View Full Version : Why the Cowboy Code is Not Frivolous
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2011/02/10/cowboy-code-frivolous/?test=faces
A man’s got to have a code, a creed to live by, no matter his job." -- John Wayne
The other day the Montana State Senate passed SB 216 sponsored by rancher and Senate President Jim Peterson. The bill is simple and direct and it doesn’t cost the taxpayers a dime. SB 216 would adopt The Code of the West from the book "Cowboy Ethics" and make it the official Montana Code.
"Cowboy Ethics" was written by James Owen, an investment professional who after Enron and the other Wall Street scandals of a few years ago, decided it was time to take a good look at what we had become as a society and individuals. Like me he has a great deal of respect and admiration for the iconic American cowboy and the cowboy way of life.
He came up with his "Code of the West" which states some simple common sense principles that not just cowboys but all of us should try to live by.
The code includes admonitions such as "Live each day with courage," "Be tough, but fair," "Ride for the brand," and "Know where to draw the line."
About Social Security Benefits and Wage Garnishment Montana Governor Schweitzer has said he will veto any frivolous legislation. I guess he consider ethics "frivolous." He wants the legislature to focus on important things like jobs and a budget shortfall. He’s right that those things are extremely important. But the ethics and values deficit in this country is just as important as the fiscal and financial deficits.-- If life is just about dollars and cents then we are in bigger trouble than I thought.
Somewhere along the line we forgot these basic values and replaced them with a self-centered "grab all you can and forget the consequences" attitude and situational ethics.
Children cheat on tests and think it is not only okay but is a path to success.
In 2002 a study by Rutgers University found that cheating was rampant and in many cases accepted behavior among students. The director of the study said "I think kids today are looking to adults and society for a moral compass and when they see the behavior occurring there, they don't understand why they should be held to a higher standard."
If that is how our young people see the world Lord help us.
One student said,” I actually think cheating is good. A person who has an entirely honest life can't succeed these days."
Another student in the survey said, "What's important is getting ahead. The better grades you have, the better school you get into, the better you're going to do in life. And if you learn to cut corners to do that, you're going to be saving yourself time and energy. In the real world, that's what's going to be going on. The better you do, that's what shows. It's not how moral you were in getting there."
She was 17 at the time and by my ciphering she would be around 26 now. With an attitude like that she should run for Congress.
And I can’t imagine things have improved since 2002 and my guess is that they have gotten worse.
Some politicians cheat on their wives. If a man will cheat on his wife what do you think he will do to the folks that elected him?
Bad behavior in public life will more likely land you a book deal, a reality TV show or a spot on Oprah than the consternation of society. You want proof?
Disgraced former New York Governor Eliot Spitzer romped with hookers and he now has a television show on CNN.
By the way hookers are now called "escorts" and they have become a part of mainstream popular culture thanks to Spitzer and actor Charlie Sheen.
And while the collapse of the housing market has many causes one big one was that some unscrupulous lenders approved loans although they knew the borrowers could not afford them. By the way the borrowers also knew they couldn’t afford them as well and now some of them just walk away from their obligations.
Now that's a great example for the kids, isn't it?
Some folks might say I’m “naïve” or “old fashioned” or that “times have changed and I need to get with it” whatever “it” is.
Maybe so.
But when a nation forgets the values that made the country strong and discards its ethical compass as “outdated” that nation could be at its end.
And if not the end you sure as Hell can see it from here.
1stindoor
02-11-2011, 08:17
Having grown up...or at least gotten older in Texas, we used to have the "Cowboy Rules" listed all over the place.
Rules To Live By.......
Good judgement comes from experience, and alot of that comes from bad judgement.
Don't never whittle towards you, and don't never spit against the wind.
There's 2 theories to arguing with a woman. Neither one works.
Letting the cat outta the bag is a whole lot easier'n puttin it back in.
If your riding ahead of the herd, look back every now and then to make sure it's still there.
If ya get to thinkin your a person of some influence, try ordering another fellar's dog around.
Be cautious in choosin a mate. Don't settle for one who can't open the gate.
A mountain lion felt soooo good after eatin' a whole bull he started roarin'. He kept it up till a hunter happened along and shot him. MORAL: When your full of bull, keep yer mouth shut.
Never kick a cow chip on a hot day.
Don't squat with yer spurs on.
Never slap a man that's chewin' tobacco.
If'n you find yerself in a hole, the first thing to do is stop diggin'.
It don't take a genius to spot a goat in a flock of sheep.
Always drink up-stream from the herd.
The quickest way to double yer money is to fold it over and put it back in yer pocket.
There are 3 kinds of cowboys.......
1. the one that learns from readin'
2. the few who learn by observation
3. and the rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.
I have been using this one, "Good judgement comes from experience, and alot of that comes from bad judgement," for most of my life...to various degrees of success.
bandycpa
02-11-2011, 09:00
This brings up an interesting question about us civilians. Do you QPs think that it is appropriate for civilians to adopt creeds like the SF Creed or the Ranger Creed and apply them to their own personal lives?
Nice article. The part about student cheating drew my attention.
Some years ago, I was going through some assignments - simple ones that involved a few calculations on a spreadsheet. As background, I included instructions on the WWW. During class, I went through the entire procedure - everything, with no gaps - on how to create the spreadsheet. If any student (out of 160!) didn't understand, we went over it again.
So...no real reason to cheat, right?
But I got in one that looked absolutely splendid! It was almost a work of art as spreadsheets go. Except - even though the answers were right, the formulas were utterly wrong. Then I spotted a second assignment that looked just like it. So I required the students to provide the electronic files, which they did.
OK, at that point I found out that they had used Word instead of Excel. And the two students had files that were exact duplicates - and were created within 1 second of each other. Cheating, right?
I followed the book to the letter. Got the forms, filled them out, had the students sign them. The students would have gotten a zero on the assignment - but no other sanctions.
And what did my boss do? He refused to sign them. It was "too much trouble". Since then, I have noticed that even cheating on tests is not pursued. Officially, academic dishonesty is deplored and punished. Practically speaking - it is ignored.
This leads to many bad things. One can imagine what happens when a doctor, engineer, or other professional gets used to such behavior. I think we're reaping part of the consequences now.
Could we as civilians adopt a robust moral or ethical code? Sure - as long as we limit it to defining our own behavior. But those who try to impose it on any part of the greater society will pay a price.
As a friend says, "Once you lose your integrity, the rest is easy." Please forgive me for concluding that his cynical comment comes close to the truth.
As a friend says, "Once you lose your integrity, the rest is easy." Please forgive me for concluding that his cynical comment comes close to the truth.
This Country settled into a trial lawyer's ideal with regard to integrity about the time of the Lewinsky brouhaha.
Dozer523
02-11-2011, 09:45
Nice article. The part about student cheating drew my attention.
As a friend says, "Once you lose your integrity, the rest is easy." Please forgive me for concluding that his cynical comment comes close to the truth. Had a math teacher in Junior High who gave a mutiple choice test to first period and, oddly enough, the answers ran "a,b,c,d, repeat". News of this spread like wild-fire through the rest of the his classes.
Guess what.
Having grown up...or at least gotten older in Texas, we used to have the "Cowboy Rules" listed all over the place. I have been using this one, "Good judgement comes from experience, and alot of that comes from bad judgement," for most of my life...to various degrees of success.
Three Texans ridin' in a pick-up. Which ones the REAL Cowboy?
The one in the middle.
Don't have to drive, Don't have to mess with the gate.
Back in the 80's, we went to Biggs AAF to train on the DMVS (Desert Mobility Vehicle System. We'd drive though the country side a few hundred miles along the border. We were told the only rule we had better never violate was "Leave the gate the way you found it".
The Reaper
02-11-2011, 10:12
Back in the 80's, we went to Biggs AAF to train on the DMVS (Desert Mobility Vehicle System. We'd drive though the country side a few hundred miles along the border. We were told the only rule we had better never violate was "Leave the gate the way you found it".
That, and don't take the government van to Juarez.
TR
Officially, academic dishonesty is deplored and punished. Practically speaking - it is ignored.
Y'all have an issue you need to deal with if that is the case there.
FWIW - kids make poor decisions but still need to be held accountable for them while having the opportunity to demonstrate a willingness to own up to and correct those behaviors. We found an enforcable 'Three Strike' policy for cheating/academic dishonesty (plagiarism) worked well for us.
Strike One
An automatic '0' on the assignment/exam
Original assignment w/documentation/memos kept in the student's permanent academic file
Counseling on the effects of the '0' and the violation of the policy regarding cheating/academic honesty
Parent meeting to discuss the issue and information on its consequences
Note: a '0' sometimes meant the student failed the course for the semester; I had seniors who cheated on a final exam or plagiarized a final term paper in a core course and had to re-do the course in summer school before receiving their diplomas
Strike Two
Automatic failure of the course
Counseling and parent meeting
Academic probation
Strike Three
Dismissal
There were several occasions when we 'strongly' suspected a student had cheated but could not prove it - however, when confronted with such an issue, we had the student retake the exam or redo the assignment while being monitored by faculty as 'proof' of 'their' integrity and then averaged the two grades for a final academic grade.
After enforcing and holding to our polciy (as outlined in the Students and Parents Handbook) and having several students fail courses, fail to graduate with their class due to the need to retake a course in summer school, and dismissing a student for a 'Strike Three', the word was out to the community and the issue was seldom a problem for us.
Three Texans ridin' in a pick-up. Which ones the REAL Cowboy?
The one in the middle.
Don't have to drive, Don't have to mess with the gate.
Those aren't 'real' Texans - real Texans have cattle guards so nobody has to mess with any damn gates. ;)
And so it goes...
Richard :munchin
Y'all have an issue you need to deal with if that is the case there.
True - and folks who have been there since inception 30+ years ago agree. However, the realities of the demographics, retention rates and politics mean that nothing is done.
That's the problem with codes of ethics, IMO. One starts off with a little compromise, a small white lie, a bending of the rules and it is so very easy. One follows the path, one easy step at a time. Ultimately, one has an issue. It takes someone with a very strong moral compass to fight such trends and environments. Perhaps that's one reason I admire many here - they seem to have that strength.
1stindoor
02-11-2011, 10:58
Those aren't 'real' Texans - real Texans have cattle guards so nobody has to mess with any damn gates. ;)
Cattle guards only work some of the time. A shut gate works all the time...until your fenceline gets a break.
As for your three strike rule...I think it's great...but here's an issue we have in our county (my wife's been teaching for 21 years). Her principle refuses to let any teacher give their student a zero. Reason? It's so hard to overcome a zero on a report card. Instead give them a 60. It's still a failing grade but then the little johnnies and joannies can recover. Sadly though they don't learn the lesson that their actions (or inactions) have consequences.
Instead give them a 60. It's still a failing grade but then the little johnnies and joannies can recover. Sadly though they don't learn the lesson that their actions (or inactions) have consequences.
Yeah, that's the Brokeback Mountain Cowboy Code
As for your three strike rule...I think it's great...but here's an issue we have in our county (my wife's been teaching for 21 years). Her principle refuses to let any teacher give their student a zero. Reason? It's so hard to overcome a zero on a report card. Instead give them a 60. It's still a failing grade but then the little johnnies and joannies can recover. Sadly though they don't learn the lesson that their actions (or inactions) have consequences.
We ascribed to a similar policy in that we didn't give below a 50 for an assignment - if the student got a 50, they knew that the number represented the teacher's effort and not the student's - the teacher had done their half of giving the student the opportunity to achieve a 100 but the student did not.
HOWEVER - cheating or plagiarizing on an exam/assignment automatically gave you a '0'.
Richard :munchin
Some years ago....What have you done about this issue since then?
This brings up an interesting question about us civilians. Do you QPs think that it is appropriate for civilians to adopt creeds like the SF Creed or the Ranger Creed and apply them to their own personal lives?
If you were to write a prayer - Ranger or SF type creed, what would it say, and would you follow it, live by it?
Could you creatively blend the principles and the "Pledge of Allegiance" and the 6 last commandments of service, love and honoring your neighbor, (I've intentionally removed the first 4, as to not hurt anyone's sensitivities), but include them as you see fit.
Could you place honor and fighting injustices or wrong when seen? To always place the needs of others before your own, to protect small children, the aged, women or the sick? (I excluded young men, and men, in this line of thinking because if you are a man, then you should be able to protect yourself, protect one anothers, and protect the former).
---------------- now a plug for another -----------
"Cowboy Ethics", by James Owens was required reading in my last company.
I have forwarded many copies of Owens' book to others with warm replies, and endless (thank you's).
I got my first copy of "Cowboy Ethics", from Jack Dale who has also written a book entitled, "The Code". Personally, I think it should be required reading of all men, boys, and women who have to live with us. I think it should also be read by all SF candidates, their brothers and fathers, and the women, (wives, sisters, girl friends, etc.), who have to live with them, in short, I think everyone should read 'The Code".
I only mention this, because the question was asked, should civilian types adopt the SF or Ranger creed to live by? The answer is Yes. Go write a creed, some civilians live by such convictions, they even write books about it.
Wet Dog
What have you done about this issue since then?
Me personally? I obey orders without question. Or even much thought.
Others who have been around 30+ years and have tenure? They complain about the decline in standards over coffee, then obey orders without question.
I didn't say I was proud of myself.
greenberetTFS
02-11-2011, 12:36
I must admit this is the first I've herd of the Cowboy Code but you'll have to forgive me because I'm from Chicago and there ain't many cowboys there..........;)
Big Teddy :munchin
I must admit this is the first I've herd of the Cowboy Code but you'll have to forgive me because I'm from Chicago and there ain't many cowboys there..........;)
Big Teddy :munchin
BT, the Chicago Code is, "he sends one of yours to the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue", right?:D
Having grown up...or at least gotten older in Texas, we used to have the "Cowboy Rules" listed all over the place.
Rules To Live By.......
Good judgement comes from experience, and alot of that comes from bad judgement.
Don't never whittle towards you, and don't never spit against the wind.
There's 2 theories to arguing with a woman. Neither one works.
Letting the cat outta the bag is a whole lot easier'n puttin it back in.
If your riding ahead of the herd, look back every now and then to make sure it's still there.
If ya get to thinkin your a person of some influence, try ordering another fellar's dog around.
Be cautious in choosin a mate. Don't settle for one who can't open the gate.
A mountain lion felt soooo good after eatin' a whole bull he started roarin'. He kept it up till a hunter happened along and shot him. MORAL: When your full of bull, keep yer mouth shut.
Never kick a cow chip on a hot day.
Don't squat with yer spurs on.
Never slap a man that's chewin' tobacco.
If'n you find yerself in a hole, the first thing to do is stop diggin'.
It don't take a genius to spot a goat in a flock of sheep.
Always drink up-stream from the herd.
The quickest way to double yer money is to fold it over and put it back in yer pocket.
There are 3 kinds of cowboys.......
1. the one that learns from readin'
2. the few who learn by observation
3. and the rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.
Okay, That's HOT!;)
And as post #14 points out, IMHO, it IS a good idea!
Holly:munchin
bandycpa
02-11-2011, 13:53
If you were to write a prayer - Ranger or SF type creed, what would it say, and would you follow it, live by it?
Could you creatively blend the principles and the "Pledge of Allegiance" and the 6 last commandments of service, love and honoring your neighbor, (I've intentionally removed the first 4, as to not hurt anyone's sensitivities), but include them as you see fit.
Could you place honor and fighting injustices or wrong when seen? To always place the needs of others before your own, to protect small children, the aged, women or the sick? (I excluded young men, and men, in this line of thinking because if you are a man, then you should be able to protect yourself, protect one anothers, and protect the former).
---------------- now a plug for another -----------
"Cowboy Ethics", by James Owens was required reading in my last company.
I have forwarded many copies of Owens' book to others with warm replies, and endless (thank you's).
I got my first copy of "Cowboy Ethics", from Jack Dale who has also written a book entitled, "The Code". Personally, I think it should be required reading of all men, boys, and women who have to live with us. I think it should also be read by all SF candidates, their brothers and fathers, and the women, (wives, sisters, girl friends, etc.), who have to live with them, in short, I think everyone should read 'The Code".
I only mention this, because the question was asked, should civilian types adopt the SF or Ranger creed to live by? The answer is Yes. Go write a creed, some civilians live by such convictions, they even write books about it.
Wet Dog
Wet Dog,
Thank you for the input sir. I believe the convictions in the Creeds apply to civilian life as well. As you said, the key is not just to learn them, but to live by them...to (as much as possible) make them an indispensable part of the fabric of our being.
My concern was that it would be perceived as someone being a "wannabe" because they (okay, "I") adopted a Creed shared by a very select number of elite individuals as a code that they themselves (okay, "I" again) aspired to live by.
Bandy
I've tried to live by the creed my Dad taught my brothers and I, "Do the right thing...even if you think nobody is watching."
Maybe that's too simple.
It's been a decade since my Dad died; I miss him still.
Richard :munchin
Wet Dog,
Thank you for the input sir. I believe the convictions in the Creeds apply to civilian life as well. As you said, the key is not just to learn them, but to live by them...to (as much as possible) make them an indispensable part of the fabric of our being.
My concern was that it would be perceived as someone being a "wannabe" because they (okay, "I") adopted a Creed shared by a very select number of elite individuals as a code that they themselves (okay, "I" again) aspired to live by.Bandy
Very well articulated Bandy!!!
Wet Dog Sir, my curiosity is pinging here....:munchin
Holly;)
I've tried to live by the creed my Dad taught my brothers and I, "Do the right thing...even if you think nobody is watching." Maybe that's too simple.
Richard,
That creed is as good as any and better than most. I was always drawn to the code Nitobe wrote of in Bushido Soul of Japan. One of my favorite passages being,
A truly brave man is ever serene; he is never taken by surprise; nothing ruffles the equanimity of his spirit. In the heat of battle he remains cool; in the midst of catastrophes he keeps level his mind. Earthquakes do not shake him, he laughs at storms. We admire him as truly great, who, in the menacing presence of danger or death, retains his self-possession; who, for instance, can compose a poem under impending peril, or hum a strain in the face of death. Such indulgence betraying no tremor in the writing or in the voice is taken as an infallible index of a large nature--of what we call a capacious mind (yoyu), which, far from being pressed or crowded, has always room for something more.
However Nitobe had his flaws, among them his recommendations to be hard on your children might constitute child abuse in our society, also plenty of atrocities were committed by the Japanese in WW2 in the name of Bushido, but the code itself and the virtues struck me as insightful.
There are web sights. Where you can type your answers onto water and soft drink labels. Then print them out and wrap them around your beverage. It's definitely a society where cheating and short cuts are perfectly acceptable.
I've tried to live by the creed my Dad taught my brothers and I, "Do the right thing...even if you think nobody is watching."
Maybe that's too simple.
It's been a decade since my Dad died; I miss him still.
Richard :munchin
That's the true test.
bandycpa said :
This brings up an interesting question about us civilians. Do you QPs think that it is appropriate for civilians to adopt creeds like the SF Creed or the Ranger Creed and apply them to their own personal lives?
Here's some team rules NDD posted in an older thread which are pretty good and I believe some could be universally applied. Some are more focused on SF teams. :
1. If one is working we are all working.
2. If one is hurt we are all hurt.
3. If one is fighting we are all fighting.
4. You do what has to be done without having to be told.
5. We are all leaders.
6. None of us are too good for any task.
7. Quiet professionalism is the way.
8. Stay out of it until you've earned the right to get into it.
9. Actions drown out the whisper of words.
10. We may fight like cats and dogs with each other, but we will turn like a rapid pack on an outsider.
11. When you walk into that team room, you better be able to do your job to the level to which you were trained.
12. The maximum effective range of an excuse is exactly zero meters.
13. If the team calls, you go. It doesn't matter the hour or the mission.
14. Be the Teammate you want to have.
15. If you take, you owe. Back in the day, it wasn't just schools, bonuses were the same way.
16. Everything you do is a reflection on your team.
17. You never refuse a teammate in need.
18. Being accepted should be hard.
19. You are responsible for maintaining your skillsets. All our lives depend on it.
20. Selection is a continuous and ongoing process that ends the day we die.
21. No sniveling.
Buffalobob
02-11-2011, 17:03
The other day the Montana State Senate passed SB 216 sponsored by rancher and Senate President Jim Peterson. The bill is simple and direct and it doesn’t cost the taxpayers a dime. SB 216 would adopt The Code of the West from the book "Cowboy Ethics" and make it the official Montana Code.
Perhaps the Montana legislature works for free and each member pays a share for the upkeep of the building. Otherwise it cost the taxpayers of Montana something to have the bill passed.
and Nero fiddled while Rome burned
The Reaper
02-11-2011, 17:04
Wet Dog,
Thank you for the input sir. I believe the convictions in the Creeds apply to civilian life as well. As you said, the key is not just to learn them, but to live by them...to (as much as possible) make them an indispensable part of the fabric of our being.
My concern was that it would be perceived as someone being a "wannabe" because they (okay, "I") adopted a Creed shared by a very select number of elite individuals as a code that they themselves (okay, "I" again) aspired to live by.
Bandy
Bandy:
How would anyone know what creed you were following unless you told them?
Why not just keep your mouth shut and do it?
Yes, if you told me that you had memorized the Creed, or tatooed it on your arm for quick reference, I would think that you were an idiot.
TR
bandycpa
02-11-2011, 17:18
Bandy:
How would anyone know what creed you were following unless you told them?
Why not just keep your mouth shut and do it?
Yes, if you told me that you had memorized the Creed, or tatooed it on your arm for quick reference, I would think that you were an idiot.
TR
TR,
Excellent point. The last thing I want is the idiot placard hanged around my neck. Thanks for the headsmack. My apologies for stirring the pot.
But, for the record, tattooing would not be an option. I'm not a fan of needles at all. :D
Bandy
Do you QPs think that it is appropriate for civilians to adopt creeds like the SF Creed or the Ranger Creed and apply them to their own personal lives?Having a professional or occupational creed is fairly common...as far as adapting the SF or Ranger Creed, I think once you distill the principles, with a minor exception or two, you have a decent set of rules...I'd like to see your adaptation...
Surveyor's Creed and Canons
As a Professional Surveyor, I dedicate my professional knowledge and skills to the advancement and betterment of human welfare.
I pledge:
To give the utmost of performance;
To participate in none but honest enterprise;
To live and work according to the laws of humankind and the highest standards of professional conduct;
To place service before profit, honor and standing of the profession before personal advantage, and the public welfare above all other considerations;
In humility and with need for Divine Guidance, I make this pledge.
Canon 1.
A Professional Surveyor should refrain from conduct that is detrimental to the public.
Canon 2.
A Professional Surveyor should abide by the rules and regulations pertaining to the practice of surveying within the licensing jurisdiction.
Canon 3.
A Professional Surveyor should accept assignments only in one's area of professional competence and expertise.
Canon 4.
A Professional Surveyor should develop and communicate a professional analysis and opinion without bias or personal interest.
Canon 5.
A Professional Surveyor should maintain the confidential nature of the surveyor-client relationship.
Canon 6.
A Professional Surveyor should use care to avoid advertising or solicitation that is misleading or otherwise contrary to the public interest.
Canon 7.
A Professional Surveyor should maintain professional integrity when dealing with members of other professions.
It doesn't mention working outside in -15°F when the office staff is having cookies, though...or dealing with nosy occupants...
bandycpa
02-11-2011, 20:16
lksteve
The three big ones that I use with my kids on my sports teams are:
1) Do your best
2) Take care of each other
3) Have fun
As I thought more and more about these rules over the years, I’ve found that these three apply to pretty much anything in life.
The question about the different military creeds came from my fascination with the Ranger Creed. In 6 simple yet profound stanzas, I felt that a person could encapsulate the values of professionalism in whatever endeavor they did. From taking responsibility for one’s actions, to taking on a higher standard (and having that expectation placed upon one from others), to not failing one’s comrades, I thought that this summarized the approach I wanted to take with life. However, I am not, nor ever will be a Ranger. That was the impetus for my question.
As TR pointed out, it isn’t necessary to make it known that these standards, adjusted for my own personal set of circumstances, are the ones I personally aspire to. I don’t teach my kids the Creed word for word, but they hear its principles from me when I teach them about the right way to do things in life.
craigepo
02-11-2011, 21:16
The question about the different military creeds came from my fascination with the Ranger Creed. In 6 simple yet profound stanzas,
I really enjoyed the fact that the 1st letter of each paragraph began with the letters RANGER. This allowed young rangers like me to easily memorize the creed, which in turn allowed me to get some minor plus spot reports at R.I. changeover each morning in Ranger school. Sleepy ranger students like myself always needed help in this regard. Hell, I can still recite that creed, even when sleepy or hungry.
Many denominations within the Christian Church have, for centuries, repeated creeds such as the Apostle's Creed, the Nicean Creed, and others. The ideas underlying the creeds, and often the creeds themselves, were memorized by the congregation after hearing the recitation dozens of times. Pretty effective way of teaching doctrine at a time with limited technology.
bandycpa
02-11-2011, 21:55
I really enjoyed the fact that the 1st letter of each paragraph began with the letters RANGER. This allowed young rangers like me to easily memorize the creed, which in turn allowed me to get some minor plus spot reports at R.I. changeover each morning in Ranger school. Sleepy ranger students like myself always needed help in this regard. Hell, I can still recite that creed, even when sleepy or hungry.
Many denominations within the Christian Church have, for centuries, repeated creeds such as the Apostle's Creed, the Nicean Creed, and others. The ideas underlying the creeds, and often the creeds themselves, were memorized by the congregation after hearing the recitation dozens of times. Pretty effective way of teaching doctrine at a time with limited technology.
Growing up in a "metho-costal" church, I didn't know that the Apostle's Creed or Nicene Creed existed (It was a small, country church...the first time I heard the term "narthex" I had no idea what that was either). When I moved to another area after starting my accounting practice, I started going to a Methodist church. We said the Apostle's Creed every Sunday. I didn't study it, but it wasn't long until I could say it word-for-word. First I memorized it, and then I pondered on it. As you said craigepo, creeds are a simple, effective way to teach doctrine. Memorization followed by reflection results in indoctrination (not saying that's a bad thing).
Utah Bob
02-14-2011, 13:00
Yeah, that's the Brokeback Mountain Cowboy Code
THEY WERE SHEEPHERDERS, NOT COWBOYS!:p
"Cowboy Ethics" was written by James Owen, an investment professional who after Enron and the other Wall Street scandals of a few years ago, decided it was time to take a good look at what we had become as a society and individuals. Like me he has a great deal of respect and admiration for the iconic American cowboy and the cowboy way of life.
He came up with his "Code of the West" which states some simple common sense principles that not just cowboys but all of us should try to live by.
The code includes admonitions such as "Live each day with courage," "Be tough, but fair," "Ride for the brand," and "Know where to draw the line."
How much did Mr. Owen make on these and other 'scandals' before deciding to ride on the high road? How much is Mr. Owen making now off from the Center for Cowboy Ethics and Leadership <<LINK (http://www.cowboyethics.org/SpeakingEngagements.php)>>?
In reference to posts #3 and#31, a question. Do we as civilians help or hinder civil-military relations when we appropriate aspects of the warrior ethos to use in our everyday lives?
By the way hookers are now called "escorts" and they have become a part of mainstream popular culture thanks to Spitzer and actor Charlie Sheen.Charlie Sheen wishes he had that kind of influence...with his pharmacist.
(Mr. Dorinson has apparently never heard of Holly Golightly. Or The Village Voice. Or Craigslist.)
1stindoor
02-14-2011, 14:32
I hate to split hairs on this one but there is definitely a caste system to the "women of ill repute."
Your "street walker" or "prostitute" is probably at the very bottom of said system. Escorts are usually of a higher social order and as such charge higher rates. You're not going to find them working the streets, hanging around truck stops, or sitting around in hotel lobbies. They also tend to dress nicer, in order to appear more than what they are.
The type that blew it for Spitzer...no pun intended...are paid a lot to keep their mouth shut...again no pun intended...and stay out of the limelight.
THEY WERE SHEEPHERDERS, NOT COWBOYS!:p
My bad. Never saw the movie.