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Air.177
08-30-2004, 15:56
Does anyone have anything to say about this? Good Info, Bad Info, It's a cartridge without a purpose, anything.

That is all

Bravo1-3
08-30-2004, 16:17
I had the opportunity to fire the 229 in .357 Sig. It's a nice little cartridge, but I didn't see too much of a point for it when .40 S&W is much more common, and out performs it for being only a tad longer overall than the .357 Sig.

It's just another way to chuck 9mm bullets in my opinion.

Air.177
08-30-2004, 16:25
Thanks Bravo, That's pretty much what I thought.

rubberneck
08-30-2004, 16:37
Very nice cartridge as it mimics the ballistic performance of the 357 mag in a much shorter package, but unless you reload it doesn't make sense as 100 rounds costs roughly as much as 45 ACP and the 45 is much easier to find.

I wouldn't suggest using reloads factory or otherwise in an un supported chamber. Glock has had some serious issues with the reloads causing their guns to go boom. The .357 is such a high pressure cartridge that a weakened case might ruin you week.

bberkley
08-30-2004, 17:26
Air.177,

Reloading .357 Sig is difficult, lots of guys have problems with neck tension, cartridge OAL, and finding the right bullet to use.

I keep wondering if Gaston Glock had the .45 G.A.P. developed so he could have a signature round like Sig's .357 Sig.

I've almost made my own .357 Sig brass (well, I got a .40 case mixed in with my 9mm brass, and ran it through the sizing die and necked it down to 9mm). :)


Thread Highjack Follows:

Rubberneck,

Pretty much everything out there has an unsupported chamber, its not just Glocks. Glocks have gotten a voluminous amount of bad press from Dean Spier's Gunzone website. Most of the kB!'s for a Glock have been ammo deficiency/reloader error. The Glock's get a bad rap for their polygonal rifling, and the use of lead bullets. I shoot lead bullets out of my Glock factory barrels, and have no leading problems. Then again I use quality hardcast lead, and not homemade bullets cast from used wheel weights either.

The Glock .40s have a very unsupported chamber at the 6 O'clock position, a factory barrel will bulge the hell out of the brass, which is a big, fat suck if you reload. I used to shoot a .40 Glock in USPSA, but I replaced the barrel with a KKM because I wanted my brass to last longer. Excessive cold-working of the brass will certainly lead to case failure.

The other problem is directly related to reloaded ammo in the area of quality control. People either double-charge, don't work up a load properly, use the wrong powder, use no powder (leading to a squib), or don't crimp enough and have a bullet get set back into the case mouth when it strikes the feed ramp. Every gun is liable to go boom the wrong way when one of these things happens. It is not endemic to the Glock.


Thread Highjack over

APLP
09-25-2004, 01:44
Roger that on the KKM. I use the KKM's in all of my .357 Sig, 10mm, and .45acp Glocks due to the better chamber support that allows for higher pressure ammunition to be fired safely. I have seen conventional plus P ammunition show signs of internal case rupture and blown primers from the factory 31-33 barrels.

KKM is also provides excellent quality and service for custom length barrels and threads.

I run a standard length Glock-31 barrel, that turns 2350fps with the BMT CQB ammunition that penetrates 1/4 inch stainless. The 6.5" KKMs run past 2600fps from the same Glock which ups the ante some.

rubberneck
09-25-2004, 06:33
I run a standard length Glock-31 barrel, that turns 2350fps with the BMT CQB ammunition that penetrates 1/4 inch stainless. The 6.5" KKMs run past 2600fps from the same Glock which ups the ante some.


Holy crap. Did you really mean to say your .357 sig ammo hits 2350 fps? Most factory ammo is right around 1300 fps. If you can safely get 2350 fps (have you guys figured out what type of chamber pressure that round generates?) I'll have to get me some. :p

The Reaper
09-25-2004, 08:00
Holy crap. Did you really mean to say your .357 sig ammo hits 2350 fps? Most factory ammo is right around 1300 fps. If you can safely get 2350 fps (have you guys figured out what type of chamber pressure that round generates?) I'll have to get me some. :p

It is a very lightweight bullet, but all of the BMT ammo I have run over the chrony has done at least what APLP has claimed.

The .30-'06 I tested was over 3900 fps. The .45ACP did more than 2000 fps.

SMOKIN'!!

TR

rubberneck
09-25-2004, 08:16
It is a very lightweight bullet, but all of the BMT ammo I have run over the chrony has done at least what APLP has claimed.

The .30-'06 I tested was over 3900 fps. The .45ACP did more than 2000 fps.

SMOKIN'!!

TR


I just wanted to make sure that it wasn't a typo. That stuff is really hauling ass. What is the recoil like on the .45ACP as compaired to 230 grain hydrashoks? I would imagine that that stuff really gets everyones attention on the range.

Stan, how many grains is the 357/9 bullet? And is it available to non LEO/Military?

Brother Rat
01-24-2005, 08:42
So, overall, which would you take as a personal defense cartridge between the .357 Sig and the 40S&W? :munchin

STR8SHTR
01-24-2005, 19:26
BR I carry a Beretta Cougar chambered in 357 sig at work. I love the caliber but do not like the weapon. The 357 Sig cartridge has really performed for us when it counted. I carry a G32 off duty and love it. I like to own weapons that the office can feed. 357 hands down for me. I have my reloader set up to load 357. A little cheaper to load than the 40.

APLP
01-24-2005, 22:01
I just wanted to make sure that it wasn't a typo. That stuff is really hauling ass. What is the recoil like on the .45ACP as compaired to 230 grain hydrashoks? I would imagine that that stuff really gets everyones attention on the range.

Stan, how many grains is the 357/9 bullet? And is it available to non LEO/Military?

Sorry I took so long to respond to your question. Next time please just hit me in the head.

I would rather shoot the BMT 85 grain .45acp subgun ammo in the Glock-21 ammo at 2400fps than a standard 230 grain ball load at 830fps. Dwell time of the bullet in the barrel, cyclic time of the slide, yields a quick impulse and flat shooting gun with little muzzle rise.

The BMT 9mm and .357Sig generally use a 60 grain bullet for most applications. Standard velocities from a 4.6 inch KKM barrel would run 2000 and 2350 fps respectively. The 10.5 inch 9mm barrel can turn 2400fps, and the longer barrel .357Sig can turn over 2700fps.

There is a non restricted line of ammo available that comes very close to the same energy levels. The non restricted handgun bullet designs are constructed to be resistant to penetrating soft armor, and most of the military and l/e bullet constructions are optimized to penetrate armor.

BearFlag
01-27-2005, 04:18
When the funds become available (college student) I plan on getting an SA XD in .357 or maybe .45 GAP and then get a nice BARSTO barrel kit for it in .357.

Prices have really come down on the .357 ammo and you can usually find it online or at your local gun store at comparable prices.

It is very similar to the .40, but it tends to have even higher velocities, better material penetration, and amazing fragmentation for a pistol, it almost never over penetrates and deposits a load of energy on people.

An ideal LEO bullet IMO, and even though I am just a civilian, You never know what you might be up against. W/ the .357 or .40 I know if I got pined down I could shoot a guy thru a car door, slow bullets might not work on that one.

The only real downside I see it that it might be a bad bullet because it is a good penetrator so for self defense bullets that miss might go flying thru the drywall, lumber, and then hit a bystander, more reason to practice shooting I guess.

Air.177
01-27-2005, 05:28
When the funds become available (college student) I plan on getting an SA XD in .357 or maybe .45 GAP and then get a nice BARSTO barrel kit for it in .357.

Prices have really come down on the .357 ammo and you can usually find it online or at your local gun store at comparable prices.

It is very similar to the .40, but it tends to have even higher velocities, better material penetration, and amazing fragmentation for a pistol, it almost never over penetrates and deposits a load of energy on people.

An ideal LEO bullet IMO, and even though I am just a civilian, You never know what you might be up against. W/ the .357 or .40 I know if I got pined down I could shoot a guy thru a car door, slow bullets might not work on that one.

The only real downside I see it that it might be a bad bullet because it is a good penetrator so for self defense bullets that miss might go flying thru the drywall, lumber, and then hit a bystander, more reason to practice shooting I guess.

FYI:The head of the .45 GAP cartridge is larger than the .40S&W/.357Sig, so a drop in barrel of a caliber different from the original is not advisable without talking to a qualified gunsmith.

BearFlag
01-27-2005, 13:22
FYI:The head of the .45 GAP cartridge is larger than the .40S&W/.357Sig, so a drop in barrel of a caliber different from the original is not advisable without talking to a qualified gunsmith.

I don't plan on doing it w/out consulting SA, and BARSTO [thumbsup]