scratched up and eatten by a draw.

Now, picture yourself in that same situation smiling just because you had the balls to go for it and knowing that you will never stop until they tell you that you are done.

Some how in the back of my mind I always knew I would go SF.

There's a brotherhood...and it's hard for an outsider to understand. So many things it's tough to list. Working with the people that make it through the assessment and training process...knowing that the people you would go to war with are the best trained warriors on the planet. The autonomy. The unconventional problem solving. Doing more with less. Split team operations. Cross-Training. You name it...everything about SF appealed to me.

Read as much as you can about SF ... both current operations and the historical stuff. The more you learn, the more you'll want to be a part of the best military unit out there.

Special Forces: A Guided Tour by Tom Clancy wasn't bad.

Inside the Green Berets by COL(RET) Charles M Simpson was a great book covering more of the older history in detail.

Green Berets at War by CPT(RET) Shelby Stanton was also very well done.

Have absolutely crystal clear, solid reasons in your head and you will not only follow through onyour prepartory training, but you will be successful.

Best of luck,
Warrior-Mentor

[Mcmiller]

I realize this thread is pretty old and I apologize if it is inappropriate to post here, but I wanted to thank everyone on this thread for sharing. One aspect of the paper I am writing is a proposal to investigate what motivates people to choose challenging occupations and the broad diversity of views shared here has refined my thinking.

[Mike]

They made me do it, honest.
I enlisted abn inf in '66 to dodge the draft.
I was in Airborne Infantry AIT at Ft Gordon when they called 3 of us out of morning formation and said we had to go take the "SF" test.
Fine by me.
We got orders for JFK Center "pending graduation from abn school."
The rest is history.
Best thing ever happened to me.There were some dangerously dumfuks leaving that infantry school. Glad I was ble to get away.
There were good people, too, but the others were just plain scary.

[kgoerz]

on the detachment i commanded, you would have been fourth oldest...the team sergeant was 33, i was 30, the senior medic was 29...how the times change...

i am not sure exactly why i went SF...i knew, growing up, i was going to be a soldier...my father was a soldier, a straight-leg infantryman and a damned good one...i didn't want to be just like my dad (very few of us do), but i wanted to be something like him...

i was interested in SF, but at the time of my enlistment, one had to be 20 upon completion of training...i was not quite 19 when i enlisted and found myself at Fort Bragg in the 82nd...in my mind, it was the most chickenshit outfit in the Army...of course, it was also the only outfit in the Army i experienced in my first enlistment...as a PFC spending time as a G on Gobbler Woods, i felt more like a soldier than i did hanging around the company area wearing spit-shined jump boots and starched fatigues (changed both boots and fatigues after the noon meal, so as to not get gigged for working or sweating earlier)...wound up on several details working with SF units and decided if i was going to be a soldier, i'd have to go SF...oddly, i never considered the possibility that i might not make it through the training, never thought about getting hurt, never even considered what may or may not happen...i just went through the course and made it...

the truth is, i loved being a soldier...i just never cared much for the Army...and i loved every day i spent in SF...even though i didn't know it at the time...

My whole platoon in Basic was going SF. One other platoon Ranger, the other 82nd. I did a lot of studying about SF before joining. I knew one thing, it wasn't some commando outfit. I had no doubt it was a life long decision. Never even thought about other careers. It was Army SF since about 10th grade. Not from a military family. Five older brothers and none of them were in the service.
I did get booted out and had to spend two years in the 82nd before going back and passing. Probably for the better. The 82nd was far from chicken shit, at least in my Infantry BN.I was still the youngest on my first and second teams.
Same as you. The thought of quiting or failing never occurred to me, especially the second time. First time we were hanging onto the skin of our teeth. So failing was always a possibility. As privates it was do or die. You were just thrown in with the rest of the students and expected to know things that you only learn from being in the Army. No classes on finances, wear of uniform, records or something as simple as assembling TA50.
I use to always laugh in Basic and jump school when other privates going SF would think they were going to learn to become some type of ninja. As a whole SF was mostly what I expected. When people did quit it was like they had some type of disease. No one talked or went near them again.
I am so glad I went back to the Q-Course. I almost got out. Back then you could take an SF Physical up to the third floor of the White House, the one on Bragg that is. Then you received orders three weeks later. Thats all it took. Lots of 82nd guys starting disappearing to attend the Q-Course. They started to notice this and this back door was shut down.
Take it one day at a time. Don't think of it as a School. Wake up every day and face the challenges like you would anywhere else.

[frostfire]

I may be just an impressionable young 'un, but I sincerely believe SF makes a better person.

The mental toughness alone is already a trait valuable in any setting, add to that professionalism, combat fitness, thick skin, team work, and the list goes on. Also, the diversity in SF must be hardly matched by any other unit in the US or in the world. From the 18x alone, there're rocket scientist, cattle rancher, teacher, wallstreet trader, missionary, software engineer etc. All bringing their skills into one solid team. Versatile is an understatement, and individuals that make that team works must be the cream of the cream of the crop.

I've been working towards 18x eligibility for quite a while. I had to choose the hard route since the easy one compromises integrity. Missing out or failing does not worry me anymore. Not only I believe being an SF soldier would make me a better person/servant, the pursuit of that goal alone has made a better, ever-squared-away person. I've stayed out of trouble that many folks put themselves through, to maintain clean records. Everytime **** happens, I would smile to myself and be thankful for yet another chance of stress-inoculation. I do tasks assigned to me as if those are the last thing I do on earth. Perfection and excellence are no more just plain sayings. Finally, I cannot put in words how valuable this site and every seconds some QP's here spent mentoring/chewing me out have been.
Hence, there's no turning back.

Then there's "de oppresso liber," and that one is personal.

[deanwells]

Initially, I wanted to be in an elite crowd. After going through the course, I began to realize that being part of an elite crowd was a perk. There is so much more to it. I won't spoil the pleasant surprises in store for those who are COMMITTED to this way of life. If you are considering this life, you better be 100% sure this is what you want, because half assed reasoning is a recipe for failure or worse.

I hope the best in your future endeavors,

DW

[LEStudent]

Well, I thought I would update you all. It's been a hell of a long time since I posted here. I had the chance to visit Ft. Bragg on business about a year and a half ago, and spent a week at the SWC w/ instructors there at the school house, demoing some software that was to be used for training there at the schoolhouse. Long story short, I decided to pony the hell up and go for it.

However.

Late last year I was diagnosed with vertigo. My dreams of SF were grounded. I can't even walk around my house w/out medication, much less do strenuous activity. However, I did land that job working on the combat sim that is now used there at the SWC. There's a bit of bittersweet satisfaction knowing that, while my ass is grounded, those of you who can, and do go, will benefit from my work.

Lastly, if any of you folks are instructors at the SWC (and you don't have to point yourselves out) I want to thank you for your hospitality to us when we were there. You may or may not remember the Aussie and the American that showed up w/ SFC A.B. in November of '05 to demo VBS1, but we sure as hell remember you. Thank you for your kindnesses to a couple of civvies and for having us in your house for a few days.

[lksteve]

The 82nd was far from chicken shit, at least in my Infantry BN.i'm glad it worked for you...the 307th Eng. Bn. was very much a clique...

[NBC-Guy]

I joined the Army because my father was in the Army for his whole career and it made him into a totally person than who he was when he enlisted. The big reason I want to go into the Special Forces is from my interactions with three key individuals. The first was a CSM whom got me into JROTC as a freshman. Then second was my ex-girlfriends father, a CW4, who treated me as a son and encouraged me to follow this dream of mine and provided incite to what it took and above all told me of the confidence he had in me. Lastly, was a Maj. that was a cadre member in the ROTC program I was in for a couple of years. He told me the realities of what to expect and suggested WM's book for a more precise look into training and what not.

Associating with these three great people showed me the type of company and men that are within the various Groups. They are people that inspire, that push themselves, and above all hold themselves to a high standard. All of those reasons inspired me to do research on my own into the different missions, different Groups and AO's, and ultimately brought me to this site.

I have been planning going to a NG Group when I return from Iraq, but I just found out that after I demob I can go to an AD recruiter and get an 18x contract if I meet the pre-req's which I believe I have most of those boxes checked. I had planned to eventually go AD if I had made it thru the pipeline thru the Guard and its just amazing that this opportunity has surfaced. I only pray that the paperwork will fall into place and allow me to pursue this dream.

I would like to thank all of you for what you do, endure, and above all sacrifice in the name of Freedom and our country. I pray everyday and bust my ass in the gym and on the track to enable myself to own day join the fraternity and brotherhood.

SPC B

[abc_123]

.I had planned to eventually go AD if I had made it thru the pipeline thru the Guard

SPC B

That's great. So Specialist, you had it all planned to waste a NG company's training NCO's time and effort let him, the admin nco, and the Ops Sergeant, do all the paperwork and babysit your ass...maybe even call the unit whining to have the Company SGM go to bat for you if you had happened to step on your crank along the way...all with the expressed purpose of showing up with paperwork in hand to transfer to the Active Duty.

Super.

No wait, I'm sure you would have shown up at that NG Company and told them right off the bat that you had no intention of serving with them and that you were simply using them to get a slot into SFAS/Q etc enroute to AD Right? ... Sure you would.

Yep, it's all within the rules....but I don't like people who from jump street misrepresent themselves to work an angle for personal benefit.

From that statement, you sound like one of those people.

I hope that I am wrong, and/or hope some AD team doesn't find that that to be true the hard way.

[abc_123]

double post. post deleted.

[NBC-Guy]

That's great. So Specialist, you had it all planned to waste a NG company's training NCO's time and effort let him, the admin nco, and the Ops Sergeant, do all the paperwork and babysit your ass...maybe even call the unit whining to have the Company SGM go to bat for you if you had happened to step on your crank along the way...all with the expressed purpose of showing up with paperwork in hand to transfer to the Active Duty.

Super.

No wait, I'm sure you would have shown up at that NG Company and told them right off the bat that you had no intention of serving with them and that you were simply using them to get a slot into SFAS/Q etc enroute to AD Right? ... Sure you would.

Yep, it's all within the rules....but I don't like people who from jump street misrepresent themselves to work an angle for personal benefit.

From that statement, you sound like one of those people.

I hope that I am wrong, and/or hope some AD team doesn't find that that to be true the hard way.

I did not in any way mean it in that manner abc_123. My plan was one of longevity which I often don't say on the forum due to the fact that I am not SF qualified. I was planning on going into the Guard group and staying there for as long as necessary to gain experience then if I gained the necessary competence and tactical proficency, put in a packet to go warrant in which time I planned to have gone Active Duty.

I by no means was going to waste the time and jump ship that quickly. I am not the type of person to burn bridges in that manner and to screw people over. I researched and talked to several AD recruiters to see if there was a way for me, being already four years into my contract to get onto AD for fear of being perceived as I have just been seen. A few days ago I found out that I could get into the 18x program thus changing the plans I originally had.

SPC B.

[abc_123]

Look, I shouldn't have jumped on you based upon one post....and for something that never came to pass anyway.

It's just that I am becoming irritated at the fact that there seems to be (from my perspective) an increasing number of individuals in the NG pipeline that use NG resources to get trained and prepared and supported thru their time in the pipe and then give nothing back to the organization that supported them. Look, I respect these individuals for completing the Q etc. (how could I not) and respect them for their willingness to serve and move to the sound of the guns when there are so very many sheeple in this country. However, when you are in a short-handed unit trying to do your own recruiting, spending time/effort trying to run a quality NQP program it's frustrating to have people exhibit no loyalty, or give any payback before jumping ship... without at least getting a deployment out of them.

Glad you found a path to your goal. AD SF. Work hard...and good luck to you.

Be safe.

[ksgbobo]

I have thought long and hard about this one. I grew up in a military family. My father was an officer in the USMC, so naturally I planned on joining the Corps. I did not enlist after high school because my dad told me that life as an enlisted man in the Marine Corps is shit, which I believe, because I have many friends who have BTDT. So I put off the military and went to college, doing the "right" thing.
I was an LDS missionary for two years in Mexico. I was happy serving our Lord, but wanted to serve my country during this time of turmoil. I met a fellow missionary who told me his dad was SF in Utah, and told all the cool stories about the kinds of things his dad did. That stuff appealed to me.
After I got home from my mission I was down in Melbourne Florida helping out with hurricane clean up in '04. We stopped at a Ryans Steakhouse - I think it was - off the highway there around Melbourne and ate lunch. Inside was a company of Army Infantry guys, and an SF team. I was stoked to see the SF guys, they were confident, well built and stood there with a purpose. As I was standing in line with the regular infantry guys, they were all bitching about their officers and such, and I asked them where they were from. I think it was Mississippi.
Well, I really wanted to talk to the SF guys, but they were off in the party section by themselves secluded from everybody else. One of them got up to get some ice cream, so I got up, approched him, and thanked him for his service and for what he does because it takes a special kind of person to do what you do (I thanked the infantry guys as well). He appreciated my compliment and thanks, and returned to his team.
Since then, I am still in school and have been married for two years now. I have read many books and accounts about SOF, but SF appeals to me the most. The reason being is the motto - To Free the Oppressed. When I was a missionary it was all about serving people, being in SF is not all about being a trigger puller, but being a thinker, a diplomat, a teacher and about serving others. That is why I like Special Forces, and one day hope that I can devote my life to Special Forces.

[PiratesLife11]

Napoleon was an ass. He was more lucky than he was good. Quote winners.

Napoleon was indeed a strutting peacock; however, one should not underestimate or downplay his political savoir faire and tactical intelligence. Napoleon rose to power from relative obscurity because no one understood the French Revolution better than he did. This was no easy task. The fate of Robespierre is a prime example.

In terms of military prowess, let us not forget Toulon, where the "Little Corporal" made his bones. As a general, Napoleon trounced vitually every major power in Europe. During his Eastern European campaigns, Napoleon made Frederick Wilhelm's Prussia look like a third world country (just ask von Clausewitz, he details it quite vividly, especially the French capture of Prince August). Napoleon's cannon bombardments followed by his double column infantry and cavalry charges were the reason he was undefeated until the Concert of Europe finally ended the French expansion in Russia and finally at Waterlooo. Napoleon's only weakness was his ambition. Had he not over-extended his army, his empire would have lasted a lot longer than it did.

Napoleon's legacy still endures to this day. He initiated reforms ranging from women's rights to a fair justice system that have become the model for most modern societies, including America. It was his policies regarding economic equality that led to the aristocracy labeling him the "Anti-Christ" and "Devil of Europe". This was because he exucuted so-called nobles who did not fall in line with the new order of things and scoffed at the idea of "divine-right kingship" and "heavenly sovereignty". Upon crowning himself emperor in Rome, Napoleon sarcastically proclaimed: "Dio mi la dona, guai a qui la tocca" or "This crown is God-given, woe betide the man who touches it."—a testement to his understanding of the responsibility being entrusted to him.

By any measure, Napoleon was a great man, and certainly not a loser. Tolstoy's "War and Peace", though told from a Russian perspective, recounts excellently the sheer influence of the Napoleonic era in the early part of the 19th century. An esteemed professor of mine at UCLA once told me that a man can never truly consider himself an intellectual unless he is familiar with his Tolstoy and Dostoevsky. More and more, in daily life, I find his words and theirs applicable.

—E

[RTK]

ABC's post reminded me of a discussion I had the other day with one of my students.

Now I'm all for guys following their dreams to go SF. I don't look at it as my branch losing a leader. I see the Army just repositioning one. I've come to find out not all Armor Officers feel this way.

I got a new LT in this week at the Basic Course who essentially told me this: He's prior service Air Force 1LT and told me he has no desire to be an Armor Officer, just to go SF. He intends to graduate my course, go to Ranger and Airborne Schools and go to SFAS after, though he has an opportunity to go to combat with a combat arms unit instead of the schools. I tried to explain to him the 3 year rule about SFAS and that he could go to SFAS in the next 6 months, go to combat to learn more than his Air Force Signal career has given him so far, then pick up Ranger and Airborne on his way to the Q after the MCCC. He wants none of that. Then I asked him if he thought SF branch would look more favorably on his Ranger Tab or 1 year of combat leadership experience. He still thinks the Ranger Tab will get him farther.

Do you want him? Any pearls of wisdom you want me to pass on to him?

[Pete S]

ABC's post reminded me of a discussion I had the other day with one of my students.

Now I'm all for guys following their dreams to go SF. I don't look at it as my branch losing a leader. I see the Army just repositioning one. I've come to find out not all Armor Officers feel this way.

I got a new LT in this week at the Basic Course who essentially told me this: He's prior service Air Force 1LT and told me he has no desire to be an Armor Officer, just to go SF. He intends to graduate my course, go to Ranger and Airborne Schools and go to SFAS after, though he has an opportunity to go to combat with a combat arms unit instead of the schools. I tried to explain to him the 3 year rule about SFAS and that he could go to SFAS in the next 6 months, go to combat to learn more than his Air Force Signal career has given him so far, then pick up Ranger and Airborne on his way to the Q after the MCCC. He wants none of that. Then I asked him if he thought SF branch would look more favorably on his Ranger Tab or 1 year of combat leadership experience. He still thinks the Ranger Tab will get him farther.

Do you want him? Any pearls of wisdom you want me to pass on to him?

In addition to sounding arrogant and selfish he needs a reality check.

[The Reaper]

In addition to sounding arrogant and selfish he needs a reality check.

Concur.

Badgefinder who will be found out and will not make it.

TR

[Peregrino]

In addition to sounding arrogant and selfish he needs a reality check.

Pretty astute observation for a former Marine. :p FWIW I agree, but let's let the QP SNCO's and O's provide RTK with his ammo. Besides, I don't think we'll have to worry about the ex-AF LT; somehow I doubt he'll make the grade where he is, which will preclude him moving on to SF. Nobody wants a problem child that's focused on I/me and won't listen to quality advice. My .02 - Peregrino

[Pete S]

FWIW I agree, but let's let the QP SNCO's and O's provide RTK with his ammo.

Sorry, didn't mean to intrude

[RTK]

Pretty astute observation for a former Marine. :p FWIW I agree, but let's let the QP SNCO's and O's provide RTK with his ammo. Besides, I don't think we'll have to worry about the ex-AF LT; somehow I doubt he'll make the grade where he is, which will preclude him moving on to SF. Nobody wants a problem child that's focused on I/me and won't listen to quality advice. My .02 - Peregrino


I've got no doubt he'll retrograde himself on attitude alone. I'd like the little bastard to be able to write a 5 paragraph OPORD to standard. So far, no dice. He's kinda throwing the cart in front of the horse, all in front of a huge bus, IMHO.

After a few days I'm gonna print what get's added out and give it to him. Thanks for the help, fellas.

[Pete]

RTK I sent you a PM - check your box.

[Irishsquid]

I used to want to join because my dad was one. Somehow, I got talked into joining the Navy instead...over the last 4 years, I'd like to think I've grown a bit, and I know for a fact I've experienced a bit. I guess my main reason now is that I've worked a bit with some SF types, and they were by far the most professional and mature soldiers I've ever seen. They also had a sort of "brotherhood" I've never experienced anywhere else in the military. I was honored to work with them, even if only briefly, and I can't wait to go back.

[VAKEMP]

I am currently finishing up my paperwork to go "Blue to Green", 18X. If all goes well, I will be in the Army in a couple of months.

My reason for wanting to go SF is much the same as many others have already posted. I want to be surrounded by the best.

[ArandTallwite]

I want to be sf because I was told I wouldn't make it through selection. Not the best reason to want to do something, but now I want to finish the Q course because the instructors are just amazing. It's like a second family. I assume it will only get better once we get to a team. So that's my reason now.

[relentless]

My reason for wanting the tab: back in high school I was on a relay team with three other guys. Every time we competed, we knew why we were there, and what we wanted to do. we understood each other without having to speak. we didn't want to win, we wanted to break the record. we knew what each other was thinking without even saying a word. We would look at the competition and they would look at us. they knew we were business. Just like regular army units look at anyone who dawns the tab....My high school days are are over, and I need something to fill the longing, the wanting to be on a team like that again. we were three one hundredths off a state record. I need to give something my ALL again. I need to give my teammates all I have and then some.

[alright4u]

Im the early 60's SF was doing the work in SE Asia and had been for some time.

In 62 or 63 I read a national geographic mag about the montagnard uprising and the SF men who put it down. My father was an officer who warned me that SF was a dead end career for officers at the time.

The sad thing was we could go through OCS after basic and AIT, then to airborne and to the SFOC without knowing jack about about a US Infantry Division or what the division HHC was. I am not joking,

I went through the SFOC in 67 and was in in country in June 68, I volunteered for C&C and ended up at C5 then Omega and CCS. I was around the sharpest NCO;s this country has, and; that is what you get in SF. What you do not get in SF is the PVT and the leg infantry NCO who has spent years on Army pistol or rifle teams away from troops.

After the IOAC, I saw the leg infantry types in 73-74 for the first time in my life.
That was the 2nd ID in Korea. What a downer. My conclusion is I would have fared better having a tour with an airborne unit like the 82nd or the old 101st or the 173rd first before going to SF. Things change but; you get used to the best NCO's in the Army in SF, and ; you will not find them in leg units. All SF NCO's I served with could have easily gone through OCS. You will not find that outside of SF.

My advice is be the best Infantry man first, then go to SF. Commanding a company of yards with SF NCO's as platoon leaders is easier then a leg US rifle company. Learning how to deal with the ticket punchers and those LT's playing politics with the BN CO is better learned outside of SF as no one did that crap in SF. Please stay away from any officer looking for silver stars. He will get men killed.

You will never forget your SF friends, You will have a hard time recalling the pros in a leg unit.

That is just my two cents.

[SF_BHT]

My reason for wanting the tab: back in high school I was on a relay team with three other guys. Every time we competed, we knew why we were there, and what we wanted to do. we understood each other without having to speak. we didn't want to win, we wanted to break the record. we knew what each other was thinking without even saying a word. We would look at the competition and they would look at us. they knew we were business. Just like regular army units look at anyone who dawns the tab....My high school days are are over, and I need something to fill the longing, the wanting to be on a team like that again. we were three one hundredths off a state record. I need to give something my ALL again. I need to give my teammates all I have and then some.

Well in SF you have to think, sometimes you will be alone and other times you will be with your team mates.

Your first test was a Failure..:mad: Do not post again until you read your welcome e-mail and Post your intro as directed. Following instructions is a very important part of life and SF. Read, Search and Read more and follow instructions.

[RT AXE 10]

[QUOTE=SF_BHT;230815]Well in SF you have to think, sometimes you will be alone and other times you will be with your team mates.


Just to support the above statement: In SF you're a force multiplier, meaning, as an individual and or team member you must be a highly profficient soldier, able to teach, develop, create, and advise a Platoon, Company, Battalion, up to and possibly a Division. Now what type of a soldier is needed to do this task? What knowledge and skills should you posses? Can you work alone?, closely with a team?, In an area foreign to your likes?, Work under high pressure and in a hostile environment? Not see your family for extended periods of time?. Do all that it takes and still maintain your self and your team... As mentioned before, SF is not for those who cannot think on their own, adapt to tough situations, have no ingenuity and not a self starter...

Axe
If your short of everything except enemy, You're in combat...(Murphy's Law)

[Scimitar]

Why SF?

Number one reason...'Empty Boots' Fatigue...

This past 6 years I have been spending my 50+ hours per week in the business world.

My frustration with the Empty Boots syndrome that I would see around about me every day pushed me to start looking elsewhere for the real deal.

I found it in SF.

I have noticed something about the world around me. There seems to be four reasons why people undertake something.
1) Ego
2) Greed
3) Life Style - Seeking Comfort
4) Passion

For me, life really just comes down to one thing...winning.

I want to win. I want to be surrounded by lads who want to win. Every SF soldier I have met (and many conventional soldiers for that mater) has been mission focused, they want to win, and from my experience that is a rare quality.

Looking good is not more important then winning
Have status is not more important then winning
Being wealthy is not more important then winning
Being comfortable is not more important then winning

It seems to me that the majority of SF soldiers are all about passion, a passion for excellence, a passion to complete mission, a passion to win.

So yes, I took a shot at SF back in 06, An injury stopped me that time, but I just couldn't let SF go, tried giving it up…

…Twice…

Just couldn't shake it. So the knee's been given the go ahead and I'm taking another crack at it early next year. ARNG side of the house this time, (I'm told I'm too old to be running around with you young lads in the 18X program) ;).

Frankly, being able to bury my head in this website as well as many of the books out there has kept me motivated. Not to mention the odd help from the likes of TS, Cric, and Books, to mention a few. Thank you gentlemen for giving me the kick up the forth point or the odd encouragement where needed and thanks TS for the website, my wife calls it my girlfriend I'm on it enough. :D

In 25 weeks (and counting) I will be back on US soil and annoying the hell out of a certain Sgt Elliot. Actually I’m pretty sure I’m annoying the hell out of him already. :D

Special Forces - Take 2 - here's to being surrounded by 'full boots'

Scimitar

[hdgb]

Great thread and a bunch of great answers.
For me when i was in high scool the military appealed to me because my parents had no money for college and i was athletic but not scholarship material. I had seen the movie and read the book and i did the math.
Lets see if i deploy with an A team thats 1 in 12 , if i'm in the 82nd thats maybe 1 in 10,000. I reasoned if the commanders actually thought about the reason for deploying 12 just as hard as the 10,000.
Well i wanted to be 1 in 12. Any way that was my thought process and it worked out w/ hundreds of deployment with just me and my 11 other brothers. Once in i was hooked and only looked forward to more training oportunities, Ranger , recondo, JM, Scuba, Halo , Man the Q-course was only the beginning. I stayed for 24yrs and loved every minute of it. Becoming a TM sergeant was the culmination and the best days of my life.

[21BravoInDaSand]

For me it comes down to a few things which I cannot compromise; killing bad guys who want to kill us, helping people who need our help & overall excellence (training, teammates & mentality).

[BlackRob82]

After 6 years in the Army job satisfaction is at an all time low, the need for something new, challenging, and more fullfilling is at an all time high, I wouldn't say its been calling me and at first i wouldnt have given it a thought but throughout my time in the army something to do with SOF has always piqued my interest or caught my attention, the missions, the men involved in it, the mentality, the attitude, the confidence hell, even the little things like the cool guy gear, the mustaches, long hair and even the tab and neat beret has caught my eye and over time the call and desire for something more has grown, after 3 tours in Iraq and a long discussion with the wife and kid and looking at my options I have decided that now is the time to make that leap and go for it.
Time to start training:lifter

[Utah Bob]

Well it seemed to me, back in 67, that SF were the best trained and most professional. I was right.

[Richard]

Yep - bottom line...we go there because it is there! ;)

Richard's $.02 :munchin

[greenberetTFS]

Yep - bottom line...we go there because it is there! ;)

Richard's $.02 :munchin

Amen Richard,It is what it is.....................................:D

GB TFS :munchin

[Doctor Porkchop]

For me it is a matter of pride and service; I grew up in a small country in CA, one of my uncles got to work with a few QP's down there and he could not stop talking about their proficiency and professionalism(pretty sure there are a few of them on this site), that inspired him to never quit; years after that I moved to a large city on the east coast, had no money for college, so I joined the Army to get funds for my education, during my first year as PVT I realized that serving our country was one of the best decisions I'd ever made, so I started reading books, taking college classes, and studying my MOS soon after I found myself leading a squad of combat engineers, they made me proud, but wanted to serve, I'd attended SFAS a few years before but was not mature enough to understand the kind of commitment it takes; after returning from Iraq and being assigned to a training post I found the perfect time to prepare myself and family, and made it, right now I'm eager to learn and to be challenged, there is nothing else on my mind than to serve our country with the best and become the best.

[rltipton]

I spent some time around some 10th Group guys in Germany back in the 80's and I was impressed with how tight they were. I went SF mainly because of them...for the outward display of pride the guys always had in their unit. They were in the gym every afternoon, running every morning, just like me, although I was the only one in my unit who was... You could tell they loved their jobs. I wanted that...the teamwork, pride, cohesion, camaraderie.

Once I got to a team I realized very quickly that all the hard work was worth it. It is simply the best job in the Army (World?), period. It exceeded all of my expectations and then some.

Join SF because when it's all said and done and you are an old fart you'll be the real deal guy who really did all the cool shit, with a wealth of stories from your REAL adventures, with a posse of brothers closer to you than your blood kin, and you will look back and know you got to do some cool shit that the average Joe cannot even fathom and most would not believe.

There is much more to it than just being on a team though... The word "family" doesn't do the brotherhood justice. There is only 1 way you will understand it, and that is to get your tab and live on an A team.

[Blitzzz (RIP)]

You're right Bob, 67 was a very good year. Blitzzz

[mojaveman]

Why did I want to serve in Special Forces?

Honestly, when I was a kid I saw the movie and it connected with something in my psyche. I liked all of it, the training, the traveling, the adventure, and mostly, being around guys who shared some of the same values as myself. I served with some awesome people in Group, in particular, the many Viet Nam veterans and other legends that I saw and talked to on a daily basis. I often tell my friends who have lived average lives of my exploits in SF and they don't believe me. It was a phenominal experience. My only regret is that I didn't stay on that 'roller coaster ride' a little longer.

[Heretic]

Why did I join SF?

Inside I felt I was better that where I was at. I wasnt being challenged enough and wanted to understand what the word commitment meant. Something inside said do it.

Do you believe that? The truth, I heard chicks dig Green Berets. I dig chicks so simple math here I am.

Why did I leave SF? The grass was greener on the other side.

The truth? It is greener on the other side. So green I worked myself out of a job.

Why did I come back. I miss my friends. I miss the team. I miss SF.

The truth? There are no chicks on the other side of the fence. Well there are but you dont have time for them.:D

Now here is the honest reasons:
I have no clue why I joined. I heard about it liked the challenge and did it. What I learned from SF? That what it has taught me I am still not done paying back. That the man on the left or right REALLY does count on me for safety so much so that he is willing to throw rational thought from his mind and do inhuman actions for the good of this nation all because he TRUSTS the man on his left or right is there with him no matter what the outcome is. That the price paid in victory or in falling his BROTHERS paid the same price.

p.s. chicks dig Green Berets.:lifter

[rltipton]

I served with some awesome people in group, in particular, the many Viet Nam veterans and other legends that I saw and talked to on a daily basis.
Brother that's no lie. It saddens me so many are retiring, taking with them the first hand experience of how it all came to be. The legends...the old crusty farts running SWCS...the true HALO gods - pioneers with Skydiving "D" License Numbers in the single digits , the Son Tay Raiders, the Blue Light guys and so much other shit they will take to their graves. Man we rubbed elbows with those heroes...REAL heroes! I feel so privileged to have known so many of those guys like Bennie Pokemire, Richmond Nail, Pappy, Skygod Dave and Ernie Tabata and so many others. Someone said something on here that struck a chord, "You never forget lessons taught by a real hero." That's so true. I learned a hell of a lot of lessons from those cats.

And yeah chicks really do dig green berets.

[mojaveman]

[QUOTE=rltipton;265096] I feel so privileged to have known so many of those guys like Bennie Pokemire,

Bennie Pokemire once had an M-60 tank magically delivered to Camp Mackall for training. Don't ask me how he did it and from what I heard he didn't even sign a hand receipt for it. If I remember correctly, it was there for awhile before the parent unit came looking for it.

MSG Pokemire was one of the first SF people that I met when I came to Bragg to attend the Q course way back in '84.

[Soldier_@_Heart]

Even though I am not SF, I will gladly saw what inspires me.

1. Being the best at what I do no matter what I do, most of the times I don't even like what I do. I hated 92F ait and I hate the MOS, but I still graduated as a honor graduate.

2. De Oppresso Liber - To Free the Oppressed.


One saying that I feel goes hand in hand with SF is this.

"Give a man a fish, you feed hime for a day. Teach a man to fish you feed him for lifetime. "

PV2 Gouvea

[Basenshukai]

I was lucky enough to attend a very conservative private school when I attended high school. In the school library, they had two military-oriented encyclopedias (the kind "Time-Life" would offer on occasion). One was something like "War and Conflict" and the other was about special operations forces (I don't remember the title). Each had like 40 volumes; about 120 pages each with lots of pictures. I spent my entire junior year immersed in those two encyclopedias. I read every book (about 80). My favorites were the stories from Vietnam-era SOF (SF, SEALs, Project Delta, etc.). I was so impressed by these stories that I had it in my to dare and attempt the military - but I did not have my heart set on any SOF.

Fast forward about four years later and I'm working as a tour guide in a naval-oriented military museum in NYC (Intrepid Sea, Air and Space) on one of the ships there at the time - the USS Edson - in order to pay through my college. One of the visitors one day was an old retired Recon Marine NCO, a Vietnam Veteran. He didn't say much and did not get into war stories. I asked him for his reasons for joining an elite unit while in Vietnam and not just sticking around the regular Marines and this was his answer: "Most of the regular guys I had the displeasure to work with were not into it - they were a##holes and would just as soon get your a## shot. I figured that if I was going to risk my neck in any case, why not do it along side professionals."

That's when I recalled that I was sold on the idea on joining something elite.

Now, here is the real funny story:

I had not joined any Army program for commissioning at this time. I was just playing with the idea at the time. The Navy kept calling because I had taken the ASVAB and gotten a perfect score, so they were trying to line me up for the nuclear warfare program and something called "BOOST" (a commissioning program). But, I was not into the Navy thing, ships, et al.

Anyway, one day this real hot chick shows up there at my tour spot and I chat with her and she eventually gives me her number. About a day later I call that number and the voice that picks up says: "Fordham University, Army ROTC, this is Maj Smith, how may I help you?" (I don't really remember his name, so I put 'Smith', but he was an Armor officer)

It turns out that the girl was a newly commissioned 2LT and had already left for her basic course. She gave me that number to avoid being rude, yet not give me her number. I never talked to her again and never saw her again. But, I did go to see the ROTC office and eventually signed a contract that led me to a full scholarship.

Now, 14 years later, I'm a field grade officer and I have been six years in SF. All thanks to some books, a silly tour guide job and a girl that didn't really like me after all. LOL!!! She enhanced my life more than she will ever know.

[Dozer523]

Even though I am not SF, I will gladly saw what inspires me.

1. Being the best at what I do no matter what I do, most of the times I don't even like what I do. I hated 92F ait and I hate the MOS, but I still graduated as a honor graduate.
2. De Oppresso Liber - To Free the Oppressed.
One saying that I feel goes hand in hand with SF is this.
"Give a man a fish, you feed hime for a day. Teach a man to fish you feed him for lifetime. "

PV2 Xxxxxx I bet the dyslexia part seems pretty cool, too.
How about the part about following insrtuctions? Flesh out the profile when your not too busy.
Might read the instructions for posting on this Special Forces Questions forum. No tabbie, no talkie!
Don't forget that after you feed "hime" for a day by teaching him to fish, if you buy him a boat and a case of beer he might marry you and never bother you again.
Oh and don't forget a little Situational Awareness with that unique last name. If I wanted to find you, how hard do you think it would be? Especially as I know where Fort 'Lost in the Woods' is. Actually, I might look you up -- I'm going to the Lake of the Ozarks and I might stop by. Do me a favor (SERIOUSLY) find out is they rent jet skis at the Rec center. PM me. (REALLY)
Then edit out your name.

[11B2V]

Well, there is God and country, CQB and HALO, Oakleys and beards, however......

If you are out there contemplating that SF versus whatever else decision, I have another question for you. Have you ever MET an SF soldier? I have met quite a few, and I can tell you that they usually have extremely confident, can-do, magnetic personalities. These guys can do anything any human can. They are truly professional, but I will expound on the word professional. Their fieldcraft is top notch. They take care of one another, and they can take care of you too. They are ALWAYS teaching, either by mission or by quiet example. Their mindset and leadership always seems to make sense - they make good decisions, sometimes life saving decisions. They are trusted to go out on their own, to sandy hide sites and snowy mountaintops to accomplish vital mission objectives, sometimes with little or no resources and THRIVE. Don't you want to earn a place among people like this? I know I do. Special Forces are not for everybody, but if you are SERIOUSLY considering it, I advise you to go meet one of these dudes. You can find them all over the GWOT, at Ranger School, even the PX (sometimes)! If you are a civilian, call your local SF recruiter, or pm a QP on this site. If you DO talk to one, a word of advice... put all your experience in your back pocket for now, and check your ego at the door. Ears open, mouth shut, school is in session.

I said all that to say this, if you REALLY want it, get fn prepared and go do it. Don't let anyone stop you, I hear SFAS/the Q is good enough at sorting the admirers from the doers. SFAS in 2010:lifter. Just my .02

Asset sends - RLTW

[The Reaper]

Well, there is God and country, CQB and HALO, Oakleys and beards, however......

If you are out there contemplating that SF versus whatever else decision, I have another question for you. Have you ever MET an SF soldier? I have met quite a few, and I can tell you that they usually have extremely confident, can-do, magnetic personalities. These guys can do anything any human can. They are truly professional, but I will expound on the word professional. Their fieldcraft is top notch. They take care of one another, and they can take care of you too. They are ALWAYS teaching, either by mission or by quiet example. Their mindset and leadership always seems to make sense - they make good decisions, sometimes life saving decisions. They are trusted to go out on their own, to sandy hide sites and snowy mountaintops to accomplish vital mission objectives, sometimes with little or no resources and THRIVE. Don't you want to earn a place among people like this? I know I do. Special Forces are not for everybody, but if you are SERIOUSLY considering it, I advise you to go meet one of these dudes. You can find them all over the GWOT, at Ranger School, even the PX (sometimes)! If you are a civilian, call your local SF recruiter, or pm a QP on this site. If you DO talk to one, a word of advice... put all your experience in your back pocket for now, and check your ego at the door. Ears open, mouth shut, school is in session.

I said all that to say this, if you REALLY want it, get fn prepared and go do it. Don't let anyone stop you, I hear SFAS/the Q is good enough at sorting the admirers from the doers. SFAS in 2010:lifter. Just my .02

Asset sends - RLTW

Did you miss the sticky at the top of this forum?

http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22758

TR

[Dozer523]

Well, there is God and country, CQB and HALO, Oakleys and beards, however...... gag me
I advise you to go meet one of these dudes. Dude, Don't call me or any other QP dude. got that? Dude.
put all your experience in your back pocket for now, and check your ego at the door. Ears open, mouth shut, school is in session. Read the stickies. read the posts to others. read the posts to you.

Ears open, mouth shut, school is in session. That is Good Advice.
Ears open, mouth shut, school is in session. Really, GREAT advice. Take it Plato.
Don't let anyone stop you, SFAS in 2010From what I've seen no one is going to have to try to stop you, you have you to do that for you already. .
Just my .02 Not worth that.

Asset sends - RLTW.

[11B2V]

TR, sticky read and duly noted. Didn't realize there was that string attached, I read page 1-11 then posted, that sticky seemed to be overlooked a lot... Won't happen again. Dozer523 pm sent.

*Edit-It is not my intention to offend any QP by calling them dude, especially if you do not know them. I should clarify that I was speaking of fellows I have known personally.

[wdonghia]

lot of good answers

[Pete]

lot of good answers


Wow, wdonghia, what a post. Your post count is now two.

It's clear you are posting without reading.

Read this whole thread from the begining and report back to me in a PM with your findings.

You ain't got all night - but I do.

[Dozer523]

. Dozer523 pm sent. . Bakatchoo

[ZonieDiver]

I wanted to go SF because of a way cool SF Captain/Major to whom I was exposed in ROTC. We participated in field excercises that he planned and helped execute in the Florida Everglades with units of the 11th and 20th SFGA's - the caliber of which I did not see until Robin Sage. When I completed SFTG Phase III as the Distinguished Graduate, I visited him - S-3 in one of the 82nd's Brigades - to thank him. I was the second former cadet of his to have received such accolades. To this day, Major Carl Wesneski is and always will be the epitome of what an SF soldier is... to me.

[The Joker91]

I first became interested in SF after reading "Special Forces" by Tom Clancy. I admit that I was uneducated in what QP's do when I started the book, but by the end, I was fully aware of the full spectrum of what ODA's do on a day-to-day basis.

Fast forward to 2004 and my time in Iraq. We were trained in pre-mob by Special Forces (that was when RC Civil Affairs units were under the control of USASOC) in foreign weapons and combatives. They were the best trainers I had seen....period. We also had two QP's in our unit. One was our CSM and he was, in a word, fantastic. The other was a CPT who, unfortunately, I did not work with much while in the sandbox. But when I had to de-mob early (due to a family crisis), it was he who took me drove me to the airport. I mentioned in casual conversation that Robin Sage was starting that night, the gleam in his eyes was something that never left me.

One more reason. Men are judged by the company they keep. To be around men who strive to make themselves better will only make me a better person and a better soldier.

[The Reaper]

I first became interested in SF after reading "Special Forces" by Tom Clancy. I admit that I was uneducated in what QP's do when I started the book, but by the end, I was fully aware of the full spectrum of what ODA's do on a day-to-day basis.

Fast forward to 2004 and my time in Iraq. We were trained in pre-mob by Special Forces (that was when RC Civil Affairs units were under the control of USASOC) in foreign weapons and combatives. They were the best trainers I had seen....period. We also had two QP's in our unit. One was our CSM and he was, in a word, fantastic. The other was a CPT who, unfortunately, I did not work with much while in the sandbox. But when I had to de-mob early (due to a family crisis), it was he who took me drove me to the airport. I mentioned in casual conversation that Robin Sage was starting that night, the gleam in his eyes was something that never left me.

One more reason. Men are judged by the company they keep. To be around men who strive to make themselves better will only make me a better person and a better soldier.


http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22758

TR

[wet dog]

This thread has been alive for some time, but not touched since 5/09.

I was born in 64, just a kid to some of the older fellas here. In the spring of 1972, at the tender age of 8, my father greeted a young soldier at our door. Dressed in class A's, jump boots, wearing a Green Beret. My father immediately welcomed and embraced him with a warm and tender hug. I've never seen my father show such intimacy with someone outside our family, and never again to this day. This young man had just returned home from Vietnam, when he learned that his own father had recently died, someone whom my father had served with in Korea.

My father was his 'second' dad, and while I have learned only later in life what it meant to be part of a team, to know the fellowship, love and brotherhood what this community stands for, I will never forget that day.

I enlisted in SF because of a visual image of what commitment stood for, and what TEAM really meant. At 18, I entered college, ROTC was on the list of classes available. There I met another SF soldier, a MSG, my second in 10 years. I thought, these guys are rare indeed. After a semester and 1/2, I was not moving along with what I thought post adolescence should be, most professors were static, no lecture moved me, I longed for thought, not canned expressions of fellow students. I was, for the first time, lost and homesick.

Walking back to my dorm room one afternoon, the MSG pulled over his car and asked if I wanted to join him and a few of his buddies for a BBQ and home time with kids, and few girls and a couple of "moms".

Before the evening was over, I had a chance to view some old photos albums of younger vets now in the living room drinking beer, heard a couple cool stories about a curtain medic who delivered a baby in a small obscure village somewhere, and once in the middle of said story, the room got quiet, a tear fell and a toast was raised to said medic who was no longer with the TEAM. It was not difficult to see that this was a tight group that loved each other as much if not more than thier own families, who understood the ties between them as well as themselves.

I simply wanted that, more than anything else.

When I finally made it to the recruiter, and was given REP63 orders, the Recruiting SGT at MEPS asked me, "Why SF?" I could'nt answer him, how could I, the journey was already to long for a simple answer. Drill Sergeants in Basic asked, my answer was always given in push-ups. It was only when I arrived at Ft. Bragg, NC, a curtain MSG, now SGM found me and said, welcome.

WD

[greenberetTFS]

http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22758

TR

Exactly TR,but no one's paying attention to it....................:mad:

Big Teddy :munchin

[wet dog]

Got it Wet Dog. Team Sergeant

Go back to your original post "Why go SF?" and find the edit button. Delete the entire paragraph and hope TS does not remind you to follow directions first.

WD

[Team Sergeant]

AJ_Johnson , after you pull your head out of your ass go and re-read our rules.

http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3452

Then go and run 10 miles tomorrow.

Team Sergeant

[Utah Bob]

Some men look at SF and ask "Why?"
I looked at SF and asked, "Why not?"
:D

[ZonieDiver]

If going SF is "about you" - it is for the wrong reason.

[Calrngr]

Some men look at SF and ask "Why?"
I looked at SFD and asked, "Why not?"
:D

Well put.