View Full Version : Enhanced Combat Helmet to Be Fielded in Fall
Enhanced Combat Helmet to Be Fielded in Fall
http://www.asdnews.com/news/33374/Enhanced_Combat_Helmet_to_Be_Fielded_in_Fall.htm
".............."If you hold them in your hand, you'd have a tough time telling the difference, other than the relative thickness," Cole said during a media roundtable Feb. 2 in the Pentagon. "The ECH is a little bit thicker, also about an ounce to four ounces lighter depending on the size. But it's really a huge leap ahead forward in terms of head protection capability."................."
Out with the Advanced in with the Enhanced.
1stindoor
02-08-2011, 07:09
It's not the size, weight, shape, etc. of the helmet that's the issue...it's getting Joe to wear it versus his baseball cap.
This coming from the guy that's had more firefights in a ballcap than I did in a helmet.
The Creepy One
02-08-2011, 12:22
So out of curiosity, why the preference for baseball cap?
1stindoor
02-08-2011, 12:32
A couple of reasons:
1. After many long drives in a GMV through the desert it was more comfortable.
2. It was my father's cap from his union...given to me just before he died.
3. Oakleys stay mounted on the bill easier than they do on a MCH.:cool:
Papa Zero Three
02-08-2011, 14:11
So out of curiosity, why the preference for baseball cap?
Because a baseball cap stops an AK round just about as well as an ACH but the ball cap is more comfortable. If someone built a ball cap with NVG and ARC rail mounts on it you would have 100% usage I am sure.:)
Texas_Shooter
02-08-2011, 14:52
A couple of reasons:
3. Oakleys stay mounted on the bill easier than they do on a MCH.:cool:
LOL
mojaveman
02-08-2011, 15:07
Interesting.
I remember when the first Kevlars came out around '84? and many didn't like the way they looked. Heard more than a few comments about the style of the helmet and how they looked like the German helmets of WWII. Unlike the old steel pots at least they came in diferent sizes.
Snaquebite
02-08-2011, 16:06
Because a baseball cap stops an AK round just about as well as an ACH but the ball cap is more comfortable. If someone built a ball cap with NVG and ARC rail mounts on it you would have 100% usage I am sure.:)
The ACH was never rated for rifle rounds. It is level IIIA protection tested to the standards below. The ECH is supposed to be ballistically superior but I have not seen any criteria listed. The ECH has been in the works for over 3 years.
Ballistic Resistance (ACH)
NIJ0101.04 Leval IIIA
NIJ-STD0106.01
9mm, 124 grain, FMJ @ 1450 fps, backface < 12 mm
44 Magnum 230gr
Fragmentation Resistance
2 grain RCC @ 4075 fps
4 grain RCC @ 3450 fps
16 grain RCC @ 2425 fps
64 grain RCC @ 1700 fps
17 grain FSP @ 2150 fps
EDit to add: While some reports say that the helmet (ECH) will stop some rifle rounds, officials refuse to say specifically what round. The biggest requirement in the ECH development was 35% increased fragmentation protection and lighter than the ACH.
The Reaper
02-08-2011, 17:04
The ACH was never rated for rifle rounds. It is level IIIA protection tested to the standards below. The ECH is supposed to be ballistically superior but I have not seen any criteria listed. The ECH has been in the works for over 3 years.
Ballistic Resistance (ACH)
NIJ0101.04 Leval IIIA
NIJ-STD0106.01
9mm, 124 grain, FMJ @ 1450 fps, backface < 12 mm
44 Magnum 230gr
Fragmentation Resistance
2 grain RCC @ 4075 fps
4 grain RCC @ 3450 fps
16 grain RCC @ 2425 fps
64 grain RCC @ 1700 fps
17 grain FSP @ 2150 fps
EDit to add: While some reports say that the helmet (ECH) will stop some rifle rounds, officials refuse to say specifically what round. The biggest requirement in the ECH development was 35% increased fragmentation protection and lighter than the ACH.
From what I have heard, the new helmet does not even stop all of the pistol rounds required for a IIIA, much less rifle rounds.
TR
Snaquebite
02-08-2011, 17:15
From what I have heard, the new helmet does not even stop all of the pistol rounds required for a IIIA, much less rifle rounds.
TR
They have been really tight lipped in disclosing ballistic capabilities...
This is a helmet worn by a WO from B/2/3 who got shot in the back of the head by a sniper with a .223 round during a night time raid. He got a splitting heacache, and a new helmet.
This is a helmet worn by a WO from B/2/3 who got shot in the back of the head by a sniper with a .223 round during a night time raid. He got a splitting heacache, and a new helmet.
I remember that.
NoRoadtrippin
02-16-2011, 19:17
I think you'd have more luck getting Soldiers in the helmet if they invested in the suspension system again. The new(er) pads are much better than the PASGT suspension without a doubt, but it sounds like systems like the Occ-Dial or even just Ops-Core chinstraps make a huge difference in comfort. I have the Occ-Dial on my personal short list of items to buy.
Ambush Master
02-16-2011, 19:45
So out of curiosity, why the preference for baseball cap?
Hell, I never went into the Bush wearing anything other than a Cravat (OD Triangular Bandage)!!!
Later
Martin
tango_uniform
02-17-2011, 11:36
http://www.military.com/news/article/new-helmet-blocks-rifle-shots.html
Testers hoped to get about a 40 percent increase in ballistic resistance over the ACH. But Cole said in some tests, the new ECH was 70 percent stronger than the helmets worn by Soldiers and Marines today. Additionally the new helmet weighs about four ounces less than the ACH.
Surgicalcric
02-17-2011, 13:07
I think you'd have more luck getting Soldiers in the helmet if they invested in the suspension system again. The new(er) pads are much better than the PASGT suspension without a doubt, but it sounds like systems like the Occ-Dial or even just Ops-Core chinstraps make a huge difference in comfort. I have the Occ-Dial on my personal short list of items to buy.
Totally concur.
I have the Occu-Dial in my TC-2001 ACH and had their chinstrap prior to that. The OD makes the ACH much more tolerable.
Regardless of how comfortable the helmets get I will always fall ball to a softcap/ballcap as much as possible.
I remember that.
He's lucky to be alive. I got video of that since we had the combat camera guy out with us on that mission. After you guys left, we got pretty busy.
Totally concur.
I have the Occu-Dial in my TC-2001 ACH and had their chinstrap prior to that. The OD makes the ACH much more tolerable.
Regardless of how comfortable the helmets get I will always fall ball to a softcap/ballcap as much as possible.
And also ear pro. The Peltors comtac 3 are super comfortabe under the ACHs vs my MSA's. What I would like to try is the Peltors that get attached to the Ops core ARC rails and see how they are. One of the guys here in ATIC is running that set up and it looks pretty comfortable.
Totally concur.
I have the Occu-Dial in my TC-2001 ACH and had their chinstrap prior to that. The OD makes the ACH much more tolerable.
Regardless of how comfortable the helmets get I will always fall ball to a softcap/ballcap as much as possible.
Not this guy! the 2001 might as well be a ball cap. If I could swap mine out for the older 2002 i'd be a happy man. That B 2/3 helmet pic earlier woulda hit nothin but peltor on the 2001's... I'm not a fan. I feel like im wearing a balistic yamuka.
Whens the last time i called you a kit whore? :D plus how ya supposed ta see in the dark with a ball cap on? :D
Surgicalcric
02-17-2011, 18:52
Not this guy! the 2001 might as well be a ball cap. If I could swap mine out for the older 2002 i'd be a happy man. That B 2/3 helmet pic earlier woulda hit nothin but peltor on the 2001's... I'm not a fan. I feel like im wearing a balistic yamuka.
Whens the last time i called you a kit whore? :D plus how ya supposed ta see in the dark with a ball cap on? :D
To each his own Brother.
I am sure there are guys who's shoulders have been spared by deltoid plates...you planning on wearing those as well? And the pelvic plate?
I am sure you can find a 2002 if you feel soo strongly about it. I know a few other guys who work over there who wear the 2002... ;)
To each his own Brother.
I am sure there are guys who's shoulders have been spared by deltoid plates...you planning on wearing those as well? And the pelvic plate?
I am sure you can find a 2002 if you feel soo strongly about it. I know a few other guys who work over there who wear the 2002... ;)
theyre going away. haha no i wont sign up for those, but poking tiny little holes in your dome can do a lot more than tiny little holes in your shoulders. I agree theres gotta be a limit. I wear front, back, side plates and a helmet. The ear cut doesnt really affect my mobility. I see people wear the cutaways because theyre lighter, then put weights or battery packs in the back to offset the weight of their nods.. i just kinda see it as adding the weight you lost by taking the ear part off. To each their own. Not everyone finds the same shit comfortable. Who knows. Maybe im just a puss :) I dont think its gonna last though. I see a different helmet in our future..
theyre going away. haha no i wont sign up for those, but poking tiny little holes in your dome can do a lot more than tiny little holes in your shoulders. I agree theres gotta be a limit. I wear front, back, side plates and a helmet. The ear cut doesnt really affect my mobility. I see people wear the cutaways because theyre lighter, then put weights or battery packs in the back to offset the weight of their nods.. i just kinda see it as adding the weight you lost by taking the ear part off. To each their own. Not everyone finds the same shit comfortable. Who knows. Maybe im just a puss :) I dont think its gonna last though. I see a different helmet in our future..
The point of the 2001/2 isn't about weight or mobility it's about wearing a headset underneath. I can put on my 2001 over a set of peltors and it makes absolute zero change in comfort, fit, all that. If I could do something about my big dumbo ears it would be like I didn't even have a headset on.
The Peltor/Ops Core Arc setup is great, but it costs $2,000 to get all the pieces.
surgicalcric- You said you have the occ-dial suspension on your 2001? The ops-core website says that it will not fit, but if you say otherwise I may just have to get one.
The point of the 2001/2 isn't about weight or mobility it's about wearing a headset underneath. I can put on my 2001 over a set of peltors and it makes absolute zero change in comfort, fit, all that. If I could do something about my big dumbo ears it would be like I didn't even have a headset on.
The Peltor/Ops Core Arc setup is great, but it costs $2,000 to get all the pieces.
surgicalcric- You said you have the occ-dial suspension on your 2001? The ops-core website says that it will not fit, but if you say otherwise I may just have to get one.
Is the ops core arc setup the rail system that comes on the bump helmets? If so I havent seen one for the 2001. I tried to make one from the 2002 fit, but the curves were all wrong. I dig the idea of the rail mounted peltors, but havent tried em. I'm the opposite - I have tiny ears and dont have any issues with wearing peltors under any of the helmets since we got a new harness for em. Not sure what kind it is though. That being said its definately more of a pain in the ass to PUT the helmet on, but once its on none really bother my peltors.
The "ARC Rails" are the Ops-Core helmet rails, the "Occ-Dial" is the suspension system. Peltor made a headset with Ops-Core called the Arc headset or something along those lines that attached to the rails rather than tension around your head. The 2,000 dollar setup I was referring to was the optioned out helmet with that headset.
Is the ops core arc setup the rail system that comes on the bump helmets? If so I havent seen one for the 2001. I tried to make one from the 2002 fit, but the curves were all wrong. I dig the idea of the rail mounted peltors, but havent tried em. I'm the opposite - I have tiny ears and dont have any issues with wearing peltors under any of the helmets since we got a new harness for em. Not sure what kind it is though. That being said its definately more of a pain in the ass to PUT the helmet on, but once its on none really bother my peltors.
Ops core makes rails for the 2002 along with MSA, however the MSA ARC's don't have the little holes for the bungie cords for the nods, but the Ops core ARC does have the holes to put bungie cords in. The MSA ARC are cheaper then the Ops core. Non the less, I'm running ops core ARC for my 2002 along with the H nape. The occ dial just doesn't work for me so that's why I went with the H nape.
Not sure the difference between the nomenclatures you guys are talking about... I wear my helmet (except on longer rides or through greener pastures) just because hitting your head hurts - I'm not that tall, but qalats out here are made for midgets... same goes for RG's!
I have seen a helmet work in Marjah, the guy wasn't wearing it at the time though! It stopped a stray AK round deflection from going into some of our commo gear. Also, hearing from some of those guys in the battle of Shok Valley, helmets were literal lifesavers in that one.
Surgicalcric
02-18-2011, 20:54
...surgicalcric- You said you have the occ-dial suspension on your 2001? The ops-core website says that it will not fit, but if you say otherwise I may just have to get one.
The Occu-Dial will work on the 2001. The issue is the mounting holes on the front of the helmet for the chin strap is a little closer on the 2001 than the 2000 and 2002 models. It took my removing a lil foam from the mounting surface but it fits just fine.
Their rail system will also fit the 2000-02 model helmets. If being used in conjunction with the Occu-Dial a longer set of mounting screws will be needed for the rear of the helmet as those provided with the rail kit arent long enough.
HTH
Old thread but I thought I'd throw this out there..
Got a new helmet from ops-core with the rail. Big improvement. The suspension system can take some pretty major adjustments before you can get your helmet to sit right but it's worth it. Also this version feels quite a bit lighter.
Normally prefer invisios, but with the peltor attachment to the rail it's pretty damn comfortable. The guys still wearing peltors that go over the top of the head are hating life with the suspension system though..
The reason I like it so much is once its properly adjusted you can wear your chinstrap loose with nods down and your helmet won't move around on ya.. With the previous version I had to keep the rear straps pretty tight to keep my nods from pulling the helmet down in front.
Not that I John Wayne around with my chinstrap undone, but ill undo it from time to time when the situation permits for comfort.
If someone is making kits to retrofit peltors to the rail system they'll probably do pretty well. Itl save units money over buying brand new headsets..
It's not the size, weight, shape, etc. of the helmet that's the issue...it's getting Joe to wear it versus his baseball cap.
This coming from the guy that's had more firefights in a ballcap than I did in a helmet.
Never worried about a helmet when the majority of incoming was small arms...they'll wear helmets if the T start using arty...I'd guarantee it.
Easter Offensive II Corp 50 rds of 120mm an hour makes you love your helmet.