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Richard
11-16-2011, 07:55
Flashbacks of living in Europe in the mid-70's with the RAF, RZ, RB, AD, IRA...

Germany has been shocked by a series of revelations relating to a trio of neo-Nazis who appear to have carried out a crime wave lasting for over a decade. They are suspected of murdering nine immigrants and a policewoman as well as a series of bank robberies. The evidence points to a new kind of right-wing terrorism unlike anything Germany has seen.

And so it goes...

Richard :munchin

A Disturbing New Dimension of Far-Right Terror
DerSpiegel, 14 Nov 2011

Frühlingsstrasse in the Weissenborn neighborhood of the eastern German city of Zwickau is a street lined with renovated old houses, manicured front gardens and sidewalks that look swept clean. It would be an idyllic residential neighborhood, if it weren't for the house at number 26.

The windows are smashed, a section of the front wall has collapsed onto the lawn, and there is a gaping black hole on the right side of the second floor. An incendiary bomb exploded at this house a little over a week ago. But the real nature of the bomb that exploded there was not clear until last Friday. As it turned out, the reverberations from the explosion rocked not just the nearby houses on Frühlingsstrasse, but the whole of Germany.

Beate Zschäpe, who was renting an apartment in the building, left the house shortly before flames burst from the windows at 3:05 p.m. on Nov. 4. She dropped off her cats with a neighbor, and then she did what she has been doing time and again for almost 14 years: She disappeared.

Three hours earlier, a fire had also been set in a parked camper in Eisenach, a city 180 kilometers (110 miles) away. The two men inside, Uwe Mundlos and Uwe Böhnhardt, had just robbed a bank. They had ended up in Eisenach after being on the run for 14 years. The two men shot themselves before a police patrol could reach the burning vehicle.

Shocking Discoveries

It didn't take investigators long to see the connection between the two incidents. Then they began digging through the wreckage in Frühlingsstrasse, looking for clues. The deeper they dug, the more astonished and shocked they were by what they uncovered.

At first, it seemed that they had just hit upon a gang of bank robbers that had blown up their hideout.

They dug deeper.

Were the two men and one woman a neo-Nazi trio that had built pipe bombs in the eastern state of Thuringia in the late 1990s and had gone into hiding in the Zwickau area?

The investigators dug even deeper.

Was the trio a group of cold-blooded murderers who had gunned down police officer Michèle Kiesewetter in the southwestern city of Heilbronn four years ago? The investigators found Kiesewetter's service weapon, a Heckler & Koch P 200, and that of her severely injured fellow police officer in the burned-out camper, while the presumed murder weapon was found in the rubble in Zwickau. But that wasn't the end of the story.

Were they members of a right-wing extremist terrorist organization that had randomly shot and killed nine men throughout Germany since 2000, eight of them of Turkish origin and one from Greece? That was the point at which the investigation had arrived by the end of last week, when police found a weapon in the pile of rubble that had become synonymous with what was probably Germany's longest, most brutal and most mysterious series of murders. The weapon was a Ceska, model 83, 7.65 caliber Browning.

(cont'd)

http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,797569,00.html

mojaveman
11-16-2011, 10:36
Interesting.

I think far right violence in Europe is going to get much worse as the Muslim populations continue to grow and not just in Germany.

DesertRat
11-16-2011, 13:28
I agree Mojaveman.

Pericles
11-16-2011, 22:07
You still have a big cultural divide in the former West and East. The West confronted its past with Nazism, while the East ignored it, under the mantra of being a socialist state that had nothing to do with the Nazi period. You saw much more of the traditional German military garb in the NationalVolksArmee than you did in the Bundeswehr.

Certainly in the late 90s there was some nostalgia for the DDR, and that can persist in the generation that lost their jobs after re-unification and never worked again.

-Jas-
11-17-2011, 11:23
Well maybe a few looks from Germany directly (or added to those working in 10th)

The whole incident moved onto a discussion about the Bundesverfassungsschutz (National Intelligence Service only working on domestic issues - the counterpart to the BND Bundesnachrichtendienst) and its methods.

The main instrument used by the BVSch (see above) is called V-Mann. They are simply spies within those groups and parties. But there are two kinds. Actual Nazis ore criminials working for both sides (convinced V-Mann) or embedded Intelligence Officers. And there´s the catch.

As investigations´going on it seems that some of those embedded ones were actually helping in performing or at least planning assaults in the past without stopping them or giving key information to the agencies and police.

The newly potrayed "NSU" (National Socialism(t) Underground) is an active group in the NeoNazi Scene. So this begs the question: With this information about acts of violence and murder by active members of this group why not just violently smash ´em? Well this is one hope that the gouvernment has secretly. More in favor of putting the Police in spot, they want a national outcry and a solution by the society. Does it work? Well it did in the early 90´s after the first NeoNazis clashes with burning immigrant and refugee shelters.

This time? I doubt it. We do have a violent leftist youth called the Schwarzer Block (Black Block). But they are also highly critisized by the public.

It would be wonderful to see just those two groups of lunatics fighting it out on the streets and the rest just watching from the balconies as 2 problems are solved at the same time but they both have on common enemy - the gouvernment.

Can we rely on the massive amount of immigrants living in Germany? Hell no. That would be the worst thing to happen. If they step in the fight it will only trigger more affection for those NeoNazi groups.

So what´s lef is well the Gouvernment and its executive powers of police, intelligence and perhaps the military (also doubting that).


And there the devil´s circle closes itself. The only instituitions to powerfully fight these groups are highly involved within them due their V-Mann. Getting rid of them is not an option cause information is still key. It´s a dilemma and noone has a real solution to this right now...

Let´s see how it further develops. If they manage to tag more murders and assaults to the NeoNazi Scene, and (sad to say that but thats how it works here) even some native german Victims (seems like their looking into linking the assault on the Police President of Passau to the group) it may cause the society to loudly call for "revenge" and disrupting of the NeoNazi Scene. Hopefully this will not lead into a growth of the Black Block on the left side.